Baowolf's Mentor Group- Closed (Page 60)

Mike, good job on the wardrobe recovery! I like the look of that workout. Really like the ones that have some easy sets between the harder ones. Think I'll add it to my Ziploc bag .

Jay, "pull" is where you swim with a pull buoy, thus no kick so all the work is all upper body. I don't do as much of that as I should, but when I do, I often skip the buoy, and just don't kick. Probably not recommended, but thought I'd mention it in case you don't have a pull buoy. I don't really like fins, paddles, buoys, etc. much and keep it simple.

And I thought I had problems what with whacking the lane divider with my hand!

200 yards using a pull bouy

And I'd let the lifeguard know if the pool tried to eat any part of me


Edited by Mike_D 2013-11-13 8:32 AM

I tip my cap to you Mike! I tried that workout and I couldn't get through it. I thought I was doing okay with my swim workouts but that took it to another level. I did make a discovery today...not that its a shock but I don't have any kick at all. I tried to use the kickboard and I barely moved. Are you supposed to kick your feet above water (ie make waves) to move? If so, I need to try that next time. Plan is to rest up for an hour and then off to run 10K.

Jay -- if you find out how to kick, please let me know. I have zero kick when I swim. I, too, somehow am motionless in the water when kicking with a board. Form wise, your butt should be above the water, and your kick should be just below the surface, and comeing from the hips, not knees. Try it with fins and see if that helps.

Yea, that's exactly how it was for me...I made it about 12.5 yards before I said screw this lol. Thats why I was wondering if I should be kicking above the water...unforutnately, that doesn't sound like proper etiquette. I don't think fins are an option either...the YMCA doesn't have any I'm going to search this and figure out an answer lol.

10K done; 9:21 pace....I'll take it for now.

Edited by medeiros13 2013-11-13 2:19 PM

I find the only way to really work on kick for me is to put on a mask and snorkel , that way I can just focus on kicking and not on breathing. But ya my kick sucks a lot. To do some of the drills I need to put my fins on or I just can't do them. The one I am focused on atm is you put one arm out in front the other hand on your hip and you kick with your face down, kicking on your side and breath without taking any strucks, just kick, balance and breath. I did 600 yards of that on Monday. I did 3:00 on one side, then the other etc..

Today's workout was fun.. not 3x 6:00: (pace (heart rate): 6:41 (163), 6:51 (167), 6:48 (170) as part of a 9 mile run. I was able to hit those paces and then was completely smoked for the next 4 miles, just starting to recover for the last mile with a slight improvement in pace. Doing interval bike, interval run, interval swim, rinse repeat is pretty tiring. Not looking forward to Sunday's 8:00 repeats.

If you get fins get the short zoomer type fins.

If you need swim toys (or suits), I've had good luck with https://www.swimoutlet.com/Swim_Gear_s/327.htm I wonder if the kick thing is gender/weight distribution related. For whatever reason I don't have any trouble moving forward kicking with or without kick board. You might also try flipping over on your back, arms reaching overhead and kicking. That is my "go to" drill to sort myself out if I am feeling tense/sloppy/tired/etc. One length of that and I'm back to feeling more streamlined.

Nice speedy work Steve! Are you indoors exclusively now?

Hey Pam, you recovered from Ragnar, mom's procedure, catching up on RL etc.?

Short swim yesterday (on purpose) and bagged the trainer ride I had planned due to working late. May work out well though....looking warm enough to ride outdoors this afternoon. I'm at about 80 miles cycling and 5K yards swimming per week right now and feeling good. We have home improvement central around here, so I am officing in the kitchen until after Thanksgiving. My work station is a mere 10 feet from the refrigerator. Help me!!!!!

I am indoors for the bike and swim, outdoors for the runs unless it is dark when I have to run (99% of runs outdoors). Got to love LT workouts in one of the 3 sports every day. It will take some getting used to. It is definitely not the type B workout of choice.

Steve, glad you can get outdoors for running. Yes, better you than me on the daily dose of intensity!

My BIL is the fitness coordinator at UMASS and would like to put together an indoor triathlon this winter. Has anyone in the group ever done an indoor event? If so, can you shed some light on how they coordinated the swim with a normal 6 lane pool.

i've not raced one, but I've seen it done. The goal is to 'snake' the swim by using both sides of a lane, and having people move to the next lane when they've finished the up & back in a lane. In a 6 lane 25 yard pool, you'd have a 300 yard swim. So if you are at one end of a pool, start is at far right late (usually every 5 sec or so, seeded by time). Up and back, under the lane divider, up & back, under the lane divider, etc. Swimmers get out at the end of the up & back in lane 6.

The key is having people honestly seeded. If you get someone near the front wtih the faster folks who can't keep up they create a hellacious traffic jam or just get swum over, pushad aside, etc.

I've raced a handful with pool swims, and what Mike said. Time trial start, and snake swim. Depending on length of the pool vs. length of tri, may not have to swim up and back in the same lane (nice to NOT do that so there is the possibility of passing without a head on collision). Here is a link to the last one I did, and it has a diagram of the swim. http://www.dallasathletesracing.com/wp-content/uploads/20420.jpg Mike is totally right about the traffic jams...inevitable unless you have a wide time gap between starts. Hopefully it will be a relatively small event and they can give a wide gap.

MTA: probably seems obvious, but RD needs to really stress that everyone should stay right except to pass. Amazing how many people will try to swim side by side with their buddy or totally block the lane by not passing in a reasonable timeframe. Sorry, pet peeve.

MTA: founds some more swim workouts of varying distance that are reasonably simple and geared to tri so thought I'd share: http://trihawks.com/node/11

Edited by squirt 2013-11-15 12:50 PM

Mike and Carol: Thank you!

Does anyone have an idea as to how to do an indoor bike...all I can think of is using a machine and periodically checking for distance.

I haven't done one that was all indoors, but I think for the bike, they will often clock how far each person goes in a given amount of time and factor that into the results. Same for the run.

Hrm, swim actually felt good today. The only thing I have been doing different is 15:00 of drills on single arm lead with some archer and tubing workouts for catch 2-3x per week... well and some core work. But things felt decent today. It was only a 2000 yard swim with 15 min of that drills, but still, felt solid, must have been a fluke. I did my main set at 63 on my torture device, and that was alright so I put it on 64, 65, 66, 67, 68,69 75 and never really had my form fall apart and kept my toes. (63 is 1:57/100 ish so 75 is 1:42/100 (for only 50 yards at the end of the workout). We see next week. Lets are toast from the speedwork, not wanting to look at tomorrow's workout. Hopefully I can dial in the power meter thingy for something else to look at during rides. It had been mid 50s all week for the run, then today I went out for my run and hrm 40F a bit brisk until I got warmed up. Getting to be that time of year when you have to check the thermometer before going out for a run.

Hey all! Still here but work, training, rentals, sleep, life have kept me from posting as much. Besides, you are all talking about swimming and brrr, it's cold here (or was) so I can't think about that. I admire all of you for getting the swim done when it's cold out.

Jay, I think I read something about someone on BT doing an indoor tri where it wasn't by distance but more by time. For the bike, everyone had 20 minutes on the bike and then at the end of 20, they looked at their total distance. Same thing for the treadmill. But I'm not sure about the swim tho. You may want to search the RR for indoor events.

About to go out for 17 to 18 miles. At least I don't think it will rain which is what happened yesterday. I didn't really mind the rain but it was a tad bit colder than I had dressed for. I'm very, very consciously trying not to overdress and so far I've had 2 right nippy runs this week.

d.p.

Edited by Pink Socks 2013-11-16 6:58 AM

Pam -- just caught myself thinking "oh 17 or 18 - a short bike? OH! wait - she's *running*. Holy carp!"

I just did some biking this AM. 24 miles at a steady pace. just wanted to get the legs moving, and get some saddle time in. It was all on the trainer as well, so no outside biking for me. think that's done until next spring. Its cold here most mornings (30's) and this boy isnt' riding a bike anywhere outside in that weather.

Will likely go for a swim with the wife a bit later this AM.

steve - glad to see the swim coming together for you. Nicely done

Well, it was a good swim, we see if it holds together next week. Today's trainer ride included 4x 1:00 at LT 1:00 recovery followed by 2x10:00 at LT Followed by 2x 15:00 at Z3 and then a 30 min brick run. I got the Trainer road power meter thing working and was able to build the entire workout in so that all the pretty bars show where you should be. The LT efforts were at power 250 (power is simulated (cadence, speed, trainer resistance formula), 92 cadence. The readout is pretty cool, shows a graph as you go and you can see your HR, Cadence, Power, target power all at the same time with the bar in the red if you are too fast or slow and green if you are in the target range. You can put it on the bottom of the computer screen and still watch movies in the background.

I thought the same thing hrm 17-18 miles short bike... oh ya its a run. When is the race?

Steve - Trainer Road is great!! Been using it for a few months and it is a great way to make indoor riding more fun. Used it this AM, in fact. Enjoy!!

What is your time trial power on your trainer for the program? I think mine is around 245 watts which converts to 21.4mph. Will do another TT in probably 5 weeks. HR lags behind effort, power is pretty immediate. I like the 5 second smoothing and that you can build custom workouts with precision.

last time I did a TT it was 210, but that was a while ago. I need to do another soon so I can baseline for the next 2 months of bike work.

There is something about watching those power output lines on the graph as you pedal away that I find motivating.

Oh my, all of this talk of LT, TT, HR, cadence, power - oh my, it's gonna make my head explode. Steve, I'm glad that you got it all working tho. It sounds like you are having run with all of the hard workouts.

My times spent running 17 or 18 miles is really not that different from my times biking 17 or 18 miles. Not that I'm a fast runner. Just a really crappy cyclist. Last year when I did my most biking, the Olympics were on. I remember one day being so proud of biking 22 miles. Flat surface, rails to trail therefore no cars, beautiful day. I thought I was so tough. Watched the Olympic mararthon and they were at mile 22 in the same time it took me to bike it. :-(

Got the 18 miles of running done yesterday and it was slow. My times for any run less than 10 miles have gotten faster and I can feel how much stronger I am than in prior mary cycles. But dang, those long runs don't ever get easy, do they?

My family had a big deal yesterday. We bought a used truck for my son. It will still be 5 months before he can get his license. The deal was good enough to act sooner rather than later. It's what my son wanted (which I'm gonna confess, since he is 15 y.o. that doesn't work, doesn't have money, and isn't contributing to regular household things....well his desires were NOT top on my priority list but hubby is a pushover.) But I'm hopeful that this will be a turning point to make my son start becoming a productive member of society. He is washing and waxing it today and cleaning it out inside and out. I've already put a bug in everyone's ear (not that it will help) that working at a auto parts place would teach him valuable skills (plus he'd get an employee discount). But now that he is out there working on his car, I see how much I need to clean my car. So off I go to snag the ShopVac before it is used on the truck.

Pam are you still doing the half mile repeats x about 12 or 15 by now? It looks like you still need a bit of speed work. You will find that after you get in like 8 16 mile runs that the 18s aren't so bad. A fun thing to do is to look at your mile times. Pick a pace, stick to it and then see where it drops off. Was it mile 6, 10, 12, 15, 17 or 18? As you get more fit you will hold that pace longer before you crash out. Ideally before race day you will be able to hold that pace for the 18 miles (something like 10:00 mpm for you 8).).

Today's 7 mile run included 3x 1.15 mile runs at 7:11 mpm pace. Those just suck the energy out of ya for sure.

Edited by Baowolf 2013-11-17 3:41 PM