Disturbed275's Group - FULL!! (Page 3)

Gee, thanks Phil.  I try my best

I use Total Immersion a good part of the time. It's really good if you are new to the water as it will definitely help you find your "balance." Also it's style puts plenty of emphasis on being relaxed and taking your time, which helps battle the "oh crap I can't breathe" feeling.

When swimming distance becomes easy and you want to get faster though, you'll likely have to move to something a bit more traditional... I've never found any TI stuff that could keep up with a fast "normal" swimmer.

Would you consider one more, you know I want be too much trouble. Have decided to do a 1/2 IM in September and know I'll need the help, sorry so late I must have missed the groups firing up?

Hey Kip!  You are more than welcome to join.  I meant to send you a message when the groups opened.  You and Luc seem to be the only two left from the last group who are still active on the site.

Hey all, I am going to do the switch from swim talk to run talk.  I am a little impatient with the running, and I am trying hard not to be.

I ran last night at 4.0 mph (slow I know) and while I was staying in my zone 3 (166-176 HR) I was right at the top at the end.  This was a tempo run, so a little faster.

So how long does it take to get your HR down?  I have been working on this for about 2-3 months now.  I don't have any issues in the water and I actually have trouble getthing my HR up while biking.

So how long should I expect it to take to get my HR down, and what would be a good expectation of a HR range I ultimately want to be in?  I mean, I am running really slow right now and I still spike into the 170's regularly.  I can't imagine that will be good for me in my HIM

HELP . . . I will try anything

Thanks all

One thing to remember about HR training is it is not perfect and not for everyone. My high school cross country coach took me off of HR based training since I was able to get up to 85% with a brisk three block walk (this was with several paid folks from Polar helping determine our max/resting/etc numbers back in the day). On biking, I function rather normally with HR training, but have always been an outlier with running HR. This was also back when I was 6' 145 lbs and running sub 5 minute miles too. So, it wasn't a fitness issue.

For me, personally, running limits are much more about being smart with pace & mileage & wear/tear than HR. I may be in the minority here, but if you feel you are not tired during  the run and you're being conservative on your distance ramp up, I wouldn't let HR hold you back.

Even now, for kicks, I wear my HR monitor occassionally on a run and I'll hit 180+ on an easy run. I'm not tired at all when I finish, its just something that I know is a training technique that doesn't work for me (at least with traditional methodology).

Carrie, my coach had me doing something to keep me from blowing up in the second half of my runs that might be helpful to your situation too.

He had me set my HR monitor to go off every time my HR raised over 160 and again at 163. No matter what, I was not allowed to let my HR get to 163. If the alarm went off at 160, I immediately slowed down (when I first started I had to walk up almost every hill and often jog at what I felt like was an agonizingly slow pace) until it dropped back to the mid-high 150s. Slowly but surely, my outside runs got faster while my HR remained the same. Not sure how long / far this can take you, but I know at the very least it taught me quite a bit about pacing myself.

Thanks for the running advice . . . I guess patience is still needed.

I am definitely a HR monitor person because I am just not that good at perceived exertion.

So how long before anyone should really see some noticeable improvements with this walk/run or jog/run philosophy? 

I haven't done the walk/run for awhile because I get impatient and let my HR drift.  Plus, I have found as I am still building my endurance base I may loose some form and just thinking about my form will allow me to drop a few beats automatically (hips or legs get a little tired).  My HR is staying down longer before it drifts past a zone target, but it still drifts as I run longer.  Maybe it is also a function of still buidling up my running muscles and after 30-40 mintues my body is getting tired and lazy so I loose form and my HR raises?  Any strengthenin tips to help speed this up??

Thanks all

Argh. Just found the diagnosis for an issue I'm having on Google:

Handlebar Palsy.

My first tri training injury. Son of a......



Edited by randomguymike 2009-12-16 1:22 PM

I googled it myself and read an article.  Doesn't sound fun.  How bad is the pain?

The pain isn't bad. Its more that I was freaking out since I can't use a fork, am having trouble shaving and can't bring my fingers all together when they are extended. I am very relieved it is a temporary deal and that it is all because I have horrible form on my bike. Never figured there was anything to form on the bike other than sit & pedal. Guess I was wrong. 

Luckily, I have today as a run only day and tomorrow as an off day. So, I should be able to buy some biking gloves, recover some, read up on how to ride a bike (sounds so 2nd grade  ) before my long ride Friday.

So, today's lesson for the other non-bikers is: Do not put too much pressure on your hands when you ride your bike and move your hand position occassionally while riding.

That sounds terrible, I hope it passes quickly.  I usually ride with a death grip/pressure on the handlebars as well; I'll have to work on that. 

Randonguymike - have you gotten a professional bike fit?  I had one done back in August and previous to that had carpel tunnel issues all the time, numbness, etc.

The guy that did the bike fit moved my seat all around, changed out my handlebars with a shorter width and also lowered the height, checked how my clips fit and watched me ride.  I have not had issues since this fit!!!  I don't even wear bike gloves anymore.

I think you are in Chicago, this bike shop is in St. Charles and is called "The Bike Shop".  The owner is Chris and he does the fits.  I hear he is the best in the midwest and people come from miles for his bike fits.  They are about $75, but well worth it.

Good luck!

Bike fit is scheduled for Saturday at teh tri shop I'm 'auditioning'. All three local bike shops I've tried have been pretty sub-par. Got my shoes at a place recommended over on the Illinois section of BT and seemed good. So, I'll try them out on the fit and hopefully that goes well.  

Thanks, I'll be jumping back into training Jan, 3rd just slow runs for now, a little swimming, very little bike. Half Mary in Nashville April, sprint In May Smith Mountain Lake Va. and Half IM in Sept in Williamsburg Va. Sure I'll will add some along the way but pretty committed to those. I really got suckered into the May sprint, guys at work wanting to do it, but the water is pretty cold in May. I guess whining will not make it any warmer though

Edited by fungi32 2009-12-16 4:42 PM

Carrie,

I am not an expert on HR training.  I don't use it all, although I have been curious to try it.  I am afraid it would tell me to slow down

I was just curious as to how you set your zones.  I know there is a traditional formula based on age.  Something like 217 - ( age × 0.85 ) to determine the maximum heart rate (MHR) and then split out the zones by percentage of MHR.  I have also heard that this is not accurate for all people.  A better way to determine a MHR is by doing a stress test.

I have also heard that MHR between biking and cycling can be different.  You will have different MHRs for each and thus different zones.  This may be why your zones seem fine for cycling, but not running.

That said, a HR in the 170s seems like it could be pretty high.  How do you feel when your heart rate gets up there?  Does it seem like you are pushing too hard or does the pace seem pretty easy?

I think that you would see some progress after a few months of training but then again everyone is different and their bodies adapt differently to training. 

I am glad you are getting a bike fit soon.  I have a feeling that relieve the majority of what is causing your problem.  Are you on a road bike?  If so it will probably be a good idea to shift from the drops to hoods frequently just to mix things up and redistribute the pressure on your hands.

Sounds like a good schedule.  I'm still debating on a sprint in Minnesota the second week in May.  It was cooooold last year.  Took till about mile 2 of the run before I regained feeling in my feet.  Funny thing was everyone I talked to said it was the nicest weather they'd had in years.

For those of you that have used total immersion, is that a good way to get started for a beginner in freestyle? And which of the books is the one to get, there a number of titles on the website? I will probably use a coach after a while but want to get more comfortable in the water first plus build some stamina. I feel rigth now I would only last 10 minutes of a lesson so I would like to start doing some drills on my own.

Hi Carrie - 

I have been encouraged to wear a heart rate monitor by my doctor because of a prior heart condition I used to have. I don't use it to train, but I use it to make sure that my heart doesn't go into tachycardia.

One thing I have noticed during my runs is that on the days that I'm dehydrated or tired, my heart rate tends to spike really easily. One day after several months of running, I could barely run without it jumping to 170! It was good to know that my perception of being tired was reflected with "hard evidence" that my body was tired!

Even though you may have days where your heart rate tends to jump and it feels your going painfully slow, I think that training with a heart rate monitor is a good way to be in touch with how hard your body is actually working.  

Thanks everyone -- keep the running tips coming.  Anything can help.

There were a few more swimming questions on what books/dvds to buy or what is a good source for determing how to do something.  If you don't have access to a coach right away, the total immersion is good.  If you don't want to spend money, I have used youtube.com.  That is how I learned to do a flip turn.    There are alot of really good videos on youtube.com that show above and below water.

As for endurance in swimming, just take it slow.  No point doing speed drills to see how fast you can go if you can't do them consistently.  My suggestion is to work on technique drills and by doing so you will build up a good base.  Take it slow.

My warm-up for masters swim right now is 1/2 a mile.  Sounds like alot, but not really.  You build it up pretty fast . . . STAY HYDRATED, you don't realize how much you sweat swimming.

Let me know how the swims go

A lot of beginners have success with total immersion.  It will help you get more comfortable in the water with a lot of focus on balance.

Just glancing at the titles on website I would go with "easy freestyle" or "triathlon swimming made easy."  Although that's just a first impression.  I haven't read either.

I used Total Immersion and it drastically reduced my swim time, but the biggest thing was I got out of the water with a reasonable heart rate instead of standing in T1 sure my heart was about to explode, still use the drills when I start losing my stroke, still not a great swimmer but do not think any program could help that.

Sorry, freestyle made easy is what I used

Hi Chris,

Just re-read your profile and realized you are a nutrition guru.

So a few questions and let me know if I don't give you enough info.  I have been working on weight loss for about 3-4 months now.  Lost about 15 doing the Jenny Craig diet and haven't lost anything since about Sept.  It is frustrating.  I don't think it is because I am taking in too many calories, maybe I am just not eating the right stuff?

Frustrating cuz it seems like everyone else doing races just melts the pounds off.

Common days meals:
oatmeal or egg sandwich for breakfast
yogurt as snack
usually healthy choice for lunch
banana or pretzels for snack
helathy choice for dinner or cereal
granola bar for snack

I hydrate well and workouts longer than 1 hour I will generally supplement a little with sports drink and bar or some sort

HELP