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2011-04-06 2:20 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group

DV1 - agree with the others. I would not count a warm up walk as part of your run time if it were me but don't ditch your warm up either. Maybe you can work towards shortening the amount of time you are walking for the warm up and introduce a slow jog or even a walk/jog strategy.

On my bike it takes me about (I'm guessing here) 10 min to get out of town to the country roads. I have to ride really slow down my gravel street, cross the highway, and ride through town so I don't turn my Garmin on until I am out of town. I count that time through town as part of my warm up.



2011-04-06 2:59 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
JoePetto - 2011-04-06 7:57 AM

I'm in week 10 (Bike focused week) and am starting to feel a bit nicked up - kinda like a NFL player in the middle of the season.  Nothing really that disabling, just achiness and soreness in my knees, feet and hips.  Week 11 is a recovery week (or in NFL parlance a "bye" week).  Besides lower volume, more rest, some ice and some stretching anyone have any other pearls of recovery wisdom out there to speed up some of the healing process.

Arkmann - I feel for you buddy, but it sounds like your choice is a wise one.

I know just how you feel but I am a week behind you. My ankles have finally straightened out (mostly) but now my left knee and IT band is flaring up. Like you, no debilitating pain but also not 100%. I've got a gift certificate for a day spa so I made an appointment for a deep tissue massage tomorrow. Fingers crossed she can work out some of the knots in my legs.

Some other things to help speed recovery are  massaging your tight muscles on a foam roller and compression tights (I don't have any but other BT people really like them). Hang in there!

2011-04-06 3:38 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
Day 3 in Paris day three wk 1 of plan.  90 mins on "sit up n beg" exercise bike.  God my sit bones hurt guess some of that 20lbs I lost came off there!!!  Awesome run planed fot tomorrow out hotel and head for Arc de Triomphe!1!
2011-04-06 5:39 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
I just kicked that runs butt! I'm usually a fair weather runner, but I so enjoyed the past hour in 37 degree rain that I think I have a new perspective. Even though my race is in August and will probably be 90 degrees, I'm embracing the "can't control the weather on race day" idea and will be out there training no matter what. I so happy winter is coming to an end! All hail Spring!!!
2011-04-06 7:06 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group

DV 1 - 2011-04-06 5:39 PM I just kicked that runs butt! I'm usually a fair weather runner, but I so enjoyed the past hour in 37 degree rain that I think I have a new perspective. Even though my race is in August and will probably be 90 degrees, I'm embracing the "can't control the weather on race day" idea and will be out there training no matter what. I so happy winter is coming to an end! All hail Spring!!!

Nice job! Really great to do that.  I am expecting a hot race April 17 in New Orleans.  Enjoy the running, it's the best part

2011-04-06 8:19 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group

I was a bit disappointed in my average heart rate (158). I felt like I was running at RPE 3, and 158 is very much on the high end of my RPE 3. Nonetheless, I didn't feel tired, and the legs felt great. I had my ITB begin to tighten at mile 3, but I just said HTFU and by mile 5 it was a non issue. Got home and stretched for a bit, took an ice bath for 8 minutes and put on some compression socks. Legs still feel great with no ITB issue.

Interestingly, ... and this was really interesting...., when I ran on the left shoulder of the road for mile 1-2, no issues. At mile 2.5 I had to run on the right shoulder, and by mile 3 the ITB began to feel tight. At mile 3 I switched back to the left shoulder and ITB issue began to go away. Obviously there's a slight slope on both sides, but it was only on the right shoulder that my left ITB gave me issues. To me, that would seem to indicate that either the foot strike angle was causing the issue, or....and here's what I think is so interesting...me left leg is longer than my right, so it was striking the upside of the slope with extra force....causing the issue. One the left shoulder, the left leg has more space to drop, so the strike isn't premature.

hmmmmmm.......good stuff learned tonight......maybe an orthotic could help if the ITB stuff flares up.



2011-04-06 8:33 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
cbrookhart - 2011-04-05 2:24 PM

I have a hard time finding time to do my long runs and long bikes outside.  I can do my long bikes and runs on consecutive days, but I'd like to have a few days in between.  Is it better to do a long run saturday and a long bike sunday, both outside.  Or a long run on a treadmill Wednesday and a long bike (outside) sunday?  Is it better to be outside or to have "fresh" legs?

Thanks

Christy

Great question! Sometimes the best way I can answer is to tell you what I would do for myself or tell my clients, and in this case I would rather see you do your training on back-to-back days than to always do your long runs on a treadmill. Take your rest day the day on Monday.

2011-04-06 8:35 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group

popsracer - 2011-04-05 6:55 PM OK, where did the last month go? Seems like in the blink of an eye I'm down to 8 1/2 weeks to go. Time really accelerates as you get closer to the end. It is so important to work hard from the start so you have confidence going into the last phases of prep. I'm a bit behind on my cycling and with the weather so lousy I wouldn't get as much real road time as I need. It's still way to cold for OWS practice too. I feel good in the pool and have a lot of OWS experience so not too worried there. I may just have to alter my race expectations on the bike. I've put a lot into my running this year and feel good about that but no amount of run training will help if you've cooked your legs on the bike. These next few weeks are really critical to getting in the long outdoor rides. I'm praying for better weather.

Yeah, that's the trouble with early season races. I will keep my fingers crossed that you have great weather form now until race day so you can get your cycling in!

2011-04-06 8:38 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
JoePetto - 2011-04-06 7:57 AM

I'm in week 10 (Bike focused week) and am starting to feel a bit nicked up - kinda like a NFL player in the middle of the season.  Nothing really that disabling, just achiness and soreness in my knees, feet and hips.  Week 11 is a recovery week (or in NFL parlance a "bye" week).  Besides lower volume, more rest, some ice and some stretching anyone have any other pearls of recovery wisdom out there to speed up some of the healing process.

Arkmann - I feel for you buddy, but it sounds like your choice is a wise one.

We use Recover-Ease and BCAA supplements in our house.

2011-04-06 8:43 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
DV 1 - 2011-04-06 8:19 PM

I was a bit disappointed in my average heart rate (158). I felt like I was running at RPE 3, and 158 is very much on the high end of my RPE 3. Nonetheless, I didn't feel tired, and the legs felt great. I had my ITB begin to tighten at mile 3, but I just said HTFU and by mile 5 it was a non issue. Got home and stretched for a bit, took an ice bath for 8 minutes and put on some compression socks. Legs still feel great with no ITB issue.

Interestingly, ... and this was really interesting...., when I ran on the left shoulder of the road for mile 1-2, no issues. At mile 2.5 I had to run on the right shoulder, and by mile 3 the ITB began to feel tight. At mile 3 I switched back to the left shoulder and ITB issue began to go away. Obviously there's a slight slope on both sides, but it was only on the right shoulder that my left ITB gave me issues. To me, that would seem to indicate that either the foot strike angle was causing the issue, or....and here's what I think is so interesting...me left leg is longer than my right, so it was striking the upside of the slope with extra force....causing the issue. One the left shoulder, the left leg has more space to drop, so the strike isn't premature.

hmmmmmm.......good stuff learned tonight......maybe an orthotic could help if the ITB stuff flares up.

My first case of IT band problems was brought on by a long run on a sloped path. It really can mess you up! At least you figured it out and can adjust in the future to prevent serious problems.

2011-04-06 8:55 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
Tri Take Me Away - 2011-04-06 9:38 PM
JoePetto - 2011-04-06 7:57 AM

We use Recover-Ease and BCAA supplements in our house.

 

I started using hemp protein (and hemp seeds) instead of whey because of the omegas and the BCAA in them. Yeah, the Hulk color and "unique" flavor took some time to get used too. LOL

 



2011-04-06 9:04 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
Tri Take Me Away - 2011-04-06 9:43 PM
DV 1 - 2011-04-06 8:19 PM

I was a bit disappointed in my average heart rate (158). I felt like I was running at RPE 3, and 158 is very much on the high end of my RPE 3. Nonetheless, I didn't feel tired, and the legs felt great. I had my ITB begin to tighten at mile 3, but I just said HTFU and by mile 5 it was a non issue. Got home and stretched for a bit, took an ice bath for 8 minutes and put on some compression socks. Legs still feel great with no ITB issue.

Interestingly, ... and this was really interesting...., when I ran on the left shoulder of the road for mile 1-2, no issues. At mile 2.5 I had to run on the right shoulder, and by mile 3 the ITB began to feel tight. At mile 3 I switched back to the left shoulder and ITB issue began to go away. Obviously there's a slight slope on both sides, but it was only on the right shoulder that my left ITB gave me issues. To me, that would seem to indicate that either the foot strike angle was causing the issue, or....and here's what I think is so interesting...me left leg is longer than my right, so it was striking the upside of the slope with extra force....causing the issue. One the left shoulder, the left leg has more space to drop, so the strike isn't premature.

hmmmmmm.......good stuff learned tonight......maybe an orthotic could help if the ITB stuff flares up.

My first case of IT band problems was brought on by a long run on a sloped path. It really can mess you up! At least you figured it out and can adjust in the future to prevent serious problems.

 

does this mean that ITB problems flare/happen in any uneven/hilly surface?

2011-04-06 9:42 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group

Race is 10 weeks on Saturday. So far my longest ride has been 30 miles. Am I wrong to be freaking out about how slow I am on the bike?

Should I stray from the plan a little and up my bike time and work in miles? Undecided

OMG STRESSED.

2011-04-06 9:46 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
cheekymonkeys1 - 2011-04-06 9:42 PM

Race is 10 weeks on Saturday. So far my longest ride has been 30 miles. Am I wrong to be freaking out about how slow I am on the bike?

Should I stray from the plan a little and up my bike time and work in miles? Undecided

OMG STRESSED.

My race is in ten days and I suck on the bike...

You have plenty of time to work them in and will.

2011-04-06 9:52 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
cheekymonkeys1 - 2011-04-06 9:42 PM

Race is 10 weeks on Saturday. So far my longest ride has been 30 miles. Am I wrong to be freaking out about how slow I am on the bike?

Should I stray from the plan a little and up my bike time and work in miles? Undecided

OMG STRESSED.

Don't stress yet. Next week is all about the bike. I've been feeling like I'm not biking enough either. It's coming soon.....

I keep rearranging the workouts this week. I jumped the gun and completed the long run for the week today. Hope I can recover and manage the rest of the workouts.

2011-04-07 2:55 AM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
cheekymonkeys1 - 2011-04-06 9:42 PM

Race is 10 weeks on Saturday. So far my longest ride has been 30 miles. Am I wrong to be freaking out about how slow I am on the bike?

Should I stray from the plan a little and up my bike time and work in miles? Undecided

OMG STRESSED.



You have plenty of time to get the bike miles in. A long ride of 30 so far ain't too bad. Just be sure to hit the rest of the long rides in the plan. I'm kind of in the same boat. I've been doing my work on the trainer but my long ride outside is only about 20 miles and I have only 8 weeks to go. It is ten degrees below normal here and I hate to ride in the cold. My bike focus week got side tracked for a marathon so I may try to alter next weeks schedule to get a few extra hours of riding in.


2011-04-07 6:49 AM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
cheekymonkeys1 - 2011-04-06 10:42 PM

Race is 10 weeks on Saturday. So far my longest ride has been 30 miles. Am I wrong to be freaking out about how slow I am on the bike?

Should I stray from the plan a little and up my bike time and work in miles? Undecided

OMG STRESSED.

As other's have said, you still have time to improve. I would suggest having a few longer rides (close to the 56 miles) prior to your race. If that means riding longer than the plan calls for on your longest bike days, I would do it.  

2011-04-07 7:36 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
Tri Take Me Away - 2011-04-06 8:38 PM
JoePetto - 2011-04-06 7:57 AM

I'm in week 10 (Bike focused week) and am starting to feel a bit nicked up - kinda like a NFL player in the middle of the season.  Nothing really that disabling, just achiness and soreness in my knees, feet and hips.  Week 11 is a recovery week (or in NFL parlance a "bye" week).  Besides lower volume, more rest, some ice and some stretching anyone have any other pearls of recovery wisdom out there to speed up some of the healing process.

Arkmann - I feel for you buddy, but it sounds like your choice is a wise one.

We use Recover-Ease and BCAA supplements in our house.

Thank, Jessica. Placed the order today for the RecoverEase!
2011-04-07 8:35 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
trainforacure - 2011-04-06 9:04 PM
Tri Take Me Away - 2011-04-06 9:43 PM
DV 1 - 2011-04-06 8:19 PM

I was a bit disappointed in my average heart rate (158). I felt like I was running at RPE 3, and 158 is very much on the high end of my RPE 3. Nonetheless, I didn't feel tired, and the legs felt great. I had my ITB begin to tighten at mile 3, but I just said HTFU and by mile 5 it was a non issue. Got home and stretched for a bit, took an ice bath for 8 minutes and put on some compression socks. Legs still feel great with no ITB issue.

Interestingly, ... and this was really interesting...., when I ran on the left shoulder of the road for mile 1-2, no issues. At mile 2.5 I had to run on the right shoulder, and by mile 3 the ITB began to feel tight. At mile 3 I switched back to the left shoulder and ITB issue began to go away. Obviously there's a slight slope on both sides, but it was only on the right shoulder that my left ITB gave me issues. To me, that would seem to indicate that either the foot strike angle was causing the issue, or....and here's what I think is so interesting...me left leg is longer than my right, so it was striking the upside of the slope with extra force....causing the issue. One the left shoulder, the left leg has more space to drop, so the strike isn't premature.

hmmmmmm.......good stuff learned tonight......maybe an orthotic could help if the ITB stuff flares up.

My first case of IT band problems was brought on by a long run on a sloped path. It really can mess you up! At least you figured it out and can adjust in the future to prevent serious problems.

 

does this mean that ITB problems flare/happen in any uneven/hilly surface?

Not necessarily hilly, but running on the side of a cantered road for a long period can aggravate or bring on IT band problems.

2011-04-07 8:37 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
cheekymonkeys1 - 2011-04-06 9:42 PM

Race is 10 weeks on Saturday. So far my longest ride has been 30 miles. Am I wrong to be freaking out about how slow I am on the bike?

Should I stray from the plan a little and up my bike time and work in miles? Undecided

OMG STRESSED.

10 weeks is a LONG time. If you are following the plan, I wouldn't worry. That being said, it's ok to add some volume to your cycling if you like. It won't trash you like added run volume will. You really don't need to add more bike time if you follow the plan, though.

2011-04-07 9:16 PM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
Thanks for the input folks. I think I shall extend a few rides. I know people say 'just follow the plan' but since this is my first one, and I'm really slow, I'm just not comfortable doing this. I don't want to go in without knowing for certain I can make the distance without needing oxygen and a defib machine ;-)


2011-04-08 12:26 AM
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Subject: RE: Beginner 1/2 Ironman Plan Group
It's going to be 6 days without training tomorrow for me since my accident but I'm going for a bike fit since I already dropped off the bike today for a tune up.  I'm off to Vegas on Sunday for a week long training then my race is Saturday.  I will do my first ever HIM in 80% condition but I will take it slow and steady and just aim to finish and practice everything. I won't have a time goal but more of a performance goal.
2011-04-08 8:50 AM
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Subject: swimming workouts

Do most of you do the swim workouts as laid out? I see a few of longer swims ie 1500 or 2000 continuous but thought the best return on investment for swimming was interval training in the pool?  I also find these difficult in the pool (weak swimmer) and technique tends to fall apart so I end up practicing bad technique. What is thoughts on these workouts? I realize that the occasional one is good for confidence building but was curious as to what others are doing with regards to suggested workouts?

Thanks to all for supporting this board.

2011-04-08 10:09 AM
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Subject: RE: swimming workouts
ShawnR - 2011-04-08 9:50 AM

Do most of you do the swim workouts as laid out? I see a few of longer swims ie 1500 or 2000 continuous but thought the best return on investment for swimming was interval training in the pool?  I also find these difficult in the pool (weak swimmer) and technique tends to fall apart so I end up practicing bad technique. What is thoughts on these workouts? I realize that the occasional one is good for confidence building but was curious as to what others are doing with regards to suggested workouts?

Thanks to all for supporting this board.

Yes to both!

Interval work is good to build swim cardio endurance while maintaining the best form possible. The proper form from this and drill work begins to imprint the techniques needed for sustained efforts. 

Longer sustained sessions, however, are just as important to develop this muscular balance needed to keep good form throughout the race. There's a courtship going on between muscles, nerves, ligaments, etc... while learning to swim that takes sustained efforts to strengthen. The shorter workouts and drills tell the body what to do, but the longer workouts are where the body is asked to keep it together. I suspect the people who really know what they're talking about who developed the beginner plan took all of these, and more, factors into consideration.

At the same time, modifying the plan to meet your actual or percieved needs is totally okay. We all do it for various reasons and an adjustment here or there isn't going to ruin your training.

Keep us posted!

2011-04-08 10:21 AM
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Subject: RE: swimming workouts
ShawnR - 2011-04-08 8:50 AM

Do most of you do the swim workouts as laid out? I see a few of longer swims ie 1500 or 2000 continuous but thought the best return on investment for swimming was interval training in the pool?  I also find these difficult in the pool (weak swimmer) and technique tends to fall apart so I end up practicing bad technique. What is thoughts on these workouts? I realize that the occasional one is good for confidence building but was curious as to what others are doing with regards to suggested workouts?

Thanks to all for supporting this board.

 

I am only talking from personal experience.  The first 12 weeks of the plan, I followed the swim work outs to a "T"  Then a pro triathloete friend of mine visited our club and came to the conclusion that I cross my arms a lot.  I know I cross but I didn't know it was that much.  I was over rotating my shoulders.  It resulted to super high elbows and the often zigzgs.  For the next 4 weeks I did one arm drills day in and day out on the swim work outs.  I knew I already have the endurance to swim the full IM swim so I wasn't worried about that.  Sure enough, my cross over is now very minimal and I am still not following the swim workouts to a "T" hehehe...  My swim wourkouts are usually 1 day drills for the cross over, 1 day for intervals, 1 day for distance, and if I feel like doing another swim for the week, another day for whatever swim work out I can think off.  Given that I'm still a very slow swimmer and have problem sighting, I am never spent affter the swim part of a race.

Like what DV1 said, its all about form.  In swimming, form and technique are the most important aspects of the discipline.  Once you got those two, everything else will eventually fall into place depending on your work outs.

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