Bob Stocks' Group - Full for now! (Page 4)

Wow!  You really did a long run there.  30 hours in -37 degrees!!  :-)

I'll pass on that temperature.  We're at a windchill of -1 right now, which is way too cold for me.

Got a swim in this morning and my thought for the day is HAND ENTRY. I'll start a thread in the tri forum but I'll post it here first. Watch people swim and you will see a lot of different styles. Watch the 1500 m freestyle in the Olympics and you will see different versions of freestyle. Some have a fast turnover, some have a slow turnover. Some recover with strait arms while some recover with bent arms. The point is that there is no RIGHT way to swim freestyle.

The one thing that you will notice with any proficient swimmer is that they are RELAXED!! Where your hand enters and at what angle it enters the water isn't as important as entering the water relaxed. My hand enters the water at shoulder width, almost fully extended with the thumb entering the water first. This is the correct way FOR ME. I have seen others enter with their middle finger first and a high elbow then extending forward after the entry and that worked for them. Obviously, pushing any water forward would slow you down and that would be bad.

Try different entries and see what works best. Keep in mind to relax your hand during the recovery and set it in the water during entry, don't force your hand in the water.

Have a great Monday everyone!!

Robert, robert, robert, when you jab, wait for the counterpunch.

Knocked down 90 minutes on the trainer watching the NBC version of Kona, I got bored so it turned into a really solid workout...buncha tempo, plus some intervals. It would seem that this was my first time on the bike in December, following up a month in November where I rode...err..once, and October where...ta-dah---goose egg!!!

Heh.  Thanks, Dr. Timofeef.   Swim later, if I don't pass out.

Name:  Rick / rkreuser

Background:   I am a 42-year-old divorced full-time road warrior management consultant, a single dad, and self-professed expert at working with what life gives me.  Growing up - and through college - I played soccer, rugby, and ultimate frisbee. I also cycled quite a bit on my steel peugeot with fenders and the generator headlamp. And paddled around (nothing formal) in the water, growing up in Florida. I got into triathlons after having back surgery in 2001, and looking for a way to prove to myself that I was structurally sound. I'm a pure middle of the pack triathlete that could move up the pack with a simpler life and consistent training, so that's what this mentor group is all about.

I DVR'd Scorpion King, that was a good one for the trainer... every time some gets killed you sprint for 90".  Sufficed to say, lots of sprinting.

That's my problem.  I'm never very relaxed in the water. 

Seems like an easy question, but why do you think that is?  Just curious...

Can we spend some time on the use of the word "relaxed"?  I view "relaxed" as sitting pool side sipping a margarita and snoozing. 

When I am mashing on the bike, trying to make that last repeat, etc. I am not "relaxed" nor will I ever be.  What I try and do is focus my mind to keep it clear so I am not thinking about the technical aspects of whatever I am doing and act instinctually.  Is that what you are talking about, or do you really mean"relaxed" (as in Jeff Spiccoli from Fast Times relaxed)?

I finally made it back into the pool today. First time in about a month-ish. I swear I felt like a great big sea slug the whole time, but at least I got in. Especially considering it was 25 degrees outside and I find any excuse not to go. My plan is to go 2 more times this week, but we'll see. I'm hopeful. I need to focus more on my hand entry--I think my elbow enters first, so I am working on not slapping the water so much and using the whole higher elbow entry. Your tips today were helpful, Bob! Thanks!

Rick, I'm glad you in the group as well--I know both of you together have a ton of good advice and I really, really want to be sick in the head and do the Triple T one year!  

Being relaxed is the one thing I have in swimming.  Now, if only I could get faster. . .

Thanks, Amiee. I don't know about advice...I somehow don't live by my own advice sometimes, or even like 10% of the time, but glad to help out where I can.

And now you need to get on Shaun for signing up for the TTT. It's a whooooole different deal than an IM, time for some learning.

To be honest I've never found that comfortably hard spot in the water.  Like when your running or biking there is that spot where your working hard, but you know you can stay at that pace for a long time.  Whenever I try to pick up the pace in the pool my breathing becomes labored quickly and I feel like what little form I have falls apart. 

These are some great swimming points that I am anxious to respond to. I like to think of swimming as "relaxed power" and I will try to explain that a bit later when I am at work tonight and have more time to respond.

In the mean time keep the discussion going and I know Rick knows what I mean about relaxed power and maybe can shed some light on it. (He's a fish, he just doesn't realize it!)

Let me go get my swim in, and maybe I'll remember.   I'll chip in when I get back...

Holy CHIP!!! He's actually going to swim!

I'm off for my run! Heat wave of 24 degreeswith a light breeze!!

The last time I tried to do a hard effort for a set, I pushed as hard as I could, kicked harder, labored more, was out of breath, etc, etc.

and my time for the 100 was a couple secs slower than when I just cruise and concentrate on technique!

Lesson learned.

I hear you on this one.  I find that when I try to push really hard when swimming that I actually end up going slower, as I unintentionally shorten my stroke and have less glide.

Yeah, he did.   First swim in over a month, but I've got so many excuses.

Anyway, I'd be curious to get Bob's thoughts on this (or anyone's, really), but I tried to figure out when, during the swim today, I had relaxed power...and it was at the beginning of the 2nd set. Here, maybe try this to recreate the 'relaxed power' sensation...

Swim a warmup, whatever's comfortable, 300, 500, whatever your distance is. The last 100 or 150 of that warmup, take strong strokes, pushing a bit, making sure you've given effort, but not so hard that you can't recover in a minute. Then, take a 1 min rest interval.  THEN...do a 100 at 'normal' pace; at least for me, that next hundred is the perfect swim feeling...smooth, gliding, lots of O2 in the muscles, not straining to breathe, not fatigued or gasping, not so tired your stroke begins to deteriorate. Perfect conditions to apply 'relaxed power'.

Now, that was the easy part. The hard part is having that feeling for a longer period of time. Maybe that'll be Bob's next effort.

That 3-5-7 reminds me that I should try that again.  Whenever I've tried going beyond 3 in the past, I end up getting all flustered and screwing up my stroke, so I quickly give up.  Now's the time to try again.