Ernesto's group (third season) - CLOSED (Page 42)

My reason to say that Gabe will not get caught is that he's putting mega rides that no one is doing right now. It is relatively easy to bike five hours, impossible to run the same time, so he'll keep opening gaps to the rest of the group. Besides he's training for an IM, we're not. Almost like he's competing with himself if you ask me, I've been in his shoes.

 My reason to say that Gabe will not get caught is that he's putting mega rides that no one is doing right now. It is relatively easy to bike five hours, impossible to run the same time, so he'll keep opening gaps to the rest of the group. Besides he's training for an IM, we're not. Almost like he's competing with himself if you ask me, I've been in his shoes.

       I knew what you meant. Just having fun.

I have to admit a couple of things, I am increadibly impressed by the training Gabe is logging in, knowing the goal he is striving for and the sacrifices he is willing to make to reach them.

I personally love to win the coveted prize of the tin foil medal, but I am not in the challenge for that. For me the challenge is the same challenge we face in a race or when training.  I am  competing against myself.

The little demon that tells me go ahead Jim, you had a hard day or you are too busy to workout is the same little demon that tells me why are you still running, I'm tired, lets go watch sports center or doesn't a supreme pizza and a beer sound good right now (ok that always sounds good).

The challange to me is beating that little demon and finding a way to get my workout in. So far I have been successful, but there are circumstances that come up that make us have to be creative. I have been fretting all week because we are going away for a college visit for my oldest daughter. The weekend is going to be extended because we are going to an Michigan State v Ohio State womens basketball game Sunday (ESPN 2 at 4:00). So we won't be home until late Sunday. It will be easy for me to say we are gone, we are staying in a hotel and this weekend isn't about me, its about her and just skip training. Instead I have developed a plan (approved by my wife and daughter, because the weekend isn't about me it is about her).

It includes a swim workout, while they sit in the hot tub on Saturday. My wife is also my swim coach so she will yell orders at me from the hot tub. Then an early morning treadmill run on Sunday.

My point is the challenge to me is to beat those obsticals and find a way to train. It has always been my mantra ( I should add this to my signature)

"When you don't want to do it, is when you have to do it"

ps For the record there are not voices in my head that tell me what to do

BTW.....Congrats Ernesto on the recognition at work!

Jim,

That demon becomes very easy to beat after a while, if you become consistent, having a workout is the norm (or recover from one, while wishing you could put another).

If I don't train like in October, eight days in a row due to work, or December due to family commitments, work and others, I literally feel sick and depressed.

After some time being steady at it, it will be the same for you. That's one of the purposes of this challenge. No need to beat oneself down, thirty minutes easy does the trick. The name of the game is frequency. While guys like Gabe or Chris can handle big volume along with the frequency, keep in mind that they have the proper base for doing this and they are listening to their bodies. Both know how to back down when they need a break so the work is absorbed. This is also another trick that you learn with experience and consistency.

Everybody in this group is on the right track and I am proud to be part of it.  We're up to 1035 posts so far, and we're the busiest mentoring group out of 48 threads. We are doing something well is my assumption.

Well said, Jim!  

I see when Gabe posted his last update, he "downgraded" me and Joyce 1 day, so I am just fixing the overlap...maybe it was an innocent mistake, or maybe he knows where the real competition is coming from!

Yes, but if you are a Fiat 500, then you have a chance to get Jennifer Lopez to dance on your hood!

Chris, Jackie, and Ernesto...as an engineer, I hate when people give me empirical evidence to support something that I want to argue about. Way to ruin my fun!

In all seriousness, I don't doubt it works. Just my impatient self concerned about the impact of running slow (or even walking) on short term vs. the benefits long term. But I guess I need to decide if I want to be better soon, or much better in the future. I bought the book yesterday, and plan to follow it once I get a chance to read it, in the mean time will try to keep my heart rate in MAF and see what happens. Will go for a second round at lunch.

Having said that, why is there such a difference between MAF levels (137) and LT "extensive endurance" levels (Zone 2 according to BT - 145-154). Or maybe I am comparing to the wrong one and should compare to "LT recovery" zone 1 - 112-144. I don't know if there is an answer, but just my usual self researching the heck out of everything and wanting to know everything about everything.

Go to MD for follow-up on the knee injury. Hoping for no surgery that will keep me out a long time. Today I did swimming 1000m TT @ 17:16. Only about 30 seconds off from last year. Got hard bike intervals later today. Ordered a new trainer tire today and should get it by early next week.

Good thing I can still swim/bike otherwise the weight would really come on.

You can't cross the two methodologies (MAF vs. Zones) to one another.  They are both legitimate ways to train and neither is exact.  I think Dr. Maffetone said at one point that through all his studies he came to a conclusion that 180-age (with some adjustments) was pretty close most of the time.  It is an easy way to figure out where to train from a HR perspective to build that aerobic engine.  It allows a very high % of people to train at a level that allows them to develop that Cummins Diesel engine.  Alternatively, the 5 zones are also widely used and are set off of your LT.  I think you admitted that your LT was an estimate based off of a 3 mile run.  Even a lab test as accurate as it would be would only be good for that day and that moment.  HRs fluctuate a lot.  Everything from temp, level of rest, diet, etc. will impact your HR on any given day.  I think that is why those doing Zone training are encouraged to regularly test their LT.

I have read that the MAF corresponds to high Zone 1 to mid Zone 2.  Like I said, there is no way to really compare.  I was very similar to you 9 months ago and Ernesto will attest that I asked the same questions you are asking.  I never pursued a strict MAF program but dialed down my pace a lot which allowed me to increase my consistency.  At those paces (mid 9's) I am approaching my MAF.  I am an N=1 case so its impossible to say what my MAF pace would have been last June and where it would be today.  All I can say is that by slowing down dramatically and upping my consistency I am becoming much more efficient from an aerobic perspective.  Based on a larger sample size I would say that MAF training works and that from the evidence it is worth it to pursue.  You have to make a decision on what works for you and then adhere to it.

I have a bike type question(s):

I flipped off my bike in the HIM in September.  Was pretty banged up for over a month healing and couldn't ride.  After that, the weather got too chilly for outdoor rides and have been taking spin about 2x week for my "bike" training.  I'm gathering from reading the thread that a "trainer" would be more beneficial?  I have a cheap trainer my husband bought at least 6 years ago for triathlon training (he pulled his back out on vacation 2 weeks before, didn't compete and has never trained  since)....but that's another story!  Here's the one he has http://slatbypa.info/graber-mag-trainer.php Is this the type of trainer or (drainer?) I can use?  Would I get more out of it than spin class?  Ernesto, I saw you posted a link for a special tire used?  Any help or direction is appreciated!  

 Today: 6.5 mile run outside (55') - increased tempo a bit to see how body would respond, followed by 25' recovery ride on trainer.

 ---------------------------------

- Gabe 10 days 21:47:08"
- Chris 10 days, 15:06:45
- Carol 10 days 12:40'01"
- Jen 10 days 12:02'54"
- Scott 10 days 11:58'23"
- Jackie 10 days 11:12'18"
- Ernesto 10 days 10:17'10"
- Rachel 10 days 10:03'31"
- Joe P 10 days 10:01'33"
- Barry 10 days 9:40'04"
- Joyce 10 days 8:37:18"
- Jim 10 days 8:27'16"
----------------------------------
- Elizabeth 9 days 9:55
- Charlotte 9 days 8:33'00"
- Joe D 9 days 7:51'52"
- Samy 9 days 5:37'42"
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- Matthew 7 days 7:25'00"
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- Bruce 6 days 6:36 07"
---------------------------------
- Alfredo 5 days 2:59'17"
-----------------------------
- Todd TX 4 Days 3:51'00"
- William 4 days 3:12'02"
- Todd 4 days 2:21'30"
-----------------------------
- Mark H 3 days 2:00'11"
- Leslie 3 days 1:52'00"

I can't copy and paste the Weight Challenge format.  Doesn't anyone have any idea as to why?

Competitor

Current weight% changeMitch161.5 -1.76%Chris165.2-3.39%Jen115.4-2.20%Jim172 -2.27%Ernesto178-3.47% Rachel79.5kg -2.09%ToddTx213 -0.93%Todd212-.99%Gabe160.2-2.44%Joyce128-1.69%Charlotte 143.0 +2.0%Barry213.5-1.00

Another vote for yes...even if its not running, you can always call it really ugly and slow swimming. Nothing in the rules about swimming with good form...

3rd vote for Yes!

Couldn't open the link.  I'm not sure what Ernesto recommended for a tire but I have a Gatorskin for the trainer.  It's really tough!!!  I was told the biggest benefit between spin classes and your own trainer is that you are riding your own bike.  You have all your gearing and set your resistance. You are spending time in your saddle.   Scott and I have Fluid Trainers.  They are nice and quiet.  Also the ones we use have a lever to release the resistance when we aren't riding.  Then flip it up when we are, to ensure the same tension on the rear wheel from workout to workout.