BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE! (Page 56)

2011-11-25 9:55 PM

in reply to: #3907954

Champion

10618

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

JEFF again -

I'm still at #70, but in the past week seven more peole have been added, thus moving the total of M60-64 from 1397 to 1403. So, I am now the last guy in the All-American group, meaning I am at about the 5.999 %tile. Being the last of 70 makes me think of a bunch of [people being evacuated by a helicopter.....a there's a hanging chain of of several who are holding onto the wrist of the person above them.....and we all know who will be the first to plummet!

Anyhow, that's akin to my fate for the A-A hopes in the USAT rankings!

http://www.xterrawetsuits.com/index.php/fall-2011/

2011-11-26 7:10 AM

in reply to: #3915206

Expert

1191

Sarasota, FL

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

stevebradley - 2011-11-25 10:50 PM JEFF - Hey! Great minds think alike, as I've only recently started going into the sauna post-swim myself! I do it mostly to yak with a couple of other oldsters (I use the pool mostly during the 50+ swim time), but enjoy the sense of purging the system (or, opening up the pores, i guess). I'm not aware of any problems ---- unless, of course, problems arise. I'm anticipating the day when it just doesn't agree with me and I feel lightheaded or nauseous or something, but so far it's all okay up until about the ten minute point, and then I'm outta there! Twice now I have used the sauna about 3 hours before doing a hot Yoga class, and I've wondered if that was a real mistake. So far, so good, though, even if I STILL remain lousy at hydrating -- even under the duress of a sauna or a hot Yoga class. And speaking of duress, i'd like to think that soemthing like the sauna will help make me less susceptible to (as it were) meltdowns during hothot races. I guess I'd just like to feel that i am working towards acclimatization, even if it's just a teensy bit. Wetsuit arrived yet??

OK, Ill go with you on that one... acclimatization.

It's been shipped but not here yet.

For anyone that is interested Xterra has a great sale on wetsuits... You can find the deals here:

Here's another site to visit for those of you looking to shop for TRI gear:

http://www.onetri.com/

40% most things. Got a tri suit, arm warmers and body glide (found it Steve). All for $95 including shipping. Great deals. Note that you cannot find out if the 40% discount applies until you go to checkout, enter the code (THANKS40), and give it a credit card. I was hesitate about doing this but it won't actually charge your card until you confirm the order (so you see if the 40% discount applies - i.e.. you can back out of the deal).

Happy shopping.

Edited by junthank 2011-11-26 8:31 AM

2011-11-26 7:11 AM

in reply to: #3915210

Expert

1191

Sarasota, FL

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

stevebradley - 2011-11-25 10:55 PM JEFF again - I'm still at #70, but in the past week seven more peole have been added, thus moving the total of M60-64 from 1397 to 1403. So, I am now the last guy in the All-American group, meaning I am at about the 5.999 %tile. Being the last of 70 makes me think of a bunch of [people being evacuated by a helicopter.....a there's a hanging chain of of several who are holding onto the wrist of the person above them.....and we all know who will be the first to plummet!

Anyhow, that's akin to my fate for the A-A hopes in the USAT rankings!

Hold on for dear life!!!

JoeK

2011-11-26 1:14 PM

in reply to: #3435045

Regular

108

Crystal Coast

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

Steve,

Yep the BD was mine....officially over the hill at 51. I should probably try a couple of long runs outside vice the treadmill. Treadmill running isn't really that bad, I must have some hamster in the genetic make-up. I do need to try some outside runs especially since the weather lately is perfect for running and biking. Mid 60s with a slight breeze. Currently I am planning on adding 1.5 mile every 2 weeks to my run which should get me up to about 21 miles or so prior to the race. I will be playing this run by ear though. I am not sure having only one 21 mile run prior to the race will be enough. There is also a local race in mid March but I think a March race will push me to close to White Lake (1st week of May)and I will not have enough time to bring my bike and swim back up.

I am currently burning through my AG standings and holding at 4155 out of 5035 . Seems a lot of athletes listed in the "ranked" standings have 1 or 2 races though. I thought you had to have a minimum of three. Any ideas? Not that it matters, just curious.

Hope everyone had a good Turkey Day and Denise you had a good run....

JoeK

2011-11-26 1:22 PM

in reply to: #3435045

Regular

108

Crystal Coast

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

Jeff,

I think the wetsuit is the one area you can "buy" speed and for me it also corrects a sinking "rear" section and other form issues such as my roll during my stroke along with sighting. I think you will be a bit surprised the first time you swim with it, especially in saltwater which also of course helps with your bouyancy.

Never heard about the +20 year "stay" on reoccurance for shingles once you had them. Good news since I am with you, once is enough.

2011-11-27 7:42 AM

in reply to: #3915574

Expert

1191

Sarasota, FL

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

JoeK - 2011-11-26 2:22 PM

Jeff,

Never heard about the +20 year "stay" on reoccurance for shingles once you had them. Good news since I am with you, once is enough.

Wetsuit - I can use all the help I can get!!

2011-11-27 6:17 PM

in reply to: #3915337

Champion

10618

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

JEFF -

Naw, I'm hanging on just to amuse myself, with no hope of eventual survival. I can't remember if I speculted thusly before, but I reckon the it will end up with about 45 in A-A, and me at about 63rd, and with 46-90 thus at H-M. So, instead of the top 6% as I've been the past two seasons, this year will be more like high-seven/low-eight. So it goes.

A
a
a
a
a
r
r
r
g
g
g
g
h
h
h
h
h
h
h
h!!!!!!!!!!!!

2011-11-27 6:22 PM

in reply to: #3916058

Champion

10618

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

JEFF and JK -

All the yummy talk about wetsuits converged nicely with a "preferred customer" offer I received from DeSoto, with 15% from T-day through today. Their First Wave tops are regularly $319 and $260, and while I had figured on going with the lower-priced one, that offer makes the higher one only a few dollars more than the other, so that's what I did. What I get for the extra money is 5mm of neoprene instead of 2mm from wrists to just above elbows, so that should add some paddleness to my scrawny lower arms. Halleloo!

2011-11-27 6:42 PM

in reply to: #3915572

Champion

10618

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

JK -

When you mention having only one 21-miler prior to "the race"....is that the marathon to which you're referring?

If so, that's not too shabby. Many plans will have the long run peak at 20-22 miles, figuring that adrenaline (in concert with wise race-day pacing, of course!) will carry one those extra 4-6 miles. That's not a bad strategy, really, given the number of people (that would include me, twice) who manage to compromise some body part too close to race day by doing too many longer runs leading up to it.

So, it really is a crapshoot --- go with big miles and risk injury, or hold back some and risk the nether world of terra incognita in the form of those final few previoulsy uncharted miles. My vote is for the latter, unless you are one of those bionic types who never seems to get hurt.

As for outdoor runs -- DO 'EM! At the very least , do them and think of me, who would love to run all winter in your "wintry" conditions. The bad part of taking my run off-season now is that when I return it will be consistently sub-freezing, and with only worse to come up through February, really. I do myself no favors by dressing about as minimally as is even remotely safe, but even if I bundled up it still wouldn't be too pleasant -- and that's just the temperatures. Add to that snow and slush and ice, and it has very little to recommend it. Yech.

But, run I must!!!

.......

2011-11-27 7:13 PM

in reply to: #3916460

Expert

1191

Sarasota, FL

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

stevebradley - 2011-11-27 7:22 PM JEFF and JK - All the yummy talk about wetsuits converged nicely with a "preferred customer" offer I received from DeSoto, with 15% from T-day through today. Their First Wave tops are regularly $319 and $260, and while I had figured on going with the lower-priced one, that offer makes the higher one only a few dollars more than the other, so that's what I did. What I get for the extra money is 5mm of neoprene instead of 2mm from wrists to just above elbows, so that should add some paddleness to my scrawny lower arms. Halleloo!

Doesn't come with a propeller? Darn!!

JoeK

2011-11-27 8:44 PM

in reply to: #3435045

Regular

108

Crystal Coast

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

Steve,

Yep...my reference to the race was the marathon. But I really got to get it together, Thanksgiving and kids in town got me a bit distracted along with a lot of extra calories. So much for the whining, I will hit the pavement this week for all you north of the mason dixon line. Good advice on taking it a bit easy on my training. I am prone to injury and so keeping an eye on the number/distance of long runs is sage advice. I did get my new running shoes this week so that should help.

I didn't realize wetsuit sleeves came in 5mm or that they are normally +300. That should help move some water. Hopefully you will get an early spring this year so you can try it out a bit earlier.

2011-11-27 9:25 PM

in reply to: #3916616

Champion

10618

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

JK -

Oh. Yeah. I forgot to mention that your ramping-up of the mileage is very conservative, and i mean that in a good sense. That is, such conservatism is one of the best ways to stave off injuries, which usually come when people try to get too aggressive too quickly. The 10% rule works kinda sorta okay for most people, but not all. And also, quite truthfully, injuries can happen even during recovery weeks.....but being conservative in your mileage increases can't do anything but help more than being reckless or over-ambitious.

Onwards!!!

2011-11-27 9:27 PM

in reply to: #3916518

Champion

10618

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

JEFF -

No, no propeller......but I'm hoping those thicker arms will add a "Mississippi paddleboat" touch to my swim!

2011-11-29 4:06 PM

in reply to: #3435045

Expert

801

Oklahoma City

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

Hi kids. I've been training for my first half mary at White Rock in Dallas this weekend, and it looks like it's a go. I crashed my mountain bike last Friday and hit my bad knee on a rock, so it was touch and go again, but my knee appears to be holding up with little to no swelling. Just a tiny clicking noise and no pain at all. I've started my taper and run three miles tomorrow, two the next and nothing until raceday Sunday.

I ran 12 miles this past Sunday and I have to say that my cardiovascular fitness seems to be fine. It's my body that starts hurting at around mile 8. Feet, shins, knees, hips....that's where I hurt. I don't know if it's a matter of conditioning my body to get used to the longer runs before the pain goes away, or if the pain plans to stick around for all my future long runs? The good news is I wasn't as sore the day after as I have been with my other "longish" runs. And by today all the soreness was gone.

I looked at White Rock's website and they only provide nutrition at miles 17 & 23, so obviously I'll need to carry my own. Just sticking with the mini Cliff bars and Gu's. For my 12 mile run last Sunday I ate a banana 30 minutes before I ran, then two mini Cliffs and 4 Gu's throughout and still felt hungry at the end of my run. I'm wondering what the heck I need to do to get enough fuel? Is there a formula? I had this same problem at Redman Half Aquabike, and my coach said something about me not getting enough to eat for breakfast that morning. Sooooo.....I'm going to eat a couple of eggs and a slice of toast for breakfast, then 30 minutes before the race I will have a bagel with cream cheese and a banana. Jeez....that's a lot of food.

2011-11-29 5:40 PM

in reply to: #3919438

Champion

10618

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

TRINA -

I just went to the White Rock site, and at least the water stops (with Gatorade Endrance Formula at all of them) are generous -- especially after about mile five. If you take a small hit of the G-ade at most of the stops, that should help quite a bit. Hopefully, it will be mixed not too strong.....not too weak.....but just right!

Your questions about nutrition (".....what the heck i need to do to get enough fuel?" and "Is there a formula?") are good ones, and time-honored ones......and unfortunately ones for which answers can be both elusive and ephemeral. By that I mean that it is hard for most people to settle on something that seems to work, and then inevitably there is the race in which it DOESN'T work.

For you and White Rock, though, here are some quickish thoughts:
(1) Be careful about eating too much for breakfast, or even pre-race, especially if you haven't done it previously.
(2) I can't remember you time for Redman aqbk, but I'm guessing a bit more than four hours -- 3+ for the bike, around 50 for the swim? Let's say 4:15, and then let's say 2:30 for White Rock, so that is an extra 1:45 at redman compared to W.R. --- that is a whole lot more "need" at Redman!
(3) Carrying forth with that, a plus to Redman was that you got to carry things on the bike. The negative, though, was nothing throughout the swim, and then you were probably somewhat limited in eating on the bike just because it can be kind of acrobatic/daredevilish to do so. A plus to W.R. is all those water stops, and all those chances for the electrolytes of the Gatorade.
(4) No formula, other than what gel companies recommend -- about every 45 minutes. So, if all you did were gels, you could have one about 10 minutes before the start, and then one at :45, one at 1:30, and one at 2:15 to carry ypu on home (to the finish line, that is). If you worry about that not being enough, you could aim for every 35-40 minutes, so that would have taking four, maybe, based on a 2:30 time.
(5) Your protocol for the 12-miler was good, maybe even great. AND NOW-----
(6) You say you were hungry at the end -----but do tyou think it affected your run at all? Think about that for a while, and try to divorce the (prefectly-normal) feelings of hunger after a long effort from anyhting to do with perfomance. That stuff would be cramping at the least, and just not being able to move forward at the worst. If neither of those happened, then just being hungry isn't so bad. For better that then getting sick, as in feeling bloated at best and throwing up by the side of the road at worst.
(7) And I'm guessing that the fact you had no post-run soreness, to speak of, suggests that your nutrition was indeed fine. Those problems of feetshinskneeships aren't likely related to nutrition at all, and probably have everything to do with eiitehr running form or just still getting adjusted to longer distances.

Sooooo........
I say to eat what you ate before the 12-miler (and what exactly was that, might I ask?????).
I also say to stick closely to Sunday's plan, with the only exception being to squeeze in a gel about 10 minutes before the start. Have the banana 30 minutes before, and carry the four gels and two mini-Clifs with you.
I also-also say to use the aid stations as well as you can; that's what they're there for! If the G-ade doesn't seem to sit well with you, then just go with water. Also, realistically, you can probably wait until the second aid station to start in on the G-ade, which might give you time for your stomach to lose some of the agitation-prioducing butterfklies that often accompnay a race start. Also, the first station might be a mob scene, so if you can bypass that it will make life easier. But if you need/want something there, then better to go for it than do without.

PLEASE let me know how that all sounds to you, and fire away with other questions as needed. And at this point -- take it all very easy. The work is in the bank, and anythi ng you do from now until race day will have no bearing on your performance. All you maybe need is one or two short runs to keep yourself loose, and if you focus on anything during them, it's just matters of form. NO speed or quasi-speed stuff at all, y'hear?

2011-11-29 8:15 PM

in reply to: #3919438

Expert

1191

Sarasota, FL

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

kickitinok - 2011-11-29 5:06 PM

Good luck with the race Trina. The good news.... you won't have to deal with that summer heat!!!

2011-11-29 10:10 PM

in reply to: #3435045

Expert

801

Oklahoma City

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

Steve - Thanks for the input. Sunday I woke, ate two eggs, three slices of turkey bacon and a slice of dry toast. Washed it all down with a diet coke (I know...I know...). Then two hours later I had the banana, and you know the rest. From what I gather feeling hungry during a race, which I noticed a bit of hungry feel at around mile 9-10, isn't good? In terms of being hungry at the end....I'm new to long distance running so I don't know if it affected my performance or not. No, I didn't cramp. Yes, at the end I felt like I couldn't go on, but that was just leg/knee/feet/hip pain, and if forced to I could have kept going. I overshot my run by about a half a mile and instead of running the extra distance I called my hubby to come pick me up. LOL! I was tired!

Anyway, I tend to shy away from Gatorade as the sweet-sour mix in it makes me burp for hours afterward. I think I will just stick to water. Even though it's going to be cool outside, I still sweat profusely...so water intake may be an issue also. During my long runs I hide a bottle of water and a Gu and/or mini Cliff bar behind a tree or something every three miles before I start my run as I hate wearing belts. This plan has worked like a charm during training, but won't work during a race so I'm totally relying on the aid stations for all of my fluids.

I'm really happy that I'm doing this half mary. Running has always been my weak sport (by far) and I kind of feel like I'm slaying a dragon mentally as well as physically by running in this race. This will also help me tie together all aspects of a HIM, and help me get mentally prepared for a HIM this coming tri season.

Again, thanks for the advice!

2011-11-29 10:12 PM

in reply to: #3919735

Expert

801

Oklahoma City

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

junthank - 2011-11-28 9:15 PM

kickitinok - 2011-11-29 5:06 PM

Good luck with the race Trina. The good news.... you won't have to deal with that summer heat!!!

Thanks, Jeff! I am so happy about racing in cool weather! Give me this temp all year! I seriously think I could handle swimming AND biking better in it, and no doubt on the run. Hmmm....should I go north next year for all my races after April? I think I should...

2011-12-02 7:37 AM

in reply to: #3919885

Champion

10618

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

TRINA -

That's a decent pre-un/race breakfast, but if it works for you then stick with it. It will certainly help to stave off hunger during the race, and if the hunger pangs bother you, then whatever you can do to reduce them will be a benefit.

I think what i was trying to say in my last post was that feeling hungry during a race is not a bad thing. In fact, unless it is acute, it shouldn't affect performance at all. It MAY indicate that one didn't eat enough pre-race, but when it happens to me (and I do eat skimpily before a race) I just figure it's part of my "strategy".

I mostly try to avoid anything that might contribute to nausea, or even a sense of being bloated, and if I feel hungry during a race I can accept that.

With your gels and Cif bars, you should be fine sticking to water. Lots of people do, for the reasons you mention. I consider myself kind of fortunate that I can stomach most energy drinks and most gels, and maybe that gives me some support for eating skimpily on race morning.

I don't use belts, either, and rely on DeSoto 4-pocket tri shorts. These have two pockets on each leg, and can hold a fair amount of stuff; they are not "flappy" pockets, so there is no sense of carrying baggage. MY tri tops are also DeSoto, and have pockets that I seldom use, but they're there if I need them. Anyhow, look into those as a possible off-season purchase --- I think they'd make a great Christmas present! See them at www.desotosport.com, and they should be listed under the Forza line.

What's the latest weather forecast for W.R.? Someone elsewhere said, a few days ago, that it was dicey, but that was then; how's it looking now?

SLAY THAT DRAGON!!!!!!

2011-12-03 7:47 AM

in reply to: #3435045

Expert

1191

Sarasota, FL

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

Registration for my 1st 3 races in 2012 (Check)

Purchase Wetsuit (Check)

Purchase Bike Trainer (Check)

Umm... Making XMAS shopping for my wife much easier this year...

Can't wait for 2012... I'm pumped!!!! Got some work to do though!!!

2011-12-04 11:47 AM

in reply to: #3435045

Expert

801

Oklahoma City

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

Ok I'm going to try and make this as painless as possible.

I am so disappointed. I didn't race today. I made the call yesterday after I saw this morning's forecast. 40F, heavy rain and 15-20mph winds all day. Not to mention we would have had to leave immediately after the race to travel home because snow storm is supposed to be heading into OKC late this afternoon.

Racing in freezing rain is NOT fun for me. I ran a 5K at OKC Memorial Marathon last year in the cold rain and it was miserable...and that was 10 degrees warmer. Swore I'd never run in cold rain again.

Sooooo....Now I'm looking to do the Ft. Worth Cowtown Half Mary at the end of February.

I'm sad. It was an emotional ride getting ready for this race with all my injuries and illnesses leading up to race date. To have it screwed up by horrid weather is just...I don't have any word for it.

2011-12-04 11:48 AM

in reply to: #3924561

Expert

801

Oklahoma City

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

junthank - 2011-12-02 8:47 AM

Registration for my 1st 3 races in 2012 (Check)

Purchase Wetsuit (Check)

Purchase Bike Trainer (Check)

Umm... Making XMAS shopping for my wife much easier this year...

Can't wait for 2012... I'm pumped!!!! Got some work to do though!!!

Sounds like you've got it all handled WTG!!

2011-12-04 10:02 PM

in reply to: #3925470

Champion

10618

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

TRINA -

I'm glad you're home, and well. A guy from my other group did the marathon (his first), and in his initial post about it this afternoon referred to himself at the finish as a "stumbling, babbling, shivering wreck". You might want to read his posts, both at the "mojo" group, which is in the archives. He is Av8Tx.

Sometimes discretion is the better part of valor, and through the benefit of hindsight you made the absolute correct decision -- especially given that it would've been your first go at that distance. You were aiming for it as a final bridge towards a half-iron.....but given the conditions it would've needed an asterisk next to it. That is, it likely wouldn't've refelcted the reallity of whatever your first half-iron turns out to be, as our results and experience would've been skewed by the weather.

That said, though, I fully understand your disappointment. I can only say that what is sharp and painful now will self-blunt before too long, and it sure will help that you have Cowtown coming along so soon. Thank goodness there are lotsalotsa of these things, huh? And, FWIW, Fuht Wuth is one of my favorite cities. I was never keen on Dallas, but any visit to F.W. was wonderful. I will have no trouble living vicariously through you if you do Cowtown!

Finally, you have those miles in the bank, and while you couldn't cash them in today.....they'll just sit there a whuile longer and nicely accrue interest. It'll be good to take a bit of time off, reassess how you're feeling (physically), and then re-build towards Cowtown. That'll be a chance to work through a training plan without injury or illness, and that could well work hugely towards your benefit -- maybe even making Cowtown a better experience for you than W.R. would've been, even had the weather been better.

Finally-finally, do have a look at what Jeff (Av8Tx) wrote on the other site, just to help put your mind in a better place.

And, please, let me know in a day or two as to how you are feeling (psychologically).

Illegitimum non carborundum!

Edited by stevebradley 2011-12-04 10:05 PM

2011-12-08 6:24 PM

in reply to: #3435045

Expert

801

Oklahoma City

Subject: RE: BigSkiesMentorGroup - COMPLETE!

Hey Steve - Thanks for the pep talk and the perspective. I'm 100% confident in my decision not to race. I did go and read the posts on your other mentor forum - sounds like your friend had hypothermia! I did also hear that there was a runner from Kenya that had to be hospitalized for hypothermia (internal temp of 88 degrees), and that the race docs were super busy treating people for hypothermia on site.

I was thinking the same thing(s) - I wanted this to be a bridge to a HIM, and the experience wouldn't have been an accurate one. Also, I kind of want my first half mary to be an enjoyable one - not a "Oh wow that hurt why in the hell did I do that" one. In the worst case I may not have finished the race due to the cold, and that would have hurt my confidence in the future. I followed my gut on this one, and my gut told me that running in cold rain isn't fun.

I was pretty bummed for a couple of days, but I'm back training again and hopefully I will be all the better for Cowtown like you said. Just hope my old knee holds up....I'm sure it will

Hope everyone's having a wonderful holiday season!