Asphalt Junkies CLOSED AND GETTING OUR FIX (Page 31)

I haven't learned to draw the straight line down saying I'm cutting from another post so I cut and pasted from Dirk's post in italacs...This is good stuff!!!  That is why I wanted to be a member and proud to be a member of this group!

Recovery from the sprint shouldn't be an issue because your training volume will account for any expended energy used in the HIM.  I think is wise to have a training race but if it is a possibility you might consider getting another tri mixed in before the big race.  It will be better for your performance to have another race under your belt and I would suggest an Oly to get closer to your "A" race distance.

I agree with your assessment of your bike.  You are definitely not going to have a problem with the distance.  But, like you said you don't want to be like Lieto.  He does have a tendency to crap out a little on the run.

To get your run up to where you need to be for distance you are going to want to get your volume up to something in the range of at least 25 MPW but I would suggest a minimum of 30 MPW.  You are going to need to build volume slowly and make sure you get a long run that will put you in the neighborhood of 10-11 miles minimum, again, I would suggest closer to the full HM if you can put the time together.

I would try to get your runs up as soon as you can to 4 runs a week.  I saw in your logs that you are running veryy similar distances for all of your runs.  You're going to want to stagger those mileages out some so you don't have your legs programmed to the same distance.  I would suggest you get get 2 shorter distance runs of something like 1.5-2.5 miles per week, 1 run at 3-4 miles and then for the long run start with 5-6 miles.  Build these distances up slowly (10% rule) to avoid injury and allow your body to adapt.  Make sure you take a recovery week every 3rd to 4th week or sooner if your body needs it.

Karl, just hit the quote button at the bottom of the post you want to reply to. Then scroll down through the post until you see the word QUOTE. Start typing your reply after that!

But yes, you are correct, there are a lot of great posts in this group!

thanks sorry to be a computer challenged...see this site is educational

No problem, and you can always use the preview button to check out what your post will look like to make sure it makes sense.

Johnny - Do you know about this trail race?

Weaver Basin 50K in Weaverville in October

They have 50K, 30K, and 10K options.  Looks kinda fun.

Yesterday morning's run really hurt my achilles.  Say a quick prayer for me that it's not going to be a big deal...

Now, the topic of tapering.   I will dump a few thoughts here.  I think it's important to always keep in mind the purpose or goal of tapering.  There are an endless variety of ways to taper properly with the goal in mind (especially for a triathlete).

The goal is to ensure your body is primed for the best performance.  Simple huh?

That means being properly rested and fueled...but it also means being in top shape.  So this is where the confusion and uncertainty come from.  How easy is too easy such that you detrain?  How late can I start a taper to eek out the lts bit of improved conditioning?  How much 'rest' is required by my body to be ready?

It sounds like it can be really hard to do this right.   But it's not as hard as it seems.  The reason being that there is a fairly wide window between 'rest' and 'detraining'.  But don't make the mistake of thinking the 'detraining' takes a long time to set in....it's more that the 'rest' doesn't take long to set in.

If you are used to a certain training program, you do it week in and week out and you eventually achieve a state of day-to-day recovery.  Your body is used to this.  In that case it only takes 1 rest day to be fully recharged.  (for instance, that's the way I approach all of my summer races) 

For a big race that you are focusing on, the need to continue to train right through it isn't there so you can go for the extra little bit of recovery.  So you might taper for a few days.  This makes me realize that there can be a lot of confusion over what 'taper' means.  You can say you are in 'taper' for a few weeks before a big race and that may simply mean you have made some change to your training plan versus the norm.  If it just means your 'long' run is less than 15 miles instead of 18+ then you can say you are in your 'taper' but that's not so much what I'm talking about.

I have my daughter (who races this weekend) doing the following:  Up until today, she's doing the absolute norm with her training.  Beginning tomorrow I have suggested 3 miles (instead of 4 or 5) then on Friday 2 miles...then race day.  (She's been as high as 30 miles for her longest week for reference).  Her routine has been 6 days of running with a longer run so about 4 miles average distance on the typical days...  That amount of training only takes an easy day to recover from.

I think that the confusion about taper comes in large part from the ironman training plans.  That volume of training is so incredibly high that athletes are often in a serious state of stress.  So much so that medical testing can tell!  They may be anemic, have wacked out hormone levels, not sleeping well...These athletes warrant a 2 week taper.

As usual, Jeff has an awesome post! Thanks man. On the subject of tapering, how do you taper the other two sports when you're looking to race in one - as in how would you taper the bike and swim for a running race? Use less taper, but still do low intensity stuff?

I hope your achilles feels better, don't forget to take your own advice!!

And thanks to Dirk and Jeff for the info about Training Peaks - It sounds like Garmin Connect is as good as any, so I'll stick with that too.

I never got my clipless pedal ride yesterday, the delivery of my shoes was delayed by a day. They should be here any time, so I'm excited about trying them out tonight. How should I go about adjusting the cleats and things? I'm planning on leaving about an hour and a half this evening for making adjustments and riding around the neighborhood. I actually might make it a bike maintenance-fest in the end, since I think there are a couple of other things that could so with checking and adjusting. We'll see how the time goes.

Best of luck training today everyone!

Jeff thanks for that post on the taper, exactly what John said great post and I can't agree more with him on your achillies. Hope it's doing better and not anything serious and maybe you should take it a little easy especially with the full schedule of races you have planned this season.

John I'm no expert with the clipless pedals but when I got fit for my bike they set me up so I had a little play in my shoe where I could turn in a little and turn out a little with my foot since I am pretty much starting off and I may not pedal exactly straight up and down especially when I start getting tired. So far no issues with the set up of my shoes and just throwing that out there. 

Jeff, thanks for the tapering answer!!!

Let us know how ur Achilles is doing.  Hope everything is good!

JeffY - 2012-04-25 11:52 AM

guitarfrk75 - 2012-04-25 10:12 AM

As usual, Jeff has an awesome post! Thanks man. On the subject of tapering, how do you taper the other two sports when you're looking to race in one - as in how would you taper the bike and swim for a running race? Use less taper, but still do low intensity stuff?

I hope your achilles feels better, don't forget to take your own advice!!

And thanks to Dirk and Jeff for the info about Training Peaks - It sounds like Garmin Connect is as good as any, so I'll stick with that too.

I never got my clipless pedal ride yesterday, the delivery of my shoes was delayed by a day. They should be here any time, so I'm excited about trying them out tonight. How should I go about adjusting the cleats and things? I'm planning on leaving about an hour and a half this evening for making adjustments and riding around the neighborhood. I actually might make it a bike maintenance-fest in the end, since I think there are a couple of other things that could so with checking and adjusting. We'll see how the time goes.

Best of luck training today everyone!

That's a good question regarding a triathlete tapering for a HM. Your usual long run the weekend before race day should still be done, but easy. Your last bike ride of more than an hour should be no later than Wed. Shorter rides, even intense can be done up to 2 days prior to race (thurs for a sat race is fine for a hard 45 minutes for instance) You can swim harder and longer than normal. I have had good luck with a typical hard Friday swim before Saturday races. I think swimming is a great day before workout. Never take the day before off. Swim is good as would be a 2 mile easy run with strides. For a Saturday race it would look like a normal training week (except no HARD runs) until Thursday. Thursday could be a modest distance easy run and/or short, hard bike or swim. Friday would be a swim and/or 2mile run. That's it unless you have a sense that you are in a state of overtraining. And the final part....eat like a king or queen the day before the race. Give no thought to calories. Eat enough that you would feel guilty if it weren't for a purpose.

I apply the same general logic to my tapers too.  When I haven't traveled or been busy with other family activities the day before a race I always do something.  (I usually don't do anything hard though.)  I have found that my mind seems to drift toward wondering if I'm ready or I think my legs are going stale or something along those lines.  Getting an easy run or bike in keeps those thoughts from creeping in and distracting me from where my mind should be............race preparation.

One other point.  As your volume increases on a general training platform you can get by with a shorter taper too.  For instance: Jeff and I generally train a lot of hours in  a week, Jeff more than I, and we have forced our bodies to adapt to the training volume. And, as he has already said, your body begins to recover faster as your volume increases.  Each of you should experience this even now since you have been training for at least a month.  Look back to your training load when you first began training as a gauge for what you can handle currently versus then.

Just as Jeff said, tapering is pretty individual.  And you can and should play with this a little to determine what works best for you.  Yes!  You will probably flounder a little at a few races but that is racing AND learning to race better.  If you never challenge yourself completely you'll never know what you can REALLY do.

Clearly an M dot Tattoo... I thought those were part of the triathlete's "uniform." Make sure it's on the back of your calf. Anywhere else is just obnoxious.

You could go practice an OWS in the canals at the Venician.

That does look like a neat event. I hadn't heard of it before. The countryside around Weaverville is really nice.

That reminds me; the old outlaw Black Bart once robbed the Weaverville to Redding stagecoach not far from where I do my open water swim practice. There is a museum in Weaverville with a lot of old west and gold rush history saved there.

That race takes place the day before the Nike Women's Half Marathon in San Fransisco that my wife is hoping to run with a couple of her friends. So we definitely wouldn't be able to make it since I'll be down there supporting her for her first half marathon.

Jeff, sending a little Achilles healing your way.  I know how nasty that can be.  Hopefully it recovers quickly with some rest from running.  Go with a full face tattoo, I think those look really great in professional settings.

Thanks for all the taper talk.  I was thinking I might do a little less than typical lay off.  After one full day off Sat. and two days of huge carbo loading - not by design but just lots of foods at the weekend away that I don’t usually eat - I had maybe the best long run of my life Sunday evening.  It got me wondering if a really short taper is fine given I’m pretty adapted to all this easy pace running.

HAHAHAHAHA....That just about made my day.  Not that I'm against tattoos...but that is damn funny.

I haven't heard of the race before, either.  I'm wondering if this is its first year.  I might do the 10K but then I'd have a race every single weekend in October.  I'm not sure if I want to do that!

Awesome that your wife is doing her first half mary at such an awesome venue!  Good for her!

So, in a earlier post I saw a comment on carb-loading. Also, more info on nutrition. This article has some great info on carb-loading and I decided to post it. It is a bit long winded, but worth the read. I used this as a template for my 117 mile ride last week and it work wonderfully. I also have my nutritionist working on some more info on carb-loading and I will post it when she's finished.

Carbo-loading: Tips for Endurance Athletes

• Nancy Clark MS RD CSSD
• Aug 05, 2011

Does carbo-loading mean stuffing myself with pasta?
Should I avoid protein the day before the marathon?
Will carbo-loading make me fat…?

If you are an endurance athlete who is fearful of “hitting the wall,” listen up: proper fueling before your marathon, triathlon, century bike ride or other competitive endurance events can make the difference between agony and ecstasy! If you plan to compete for longer than 90 minutes, you want to maximize the amount of glycogen stored in your muscles because poorly fueled muscles are associated with needless fatigue. The more glycogen, the more endurance (potentially). While the typical athlete has about 80 to 120 mmol glycogen/kg muscle, a carbo-loaded athlete can have about 200 mmol. This is enough to improve endurance by about 2 to 3%, to say nothing of making the event more enjoyable.

While carbo-loading sounds simple (just stuff yourself with pasta, right?), the truth is many endurance athletes make food mistakes that hurt their performance. The last thing you want after having trained for months is to ruin your performance with poor nutrition, so carbo-load correctly!
Play video on great carb options by clicking on the following link.
Carbohydrates - Fuel Up for Stamina

Training Tactics

The biggest change in your schedule during the week before your event should be in your training, not in your food. Don't be tempted to do any last-minute long sessions! You need to taper your training so that your muscles have adequate time to become fully fueled (and healed). Allow at least two easy or rest days pre-event.

Fueling Tactics

You need not eat hundreds more calories this week. You simply need to exercise less. This way, the 600 to 1,000 calories you generally expend during training can be used to fuel your muscles. All during this week, you should maintain your tried-and-true high-carbohydrate training diet. Drastic changes can easily lead to upset stomachs, diarrhea, or constipation. For example, carbo-loading on an unusually high amount of fruits and juices might cause diarrhea. On the other hand, too many white flour, low fiber bagels, breads, and pasta might clog your system. As Marathon King Bill Rodgers once said “More marathons are won or lost in the porta-toilets than they are at the dinner table...” Fuel wisely, not like a chow hound.

Be sure that you carbo-load, not fat-load. Some athletes eat gobs of butter on a dinner roll, big dollops of sour cream on a potato, and enough dressing to drown a salad. These fatty foods fill both the stomach and fat cells but leave muscles poorly fueled. The better bet is to trade the fats for extra carbohydrates. That is: instead of devouring one roll with butter for 200 calories, have two plain rolls for 200 calories. Enjoy pasta with tomato sauce rather than oil or cheese toppings. Choose low-fat frozen yogurt, not gourmet ice cream.

Meal Timing

NYC Marathon Queen Grete Waitz once said she never ate a very big meal the night before a marathon, as it usually would give her trouble the next day. She preferred to eat a bigger lunch. You, too, might find that pattern works well for your intestinal tract. That is, instead of relying upon a huge pasta dinner the night before the event, you might want to enjoy a substantial carb-fest at breakfast or lunch. This earlier meal allows plenty of time for the food to move through your system. You can also carbo-load two days before if you will be too nervous to eat much the day before the event. (The glycogen stays in your muscles until you exercise.) Then graze on crackers, chicken noodle soup, and other easily tolerated foods the day before your competition.

You'll be better off eating a little bit too much than too little the day before the event, but don't overstuff yourself. Learning the right balance takes practice. Hence, each long training session leading up to the endurance event offers the opportunity to learn which food—and how much of it—to eat. I repeat: During training, be sure to practice your pre-event carbo-loading meal so you’ll have no surprises on the day of the event!

Weight Gain

Athletes who have properly carbo-loaded should gain about one to three pounds—but don't panic! This weight gain is good; it reflects water weight and indicates you have done a good job of fueling your muscles. For every ounce of carb stored in your body, you store almost three ounces water.

Fluids

Be sure to drink extra water, juices, and even soda pop, if desired. Abstain from too much wine, beer, and alcoholic beverages; they are not only poor sources of carbs, but are also dehydrating. Drink enough alcohol-free beverages to produce a significant volume of urine every two to four hours. The urine should be pale yellow, like lemonade. Don’t bother to over-hydrate; your body is like a sponge and can absorb just so much fluid. Be sure to take a look at the following article on drinking fluids.
Fluid Facts for Athletes

Protein

Many endurance athletes eat only carbs and totally avoid protein-rich foods the days before their event. BAD IDEA. Your body needs protein on a daily basis. Hence, you can and should eat a small serving of low-fat proteins such as poached eggs, yogurt, turkey, or chicken as the accompaniment to most meals (not the main focus), or plant proteins such as beans and lentils (as tolerated). Learn more about protein needs and the athlete by clicking the following link. PROTEIN: The Pros, Cons, and Confusion

Event day:

Carb-loading is just part of the fueling plan. What you eat on the day of the event is critically important and helps to spare your limited muscle glycogen stores. So fuel yourself wisely both BEFORE AND DURING the event—and hopefully you will enjoy miles of smiles!

If you have any concerns or questions about your nutritional needs, seek the consultation of a local sports nutritionist for appropriate care. To locate a top sports nutritionist in your area, please visit our Find a Sports Nutritionist Near You section.

Nancy Clark, MS, RD, CSSD is Board Certified as a Specialist in Sports Dietetics. She counsels casual and competitive athletes in her private practice at Healthworks, the premier fitness center in Chestnut Hill MA (617-383-6100). Her bestselling Sports Nutrition Guidebook and food guides for new runners, marathoners, soccer players and cyclists are available at www.nancyclarkrd.com. See also sportsnutritionworkshop.com for information about upcoming and online workshops.

SIDEBAR:

Tools for Carbo-loading

When carbo-loading, you want to consume about 3 to 5 grams carbohydrates per pound of body weight. (This comes to a diet with about 60% of calories from carbohydrates.) Divide your target grams of carbohydrates into three parts of the day (breakfast + snack; lunch + snack; dinner + snack), and choose foods to hit our target! You can find carbohydrate info on food labels and www.fitday.com

If you weigh:	Total #g carb/day	Target #g carbs per five hours: *
100 lbs	300 to 500 g	100 to 175 g
125 lbs	375 to 625 g	125 to 210 g
150 lbs	450 to 750 g	150 to 250 g
175 lbs	525 to 875 g	175 to 290 g

*7:00 a.m.-noon; noon-5:00 pm; 5:00-10:00 pm

Sample 50 gram carbohydrate choices for the foundation of a meal or snack

Wheaties, 2 cups
Nature Valley Granola Bar, 2 packets (4 bars)
Thomas’ Bagel, 1 (3.5 oz)
Banana, 2 medium
Orange juice, 16 ounces
Apple, 2 medium
Raisins, 1/2 cup
Pepperidge Farm multi-grain bread, 2.5 slices
Baked potato, 1 large (6.5 ounces)
Pasta, 1 cup cooked
Rice, 1 cup cooked
Fig Newtons, 5
Flavored Yogurt + 3 graham cracker squares

Two Sample Carbo-loading Food Plans (3,200-3,400 Calories)

Appropriate for a 150 pound athlete who needs about 4 grams carb/lb body weight

MENU #1

Food/Drink	Approx Calories	Carbs (g)
Wheaties, 2 cups	220	48
Milk, 1% lowfat, 8 ounces	100	12
Bagel, 1 (3.5 ounce)	300	55
Cream cheese, lowfat, 2 Tbsp	50	2
Orange juice, 12 ounces	160	40
		Breakfast: 830 cals, 75% carb

Food/Drink	Approx Calories	Carbs (g)
Whole grain bread, 2 slices	200	40
Peanut butter, 2 tablespoons	200	8
Jelly, 2 tablespoons	100	25
Fruit yogurt, 8 ounces	230	35
Potato chips, baked, 2 ounces	240	45
		Lunch: 970 cals, 65% carb

Food/Drink	Approx Calories	Carbs (g)
Apple, 1 large	120	30
Graham crackers, 4 squares	120	22
		Snack total: 240 cals; 90% carb

Food/Drink	Approx Calories	Carbs (g)
Chicken breast, 5 ounces	250	--
Rice, 1.5 cups cooked	300	65
Brocolli, 1 cup	50	10
Dinner rolls, 2 whole wheat	200	40
		Dinner: 800 cals; 60% carb

Food/Drink	Approx Calories	Carbs (g)
Banana, 1 medium (4 ounces)	100	25
Sherbert, 1 cup	260	45
		PM snack: 360 cals, ~100% carb

	Approx Calories	Carbs (g)
TOTAL Menu #1	3,200	547g
		~70% carb; ~4 g carb/lb for a 150 lb athlete

--- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- --- ---

MENU #2

Food/Drink	Approx Calories	Carbs (g)
Oatmeal, 1 cup dry, cooked in	300	55
Milk. 16 ounces	200	25
Raisins, 1/4 cup	130	30
Brown sugar, 1.5 tablespoons	50	12
Apple juice, 8 ounces	120	30
	Breakfast: 800 cals; 75% carb

Food/Drink	Approx Calories	Carbs (g)
Sub sandwich roll, 6” (4 ounces)	320	60	Lean meat (4 ounces)200--Fruit yogurt, 8 ounces24040Grape juice, 12 ounces22055 Lunch: 980 cals; 80% carb

Food/Drink	Approx Calories	Carbs (g)
Fig Newtons, 6	330	65
Jelly beans, 15 large	150	38
	Snack: 480 cals; 85% carb

Food/Drink	Approx Calories	Carbs (g)
Spaghetti. 2 cups cooked	400	80
Prego spaghetti sauce, 1 cup	250	40
Italian bread, 2 slices	150	30
Root beer, 12 ounces	140	38
	Dinner: 940 cals; 80% carb

Food/Drink	Approx Calories	Carbs (g)
Canned peaches in syrup, 1 cup	200	48
	Snack: 200 cals; ~100% carb

	Approx Calories	Carbs (g)
TOTAL Menu #2	3,400	646 g
		~75% carb; ~4.5 g carb/lb for a 150 lb athlete

Got my long swim done today.  Instead of 1X2000, it ended up being 2X1000 due to the following reasons:  swim cap kept sliding off, I got into a lane with splashy splash, splashy splash was replaced by wake-man, the third dude was Mr. Breaststroke.  Eeeee gads!!!

Wake-man was pretty amazing.  The wave of water that preceded him was HUGE!!!  I felt like I needed to dive under the wave every time he was coming at me!  He wasn't fast, either!

I agree Jeff.  This would be the best option for you but maybe add a couple of facial piercings with chains connecting your nose to your ears.  If you do it, I'll do it.  But YOU go first.  I promise I'll do it after I see yours.

This is funny!  I have swam with a guy that always puts one lane between he and I because he says I swim to fast for him and cause a wake that he can't swim through. (No I'm not that fast.  He's just a little older and does a pretty slow breast stroke most of the time.)

I did get a decent swim in myself today.  It has been a little more than 2 weeks since I have been able to swim, so I just knocked the rust off a little and didn't really try to kill myself.  I did have a few fast 50's that were moving quite well after my MS just to stay with some kind of speed work.  I was really happy to have an opportunity to get in the water.

Tracy that is so funny I'm still laughing, Wake-man lol. I must have ran into his cousin Wake-man jr. on Monday. I had to swim in the open area and was next to a guy with flippers and was kicking pretty good and had his own wave action going on enough so that I felt like I was doing an OWS on a windy day.