Asphalt Junkies CLOSED AND GETTING OUR FIX (Page 151)

Tony I understand your feelings about the race. Maybe another way to look at it is this is a way to show the world how New York will continue on, adjust  to set backs but always press on. It could be even more inspirational in a way.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do!

Ok - battled the 50's in the pool today and even added 3 more. Ouch. I had to take longer rests after #3 and #6 so that is why I added 3 more.  I think the more beneficial way to complete a workout like this is to pick a pace you can sustain throughout the set on rests of 10-15 seconds but still at a really hard effort. I had a specific purpose of embracing the pain cave today though so I pushed as hard as I could each time. I am still feeling the effects of those hard efforts and have been as hungry as a horse all afternoon!

I noticed the strength training I've been doing today while I was in the pool. I don't think I feel a lot stronger necessarily but I felt like I was able to work from my lats and engage my upper back. I felt more controlled through my back, able to push through the stroke and avoid what usually feels like a twisting and pinching of my lower back. Hard to explain really but it was good. I hit the weight room again after the swim and increased my weight on several exercises and I have added a new one which is so far the hardest for me - the machine is an assisted pull-up/chin-up. I'm not very good at it but I'm trying.

So, my point is just to note my experience. I have been one of those who will skip the weights for more swim/bike or run. I'm not skipping anymore. Now I'm wondering if there is work I should be doing for my legs too!

If you are becoming hypoxic using during your swims while breathing every 4th stroke I would actually suggest you slow down some to allow you to swim without that experience, AND breath every 4th stroke.  I suggest this because it may be an indicator that you can improve your form by focusing on a slower, smoother and more efficient stroke.  By slowing down you will be able to focus more on your form because you won't be driving yourself into "rep exhaustion" if that normally occurs.  There is nothing wrong with becoming exhausted during your WO's but that should normally occur halfway to three quarters of the way through the WO.

I'll also say that Jeff's suggestion to swim long sets, just as we do long runs, can improve our swim fitness in the same manner.  Depending on what distance we chose to race, the long reps can challenge us mentally as well as physically and drive our fitness in both categories higher.  I have nearly always done sets of 500's in my routine at about a 2-3 times a month schedule.

The most likely cause of your legs dropping will be head position.  You are probably lifting your head out of the water which forces your legs to drop.  This would be the case with anyone raising their head while breathing so yo aren't some anomaly.

Try swimming slow enough that you can really focus on your head position.  Pay attention to what you do when you rotate to breath to your left.  You need to do this with nothing in mind other than seeing what happens to your head.  Are you lifting it from a line that changes the position of your head so that water would hit you in the face rather than the top of your head?  If you are turning your head correctly you should feel the water shedding across the top of your head.

A drill you can do to get better control of your head position:  Grab a kick board, place both of your hands on the kick board out in front of your head.  Now just push off the wall and practice holding your head in the proper position and breath bilaterally for 50 yards or so.  Do this at every swim session for the next month and you'll be surprised at how much faster this simple technical improvement will help your speed.

I am about 99% sure I am going to defer the NYC marathon until next year. I just can't in good conscience go out there and run the event knowing there are people out there who have lost there homes, suffered damage to their homes and properties, have no power, food, water or clothing. You can't even get gas in most places and if you are lucky enough to find a station with gas you are waiting for hours to get some. It's unbelievable.

While I support NYC's efforts to try to get back to normal they are restoration and recovery mode and they should be directing thses resources to helping people in need right now. I can't go out and run in these circumstances. I have waited 3 years to get in and I want to enjoy the experience and won't be able to do that so waiting another year is not going to make any difference.

I just think this is a very bad decision on the Mayor's part and it is being heavily criticized. They are literally recovering bodies in Staten Island as one Congressman said and the Mayor is worried about the marathon. It is extremely depressing watching the news. I do apologize for going on about this and do appreciate the support. It's just terrible to see what is going on here right now. 

Dirk, great tip on learning bilateral breathing and breathing while swimming in general.

Did go out and but some long running pants last night. 

OK tomorrow is IMFL and the participants should have beautiful weather.  Mid 50's at daylight, ver light winds so the ocean should be calm with the high being low to mid 80's and no rain.  Perfect conditions!!!

We are leaving at3:00 am to go volunteer for pre-race stuff, then handing out pizza from 2 - 7, so no training for me but does voluntering count?  lol

Also next week, i will be out of town for work again so I won't be bothering ya'll here but i do hope to get lots of training in.

Ya'll have a GREAT weekend and week!

Dina, I will defer to others but I still work out tooooooo much in the gym but I have quit working shoulders because I just can't swim when they are so tired you can't get your hands over your head.  I still work core chest and back fairly hard but not as hard as I used to.

I also quit working my legs because my legs would be sore for 4 days after a work out to the point I couldn't bike or run, barely walk.  I think if you do hill repeats, that is a good leg w/o.

Remember I am very slow but it finally hit me why we are supposed to run so slow... we run every day, I was from the gym thinking where we went to total exhaustion in every set and w/o but remember we only worked each muscle every 3 - 5 days.  Can't do that and run every day...  I'm slow running, swimming, biking and mentally but I usually do get there...lol

Don't be sorry for talking about your situation. I go on about a lot more meaningless stuff than that LOL!!

I have to apologize because honestly, I don't read the paper or even watch the news very often. I sat down yesterday evening and read some articles about the conditions you all are dealing with and I think you are making the right call by not racing.  I read about a mom who had both her kids washed away right out of her arms and remembered why I don't read the news. Heart wrenching. So talk about it all you want Tony, we'll be listening.

I certainly understand your sentiments Tony.  Knowing the type of resources required to get the power back on to large blocks of the power grid in my area is challenging to say the least.  And after the Derecho storm that dropped such a large portion of our system on June 29 I know even more about the logistics involved to direct that much labor.  It is an overwhelming number of personnel to feed and house.  Then you have to organize an outside company work force.  Organizing a large work force to mobilize toward a disaster really is not difficult.  Normally it's almost as simple as making calls to large electrical contractors and other utilities and they begin to send people within a day or so.  We have sent people to outlying areas to stage a day or so before the storms hit.  The linemen will simply stay in a hotel for a day or so and then move in once the storm has moved through.

  The planning for this storm very likely started 2-3 days prior to the storm hitting (most people are unaware this occurs).  The logistics of a storm like this are tremendous and the challenges come in arranging lodging and material to complete the restoration.  That's plain and simple!  No company can stock the amount of material required to restore large amounts of customers like this.  I could literally go on and on about this and maybe I have already done just that.

So, with the above in mind I have a very practical sense of what you are saying about the resources required to run the race and restore, not just the electrical grid, but all other utilities and public transit and ect.......  I also understand the numbers of dollars NYC is probably expecting to haul in toward their budget from large events such as the marathon and they are probably considering that as well.  That is not an excuse, just an observation, and one I don't feel is important enough to justify allocating those resources away from restoration.

One more thing about the restoration.  The biggest hold up I see for our restoration efforts are the engineers!  Those clowns couldn't organize an Easter egg hunt.  With all their book knowledge and lack of practical real world experience they get in the way!  Let the linemen out of their cages and get the power back on in true working fashion

I just spoke to an old HS friend about this very thing Wednesday night.  He and I reconnected through facebook and he sent a message to me with his phone number and asked me to give him a call.  He has been doing some short triathlons the past couple of years and wanted my take on if he was ready to take a dive into longer distance stuff AND keep lifting weights.  He had seen my recently changed profile pic on facebook and thought it looked like I still spent time lifting weights. 

He is a 6'1 and weighs 215 and spend alot of time in the gym.  Our discussion was about whether I thought he should keep lifting to maintain his body mass.  I couldn't answer the question for him and only asked another question to him; "What are your goals?  Do you want to become faster or are you happy with where you are?"  Currently he is able to become faster by gaining fitness and so on.  But in the end game if he wants to place in AG stats (not just the Clydes) he'll have to lose weight.  His answer ended up being he was happy with doing the races as a Clyde and keeping his mass.

I think you can perform as well as you want carrying mass or spending time in the gym lifting a lot.  You are not as likely to get on the podium by splitting your time evenly between lifting and triathlon training.  But then that is where you must decide which is more important.  I'll say that it seems like you want to perform better because some of us in the group perform well at races, but if it came to bench pressing and other types pf lifting exercises you would blow us out of the water.  After your race last weekend, which I think you did quite well at, you can decide which direction you want to go.  But don't feel pressure from us to perform better....EVER!  We support you in whatever avenue of fitness you take.

Karl good luck and have fun at IMFL this weekend. Don't eat too much pizza!

Thanks again to all for the support. I have cancelled my entry for the 2012 NYC marathon this morning. I can't get a refund on the hotel so I am looking to see if there is a way I can possibly donate that to someone who could use it. I just couldn't do this race knowing what everyone is going through. If they had put it off a few weeks then I probably would have done it but doing it now I would feel guilty about it and I would feel like I am taking away resources from people who need them more than a bunch of people running a race. I think this whole marathon thing has divided the city not brought it together which is an absolute shame.

On a brighter note I did sign up for another HIM for 2013 last night. I will be doing Syracuse 70.3 in June. I am also going to sign up for Riverhead Rocks Oly this morning. I really enjoyed doing that one last year. I need to find another Oly to do.

So I am officially beginning my offseason. I will take the next 3 weeks off so to speak. I will swim as much as I can and I will be doing a lot of unstructured workouts and I will catch up on my rest as well before I start the process of getting ready for next year and the IM training that is ahead.

Tony, I know it is a relief just to make a decision.  I know it was hard.

Congratulations on signing up for HIM and Oly.  Way to move forward!

x2 Tony. Good call.

On the topic of lifting, I don't think the strength training I am doing and the lifting you guys are talking about is anywhere in the same hemisphere LOL. I've yet to even be sore from my strength workouts - muscle fatigue, yes, but not sore.

I've had to break out my orthotics, much to my own disappointment. I've been fighting with this cyst on my left leg since I started back to running in the spring. Well it is not getting any smaller and now I'm getting pain on up into my lower leg. I noticed I'm turning my foot out to keep from putting pressure on that area and I just thought well, this is what my orthotics do in the first place. Bummer but I hope maybe it will help alleviate some of the pressure. My concern is I have not rolled my ankles since I've been out of orthotics and now I really notice how far my foot is lifted up in my shoe with these in. Frustrating. I feel so close to being put back together but there seems to always be a step backwards.

x3 from me.  I personally think it should be canceled too.  The PD, FD and other resources that would be needed would have to be pulled away from more important things than a marathon.

BTW Tony, There are a few of my company's "network" personnel in NYC helping restore power.  Network linemen are, in my terminology, "sewer linemen."  They work on power lines that are located under city streets and in underground vaults.  The wires run through ducts/conduits in downtown areas of large cities.  Most people don't know they are there. 

Anyway if you would happen to see this image:

.......say high to Justin for me

For the type of lifting you are doing I don't think it's necessary to become sore, fatigue can be the better route.  (In the days of power lifting it was not uncommon me to have difficulty sitting down after a day of dead lifts and heavy squats.)  I know this is necessarily the case but generally think of a lot of soreness from harder more powerful lifting exercises.  We as triathletes certainly don't want to build bulk that will be hard to carry over a race of any distance.

I kind of remember you talking about rolling your ankles in the past.  Do the orthotics provide to much support?  It appears that way to me if they are causing you to roll your ankle occasionally. 

Questions:

1. Do you normally run in a support shoe or motion control?
2. If you run in a support shoe, are you wearing the orthotics in those?  And should you be?
3. Could you purchase a neutral shoe and place the orthotics in those to provide slightly less correction and still receive the benefits without rolling over?

Dirk trust me I will. I appreciate your guys being up here as well as all the other folks from all the other different power companies and states working round the clock to help restore power here.  Trust me it is very much appreciated and they are making good progress on getting the power restored.

On another note I called the Red Cross to see if I could give my Hotel room away and they would not take it. I am going through family and friends now to see if anyone is in need or knows anyone who can use it. I would not feel right about going into NYC to have a good time knowing that it could be used by someone who needs it. Hopefully I can give it up to someone who really needs it. Will let you guys know how I make out.

You know what?  I was thinking that the race going on would be a great celebration of the human spirit and such...until this morning when I heard of families being asked to leave hotels after losing their homes...because marathoners are coming to town and have those rooms booked.

The mayor says the city needs the money...and that's true of course, but how much money will it make compared to the entire annual revenues for the city?  Probably too little to justify at this point.

Great words Dirk, very well said.

Make sure your friend knows he's going to have to add 5lbs of muscle to say a Clyde next season.  For what it's worth, that's the direction I went for a few years until I realized I could be pretty good and that pulled me in to the idea of shedding muscle.  It was a hard pill to swallow after all those years of packing on muscle to fight with my body image issues... 

Right!  Look at it this way..as a lifter you know why you do low reps and high weights and why the intensity is maximized and the rest period is so long.   The super high peaks of demand force the body to adapt.  The adaptation is to the peak demand.

So why not work that hard in the weight room, but every day?  Because that level of frequency causes the body to adapt by becoming more efficient, not stronger.  You could actually get weaker (and smaller) through that kind of training.  And if you didn't get injured, you could do 80% max weight for more reps, but max weight will fall.

We run every day because we WANT that endurance and not the peak sprint speed, for instance.  But if we wanted to go to the track every 3rd day for sprints we would develop a pretty good 100 meter speed.

We don't just run slow so that we can run everyday, we run everyday so the body adapts through efficiency and not hypertrophy.

Running slow is analogous to lifting a light weight with high reps. 

But endurance and strength aren't COMPLETELY mutually exclusive.  You can still lift for strength and train for endurance.  They water each other down somewhat but you can still be impressively accomplished at both.  In the years since I began triathlon I noticed that my strength dropped right around 10% as soon as I began daily cardio training.  But that was without any REAL change in my body....had I stopped, I would have been immediately 10% stronger again.

Since I lost the 30lbs of weight over the last 2 years my strength in the weight room hasn't changed much that I can detect after that first 10% strength loss.  I can't quite be sure because I've had some injuries along the way and lost strength in areas I think I can attribute to the injures and of course the strength loss due to time missed with surgeries.

But the point is I think smaller muscles can maintain much of the strength of larger ones.  And I wonder, if we keep lifting intelligently while doing triathlon, are we perhaps simply losing mostly fat?  Even when muscles get smaller in circumference that could be attributed to a decrease in the intramuscular fat stores.

Wow, I just looked at this thread...I post too much.

I apologize if I'm flooding you all with too much opinion.