Jenny (jsnowash)'s Spring Guinea Pig Group - CLOSED (Page 13)

Some of my most favorite runs ever have been later at night, after dark.  I recognize the safety issues that some of us might face by running late at night, but I've done some summer runs after dark, no music, just me and the night that were absolutely magical.  The cadence of your footsteps, the rhythm of your breathing, being alone with your thoughts.  All very nice.

Jenny gave me my first Bike Interval workout this morning.  She prescribed a 1 hour "Threshold" ride, starting of with a 15 minute warm up.  Then 3 x 5 minutes "at 10K pace" with 5 minutes EZ riding between each.  A cool down to end naturally enough.

Later this week she has me doing my second bike ride of the week (a "Sweet Spot" ride) "at somewhere between Half and Full Marathon paces", and a third ride at EZ cruising pace.

I had to snicker when I opened her spreadsheet and saw where she equated the bike paces she wanted to running paces.  Knowing I am an experienced runner - and an inexperienced biker - this was a smart way for her to help me "get" what effort level she was looking for.

So, I tried to make sure I was doing the harder portions today at a "comfortably hard" pace, which is how I can find my 10K running pace.  I had enough time in my cool down segment that I could have fit in a 4th repeat, but decided not to.

Since I hadn't ridden in over a week I made all kinds of newbie mistakes.  I actually rode the 1st two harder segments on the small ring since I thought I was on the big ring, but wasn't.  Being predawn, I really couldn't see the rings well enough.  I thought it was strange that my cadence seemed higher than I had remembered on earlier rides.  Duh!  But oddly enough the paces came in pretty close to each other regardless tha ring I was spinning.

After yesterday's 6 mile run and today's bike ride, my back is none too happy with me.  Crossing my fingers ...

Bill

4:30am wake-up calls are never easy, but I had a really good 9.5 mile run this morning.  Ran down toward the water and it was really peaceful - no cars on the road, a few bunnies and squirrels here and there, and not much else.  Not much of a sunrise here in the NY metro area since it's overcast and threatening to rain, oh well.

Happy Tuesday everyone!

I just purchased my first wetsuit.  It is a used rental suit so it was less expensive, but hopefully a good quality one.  When I took it out of the box, my husband said something to the effect, "Well, I was hoping you might want to get into a skin tight silicone outfit, but THAT is not the one!"  I haven't been in it yet, but I, too, wonder how I am going to squeeze my body into it!  I am going to try it in the local reservoir soon, but I need to find a swimming buddy because I don't think it is safe to try it alone.

I did an hour long spin class this morning.  The legs seemed to fly for some reason.  I told the class, "prepare for speed" and adjust your tension accordingly.  It felt great to me, but I think some of my class likes a little more variety of hills to slow down.  I find it too easy to "cheat" on hills by not pushing the effort.

Bill, I am interested in how you guage your intensity.  Do you just know the speed or is it more of a level of intensity?  I am interested to know how the others guage their individual efforts.  I think mine may be lazy, relaxed, relaxed +1, concentrated discipline, push it, sprint, puke.  (I am beginning to think I have an unhealthy relationship with vomit!!)

Janette

Janette,

For me it's all about effort.  If it feels really, really easy, it's recovery pace.  If it feels easy, it's easy pace.  If it feels like cruising, it's marathon pace.  If it feels comfortably hard, it's tempo pace.  If it feels really hard, then it's speedwork.  I can typically tell from my effort level pretty much what paces I'm running at.  You kinda get a really good feel for paces when you run as much as I have for a fair number of years.

I wear a Garmin when I run but I don't look at it for pace purposes.  I only use it during the run to know how far I may have run.  Once I upload the data, then I look to see what paces I did.  But it's usually right about what I thouth it was.

I had a fairly well known running Coach (Tinman) for a while who helped me get my BQ (after a couple of years of failed attempts) and then later to run the Boston Marathon itself.  When we first started out he immediately slowed me down on my every-day, just putting in the miles, runs.  He said I was an injury or burnout waiting to happen.  The first few weeks were tough as he had me running slower than I was used to.  But since I was paying him after all I decided to listen to him.  I found that when I did the two harder workouts he would give me per week that I was able to do them successfully (and with much less chance of injury) because my legs never got fried.  And it continued week after week.

I'll never forget what Tinman told me before my marathon.  He said "the first 10 miles must feel easy, the second 10 miles should feel moderate, and the last 10K will be hard, but you're almost Home".  On raceday, as I approached the starting line, I thought about what he said and decided right then and there to not look at the watch or a clock on the course, and just run as he said to.  I kept telling myself those first 10 miles keep it easy.  As a result I passed dozens of runners the last few miles.  I BQ'd with 19 seconds to spare and had over a 5 minute negative split.  (My avatar picture was taken about 10 seconds after I realized I had BQ'd.)

Sorry for the long post.  Just trying to describe why I love running by effort.  The paces will take care of themselves.

Bill

Bill, great post!  Thank you.  That makes sense to me.  Jenny's earlier comment about "first, you have to bake the cake" with base miles before you get to add the icing of speedwork applies to your comment that you have learned various levels of pace because of years of running.  Over the years, I have run for various reason:  to get a certain amount of cardio, to burn calories, to avoid thinking about something else, to get in shape before a certain run, etc.  But, I am at the stage in my running life that I think it is relevant to be intentional with my effort level too.  I think it is important because:  I want to prevent injury.  I want to remain interested.  I want to improve my running times.  I want to make running more enjoyable.

That last reason made me think of Mitch's post about running in the still of the night with the sound of footsteps, your breath, the peace of your thoughts.  Once in awhile, I have runs with that serenity, but I would like more and I think paying attention to effort may be part of that.

Just some meandering thoughts at the end of my lunch ....

Janette

I echo what Bill said regarding run paces and slowing down.  I've been involved with another Mentor group for over a year now where the Mentor advocates Maffetone's running/HR philosophy.  I have never bought into his HR methodology but did do a long block of deliberately slow running last fall.  That allowed me to build a base through frequent and longer runs.  That base allowed me to really attack some workouts on a weekly basis and I'll stipulate that all together those factors allowed me to PR a HM by about 4 minutes - and that was a time from 2008.

I really believe the following:

Run lots...mostly easy.

and...

Your easy is never easy enough and your hard is never hard enough.

Jenny's cycling workout for me this morning kicked my A$$!  I haven't had a really hard cycling workout in a while so it felt good to have to dig to get the last couple of intervals done.  The Main Set was 5x2' @ 120% of my FTP with 2' rest intervals.  I then got a graciously long 5' rest interval before I had to repeat the first set again. 

The last time I tested the speed I could maintain for 20' on my trainer was around 19.5mph and the speed I could maintain for 5' was 21.5mph.  Today my target pace on my trainer was 20.4mph.  My thighs are yelling at me a bit right now but its nice to hear them! 

Below are my splits and a link to the graph showing HR/speed as well as Garmin link too.  What's interesting is that you can see the cardiac drift as the workout continues and I'm not able to get my HR fully recovered between intervals.  I'll have to check - but I think I'm really happy with my avg HR on the intervals.  I think much lower than in the past for similar workouts.

http://www.beginnertriathlete.com/discussion/training/view-laps-v2.asp?uploadid=387634&memberid=67785&eventdate=5/9/2012&eventtime=5:42%20AM&zoneid=25832

http://connect.garmin.com/activity/176391071

Great workout mitch!! 

All this discussion of how to run has really taught me what NOT to do when I'm ready to run again. I've definitely learned my lesson of trying to do too much too fast. 

On another note - had a nice 30 min swim last night. I got to the pool a little late so just swam to get some lengths in. It's really nice to be enjoying swimming again. I had built up an aversion to swimming after many years of living at the pool but I've come to like it again and it's a good feeling. My SO is surprised to me saying "We have to go swimming tonight!" 

So, I have a newbie biker question.

Yesterday when I was doing the bike Threshold workout, during one of the fast parts, I came upon a traffic light which happened to be red.  Now at this time of day the traffic is nonexistent basically, and I looked hard both ways as I approached the intersection before sailing through it on red.  Obviously if there had been any indication whatsoever of a car approaching i would have stopped.

I know this is a big no-no, something I wouldn't normally do if I was just cruising and not booking it for a interval workout.  And I fully intend to be a responsible cyclist and follow the traffic laws while biking.  But how do y'all handle this situation when you're booking along fast and there's no traffic anywhere?

Bill

I was inspired by all the talk of interval training on the bike, so I created my own routine this morning and went for it.  After stretching and popping in a movie for my 1 hr workout...20min @time trial speed at a higher resistance (~23mph...I think, I wasn't really paying attention to the speedometer.  I was trying to find a full-out speed that I could maintain for 20 minutes), then 5 min @ more related recovery pace at a lower resistance (~15mph...again, not really paying attention to the speedometer, but that seems about right), then 4x5min intervals at same time trial speed, with 5mins in between intervals at a more relaxed recovery pace.  I was definitely feeling it at the end.

And after all that, I helped make lunches and got my daughter to school on time.

So all in all, a good morning.  

Mitch - awesome bike interval workout.  You must have major discipline to hold that pace there at the end.  Good work.  If you ever get a chance to pick up a spinning interval class, you can get some of that type of workout but also have partners to "race" with you and someone else to worry about the timing. 

Bill - keep in mind that I live in a small Montana town (and we are notorious speed limit violators here in the west), but I always blow through lights when no traffic is present.  About the only rules I follow are to keep far enough to the right so as not to impede traffic, yield to pedestrians, signal left turns, call out a verbal warning when overtaking a runner or another bike and always glance behind me before spitting or blowing snot.  I have had so many cars violate rules that endanger me on a bike that I get kinda stubborn about abiding by everything.  Note:  I can handle the criticism if someone disagrees with me.  I just may be the reason "those damn bikers" get a bad reputation.

I did my last long run at 5:30 am before my race on Saturday.  I used Bill's scale of intensity and ran 10 minutes easy, 15 minutes tempo pace, 10 minutes easy, 15 minutes tempo pace, 10 minutes easy, 5 minutes cool down.  I liked it, but I think my second tempo pace was a little weaker toward the end.  Good run though.

J.

That's exactly what I decided to do this morning.  Worked out okay.

The workout Jenny had me doing today was a 1 hour 15 minute ride containing another Interval workout.  But this one at "Sweet Spot" pace, which she loosely equated to HM pace.

10 to 15 mins. warm up
3x15 mins. @ Sweet Spot pace, 5 mins. easy recovery between
10 to 15 mins. cool down

I underestimated the mileage a little and actually rode for more like 1 hour 30 mins.  But it's all good.  Here's my lap data:

The other day, on the Threshold Intervals, I saw about 20.5 mph on the fast parts (target 10K pace).  Today 18.6 or so for the fast parts (target HM pace).  So I guess I rode at about the right paces today.  I was pretty well bushed at the end of the last one.  16 mph (+ or -) for the easy recovery segments seems a bit quick.  But they did feel easy today.  I guess that's a good thing!

I purposely never got off the upper handlebars today, not wanting to aggravate the back any more than necessary.  I suppose if I had gotten down on the bottoms I may have gained a bit of speed, but probably not much.  Back feels tight, but no achiness, so a success.

Bill

Bill, In Idaho (and many states), this is in fact perfectly legal.  Idaho Traffic Code allows cyclists to, basically, lower the warning/control sign one level.  Red lights/Stop signs can be driven through after slowing and ensuring traffic is clear.  Cyclist at the control device WILL yield to all other traffic/pedestrians when applicable.  On a personal note-I feel like asitting duck when I'm unclipped at a traffic light.  We're too small of a target for most (linattentive) drivers.  Drive safe and always assume the other guy DOESNT see you.

My left shin is still a bit sore but I'm not getting the cramping and more intense pain I was getting.  I added a bit of distance and speed to my run today to see how it would feel.  No lingering pain at the moment.  I'm going to see what my shin will tolerate and modify the rest of my week a bit.  No speed workouts but some added distance.

One thing that would help for next week is seeing if we can structure Monday as a rest day.  I find that to be my toughest day to get going early in the morning and also find that my legs just need one day off. 

Good morning, All.  I did a 55 minute spinning class this morning.  I then followed up with some strength training.  It sure is easy to neglect the strength work and the stretching.  I try to get two sessions of strength every week and yoga stretch every other day.  I usually stretch before getting ready for bed and I vary the stretchs based on what feels tightest.  Stretching before and after running or biking is just part of my routine, but I certainly could do more but I find myself rushing for time if I focus on stretching too much.  With an early morning workout time, it is easiest to stretch before and then once I am done, I do just enough to cool down, but then I am off to get kids ready for school, shower, throw in laundry and hustle to work.  Ah, the life!

J.

When I got back into fitness in 2006/2007 it was really spinning classes that got me started.  I was always fond of cycling so it was a natural environment for me to work in to lose weight.   was about 25 pounds heavier then as compared to now.  I would do at least 3 spinning classes a week.  Typically a couple Aerobic Endurance Rides and then either Hills, Speedwork or Anaerobic Threshold Intervals.  I pretty much went the days of the week with the instructors I liked best.  I really enjoyed those classes.

I have found that I get more out of my trainer rides in the basement...(1) my bike; (2) my workout; (3) my music or tv; (4) my house as opposed to going to the gym; (5) more measurable as I can map to power, speed and distance as opposed to bikes at the fitness club.

I'm seriously considering not running the Bayshore Half in 2 weeks. 

What with being sick for 3 weeks, the back that went weird on me last week, and the Tri training, my running mileage has dropped off the face of the earth.  The last 10 mile run I did was at the end of March.    I ran 7.5 miles this morning at 9:06 pace, with the last 4 or 5 miles at Marathon Pace and my HR showed that to be at Tempo effort.    Ouch.

I'm not at all sure I could run 13.1 miles right now and not have it be a PW.  Seriously, I might not be able to go sub-2 hours.  For someone who just ran a 1:44 in January, that is ugly.

Maybe I should just HTFU and whatever happens, happens.

Bill