Tri/tbay group - CLOSED (Page 6)

Carol/Bill,  great job on your half marathon personal best times. Always a good feeling when the "GOAL IS ACHIEVED" I'm sure at that point in the run when you realized you were going to get that best time it had to feel good.

I hope everyone else had an excellent training weekend, we had a good weekend of weather here in Florida it was good to be out. Got out after Church on Sunday for the bike ride almost a little on the warm side. But who's complaining.

Lets here how your weekend went!!!!

I would like to add my congrats to Carol and Bill a well deserved reward for your work. 

Got a swim in on Sun. I am still battling an uncooperative back that tightens up at just at 1mi or so running, going to the doc. tomorrow. 

Thanks. 

I was back in the pool this morning.  So nice after being away for the past two weeks.  It was nice taking a couple days off after the Sunday run.  Now to get back into a workout routine.  It is much easier when you are not traveling.

Bill

Thanks for support re: the race this past weekend!  Finally wrote up a proper race report: http://www.beginnertriathlete.com/discussion/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=422541&posts=2&start=1 

Bill (wr) - I sure hope you can get some relief for your back.  Hopefully swimming will also help it some, but I'm sure that depends on the underlying problem.

Bill (fla) - I hear you on the traveling.  We don't really travel much, but when we do it takes a lot of mental fortitude to get much of anything in.  I really don't know how folks who travel a lot get in much training other than in the hotel gyms. 

Roy - nice Sunday ride!  Glad you got outside to enjoy.

Hey to everyone else, let us hear how your training is going when you can.

Question for the fishies in the group:  As I've mentioned, I'm taking a series of 6 weekly swim lessons.  So far we are doing drills of 50 and 25 yds, and not a lot of volume so that we can focus on form w/out fatigue (one of the workouts is posted in my log from yesterday).  Before the class, I would mainly swim long sets (badly and slowly), without tiring myself out too much and generally came out very relaxed.  My balance in the water was decent, but I was sort of a floating noodle .  At this point, I can keep the better technique going for the short sets, but it's hard to fathom keeping that up for any distance at all.  Lats/back/triceps are getting engaged and really weren't before, and I wind up feeling some tension in my neck/back by the end.  I almost feel like I'm rushing as I set my wrist and elbow earlier, and need to breathe more frequently as a result.  Does this sound normal, and just part of the process of correcting my lazy floppy stroke?  Our coach is great and I'll address w/ him on Saturday, but I wound up missing class this weekend, so just questioning it a little in my head this week as I continue to practice.

Hi All,

Just checking in-congratulations for the PR's in the 1/2 Marathons, Squirt and Bill.  I will be more than thrilled if I could get my time to 2:30.

Looking closely at my schedule, I have 16 weeks to my 1/2 Iron, so I figured I better focus on my training even more.

After a week of snow and ice, and missing more than several training sessions, I hit it hard this week.  So far, it's been "the perfect week" having not missed any training sessions.  My goal this week is to put in 14 hours (that includes 3 strength training sessions).

Last Sunday I rode indoors for 2:45 with a group of friends who set up trainers in someone's family room..sure did help the time go by.  Today running the longest run in over a year with hubby-7 miles.  I hope I can manage to run most of it without too many walk breaks.  Swim practice is awesome..love the new coach.  Even though I am swimming alone in the "slow" lane, I am motivated to push myself just being in the pool with some amazing master swimmers. I'm not sure if I am actually getting faster, but I feel stronger and smoother.

Squirt: I wish I could give you some words of wisdom on your swimming...just hang in there.  I imagine it all begins to feel natural eventually.  I do know that everyone breaths more often, and increases the number of strokes in any hard effort. I try to keep my number of strokes at 22 or less/25 yards but as I get tired, I'll be doing 23-24 strokes/25.  

Good Morning,

Ah Mona the ultimate improvise, adapt and overcome when the weather keeps you in. Glad you have some folks that can get together and make due. Keep it up, and your right May will be here before you know it. What have you decided to do about lodging instead of making the drive from St. Pete for race day?

Squirt, I would guess that your six session program that you purchased was drill and technique based with no or limited base work. So you are getting what was described, but I can certainly understand your thoughts for sure. You should be on your own swim developing your  base endurance, but do avoid falling back into the "one speed swimming" as I call it.  Your base endurance sets can be 200-400s with an interval goal time that fall in the aerobic range for that phase of training. So most likely those should be sets swum in the 2:00/100 or better range. I'm going off of what you described in an earlier post. You are wanting to build your swims into the 1300-2500yd range for Olympic distance training. As you go along you can do some hard efforst as tests to see what you can hold. Ask whoever you are working with to help out, or they might have another program that is based towards more distance.

As an example I'm doing 9 workouts a week, 3 of each discipline. All are labeled short, medium and long for either duration or distance. So your swims would then fall into the range I mentioned above 1300-1500 short, 1500-1900 medium, and 2000-2500 or so for your long workouts these should contain intervals sets outside of the warm up, drills cool down with the exception of a selected long swim from time to time.

You are doing great just trust the training.

Kerry you've been silent lately what are you up to?

What happended at the Doctor? Hopefully just some muscle tightness that can be worked out.

Thanks Mona and Roy!  It's so nice to have some fishes in the group .  I was definitely in a long/easy pattern last year just to prove to myself that I could survive the tri's I did.   Yesterday I talked to my tri buddy.  She is  also in the class, and experiencing exactly the same thing at this stage. Realized we're only halfway thru, so right in the middle of the learning curve. The class is specifically for triathletes (I've seen more than one mdot tattoo), and our instructor is the head of probably the largest tri club in the area, so I'm in good hands and need to stay patient w/ the process.  Actually making it to class this week will probably help too.

Mona, you amaze me with your trainer rides!  Very nice you have a group to train with like that.  When do you think you will be able to get back outside?  Do you ride in the rain?

Kerry is doing great, but I'll let him update you.  We hit the ground running this week after spending the day at the airport on Monday.  The flight before ours was cancelled and we got bumped.  Ahhh...the joys of standby travel!  

Hi All, sorry I have been MIA this week.  Congrats on the successful races, the insane trainer rides, and the swim lessons!

I was getting foot pain on the inside of my foot at the arch so I finally sprung for some new wheels.  After trying on a few pairs and having my gait looked at I settled on the Brooks Pure - cadence.  They felt pretty good after their maiden voyage on my feet.  I did get a blister but I bought some mole skin to combat it.

As far as swimming goes, I am making baby steps of progress.  I swam my first non stop 50's last week and yesterday did my first non stop 100's.  Long ways to go before St. Anthonys!  

Roy, 

Thanks for asking, I got adjusted 3 times last week, Last Sat. it snowed here and I was plowing snow on a tractor for 9+ hrs and on a campus that means turning your head every time you back up, college kids are smart but sometimes lack common sense but we pick up the slack in that dept. I believe this is what aggravated my sore lower back. I went swimming on Friday and that doesn't hurt. I did 2-200m, 4-100m  and 4-50m splits or whatever you call them, my instructor wasn't there and i felt more relaxed and able to get a "feel" for moving through the water, i was pleasantly surprised to make it 200m nonstop, so i did it again. I took your advice and am not concentrating so much on the KICK and only when i am in a rhythmic  motion with my breathing and body rotation do i try to work on the legs. At this point i want to concentrate on getting a base established on swimming and run 3 days a week with some core workouts included which leave the bike on idle for a little while. Today i tested the back out with an 8 mile run on the York heritage trail. I felt much better and am scheduled to run on wed. this week. So i go in on Mon. for another adjustment and hopefully i can get everything going again. It is frustrating to have a plan derailed  

Andy, I'm going to go out on a limb here and try to answer your swim question.  Take it for what it's worth since I'm currently learning myself.  In my class we always start off with finding our balance.  Push off the wall, both hands out in front, and just a slight flutter kick.  Focus on stretching out long in the water and pushing your chest down like you're trying to go downhill.  That should help your legs to pop up closer to the surface.  Do like 4 X 25 yards that way before you try any stroking at all.  To breathe, you can stroke once and turn your head, or do a little breast stroke type move.  But mostly just stretch out and find your balance while kicking a little.

Bill (WR) glad your back seems to be on the mend.  Kerry has had back issues off and on, and it's so hard to tell what's going to set it off.  Sometimes just stepping out of the shower, or turning to pick something up.  I would think that long term...swimming would be good for strengthening it though.

Speaking of swimming, got in my swim drills before church today, and then went on a really nice 25ish mile group ride this afternoon.  Beautiful sunshiny day, and first time outdoors on my bike in a couple of months.  Then Kerry & I headed out to dinner with some friends.  A good, pleasantly tiring day.   

Squirt excellent comment. Andy this will help tremendously pressing the chest or the lungs is the key to brining the hips up. And like a lot of folks who don't really have a kick to aid in lift and propulsion this will really help. Our lungs in swimming are our fulcrum this is the balance point and by extending the arms we adjust the fulcrum even further. As you do this drill play around with your head placement up/down and see if you can feel your lower body adjust with the movement. Let us know how it goes.

Bill glad your back is feeling better and you may be on to something as to the cause. Be careful, it still early in the season you can catch up on your lost time.

I got on my tri-bike outdoors for the first time since Miami yesterday as well. It felt great, a couple of little wobbles at first( just a difference in the handling of these bikes) but then it was all good. I'm in a recovery week for my plan so this week is pretty easy stuff.

Carol I hope dinner was good, my wife and I watched a couple of movies and had a nice dinner.

Sounds like everyone had a good week-end.  I passed up the group ride on Saturday because the temps were below 40.  I rode 26 miles yesterday afternoon.  This morning the pool was closed due to the cold temperature so I did 30 minutes on the treadmill and the usual machine sets.  Hope to get the swim in tomorrow.

Enjoy your week.

Bill

Squirt and Roy thank you both for the insight.  It was hard to take to much time finding my best floating position because the pool was packed, 3 to a lane in every lane.  I did however try it and it seems to work.  I really concentrated on looking at the bottom of the pool, head down and pushing my chest to simulate a a down hill effect.  I swam 2 100's and then did my first 200.  Each time I felt like I was struggling i exhaled and made sure my body position was correct.  Baby steps!

Thanks again

on a side note.......

ITS OFFICIAL, I am signed up for St. Anthony's! 

Sounds like a good day at the pool, Andy.  Well aside from the crowds anyway!  Glad you are officially signed up for the tri.

Today was 5 miles easy and swim drills.  After I'd done all the drills I swam a little 50 yard time trial and came in at :53.  Not fast by many standards, but big improvement for me.  Tomorrow is interval run day, and I'm on the fence about whether my legs feel good enough to tackle it.  A couple of spots have felt on the edge.  Will see what the morning brings.

Hi All,

Just caught up on everyone's progress...good going everyone.  It shows a committed group and it helps to know there are people out there that will get their training in "no matter what".

Last week, I did NOT get in my 7 mile run and only ended up with two very short runs to make a total of only 5 miles for the week.  Everyday I thought of making it up, but once the opportunity passes, I find it difficult to switch everything up to "make up" a session. I had a tendon on my foot tighten up and pull so that it was painful to run, so found it best not to push anything..it's caused from a past surgery. I ended up walking for an hour and called it a day.

Sooo....I just figured I have to focus on what I did right last week: I got to ride outdoors for the first time in months.  A friend who is training for IMCanada insisted on riding with me and she pushed me to keep spinning at a high cadence for 37 miles.  I thought I would die several times but managed to ride an avg of 15 miles/hour on a course that I usually ride 14 mph.

Thank goodness, yesterday's long run went well and I finally got out and did a 7 mile run..no walking (lots of shuffling) in about 1:25.  I think the bike and swim have given me the endurance.  

I don't understand why the 1/2 Ironman plan on BT has the longest run at only 7 miles..it's just not enough in my mind. Figuring I will take 3 hours to shuffle my way thru 13.1 miles, I figure I should at least get in a couple 2:30 runs by first week of May and keep weekly mileage to at least 15 miles/week. If I had my way, I would feel better if I could avg more like 20 miles/week and work up to 25 miles/week however, this body can't take the running like it used to and I try to avoid injury at all costs. Do you guys agree with my thinking, or what?   

A note on kicking: my swim coach commented that he could tell I was a runner because my ankles were not flexible at all, thus causing a slow kick.  I've heard kicking with fins will help loosen them up.  Then again, in most triathlons the wetsuit will keep you afloat and you don't have to kick all that hard.  In my case, I will be swimming without a wetsuit which is fine by me :-) 

2nd thing I learned at swim practice: coach said the most important part of the stroke is to wait (a millisecond) until you are ready to anchor your hand, then when pulling to keep your elbow close to the surface, creating a 90 degree angle with your arm and PULL through using the forearm (not the shoulder)...so many have a tendency to pull underwater with a straight arm and lose all that leverage.  Hope that makes sense.  

Roy: still have not made any reservations for the night before the 70.3...any suggestions? 

That's quite enough from me this week, thanks for reading my novel 

Mona

Mona, very nice bike ride!  It really helps to have friends to ride with, and sounds like you have some great ones.  Since I haven't done a HIM, take this for what it's worth, but I would not be comfortable w/ a 7 mile longest run either.  Some HM plans stop at 10 miles for long runs (like this one: http://www.halhigdon.com/training/51131/Half-Marathon-Novice-1-Training-Program), so maybe you could pattern your running after one of those, and do the swim and bike workouts from the HIM plan.

Thanks for sharing the swim tips!  Funny you should mention fins.  I really don't like them much! We used them in class last time, and the ones I borrowed were WAY too big.  Feet started cramping almost immediately from trying to keep them on, and wound up shucking them in the middle of the first lap.  Borrowed some better fitting ones, but still not fin fan. I was totally doing the straight arm thing before this class, and I think fixing that + learning what the heck a proper catch looks like are the biggest takeaways so far.

Yes, it does help to know others are gettting their workouts in.  I got my 9+ miles in this morning.  It included 1/2 mile reapeats at 5K pace, and I was tired going into it.  Bird pooped on my head a couple miles in, and I had to walk a little on most of the recoveries, but nothing came out injured.

It is funny that you mention your feet cramping.  Last night I was getting in my usual swim and had the same issue.  I was just starting my 300 kick drill and my foot cramped.  I stopped and massaged my foot.  Then my leg cramped.  I spent a few minutes trying to get it to go away with no luck and decided it was best to stop my swim workout.  I normally swim in the mornings but with traveling, this was the only time I had to swim.

I really like the tips that everyone is providing for the swim.  I used fins for a couple months last year for my stroke.  It seemed to make a difference.  I haven't used them for 4 months because I have changed my swim routine to follow the olympic training plan.

Bill

Good Morning All,

Ah fins, cramps and running oh to be an athlete.

When you put on fins and do kick sets this is almost a sure bet that you will get either a foot or calf cramp of the utmost pain. And as Mona said, runners don't normally have a lot of ankle flexation and fins lock the foot into an angle that puts a lot of tension in the calf muscles that extend into the arch of the foot. So nothing unusual going on but it is painfull when it happens. Until you have developed enough strength from kicking this is likely to continue to happen from time to time.

Not sure about the BT plan Mona, but the Higdon novice plan will work great. I've used his marathon novice plan twice and it works just fine. One thing people question about the half plan is the 10 miler on the weekend before the race, I say you've trusted the plan up to this point why question it now.

Squirt did you get any answers about increasing the length of your swims?

Mona, glad you liked the Higdon plan .  I'm with you, it helps to have a plan that someone else wrote.

Thanks for the tips, and purpose behind the fins.  I'll give them another try.  The cramping only happened when I tried using ones that were WAY too big -- gap of more than an inch at the heel and no way to secure them so trying to hold on by my toes.  One of our drills for this week just happens to be the stretched out kicking on your back that you described Mona.  Roy, I did not ask about the distance yet.  Decided to just trust the process for now and wait for it to be addressed.  Our instructor did mention that he introduced our last drill last week, so figuring we will be putting it all together a bit more in the next couple weeks.  Also noticed we are at least moving up to a few 75 yard sets in our drills this week.