Will drills with fins help or hurt a weak kicker?

I am by no means an expert, but I'd say using the fins are not helping you. It sounds like you kick too much from your knees if you go forward on your back and backwards on your stomach.

Your kicking should come from your hips, your legs should be pretty close together. Kicking with fins masks not kicking from the hips to a certain extent.

Others who know more may chime in here....

I use fins to help me work on my body position in the water and to strengthen my hips. Not so much to work on my kicking...

When your foot has flexibility like this, or lack of, you can kick down and it will hook the water causing you to go backward, hips drop, legs drop. You are not kicking the same way on your back , you are forcing the water in a different manner that is beneficial to your lack of flexibility. Zoomers will help increase your flexibility over time,they did for me, not in one session though, and longer fins are ok too, they will save you leg cramps. Zoomers are also good for drills too, other than warmup and drills dont use them, they can hurt your conditioning if abbused.

You will create propulsion, reduce drag and raise your hips with flexibility like this or better. Zoomers and sitting on ankles will increase your range of movement. The picture below is a minimum amount of flexibility you should have, the more the better!

I do not have close to that flex in my ankles. When using the fins this AM I could feel the stretching in my ankles and feet. To the point that the arches of my feet almost started to cramp. I will keep drilling with the fins. I have high arches and very rigid feet. My orthopedic surgeon has commented on my lack of flexibility in the lower legs and hips. I guess I need to really focus on this. Anyone know any good exercises or yoga moves that might help?

chevy57 

x2 for ^, get Zoomers (Blue) and use them appropriately.

The one thing about doing kicking drills with fins is that you will learn to kick from the hip properly, at least for me it did. 

I'll use fins and with or without paddles at times.  The sensation of moving fast in the water helped me to know what it means to move through the water efficiently.

I've dabbled in yoga, and like it, despite that it's a little hard for me to be serious when i'm falling all over the place b/c I stink at it. None the less, a few yoga classes would probably help give you the ideas you need, plus you'll get variations for beginners and more advanced. Probably better than just what you'll find on say youtube. MntChick13 is a good resource for some online yoga.

Don't beat yourself up too much about lack of flexibility in the feet, you can get there. I was told 6 months ago that I should never run more than a 5K until I have 9 months of ankle strengthening exercises (specifically 20 mins, 4x/week of wobble board exercises) under my belt b/c my ankles are too flexible and have no stability. What's the cause of such weak ankles giving me no support on the run? 25 years of swimming. Regardless, you do need some flexibility to learn to kick, or at least to drag your feet in such a way that they're not holding you back (I'm more an upper body swimmer who doesn't kick much anyway)...which is going to take a more flexible foot. Imagine pulling a kickboard through the water vertically vs. horizontally. The more flexible your feet get the more horitzontal they become. Could give the zoomers a shot. And the kicking from the hips is huge. I teach my kids 'straight legs, floppy ankles'.

Thanks for all of the responses. I googled the Zoomers that someone mentioned and found some very interesting reading about the foot angle. They say that ankles with less than 40 Degrees of movement will go backwards. By looking I would estimate I have about 15 degrees and I go backwards. I am learning quite a bit through this exercise. I tried to keep my knees straight and kick from the hip, but I went backwards faster. In order to go forward I need to bend my knees. This makes sense because it is the only way I can get the top of my foot to push down on the water. I would like to get a set of zoomers, but they now have Zoomers red, blue or Z2. Which ones should I get?

chevy57 

Hey Chevy!

I go backwards when I kick too. I'm told this is pretty common for "runners" who tend to have decreased ankle flexibility - but it gives my wife and the lifeguards a good laugh when I demonstrate it with a kickboard.

I've determined that, in the pool, I've still gotta kick to try to keep my legs up. But, in open water with a wetsuit, I don't kick at all because I assume the "negative thrust" would just slow me down and I might as well save my legs for the bike and run anyway!

I've been working hard to point my toes - but I think this has lead to some cramping at times too. I've done a little work with flippers/zoomers - I'm going to try more this winter.

No real advice here - just sympathy for the "negative kick". 

My kick is pretty bad so I use fins - but sparingly...  To be honest, I never wear them unless I'm doing kick drills, otherwise, I would be there all day and exausted after a couple hundred yards.

I DON'T want to rely on them - so I don't use them.  I tend to believe that in long distance swimming, the kick is used more for balance and rotation, so I work on that.

chevy,

while i'm not a very good swimmer yet (i am getting better), i would suggest to just keep trying to point your toes and make your kick wider. i tried it today, with short flutter kicks and longer ones and i could tell a difference. It's more tireing, but, once you get used to it, it shouldn't be so bad.

Good luck!

Left Right,

I am with you 100%. The biggest mistake I made was trying one of those pull buoys because I felt how fast and efforless my stroke could be. My intention is not kick for propulsion I just want it to keep my toes off the bottom of the pool. I have all winter to try to improve on this and enjoy figuring the whole thing out. I, like you have a back up plan so if I can't figure it out I will simply not kick. I find it a bit amusing because people at the YMCA where I swim notice that I don't kick. Several of the veterans have told me I will be much faster if I kick. I don't have the heart to tell them that I go slower if I kick and the harder I kick the slower I go. 

chevy57