RE-OPENED Birkierunner's 2013 mentor group - RE-OPENED!!! (Page 23)

Tom, I would get a little nervous using a bike/ped path to do this type of testing.  You really need to focus on the task at hand and don't want to be bothered being on the lookout for walkers/joggers/dog walkers/other bikes.  If there is a way to get out of the city for a weekend day and find a good test course that would be preferred.  But, its not a perfect world so you may have to make do with what you have.  Slowing down and making the 180 turn will have a very slight effect but in the big picture it is probably negligible and I wouldn't worry about it.  We are only trying to get in the ballpark with your HR anyway so don't be too concerned.  Good luck

If you're still taking members I'd like to play.

Name: Tom

Story: 46 yr old computer geek who sits on his all day. I play hockey 5-10 times a week (goaltending is addictive) in the winter but in the summer it slows to 3-5 so I have more time to train. Can't swim (20 min for 750m), painfully slow runner, love to bike. I've done a few sprints and hope to finally do an Oly this season but will have to step up my swimming and running to finish it alive.

Family status: single, dating the same (patient) woman for 4 years

Current training: nowhere near enough, but I've gotten up to run three mornings in a row to treadmill before work - if you knew how much I like to sleep and hold those last few minutes before the alarm goes off precious you'd have fallen over by now. I'm just getting back into training and have to remind myself to START SLOW. I've gotten injured from running each of the past three years.

This year's races: not signed up for any at the moment. Need to set some goals. Did three sprints last season and four the year before... still not sure what races do for me. Might do Toronto again, will definitely do Barrie.

Wight loss: desperately needed. Addicted to sugar and it shows.

What will make me a good mentee: I have soooooo much to learn.

Welcome to the group Tom.  Thanks for the bio.  Fire away with questions

Katie, we all have to deal with injuries at some point, and they suck.  The key is that you need to deal with them, otherwise they will simply keep hindering your training and ability to race.  I suffer from ITB, and it took a while to fix the last time.  3 weeks after I was "properly" running again, something went wrong with my achilles.  I had to stop running completely for 3 weeks, and my plans of a Spring HM were gone.  I'm just now ramping back up.

But, I looked at it from a big picture perspective.  I want to race throughout the summer and into the fall.  If I didn't accept that I needed to deal with injuries, then there was a very real possibility that I wouldn't be racing/running during the summer.  Just my 2 cents.

Yesterday was scheduled for a 2:15 ride in z2.  Ended up doing 40 miles but, as you can tell from my posts above I'm still to really determine zones, not sure if I stayed in z2.  I did make a stab at establishing zones based on running max HR - 15bpm and plugging it into an online calculator and based on those results, I ended up averaging z3.3, but when I look at the chart from the garmin, I spent the vast majority of the time on the high end of z2 but did get up into the mid z3 when fighting the afternoon wind off the bay and riding up some of the small hills (sometimes doing both at the same time). 

So here's the problem.  If I were to assume the online calculator nailed the zones, I found it really difficult to ride only in z2 as it felt like I wasn't really working.  Running, I'm used to spending a long time in z2 as I spent most of my last marathon training working on building aerobic base, and when running, staying at the high end of z2 still feels like I'm achieving something.  Is z2 on the bike, even the upper end, supposed to be fairly easy?  Not "recover easy", but still not feeling like you are pushing at all?

I'd turn around and ask you why you're trying to stay in Z2 on the bike?  Lots to be gained on the bike by riding in Z3 and higher.

I also wouldn't be trying to guess at your HR zones.  Use RPE till you field test and establish some training zones.  Otherwise you're beating yourself up over numbers that may be wildly wrong.  For what it's worth, my bike and run HR zones are very close.  If I knocked 15 beats off run zones and used that for riding, I'd never see any improvements.

If the plan calls for the ride to be in Z2, then (once you've figured out your zones) aim for the total ride to be in Z2.  But during the ride, I would certainly spend some time in Z3 and 4.  This can be done in short intervals, or something a little longer for 15-30min, but the key is that for you to improve on the bike, you're going to need to mix things up a bit.  Not just on the shorter rides, but the longer ones as well.  Takes a long time to make improvements on the bike using the LSD method - it's a bit different on the run.

To date I've simply tried t get at least 2 workout of each discipline in per week. Typically my swims are a half mile, bike 7-10 and runs are all 3 miles. Lately on weekends I've pushed myself harder with a couple bricks. Today was 7.5 bike followed immediately by a 3 mile run. I pretty much push myself at about 85% for most workouts.

am I going about this wrong?

Hey Jim,

Is your mentor group re-opened as the subject line implies, or are you closed to new members? I'm interested in joining you guys if that's an option.

-Dylan 

Hey Dylan.  Yes, the subject line is correct.  I re-opened the group and likely won't even bother to close it this season.  I think it will be cool to have people pop in and out as their schedule dictates and we'll just keep this free form.  Welcome

A formal plan is important if you have no idea how to keep a sound balance of number of workouts and intensity level of those workouts.  Going at 85% for ALL workouts is likely not the best plan.  The only thing in your favor by that approach is that the length of workouts is fairly short.  But once you increase your volume you won't be able to go at that intensity for ALL workouts.   Is your plan designed for total neophytes?  If so, bump up to a more intermediate or advanced level plan.  I think the free plans here on BT or for neophytes but you can get more advanced plans for the nominal membership (couple different levels). 

Thanks! I would love to join you guys. 

NAME: Dylan

STORY: I'm a 25 year old medical student. Former HS soccer player (first two years), basketball player, and swimmer. During undergrad I got pretty serious about rock climbing and didn't spend much time in the endurance world, although I continued running to keep up some level of cardiovascular fitness. Ended up dating a D1 XC runner for a bit - that sort of amped up my running for a brief period, but the vast majority of my spare time was spent climbing. When I started med school my class had a few former world class swimmers and some ex-college runners. I'd always had an interest in doing triathlons (got my BT account in '07 I think), but hadn't ever pulled the trigger on a bike or had other like-minded training partners around until then. Some of my classmates and I raced an olympic distance the start of 2nd year and I've kept training since then. This winter I got fed up with not being able to bike outdoors (I would get to the hospital before it was light out and get home long after dark), so I got myself a spin bike which has allowed me to do a good bit of serious bike work the past few months. I'm through the worst part of my schedule for school and my time constraints should continue to lighten during this last year (in general), hopefully allowing me to continue to increase volume.    

FAMILY STATUS: Married

CURRENT TRAINING: Right now I'm focused on racing Olympic distance (one in August, and one possibly in September). I have a good fitness base and am currently running ~3x/week and biking 4-6times per week. I need to get back in the pool soon but likely won't have the time until I switch off my current service at the end of April.

I took the winter off from running and focused on the bike. Over the next 19 weeks I'm going to gradually build my long run back to 10 miles at desired 10k triathlon race-pace, since I'm only planning olympic distances this year I'm in no rush to bump distance.   

2012 RACES: One Half Ironman 

2013 RACES: Rocketman Olympic Distance, BR Coastal Olympic Distance. (I'm living in Alabama right now)

Possibly another, late season race in the fall. 

In 2014 - Would like to race another 1/2 iron and a full ironman (possibly Los Cabos). 

WEIGHTLOSS: Not trying to gain or lose. I fluctuate between 125-128lbs. Would like to stay in the 125-130 range to maintain my advantage on hills and on the run.  

WHAT WILL MAKE ME A GOOD MENTEE: I train hard and have no trouble self-motivating, but prefer training in a group as I have very little experience and want to learn from others rather than making mistakes on my own. 

Despite having used BT since about 2007 I've never really utilized the forums at all, mostly just using the site as a training data depository.  

Well, today was to be the day to do my test to establish my bike HR zones.  Actually, yesterday was supposed to be the day, but ended up with winds 20-30mph with gusts to 45 mph.  No thank you for conducting the test.  Today was still breezy, about 15 mph but without the gusts, so decided to go for it.  Didn't work out so well.  I had charted the ride knowing when and where the different aspects of the test were to be initiated.  I had an outbound of about 2.5 miles with a turnaround and run down to the Bay, then back for about 2-3 miles.  Everything started out great, had the wind behind me as I went out on the first stretch.  Was pedaling easy with PRE in zone 1 and HR was reflecting that.  Made the turnaround into the wind and all of a sudden my Garmin HR shot up and was in the 220-240 range.   I didn't panic as I'm used to these spikes early on, and waited for them to subside and the device to show the actual HR.  Got through the 15 minute z1 warm up, did the second segment of z4/z2 bits and got into the 5 min z2 segment before it seemed to settle down.  Whew! or so I thought.  Now for the real test as I cranked it up for the 20 minute all out.  Within the first minute the HR shot up to >200 again and stayed there for 2 minutes.  I stopped, repositioned the HR strap, moistened the electrodes (had put gel on them before I started!), rode back about 1/2 mile and started again. 

The HR immediately settled down and stayed in the expected range for that 1/2 mile.  As soon as I turned around into the wind and started cranking again, it started spiking again.  Tried the same thing again, and got the same result.  Riding with the wind (miles 0-2.5 and 13-18), HR readings were true.  Riding against it, they were spiking every time.  Frustrating as can be, no usable results.  Gave up the test at about mile 10 and just rode letting loose with the occasional expletive as I thought about it all. 

Probably won't have another shot at it as my next ride is a long one and then I'm traveling for a week and won't have my bike.  I'm debating trading my long ride for the test, but haven't decided yet.  Ordered a Polar Wearlink chest strap as there are quite a few reviews (including DCRaimaker) who report it minimizes or eliminates this issue.  If I do ride with my current strap before the new one gets here, I'm going to soak it in water first to minimize the static electricity issue.  Bummer of a day Hal.

Tom, sorry to hear about the poor test experience.   When you described your potential testing course I was thinking there was only one turnaround but it sounds like you only had a 2.5 mi stretch??  Wind sounds like it was a major factor that would be hard to replicate and compare future results with.  Also wonder if heading into the wind dried out your HR monitor strap sensor areas and caused poor contact with skin... 

Don't get too discouraged and I wouldn't rush right back into a test until you have more time to prepare.  Also, if you can find an alternate course I would encourage you to do so.  Thanks for reporting on this...it just goes to show how some things can sometimes be out of our control.

And our winter continues....our local ski area just announced they are re-opening tonight thru Sunday night....more time on the Computrainer.

Our local bike/ski shop is sponsoring a trail run series and our first race is tomorrow morning.  Should be interesting with all the snow....

Just got done watching The Distance while on the trainer for nearly a 3 hour ride (Wisconsin weather!).  Anyway, I can't believe that Dave and Jim weren't nominated for some type of golden globe or something!  I'm glad I watched it - keeps the motivation there.

I do have a question:  Since Ive been on thetrainer over the winter, I need to get new bike tires.  I am cycling illiterate, so what should I be looking for?  Any suggestions?

Thanks, Todd

Well, Dave had more air time but did you see me in the movie trailer?  Oscar material right there....

They day that Rich was filming us during the IM WI mini-camp I organized had to be some of the roughest water I ever tried to swim in.  Swells were incredibly huge.