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Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! (Page 5)
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 2010-04-07 7:19 PM in reply to: #2775478 |
Champion  7233    |  Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!!janeclemo - 2010-04-07 6:11 PM Hi everyone. I did 2 workouts today: 1. 2100 swim which went awesome! The woman I swim with gave me some pointers on my stroke which has made me about 5 seconds faster on each 50 yd which is great! 2.TI track team workout which was some warm-up drills and then 3 x 200 at about 80% which for me was about 55 seconds. Now my shins are killing me! I've been dealing with some mild shin splints ever since about half way through my 1/2 marathon training in january and february. Should I forget about this kind of track/speed work and just focus on endurance? I'm such a slow runner I was hoping these types of speed drills would help me, but I don't want to get injured! Also, I'm supposed to bike tonight on my trainer which would make 3 workouts in one day. Is this too much? Thanks, Jane until you are up running over 20mpw easily there is no real reason, or benifit, to running speed workouts. You'll likely get injured, and you wont have the base in your legs to do anything with that faster running. simply running more will make you faster, but you need to add distance slowly. |
| 2010-04-07 7:20 PM in reply to: #2770346 |
Extreme Veteran 386 Rio Rancho - where you can ride year round! | Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! wow...gone for work and 5 pages already! lots of reading for tonight... my workout today - 22 mile bike ride, mixed in 5x4' intervals and 1x20' race pace set. good ride. |
| 2010-04-07 7:24 PM in reply to: #2775455 |
Champion 7233 | Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! tri808 - 2010-04-07 6:03 PM Question for the good swimmers out there... Over the past 2 months, I have now become comfortable swimming basically any distance. I'm still working on my form with my masters coaches (I'm far from perfect), but what type of workouts do you think are most beneficial to improving your swim times for sprint/oly races? Sometimes our masters class is focused on sprints (50-100yds)...so while I'm more than willing to do these workouts...I'm not sure if they are the "ideal" workouts for getting my 750-1500m swim times lower. I usually swim OW one day a week...so that's just a 2000m straight swim...but I also try and get in another day in the pool on my own. I have tried doing ladders (50, 100, 150, 200, 250, 250, 200, 150, 100, 50) and such...but is there any sets or workouts that you feel are better...should I just swim 1500 straight and keep trying to improve my time? Thanks i can count the number of times i have swam straight over 500 in a pool on one hand. 98% of my workouts are in the form of 50 through 200yard intervals. some ladders, some straight sets. if you are already doing an open water swim that takes care of any longer swim you might need. once i am back up to full swim volumes, i'll have two workouts a week of 25-75yrd speed intervals on longer rest, two days of 100-200yrd intervals, one of some sort of ladder, and one of slightly longer pulling/kick intervals (200-400s). that type of workout has taken me from a 12min 400 a few years ago to 4:24 400. |
| 2010-04-07 7:26 PM in reply to: #2775497 |
Champion 7233 | Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! barelfly - 2010-04-07 6:20 PM this is going to get full of pages fast!! wow...gone for work and 5 pages already! lots of reading for tonight... my workout today - 22 mile bike ride, mixed in 5x4' intervals and 1x20' race pace set. good ride. |
| 2010-04-07 7:28 PM in reply to: #2770346 |
| 14 | Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! It could very well be that my knees hurt from increses in weekly running. Too fast too soon. And then again, maybe the shoes. I will be going to the running store to explain the problem too them in the next day or two. They did say they would honor a return if there were problems. As for my mileage, I went from not running at all 5 weeks ago to a scheduled 28 miles this week, 8 miles being my longest. I will definitely try to remember to log my workouts from here on out. |
| 2010-04-07 7:33 PM in reply to: #2775518 |
Champion 7233 | Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! reloadyour9 - 2010-04-07 6:28 PM It could very well be that my knees hurt from increses in weekly running. Too fast too soon. And then again, maybe the shoes. I will be going to the running store to explain the problem too them in the next day or two. They did say they would honor a return if there were problems. As for my mileage, I went from not running at all 5 weeks ago to a scheduled 28 miles this week, 8 miles being my longest. I will definitely try to remember to log my workouts from here on out. I think you just answered your question right there. When i start running again each season ( after maybe 2 weeks off), it takes me about 6 weeks to hit 30 miles again, and thats after running all year and taking two weeks off. and even then, longest run is maybe 5-6 miles. you just went from 0-28 miles in 5 weeks. In general you should add no more than 10% TOPS per week to your running, and include a step down week in there every few weeks where you reduce mileage a bit to let your body acclimate (or at the very least do not add some weekly. |
| 2010-04-07 7:36 PM in reply to: #2775505 |
Expert 1146 Chugiak, Alaska | Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! newbz - 2010-04-07 7:24 PM tri808 - 2010-04-07 6:03 PM Question for the good swimmers out there... i can count the number of times i have swam straight over 500 in a pool on one hand. 98% of my workouts are in the form of 50 through 200yard intervals. some ladders, some straight sets. if you are already doing an open water swim that takes care of any longer swim you might need. once i am back up to full swim volumes, i'll have two workouts a week of 25-75yrd speed intervals on longer rest, two days of 100-200yrd intervals, one of some sort of ladder, and one of slightly longer pulling/kick intervals (200-400s). that type of workout has taken me from a 12min 400 a few years ago to 4:24 400. Over the past 2 months, I have now become comfortable swimming basically any distance. I'm still working on my form with my masters coaches (I'm far from perfect), but what type of workouts do you think are most beneficial to improving your swim times for sprint/oly races? Sometimes our masters class is focused on sprints (50-100yds)...so while I'm more than willing to do these workouts...I'm not sure if they are the "ideal" workouts for getting my 750-1500m swim times lower. I usually swim OW one day a week...so that's just a 2000m straight swim...but I also try and get in another day in the pool on my own. I have tried doing ladders (50, 100, 150, 200, 250, 250, 200, 150, 100, 50) and such...but is there any sets or workouts that you feel are better...should I just swim 1500 straight and keep trying to improve my time? Thanks x2 I find if I swim more than 500 yd straight I get completly bored and slow. By planning my workout with either short/fast intervals or medium/length race speed I don't lose focus. Whether that has helped me or not, I surely don't know! |
| 2010-04-07 7:37 PM in reply to: #2770346 |
Expert 2852 Pfafftown, NC | Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! My swim coach asked me to get some short fins (which I did). Now....I suppose they would allow me to swim longer....and therefore build up my threshold. I've been in the water 2X since I saw her, making small (or big, for me) gains. I've got one more trip (tomorrow) to the pool. THink I should put 'em on and see how far I can go? My fear is......they'll build a false sense of security. Your thoughts? Any of you use them, when just starting out? jeff |
| 2010-04-07 7:38 PM in reply to: #2775449 |
Extreme Veteran 396 Eastern Pennsylvania | Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! newbz - 2010-04-07 7:59 PM art welcome. Thanks for making room for me! Name: Reid15 - Art Story - 45 This is my third year of tri's. I got started after having both knees worked on due to years of running. Strictly BOP but working hard to be B of MOP. I'm a building material salesman Family status - Married (25 years next month), no kids but over 50 nieces & nephews Current training - Roughly 8 hrs/week, building up for HIM in June and IM in Sept. Races so far this year - nothing yet but I have a 1/2 marathon on Saturday. 2010 Races - Got the Nerve (May-sprint), Eagleman (June-HIM), Philly Tri (June-sprint), IMWI (Sept.) Art Edited by reid15 2010-04-07 7:40 PM |
| 2010-04-07 7:41 PM in reply to: #2775505 |
| Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! newbz - 2010-04-07 3:24 PM tri808 - 2010-04-07 6:03 PM Question for the good swimmers out there... i can count the number of times i have swam straight over 500 in a pool on one hand. 98% of my workouts are in the form of 50 through 200yard intervals. some ladders, some straight sets. if you are already doing an open water swim that takes care of any longer swim you might need. once i am back up to full swim volumes, i'll have two workouts a week of 25-75yrd speed intervals on longer rest, two days of 100-200yrd intervals, one of some sort of ladder, and one of slightly longer pulling/kick intervals (200-400s). that type of workout has taken me from a 12min 400 a few years ago to 4:24 400. Over the past 2 months, I have now become comfortable swimming basically any distance. I'm still working on my form with my masters coaches (I'm far from perfect), but what type of workouts do you think are most beneficial to improving your swim times for sprint/oly races? Sometimes our masters class is focused on sprints (50-100yds)...so while I'm more than willing to do these workouts...I'm not sure if they are the "ideal" workouts for getting my 750-1500m swim times lower. I usually swim OW one day a week...so that's just a 2000m straight swim...but I also try and get in another day in the pool on my own. I have tried doing ladders (50, 100, 150, 200, 250, 250, 200, 150, 100, 50) and such...but is there any sets or workouts that you feel are better...should I just swim 1500 straight and keep trying to improve my time? Thanks Good to know...thanks Swimming more than 200 at a time gets kind of boring anyway... |
| 2010-04-07 7:41 PM in reply to: #2775539 |
Expert 1146 Chugiak, Alaska | Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! nc452010 - 2010-04-07 7:37 PM My swim coach asked me to get some short fins (which I did). Now....I suppose they would allow me to swim longer....and therefore build up my threshold. I've been in the water 2X since I saw her, making small (or big, for me) gains. I've got one more trip (tomorrow) to the pool. THink I should put 'em on and see how far I can go? My fear is......they'll build a false sense of security. Your thoughts? Any of you use them, when just starting out? jeff Do you ever use a kickboard? It allows you to focus on just kicking and it is fun with fins! Of course, passing other swimmers in the pool with a kickboard is always fun! Anyways, in my workouts I usually do a kick set and a pull set - maybe that way they offset? |
| 2010-04-07 7:48 PM in reply to: #2770346 |
Veteran 208 Fayetteville, AR | Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! OMG! (wait, did i just use OMG? on the internets?.....yikes!) anyway, just used the new foam roller for about 15 min on my sore butt muscle after looking online at some ways to use it, and WOW! I stood up (the past few days, after sitting and then standing, i could feel the tight muscle) and it felt great! i'm sure its not "all better", and am still going to finish this as an unscheduled day off, and take my normal rest day tomorrow, but this is a good sign  we'll see how it feels in the morning. |
| 2010-04-07 7:49 PM in reply to: #2775539 |
Champion 7233 | Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! nc452010 - 2010-04-07 6:37 PM My swim coach asked me to get some short fins (which I did). Now....I suppose they would allow me to swim longer....and therefore build up my threshold. I've been in the water 2X since I saw her, making small (or big, for me) gains. I've got one more trip (tomorrow) to the pool. THink I should put 'em on and see how far I can go? My fear is......they'll build a false sense of security. Your thoughts? Any of you use them, when just starting out? jeff my guess is she wants you to use them to help both with building your kick, and lifting your legs up in the water. also, they wont lull you into a false sense of security because my guess is if you kick even somewhat hard you'll only make it 50-100 total before your legs are fried;-) it will do a great job in showing you how much O2 your legs need and use when kicking. |
| 2010-04-07 7:50 PM in reply to: #2775492 |
Member 25 Bend, OR | Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! So would a good plan be to just focus on adding distance weekly and not worrying so much about how fast I'm actually going? I hate seeing all those people in my neighborhood fly by me so fast! Hurts my ego. I'm going to be really slow in about a month when the weather gets hot! |
| 2010-04-07 7:52 PM in reply to: #2775539 |
| Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! nc452010 - 2010-04-07 3:37 PM My swim coach asked me to get some short fins (which I did). Now....I suppose they would allow me to swim longer....and therefore build up my threshold. I've been in the water 2X since I saw her, making small (or big, for me) gains. I've got one more trip (tomorrow) to the pool. THink I should put 'em on and see how far I can go? My fear is......they'll build a false sense of security. Your thoughts? Any of you use them, when just starting out? jeff Fins have greatly helped me during kicking drills. I have a horrible kick and could barely go 25 yds without fins. But since training with them (just for kicking drills) I can now go about 50-75 yards without fins now. Yes...they do help you extend your kicking drills. I can kick 500 yards straight with fins no problem. I don't like to swim with them though...I actually think it's harder because I focus more on kicking and drain my energy. When I swim, I use a two beat kick...but if I swim with fins, I feel like I need to use a 6 beat kick...otherwise they cause too much drag. It just seems to throw my whole swimming rythem off. |
| 2010-04-07 7:54 PM in reply to: #2775539 |
Member 25 Bend, OR | Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! nc452010 - 2010-04-07 7:37 PM My swim coach asked me to get some short fins (which I did). Now....I suppose they would allow me to swim longer....and therefore build up my threshold. I've been in the water 2X since I saw her, making small (or big, for me) gains. I've got one more trip (tomorrow) to the pool. THink I should put 'em on and see how far I can go? My fear is......they'll build a false sense of security. Your thoughts? Any of you use them, when just starting out? jeff I've had some experience with fins. The woman who leads the masters group that I swim with recommended I use fins, but for drills only. That way I can get a good pace going and focus more on my stroke form than on kicking hard. It has helped me a lot. It's also helped me to position my body better in the water, but I found it can really send my heart rate sky high if I'm kicking hard with them on. |
| 2010-04-07 7:54 PM in reply to: #2775573 |
| Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! BoobieDr - 2010-04-07 3:48 PM OMG! (wait, did i just use OMG? on the internets?.....yikes!) anyway, just used the new foam roller for about 15 min on my sore butt muscle after looking online at some ways to use it, and WOW! I stood up (the past few days, after sitting and then standing, i could feel the tight muscle) and it felt great! i'm sure its not "all better", and am still going to finish this as an unscheduled day off, and take my normal rest day tomorrow, but this is a good sign we'll see how it feels in the morning. I told you...FOAM ROLLER!!! It's one of God's blessings to man. |
| 2010-04-07 7:54 PM in reply to: #2770346 |
Expert 2852 Pfafftown, NC | Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! I've watched every swimming (crawl) video I can find on Youtube. I have an honest question to ask.... How much should I be using my legs? In some videos, I see them flutter kicking. That looks VERY tiring.....and IS, for me. I see others using a sort-of (or, actual) small scissor-kick....JUST to aid rotation. THAT looks most efficient....but, it's tough to do (for me). So, I'll ask....which camp to you subscribe to? Or, do you do/suggest a different approach? Thanks. jeff |
| 2010-04-07 8:00 PM in reply to: #2775592 |
Veteran 208 Fayetteville, AR | Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! nc452010 - 2010-04-07 7:54 PM I've watched every swimming (crawl) video I can find on Youtube. I have an honest question to ask.... How much should I be using my legs? In some videos, I see them flutter kicking. That looks VERY tiring.....and IS, for me. I see others using a sort-of (or, actual) small scissor-kick....JUST to aid rotation. THAT looks most efficient....but, it's tough to do (for me). So, I'll ask....which camp to you subscribe to? Or, do you do/suggest a different approach? Thanks. jeff While i'm not fast (for a 500, i avg around 1:55/100m), i go with the 2 beat kick, which is probably close to what you are describing as a small scissor-kick. If i try to kick more, i get tired fast. With a 2 beat kick i can swim non-stop well over 1600m and feel like i have enough energy to do it again. From my thinking, you want the legs fresh for the bike leg and running leg, so use your upper body and good form to get through the swim, and use your legs for balance. |
| 2010-04-07 8:01 PM in reply to: #2775590 |
Veteran 208 Fayetteville, AR | Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! tri808 - 2010-04-07 7:54 PM BoobieDr - 2010-04-07 3:48 PM OMG! (wait, did i just use OMG? on the internets?.....yikes!) anyway, just used the new foam roller for about 15 min on my sore butt muscle after looking online at some ways to use it, and WOW! I stood up (the past few days, after sitting and then standing, i could feel the tight muscle) and it felt great! i'm sure its not "all better", and am still going to finish this as an unscheduled day off, and take my normal rest day tomorrow, but this is a good sign we'll see how it feels in the morning. I told you...FOAM ROLLER!!! It's one of God's blessings to man. yes, and it feels very nice! thanks for the advice |
| 2010-04-07 8:01 PM in reply to: #2775578 |
Champion 7233 | Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! janeclemo - 2010-04-07 6:50 PM until you are up running over 20mpw easily there is no real reason, or benifit, to running speed workouts. You'll likely get injured, and you wont have the base in your legs to do anything with that faster running. simply running more will make you faster, but you need to add distance slowly. So would a good plan be to just focus on adding distance weekly and not worrying so much about how fast I'm actually going? I hate seeing all those people in my neighborhood fly by me so fast! Hurts my ego. I'm going to be really slow in about a month when the weather gets hot! running more IS how to run faster. this is why you see top runners (even shorter distances) putting in huge amuonts of miles. even the guys racing the mile are putting in 70-100 miles a week. think about it like this. speedwork on very low mileage is sort of like putting high octane racing fuel in a mini van. at the endd of the day its still a minivan. the speedwork is that last icing on the cake, but right now you need to focus on slowly and safely building mileage up. you'll prob need to slow down a bit in order to do this and not beat yourself up, and i would not add anything until the shins stop hurting first. FWIW i'm running 40ish miles a week right now, with my daily runs 1-2 min per mile SLOWER than race pace. i need to run slower to not get hurt, but the higher volume lets you turn aruond and race faster, which is where it counts. |
| 2010-04-07 8:01 PM in reply to: #2775592 |
Extreme Veteran 396 Eastern Pennsylvania | Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! nc452010 - 2010-04-07 8:54 PM I've watched every swimming (crawl) video I can find on Youtube. I have an honest question to ask.... How much should I be using my legs? In some videos, I see them flutter kicking. That looks VERY tiring.....and IS, for me. I see others using a sort-of (or, actual) small scissor-kick....JUST to aid rotation. THAT looks most efficient....but, it's tough to do (for me). So, I'll ask....which camp to you subscribe to? Or, do you do/suggest a different approach? Thanks. jeff I've read that your kick only contibutes about 10-15% to your forward momentum. I think the main purpose of my kick is to help rotate and keep my legs from dropping, increasing drag. I've only been swimming 2-1/2 years though, FWIW. Art |
| 2010-04-07 8:08 PM in reply to: #2775608 |
Champion 7233 | Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! reid15 - 2010-04-07 7:01 PM nc452010 - 2010-04-07 8:54 PM I've watched every swimming (crawl) video I can find on Youtube. I have an honest question to ask.... How much should I be using my legs? In some videos, I see them flutter kicking. That looks VERY tiring.....and IS, for me. I see others using a sort-of (or, actual) small scissor-kick....JUST to aid rotation. THAT looks most efficient....but, it's tough to do (for me). So, I'll ask....which camp to you subscribe to? Or, do you do/suggest a different approach? Thanks. jeff I've read that your kick only contibutes about 10-15% to your forward momentum. I think the main purpose of my kick is to help rotate and keep my legs from dropping, increasing drag. I've only been swimming 2-1/2 years though, FWIW. Art art nailed it, your kick adds between 10-20 % to forward speed, but consumes something ilke 70% more O2 than not kicking. in longer distance swims if you have a good kick it still helps, but the main goal for most poeple is simply kick enough to keep the legs up and in line with the body and help with rotation. |
| 2010-04-07 8:14 PM in reply to: #2775592 |
Expert 1146 Chugiak, Alaska | Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! nc452010 - 2010-04-07 7:54 PM I've watched every swimming (crawl) video I can find on Youtube. I have an honest question to ask.... How much should I be using my legs? In some videos, I see them flutter kicking. That looks VERY tiring.....and IS, for me. I see others using a sort-of (or, actual) small scissor-kick....JUST to aid rotation. THAT looks most efficient....but, it's tough to do (for me). So, I'll ask....which camp to you subscribe to? Or, do you do/suggest a different approach? Thanks. jeff I have a really strong kick and I flutter kick, but that is what I have always done. I guess you get used to it? |
| 2010-04-07 8:15 PM in reply to: #2770346 |
Expert 2852 Pfafftown, NC | Subject: RE: Newbz'z summer mentor group is FULL!!!! My main conundrum is this.......(mentally....and probably physically)..... If I go too fast, I get winded. If I go too slow, my legs sink. I KNOW I swam with my head down for the 1st time, yesterday (BFD's dissertation, telling me to imagine looking at my feet = helped). If I can get this series of contortions to equate to a fluid stroke, I "think" I'm about to make a breakthrough. We'll find out in the AM. I'm going in with 2 swim thoughts:
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