Stickyrunner01's Group - The bus is FULL! (Page 11)

Jayne,

First, here's my disclaimer: I have not actually used the method I'm about to suggest you look into, but I'm mentioning it more as something perhaps you can consider as I've read some benefits from it... It sounds like the main reason you like using the fins is to help with your breathing so you can focus on your form.  In which case, (you may laugh, but!) perhaps consider getting a snorkel.  My local running store (who also promotes triathlons) puts out a weekly e-newsletter, and they have suggested (along with their shameless plug of making this purchase at their store ) that snorkels can help so that you can put more focus on your form without having to worry about the breathing... which I think would be helpful as a beginner.  I personally cannot say either way if it's a good or bad method (maybe someone else has something to say about this), but maybe something worth considering...

Went to the school for my normal 5am swim and the cover was still on from the long weekend.  Of course, they don't give the lifeguard a key to remove the cover, and there were no janitors to be found, so the 7 of us went home.  Don't know if I will be able to find another place to swim tonight or not.

Fins:  Thanks for all of your suggestions.  I don't want to become dependent on them (mentally or physically), so next time I'm leaving them at home.  I like to go fast (be it on a bike, run, swim, motorcycle, :-) so I'm still struggling with learning "going slow" and go long--It's never been my forte! I may need to rest after every 25 yards, but you understand, right?

Seren:  Good luck with your race next weekend.  We'll all be anxiously waiting for the race report! 

Jayne,

I would agree with others use the fins to get comfortable in the water and to build leg strength but don't get dependent on them. Balance in the water and technique over time will make you more comfortable and more efficient. Practice technique without them and you will build endurance.

My master's swim is on break right now so I have been making my own workouts. I do at least 200 yrds with a pull buoy in between my thighs, this helps me think about my catch and recovery form and also breathing form without having to keep my kick in order, this might be something you can use as a tool as well.  Then I do at least 200 yrds with a kickboard, I "race" myself each lap, just to see what kick gets me the best speed. I alternate between the flutter kick and the dolphin kick.  you could also throw in some sprint sets. I am working on 5 xs 50s full speed ahead.

Seren, I am very interested in hearing about your winter tri!!! good luck to you! we are all cheering you on

Everyone sounds like their training is going well. I feel like a slacker most of the time, but my little girl and I have been fighting all this icky winter time sinus crud. I did leisurely ride my bike this weekend for the first time in 2 months. it was beautiful outside so I didn't have to worry about the weather, but I didn't have a babysitter so I took the baby in the bike trailer, we took it slow and easy lol.

Very good point.  Thats what we're after anyway.  I think you can surprise yourself Jayne.   Keep trying to work past where you are comfortable, not real far but work past it.  Maybe an extra 25-50 yards.  It's okay to really be suckin wind at the other end of the pool, just make sure you take time to catch your breath.

I got a 6 mile run in tonight.  I have been a little frustrated for the past few days because I hate missing my workouts.  I just started the HIM training plan and missing 2 workouts in the second week is driving me nuts. 

My run was really good!  I would have been a little faster had it not been for the icy spots on some of the roads I use.  Mostly everything was clear but there were spots that I could feel myself slipping a bit and there is a dark stretch of road that I couldn't see very well that felt the need to slow down for extra caution.

Tomorrow I have band practice and probably won't be able to get a workout in.  At best it will be a swim, which is what I would like to get in.

Got a good bike in this morning and a good run tonight.  I just increased the total time of my running intervals from 18 to 21 minutes on Monday, and wow could I feel the difference.  I really struggled on Monday (treadmill) with the longer running segments than normal, but tonight (outdoors) it went well. I have my iPod set up with a playlist for my runs.  Check out my training log if you want to be amused by the random collection of music.  What are some of your favorite running songs?

Tomorrow's a swim day and I'm leaving the fins at home :-)  Jessica mentioned working with a pull buoy and I have done that a few times and am getting better at it.  The first couple of laps I was all over the place!  It was pretty funny really, but now I actually feel like I can swim further when I'm pulling.  Maybe I'm wearing myself out by kicking too much????  Is that even possible?   I've been watching some of the swim technique videos on GoSwim and YouTube and I'm starting to understand the importance of balance and the way the catch/pull/push is supposed to work.  Now it's just putting the time in to make it happen.  Thanks for all of your advice and suggestions.  

Maybe if we were friends... *tear*

I am SO over winter and the frozen road situation. The neighborhoods I typically run in haven't been getting plowed, and they are a mess. I will gladly take 85 and Humid over this any day.

Sounds like the run stuff is coming together.  As far as the treadmill goes, IMO, I think the treadmill is harder.  One reason is that your are working inside where the temp. is at 68-72 degrees and tour body has to work harder to keep cool.  Outside staying cooler is obviously not a problem this time of year.  The paces on a treadmill are also consistent, constantly, where outside your body will sped up and slow down slightly many times during your runs without you being consciously aware it is happening.

Pull buoy are amazing to help focus on the catch and pull  aspects of the stroke.  I would definitely work those in during your swims.  I currently do 2x250 with the pull buoy toward the beginning of my workouts.  Also the fins make you work harder when trying to stroke.  Consider that you are moving more water with your kick while wearing fins that not, therefore increasing your effort and workload on your heart.  I tire more easily while wearing fins doing stroke work than when I am not wearing fins.  I use kick drills using fins to help recover from harder sets and as leg strengthening.

Either way it sounds like your training is coming right along.  Good work.

It's definitely possible to wear yourself out from kicking too hard/much. I personally find that I can go for more strokes between breaths when using the pullbuoy and still swim about the same distances.

Did my first run of over an hour this morning! Got my pacing pretty good and felt good for the whole run (the light drizzle of rain probably helped too).

Agree!!!  Spring can't get here soon enough.  

Jayne! awesome! I love working with the pull buoy, I find that if I begin with 200 yrds of that and then 200 yrds flutter kick with the board, I warm up quite nice and get find that "sweet" spot while pacing for 1000yrds non stop.  A quick question, have you had any formal training for swimming? I ask because I was very consistent going to the pool and working at form, I watched all the videos and read all the books etc.(this was about 3 months of work)  but still 100 yrds and I was gassed out! then I joined the local ymca masters swim, and really I was the only person in it lol so the coach catered to my upcoming 820yrd open water swim, in about 3 weeks (same hours and days practice as I did before) I was swimming 1000 yrds with gas left in the tank. I think that having someone standing up there, watching my every stroke/ kick and giving me constant feedback was the key! just food for thought.

As for the kicking wearing you out! for sure! My coach kept saying "you're not even kicking, you have stronger legs then arms kick a  little" I felt like I was kicking but it was wearing me out. One reason I do the kickboard drills is because I realized that even though I was wasting energy "kicking" i was not kicking correctly or efficiently. now I race myself every 25yrds with the kickboard to find that "sweet" spot where I am moving quickly but without too much effort. anyways, I thought I'd mention the coach thing.

dirk, what kind of band are you in?

I opted out of my run this morning, it misted all day yesterday and then we had blowing wind and 10 degree temps, so it was a slick mess out there this am. I cannot do the treadmill, not sure why, I just get soooooo bored and lose interst quickly. I did a kickboxing dvd in my living room for some cardio and strength training and I will be at the pool tonight. So I am with everybody else, READY FOR SPRING

I think the bolded part of the quote is my problem. When trying to do kicksets (of any kind) I literally go nowhere! I can swim 100m in exactly the same time with or without a pullbuoy. Hopefully I'll soon be in a position to sort out some 1-2-1 swim coaching and find out what I'm doing wrong

I have the same problem.  When I use a kickboard I go nowhere. I think it might have to do with kicking with the whole leg creating a drag problem.  Let me know if you ever figure it out

One thought comes to mind when talking about using kickboards would be that I would say to check your body posture while kicking. Typically, when you are up on the board your body is no longer parallel to the water surface, which is causing more drag than usual. This fact coupled with the fact you are no longer using strokes to cover the pool distance makes sense as to why you aren't moving as fast.

Double post

Edited by Stickyrunner01 2011-01-20 1:49 PM

It makes no difference if I use a kickboard or not I go absolutely nowhere. I might retry some kicksets again at some point in the future, but they just annoy me at the moment

Haha, yeah, swimming in general annoys me!

Folks, what is on slate for the weekend?

As Tom was saying the kick not an efficient way to get anywhere in the pool.  Your arms are the big propellers when it comes to swimming.  I would suggest that you increase your kick stroke a bit.  Sometimes I think people only kick about half of what they can do effectively.  I am guilty of this also, especially when I begin to tire. 

Another thing about kicking, you shouldn't be bending your legs a lot during the kick.  The kick should come more from the hips and not as much from the quads.  You should feel the kicking in the front of your legs toward the front of your pelvic bones.  Make sure you still bend you legs but its a more subtle bending  and a quick motion to extend your leg in a fast powerful motion.

I got a 4000 yd. swim in tonight and I am beat.  I am planning a 9 mile run for tomorrow but they are saying sub-zero wind chills are the order so I am not sure how I will handle my long run.

Jessica, I play drums for our church so not a whole lot of activity with it.  I took up playing about 7 years ago when I had an ACL reconstruction and 4 months off work.



Edited by DirkP 2011-01-20 9:14 PM

My Friday run is in jeopardy as well. Those temps aren't looking too appealing. I typically bartend 10:30-9:30 on Fridays and with class from 8:00-8:45 I would have to squeeze a run in at 9am. With those temps, I am not sure I want to layer up just for a 3 miler. While the treadmill is a possibility, I have trouble with my anterior tibialis when I run on it. Makes it painfully uncomfortable.

However, 3 miles is a lot less than 9. Best of luck! My roommate is running 12 tomorrow, I'd hate to be him...

Well, not actually, because he is in 15:45 5k shape. I'd love to be back in that shape again!

A nice short 30min run on Sunday morning and hopefully a 1000m swim (though that is a bit up in the air at the mo).


Are we talking sub-zero C or F? if it's C then just layer up and go for it (I've been out for a run in temps down to -7c (-11c with wind chill)). If it's F, then I don't think even I'd be mad enough to go out (but I'd consider it )

Its in F.  I wouldn't even know what -13 would be in C.  You know how we are here in the States, rebellious!  We don't like the rule of the oppressive rule of the monarchy (American Revolution, War of 1812). We're not gonna do what you want us to do.  LOL

I am probably going to try to suck it up, put on my big boy pants and go out this morning, but first I have to take my daughter to the periodontist.  I want to get out before the wins starts to pick up much but I don't think its going to happen that way.

Hi all!I agree with everyone here.... Pool swimming sux! I find that half the time my kicking slows me down and I often don't even kick. Unless of course I want to turn on the turbo! I'm probably not kicking efficiently. Thank god I replaced pool swimming with xc skiing! . I left early to stay ahead of the snowstorm that is plaguing the northeast and an up in NH this morning where the snow is coming dien pretty steady. Today's workout will be elliptical (courtesy of my run coach) weightlifting and maybe a short xc ski. Tomorrow will be probably 20 minutes of run, 20 minutes of bike and 20 minute of xz ski. Then Sunday is race time!!!!

I passed on my run. it's -2 with a wind chill of -17. NO THANKS! I froze just walking to/from class. I will probably just hop on the trainer tonight for 90 minutes and run tomorrow.

Happy Friday Everyone.