Dirk's Junkie group - CLOSED (Page 57)

Interesting.  I am always interested in hearing the views of a good podiatrist.  They seem to have a good grasp of lower body ailments that are related to the foot.  It's amazing how our foundation can affect the rest of the body. 

I'm no doctor, but I wouldn't think seat height would create an ankle isse as much as cleat position.  Definitely pay attention to if you are pushing against one extreme of the cleat position (either in or out).  What I would do is start pedalling with your heals pushed all the way out and spin up to about 90 rpms and see where your heals go.  Note position of both feet.  Then do the opposite, starting in and see if they float all the way out.  Let us know.

Where is the ankle pain right now?  Sharp, dull??? hurts when biking?  Running?

Mid week slump for me, having some motivation issues. The weather here is unseasonably beautiful - 70's and sunny, all the way up to 80 yesterday! I just want to get outside and work in my yard, clean up the patio, transplant my flowers etc.  My husband has had to work late every night, I've been up at 3:45 or 4:00 every day for a week and now I keep having headaches. Hopefully I can turn it around today. I'm just so tired, 5 hours of sleep for 7 days straight is not enough.

We got some good news on a personal level this week. My husband recieved a promotion at work with a 3 year contract so it looks like we are staying put for a while!

Go with Jonathan's suggestion first, but I have noticed my ankles get sore when I push hard and pedal with my toes down and heel up. This could be exaggerated by a seat that's too high, so maybe that's what the doctor was referring too?

My ankles throbbed and felt very weak for a few days after I caught myself doing it. I really struggled to run (or walk really) without it feeling like I was going to roll it over...

Just for the record, where should the cleats be under your foot? I have neither cleats or cages, so I have to position my foot manually :-)

John

Jo63 - 2012-03-15 7:03 AM Seeing as I have all the aero stuff for my bike it again goes back to the power behind the bike, so I am working on strength training more, did p90x for legs and back yesterday and am a quite sore. I was reading a post from the IMW group talking about climbing gears, and if I don't ask I won't know...... So what are climbing gears?

The discussion is probably about what gear combinations to bring to the event.  The gears are described some like 50x34 11-23, or 12-28.  The first number is the number of teeth on each of your front rings; the second is the range of teeth on the back rings.  For the front, the smaller the number, the more revolutions you have to pedal to get the same speed, for the rear it’s the opposite.  That means it would be “easier” to climb the same hill with a smaller front ring and/or a larger back ring with the same cadence (though you'll be going slower!).

So to be able to spin easily up a hilly course, you want to have the smallest front ring and the largest back ring.  IMWI is a pretty hilly IM course, so even some fairly good cyclists like to use a 12-28 in the back.  This allows you to maintain a high cadence (spin) up even steep hills.  The idea is to conserve your leg muscles for that marathon. This is a pretty complicated, interactive chart which shows speed/rpm for all the various front and back gear combinations.

The bottom line is that if you want to spin and not mash up hills, and you aren’t Jonathan or Jeff, it would be great to have a 28 available in the back if possible for IMWI.  As a example – if you want to maintain a cadence of at least 60, with your front in the 34 and your back in the 28, you will go about 6 mph.  Not sure how fast you climb hills, but there are hills on that course I would probably be going 6 mph at ironman effort level.

Dina, I'm so happy for your family.  The promotion is great news!  As for motivation, I'm not sure I can be much help.  I try to remember that the only workouts that I will regret are the ones that I didn't do. 

Warren, thanks for the discussion on the bike gears.  I never really knew how all of that worked either. 

On a personal note, I am thrilled because yesterday I ran my longest distance since before I had kids- 10 miles.  My son is 6 months old today, so I think I built up the mileage pretty quickly (using the 3:2:1 plan).  I have all of you to thank for the advice and the motivation. 

I have a couple of questions for the group.  The first would be regarding cycling.  Now that the weather is nicer, I will probably do more outside rides with the family.  We have a double bike trailer/ jogging stroller that my husband usually pulls or pushes.  It works out ok for the runs since he is so much faster than I am without the stroller, but the rides are a little bit different.  The trailer is kind of like pulling a parachute behind you, so even though he is going hard the ride is much too slow and easy for me.  If I pull, then it will be even slower for him.  I was thinking about pulling our single trailer (probably empty) behind my bike to make it a harder workout.  Any better ideas out there? 

The next question is regarding shoes.  I am about to need a new pair.  I had a pair of New Balance shoes a couple of years ago that I absolutely loved.  The pair of Brooks that I have now is pretty good, but I don't think I like them as much as I loved the NB.  I can't seem to find that particular NB shoe, but now it has a new version.  My question is, should I (a) order the new shoe from NB and hope that it wasn't changed much from its predecessor, (b) stick with the Brooks shoes that I didn't have any trouble with, or (c) get fitted for a new pair of shoes at the running store and spend a bunch more? 

First, I want to commend you for incorporating your family into your training.  I think it's a great idea if you can make it work.  I'm probably not the best person to ask because I only have a fiance and she doesn't make any requests to bike with me at all.  My first thought is, no, there's no real way to match efforts with that much weight behind his bike.  You could definitely give the empty trailer a try.  I don't see why not.

When it comes to running shoes, I have never had a problem with the shoe itself.  I like certain shoes more than others due to weight, but I would say, get what works for you.  If you had no problems with the Brooks, why not stick with them??  What made you love the old NB pair???  Your second option is to just call NB and ask what the changes were from your old shoe to the one you're looking at.  If they don't give you anything major, go with those.  Which ones were they?

Thanks, Jonathon.  I felt like I had to break in the Brooks- they didn't feel real good until around 50 miles or so.  The New Balance shoes felt great from the beginning til the end.  They were the WR1223.  I have found some online, but not in my size.  They have updated versions, up to the WR1226 now.  I found a pair of WR1225s online for about $50. 

Allison, you know how important it is to get the shoes right.

I don't know what changes were made in the model upgrade, but it cannot be safely assumed they are the same in all the important ways.

If you can't get the exact model you know to be good for you, then I would try them on in person first.  It's worth the extra money to get that right.

As for cycling...I think you are on the right track.  I have often advised couples to try to even out their efforts when cycling together.  It's usually a man who's a stronger cyclist than his wife.  But I have suggested the stronger cyclist ride a mtn bike while the weaker one ride a road bike.

If your husband is pulling the kids you can try to level the playing field in a few ways.  You've already thought about handicapping yourself with the single trailer.  You can also try running with your tire pressure low.  (I wouldn't go below about 60psi or your risk of a flat goes way up).  You can also tighten down the barrel adjuster, or twist your brake calipers to the side creating brake drag.

Windy is my hill work outs, is about all I can say.  Here in northern Indiana that's about all I can do to get close to "hills."  Like others have said, to make things easier yo can only try to make yourself more aerodynamic to have a smaller profile.  I used to HATE riding in the wind but I have adjusted my attitude to one of acceptance of the benefit of more "power" training.  I think Jonathon said something about this.

I have tried to freeze about half a bottle of water over night before long rides and that has had reasonable success.  Most of the time I only ice them as much as possible.  Drinking warm cool water isn't really that bad once you get used to it and it might be something you may want to get used to if looking at doing long course triathlon.  I have heard that some courses don't offer cold water, although I can't think that is a common occurrence.

John, I agree with your assessment about toeing down on the pedals.  I believe this can lead to a couple of very simple problems

1. Tight achilles due to a constantly relaxed position
2. Calf cramping because your calves are in a constant state of tension.

I have experienced both of these issues in the past and I also think it has contributed to some of my recent achilles problems. 

As far a positioning of the cleat itself, Jeff had a post in the last mentor session that advised us to move our cleats all the way or nearly all the way to the back position in the shoe.  I will leave the explanation and purpose for this to him to explain but I have had a much better/comfortable pedal stroke and it seems to have helped a little for my runs off the bike and my runs overall.

I agree 1 million percent with Jeff.  I had a horrible experience with some Mizuno Wave Inspire 7's.  I had bought them online and couldn't return them after I had run for a while in them and I discovered the problems weren't temporary until it was too late.  My problem was blisters.  Just just a couple of blisters!!!  But blisters ALL OVER my feet!!  I mean EVERYWHERE!!  I had blister on my heels, toes, tops of my feet and sides of my feet.  They were completely and totally horrible shoes.  I learned later that they had changed the shoe significantly.

Anyway, enough of my babbling.  I suggest you go to 3 Rivers Running and purchase your shoes.  They have a really good return policy that allows you to return the shoes for 30 days if they are uncomfortable or problematic for you.  The caveat is they can't show a lot of wear.  I believe the way the policy works well is because they actually return the shoe to the manufacturer and then they return another pair to the store for no charge.  BUT, before taking my word for it you should check with the store.

For the bike, I agree with Jeff and Jonathon.  Use something to create added effort on your part to help develop your cycling power.  As Joanne was asking about wind, weight will have a similar training impact or benefit.  I also think Jeff had a good idea for Ryan to use a mountain bike if you have one available.  He would get a similar WO to the road bike but he would have to work a little harder to maintain similar speed.

Dina, congrats on the new gig and being able to stay put.

Allison, I will join in the agreement on shoes.  I can't figure out why these companies change something that's working.  I was lucky in that my New Balance replacement version is still perfect for me, though they ditched the bubble laces which sounds like a ridiculous thing but I liked that the laces really stayed put.  I actually saved the two pairs of laces from my last two shoe and have been reusing them.

In terms of finding the new shoe, Dirk is right - go somewhere you can try some on and do a return.  Though I don't get all my shoes there, I did go to a local running store to try out the new model before I committed to buying them.  I figured the extra money was well spent in that I got to be sure the shoe would work for me and I contributed some $$$ to a local business.  YMMV, but with my running injury history I wanted to be sure.  For me at least, the shoes are pretty important in terms of staying healthy.\

Paul, this is where it would be really great to have a "guy" to go to who understands athletic injuries.  I think all of us are well served to find someone like that - whether it's a PT, and sports ortho, and ART practitioner, or whatever.  It's great to bounce these things off the forum, and you can often get some great advice, but having someone you trust in the field who understands you and endurance athletics can be a great tool.

Did the coach video you at the beginning of the seminar and then closer to the end.  It seemed there was notable improvement in your body positioning toward the end of the video.  In the beginning you had a very low body position with your hips well under the water, then in one of the later (above water segments) it looked like you had decreased the amount your hips were underwater.  Granted this may have been because the camera was underwater the first serious of shots, then above water for the second series but it looked much better. 

I also agree when the coach said your hand positioning was thumbs down but this appeared more evident with your right hand than your left.  (This is a problem that my daughter has too but she won't listen to her dad.)  It appears you have a relatively relaxed hand position too, meaning no hand cupping or tense fingers.  Your hands seem to be in a comfortable position.  This seems to be a problem that I continually have that I think was developed when I was a kid swimming for a team when I was 8-10 years old.  I can tell I do his very commonly because my hands will hurt along the tops after a swim.

_____

Another swimming video I found today for further swim assistance for everyone.

Here is another video that discusses 4 phases of a freestyle stroke.  One of the really big things to look at (the whole thing is good) is the point at which Popov begins the pull.  This occurs at :41 seconds in the video.  Notice how his right arm is in the recovery process and his left arm is still in a predominately streamline position "ballistically" pushing him through the water.  His pull doesn't start until his right hand is almost parallel to his shoulder.

Allison, we still need to get together to get a swim in.  I can't do it this weekend but if you would like we can begin planning for next weekend if you like.

That's awesome Warren!!  Glad to hear you're able to start knocking some harder runs out.  It has to feel great for you to be healthy and running hard.  The tempo efforts are going to lead to some really great racing this season but the tempo runs aren't going to be the reason for the great races...............The "run easy, run lots, sometimes hard" will be the reason for your success.

Dirk the wave inspires were my long time running shoe also. The WI 7's were terrible for me too, too short and just felt off. I was lucky enough to be able to sell them to my training friend and she really likes them.

I have been really happy with my Saucony Pro  Peregrine trail shoes so now I'm trying to find a similar pair for the road. I never really believed a shoe could make that much difference - I just thought I had really bad feet. Yesterday I wore some Nike Lunar shoes to my Toddler Gym class  and my feet hurt when I got home. The extra stability and cushion felt really bad now that I have gotten used to less. I didn't even run and my feet were throbbing and my tendon was starting to get sore. I usesd to wear those with my orthotics - no wonder I was having so much trouble. I am slowly coming around to the conclusion that all of the extra stability does not fix anything - at least for me. It has never stopped me from rolling my ankles and I have still managed to get a variety of foot injuries.

Sorry, got a little off track there .

Busy weekend for us - my sons 6th birthday party!!! We are taking a trip to the Childrens Museum tomorrow and then having the cousins sleep over. Hope to squeeze in a swim during my sons morning swim lessons if I can get all the cooking and cleaning done today. I better hop to it!

Have a great day everyone!

First, comments on that Popov video.  Don't try to completely emulate what he's doing.  For one thing, he's swimming faster than my 50m sprint!  That's why you see his head and shoulders so incredibly high.  At that level of speed the water pushes him upward.

Just his kick alone in that video is faster than the rest of us swim and that changes a lot of the dynamics of the arm timing. 

Dirk was pointing out how his recovery arm is up there by the shoulder when his other arm begins to catch.  That timing works great when swimming fast.  In the 1:30-2:00 per 100 range something even more front-quadrant seems to work better.

David: I also saw the improvement throughout the video that Dirk saw.  I was particularly impressed with your arm entry in the final swim segment.  Great improvement.  Looks like an awesome swim session. 

I want to ask about the hand entry.  Dirk, you say it's a problem for the hand to enter thumb down....but that's the only way for the elbow to stay higher.  Otherwise the elbow hits the water before the hand.  I'm not suggesting it stays in that orientation once the arm is in streamline, just through recovery and initial entry.  Comments?

IMO, yes. 

Remember to make them only as fast as you can comfortably cruise plus achieve that speed gradually.

If you spread them out throughout the run, rather than right in a row, say 1 each mile....it can help keep the legs loose.  Most people will find that the legs really tighten up during a long run as fatigue sets in and the stride length is relatively short.

That tightness can be eliminated by breaking up the stride from time to time.

For instance, last weekend my daughter did her longest ever run.  9 miles.  It was on challenging mtn bike trails and she mentioned when she was done that her legs didn't feel the usual fatigue (as didn't mine). 

I also got to do some speed stuff yesterday.  I did a lunch-time track workout with Jordan.  Changed at the Y next door and drove a few minutes to a track where we did some strides, drills and tempo stuff.  Just an introduction into leg speed for now.  We are going to try to make it a weekly thing.