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2010-04-14 4:03 AM
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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed
srichards428 - 2010-04-13 7:40 PM HRM question.

Does anybody where there HRM during there tri's?  Is it a good idea to keep a check on how much you are exerting in the beginningpart of the race?  I was thinking about wearing mine to keep a check on how fast Iam going and to make sure I have enough steam to finish.  Any thoughts on this....and also do you wear them during the swim?

Another thought just crossed my mind.  What do people wear for shortd during the swim.  Iam going to have a wet suit for my first race and was wandering if you change into bike shorts in the transition or just go without the extra padding.


I used the tri shorts also the padding was good on the bike and did not bother me on the swim or run. I might go for the tri suit so I don't need a tee shirt either. 


I used a HRM for the bike and run in my tri, I use it when I train and I think having it on in the race gave reassurance and peace of mind although I did not really change my pace much maybe slowed down a little on the run and helped me keep pace. I think because I do 90% of running on treadmill I miss out on all the pacing skills so it helped me 


2010-04-14 4:16 PM
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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed

I concur on everything already said.  The most useful aspect of the HRM during a race is to make sure you don't go too hard, too early.  Just remember, most peoples' HR will be 5-8 bpm higher on race day, just because of the adrenaline and hype.  Keep this in mind.  If you want to stay at an effort level that yields a HR of 155 in training, let that drift up to 160 during the race.  You RPE should be about the same.

I'd wear your strap/watch in the swim, but it really does not become usefull until the run into T1.  One less this to have to put on.

Tri shorts are the ticket.  That's all I've worn up through all my 70.3s and what I plan for my IM.  By the end of 112 miles I expect no shorts will be "comfortable".

2010-04-15 6:20 AM
in reply to: #2558214

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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed
Hey Everyone!  I have a question about nutrition on long training sessions.

I tend to workout in the mornings - especially on the weekend.  So there really isn't much time to wake an hour before I go and have a meal.  In fact - most times it's a matter of rolling out of bed, putting on my shoes and off I go.  I'm curious about workouts that are well over an hour - more in the neighbourhood of 2+ 

Up until now if I feel the need I'll eat a banana take some shot bloks before the run with a glass of water.  I carry some with me on the run and find after an hour I usually need a couple of more (3=100calories).  Sometimes I take diluted Gatorade with me but generally just water.  Then when I get home I replenish with carbs.  I read you should have 3-4 calories per pound of body weight for the duration of your workout.  So if I went on a 2 hour run I would eat in the neighbourhood of 400-550 calories during the two hours that followed my run.  For the remainder of the day I try to stick to lean protein and fruits & veggies.  I just eat lean on workouts less than 90 minutes and don't worry about it at all.

I've seen people's logs where they are constantly refueling and I'm just wondering how you know WHAT to refuel on and how much... ?  This weekend I'm hoping to get up early, drive north and put in at least 3 hours on the bike.  I might eat a banana in the car on the way and drink a boost but then what?  If I have one bottle with water and another with Gatorade - what/how much should I look at eating along the way to keep my energy level up?  It's a hilly trek and I remember the last time I did it after 2 hours I was seriously losing steam...

Any help is much appreciated.  Also curious on where you carry everything.  I don't even own a cycling jersey with a pocket!!
2010-04-15 2:30 PM
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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed

Marcia,

You definitely need to "teach" your body to accept food/liquids, especially on the bike.  That is your best opportunity to take in nutrition and your body is the most accepting of it.

If you are not going to/can't eat before, then you pretty much need to start right away when you get on the bike (for workouts over 90 min).  Liquids are normally the easiest on the gut, however, they may not be as satifying.  Try to get in some solids (+ water) early in the ride and slowly change over to liquids later.

As far as carrying it all...Gels + water is the simplest and most compact.  Then the various drinks are next.  Most people like some variety, thus the plethora of blocks, bars, etc.  Your use of these is based upon personal preference and taste, not need.

Start by trying to get in 150-200 cal/hr.  As you train your gut, you may be able to get up toward 300-400 cal/hr.  Anything above this can't be absorbed anyway.

Regardless of calorie contect, the 1st priority is hydration.  If you lose steam during a ride of less than 2.5 hours, hydration is 99.9% the issue.  Very few people would burn through their glycogen stores (on the bike during training) in less than that.

Drink/eat early and often!

 

I hope this helps!

2010-04-15 3:12 PM
in reply to: #2558214

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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed
Thanks Scott - useful information.  I think I'll take the time to eat a bagel w/ pb & a banana before I leave and then fill my bottles for the ride with the shot bloks.  I'll plan my ride in loops so if I need to refill my bottles I can swing by the car again.  Of course all this might be useless planning as we're supposed to have showers on the weekend  

Ohhh I just realized it's Thursday today!!  The weekend is almost here!  What does everyone have planned for this weekend?  My main goal was a 3.5 hr bike ride followed by a short run.  GULP!  It's been a while since I've done anything that long on the bike.  If it rains - I'll bring it inside on the stationary bike but it's never as good a workout... or as fun.
2010-04-16 5:23 PM
in reply to: #2794609

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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed
kimmax - 2010-04-15 1:12 PM Thanks Scott - useful information.  I think I'll take the time to eat a bagel w/ pb & a banana before I leave and then fill my bottles for the ride with the shot bloks.  I'll plan my ride in loops so if I need to refill my bottles I can swing by the car again.  Of course all this might be useless planning as we're supposed to have showers on the weekend  

Ohhh I just realized it's Thursday today!!  The weekend is almost here!  What does everyone have planned for this weekend?  My main goal was a 3.5 hr bike ride followed by a short run.  GULP!  It's been a while since I've done anything that long on the bike.  If it rains - I'll bring it inside on the stationary bike but it's never as good a workout... or as fun.


Marcia I hope you have good weather. Enjoy the ride. Have a great weekend everybody.


2010-04-17 2:43 PM
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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed
I'm curious to hear your thoughts...

A good friend of mine has decided to try a try-a-tri on June 26th.  The start time is at 10am and it takes place in a town that's about an 1hr 45min drive away.  My cousin from Niagara is also thinking of doing the same race.  I'd really like to be there to cheer them both on as it's their first attempt. 

There is also a sprint starting at 8am.  The thing is - my first A race is the week after - an olympic distance - my first - so I don't want this to interfere with that.  I was thinking it might be a good training practice.  The other thing is - there is no way my hubby and child will want to sit through my race and then wait around for the finishers of the next race.  So... my options are:

-Drive down as a family the day before, stay in a hotel, I do the sprint and stick around to watch my friends/family finish the try-a-tri with or without my family.

-Drive down as a family the day before, stay in a hotel, I do the try-a-tri while my family watches on.  Might miss my friends finishing... as I will be racing it as well.  This seems like the easiest option though it seems excessive to spend the $$ on a try-a-tri.  Might be weird if I actually pass a friend on the bike/run and keep on going.  I'm supposed to be there for encouragement...

What do you guys think?  Would either race really impact my training for the A race?  I'm thinking the try-a-tri wouldn't.  I think the race start is a walk from the hotel so my family could do whatever...
2010-04-17 10:49 PM
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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed
kimmax - 2010-04-15 3:12 PM Thanks Scott - useful information.  I think I'll take the time to eat a bagel w/ pb & a banana before I leave and then fill my bottles for the ride with the shot bloks.  I'll plan my ride in loops so if I need to refill my bottles I can swing by the car again.  Of course all this might be useless planning as we're supposed to have showers on the weekend  

Ohhh I just realized it's Thursday today!!  The weekend is almost here!  What does everyone have planned for this weekend?  My main goal was a 3.5 hr bike ride followed by a short run.  GULP!  It's been a while since I've done anything that long on the bike.  If it rains - I'll bring it inside on the stationary bike but it's never as good a workout... or as fun.


Marcia, I hope you have great weather this weekend and enjoy your ride. 

I have multiple workouts planned and I'am taking my boys to the St.Louis Cardinal Baseball game on Sunday.  I'am also taking my father since it's his 76 birthday.  He has not been to the new Busch stadium.  Should be a great time on Sunday!!
2010-04-19 12:16 AM
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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed
4 St.Louis Cardinal baseball tickets.......$220.00.

3 hotdogs, 1 hamburger and 4 regular cokes......$45.00. 

Seeing my 8 year old son's  face on the first home run with fireworks...PRICELESS!!!!!!


Baseball Game with the family was fantastic.....time for bed.

Edited by srichards428 2010-04-19 12:18 AM
2010-04-19 10:23 AM
in reply to: #2800468

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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed
srichards428 - 2010-04-18 10:16 PM 4 St.Louis Cardinal baseball tickets.......$220.00.

3 hotdogs, 1 hamburger and 4 regular cokes......$45.00. 

Seeing my 8 year old son's  face on the first home run with fireworks...PRICELESS!!!!!!


Baseball Game with the family was fantastic.....time for bed.


Sounds like a great day. I remember going to Dodger games with my Dad when I was a kid, lots of fun.
2010-04-19 10:40 AM
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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed
Sounds like a great day!  Those are the moments people remember for life!

Hope everyone had a good weekend.  I didn't end up on the road after all.  It looked like it was going to pour when I woke so I went to the gym - no windows - 3.5 hours later stepped outside to a beautiful day - sun was shining, clear skies - annoying!!!

I played around with the whole nutrition thing but not sure I was successful.  Ate a zone bar before (200 calories) and then took 3 shot bloks (100 cal each) during each of the following two hours.  Drank a bottle of water every hour.  I felt fine re: legs but my stomach was growling by the end of the ride.  Then I did a quick one mile run and my stomach hurt - not a cramp or upset stomach - but maybe from being in one position for three hours?  It actually hurt while I ran.  On my way home I ate a banana and a bagel I was so hungry and the rest of the day I had an upset stomach - burning pain.  No clue what.  Didn't clear until dinner time.  Pretty annoying so no clue what I did wrong.  I had enough energy while exercising though so that wasn't a problem.  I was just hungry but then ya... felt horrible in the aft.

I also realized that race dates do change and so my schedule looks crazy right now.  I've decided to do the sprint on the 18th of June and then watch my friend do her race.  My A race is the week after and then I have another one on the 18th !!??  How did that happen??  I thought I had planned one a month doh!

Anyway - another week - plugging along.  Good luck on the training everyone!!


2010-04-19 12:03 PM
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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed

Marcia,

I think your nutrition this weekend is a good data point and gives you clues as to what your next step should be.  Thanks for the detailed desciption of how you felt.  It helps a lot.

200 cal before and 100 cal/hr during is definitely on the low side, so I have little doubt your body was saying "I'm hungry!".  Next time out try upping it to 150 cal/hr.  You might also experiment with a diluted sports drink.  Most people absorb them better that straight water and find them somewhat more satifying.  Additionally, this would give you another vehicle to ingest some calories.

Even when you are trying to lose weight, "during"  is the one time not to skimp on fuel.

2010-04-19 1:50 PM
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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed
Okay - Thanks Scott - I'll give it a try on my next long ride.  It's funny because I DO eat in the mornings - breaky etc - I just tend not to before my workout or first thing. 

Re: Gatorade - I find I have to dilute it or it just doesn't go down all that well.  I remember one sprint I had drank a bunch on the bike and was struggling to keep it down on the run !  Anyone else have that problem?  I'm not one for upset tummies so it's a little unusual.
2010-04-19 10:45 PM
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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed
kimmax - 2010-04-19 1:50 PM Okay - Thanks Scott - I'll give it a try on my next long ride.  It's funny because I DO eat in the mornings - breaky etc - I just tend not to before my workout or first thing. 

Re: Gatorade - I find I have to dilute it or it just doesn't go down all that well.  I remember one sprint I had drank a bunch on the bike and was struggling to keep it down on the run !  Anyone else have that problem?  I'm not one for upset tummies so it's a little unusual.



Marcia, I talked to a guy this weekend that had competed in 10 Ironmans including Kona and is a tri coach.  He advised me to stay away from Gatorade and anything with OSE...ie fructose etc.  He advised that I should try gels (etc) that have only complex sugars . He went into detail on how the body can not absorb the simples sugars...dont ask me for all the details...lol.  Takes more water to dilute the simple sugars and the more diluted the less calories you are getting. This coach advised me to take a look at Hammer Nutrition since they use maltodextrin since they can be easily absorbed by the body.   This coach also advised that I do not need to worry about electrolytes in shorter/ sprint tris.  He said that if i get that close to dehydration that I have a serious problem and I should not need them for races less than 2 hours.  He then provided me with the formula to figure out my dehydration level.  I was also advised to stick to liquids and not to eat when Im biking....and for longer rides look at Heed drinks instead of eating.  He advised me of all this info. because I was concerned about gastrointestinal problems while competing in a tri.  I have not had any of these problems but I have read numerous articles on this problem and I want the best info. avaliable and I'am new to this sport.


I dont know if this will help ya but thought that I would mention that info.

Edited by srichards428 2010-04-19 11:00 PM
2010-04-20 6:06 AM
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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed
srichards428 - 2010-04-19 11:45 PM

He advised me to stay away from Gatorade and anything with OSE...ie fructose etc.  He advised that I should try gels (etc) that have only complex sugars . He went into detail on how the body can not absorb the simples sugars...dont ask me for all the details...lol. 


Interesting... thanks!  I'll do it as he says.  I'm not a big fan of the gels... sort of makes me gag hence shot bloks and no - I don't normally take stuff during sprints.  In this one case - we were staying in a hotel and on the way to the race couldn't find a place to grab breaky so we fueled up on more than gas at the local station!  Gatorade for me - chocolate bar for my child!!  She was too tired to be delighted.  Lesson learned - take a sandwich for the road when doing an out of town tri!!

2010-04-20 12:35 PM
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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed

My experience with Gatorade has not been great either.  Often times in races they seem to mix it way to concentrated for my taste (and my stomach's tolerance).  If I take G or GE on the course I will almost always chase it with water.

I tend to use drinks that use maltodextrin as their primary sugar component, like Infinit, Accelerade, Hammer (Heed), etc.

Agreed that electrolytes are not an issue in shorter races, but keeping hydrated is an issue once you start approaching 90 min.



Edited by Scottt 2010-04-20 12:37 PM


2010-04-20 12:58 PM
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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed
Scottt - 2010-04-20 1:35 PM

Agreed that electrolytes are not an issue in shorter races, but keeping hydrated is an issue once you start approaching 90 min.



My very first race was a mini-sprint in Niagara.  I was so concerned about keeping hydrated I drank about two bottles before and while en route - I must have had my hubby pull over about three times during a 2 hr drive so I could take a washroom break!!  A good lesson to learn!!

I have to say I'm brutal re: hydration.  My skin is dry - my contacts dry up in my eyeballs.  I am TODAY sitting at my desk with a 32 oz bottle that I have just polished off.  My goal is to drink 2 of them a day in addition to workout water.  So how timely is this conversation??

2010-04-20 1:25 PM
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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed

I just got done with a bike ride and Iam wandering how to increase my speed.  Is it something Iam doing?  I avergaed 17mph and was wandering how to increase average speed.  Is it a condition issue or am I not pushing myself hard enough or not working my gears to there fullest?

Any thoughts on this would be appreciated. 

2010-04-20 5:31 PM
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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed

Shawn,

I need more info...

In your log, you state x time for y miles.  Is that just moving time or entire clock time?  What is your average RPE during the ride.  What is your Max RPE during the ride.

Given your total amount of riding and newness to the sport 17mph is very respectable.  Don't beat yourself up so much.  Endurance sports are something you have to do a lot and do some more.  There is a reason 40 somethings remain competitive.  You are and will be in the steep part of the improvement curve for a long while.

Simple answer...ride more.

Sightly more complex answer...ride more and vary your pace from time to time.

 

 



Edited by Scottt 2010-04-20 6:13 PM
2010-04-20 7:01 PM
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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed
Scott,

Good question....lol.  I believe that it was overall time.  I will have to check on the bike computer.  I also dont know if the computer has a avg. RPM but I tried to maintain a rpm of 90.

I believe that just getting out will help.  Will get back to ya on the other info in a few days.

Edited by srichards428 2010-04-20 7:05 PM
2010-04-21 11:19 AM
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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed
Marcia,
I had this article in an email today regarding electrolytes and hydration. Thought you might be interested. http://www.active.com/nutrition/Articles/Electrolytes-101.htm?act=E... />


2010-04-24 10:17 AM
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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed
Scottt - 2010-04-20 6:31 PM

Given your total amount of riding and newness to the sport 17mph is very respectable. 



^^ x2  I'd love to go that fast!  I have no clue what I can do - I haven't been out on a normal rode yet - just winding bike trails which tend to be busy with rollerbladers and joggers so I have to be careful.  There's a spit that extends out in to the lake - it's long, wide and smooth but has speed bumps and can be so bloody windy.  Last summer I was able to get my speed up but I seem to be pretty poky this season!

Went for a nice scenic ride on the spit this morning - down by the lake - oye!!  The bugs!!!  Thankfully I was wearing my shades.  I may have eaten some - how's that for protein?

Hope everyone else is enjoying their weekend!! 

Oh - quick question - it's windy by the lake and still a bit chilly so I tend to layer - regardless my feet were still numb with cold when I finished.  I wore my running pants OVER my riding shorts?  Is this normal?  I saw a couple of cyclists wearing theirs UNDER their shorts?!  What's the "cool" thing to do in this situation?  The other thing I find interesting is that you rarely see female cyclists - they are all men - and tend to be on the older end  of the age bracket - I wonder why that is...
Maybe the ladies are at home knitting??



Edited by kimmax 2010-04-24 10:19 AM
2010-04-25 11:38 PM
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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed

For cooler weather, a pair of leg warmers is very handy and can be removed when it warms up (they look like tights under shorts).  If you know it will be cool the entire ride, a pair of cycling tights is great.  They are like shorts but are full length.  I don't really recommend tights under shorts, as your chamois won't work like it is supposed to.  Additionally, the seams in the crotch of the tights may be irritating.

Out here, there are a few women in the roadie groups, but very few.  In generally I see them riding together.  We have many strong girls that ride on the group tri rides regularly.

I think the "older guy thing" is fairly universal.  Not positive of the reason.  I suspect it is because cycling is easier on our old bones than running. 

 



Edited by Scottt 2010-04-26 3:25 PM
2010-04-29 2:59 PM
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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed

Scott,

How about a little info on running technique.  My weak point of the tri's are gonna be the running part.  I have never been a runner and it will be my least favorite part.  I dont mind running but it seems like some days Iam going backwards.  I'am a heel striker and have been trying to pay closer attention to my running.  Any info will be appreciated.

2010-05-05 5:23 PM
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Subject: RE: Scottt's Group - Closed

Shawn,

I'll work on that and post tonight or tomorrow.

 

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