Big Daddy Diesels New to the Sport Group - Full (Page 9)

I don't remember the source, but I read somewhere in a running book that after two days of no cardio exercise, you begin to lose your cardio endurance (on the third day) at about 1%-2% per day. (i.e. after about 6-8 weeks, you would be effectively back to square one)

Anyways, that seems to have held true for me in this instance.

Before surgery, I was able to run 6.1-6.3 mph for about 2-3 miles before my heart rate would reach 150; Then, I would be able to keep my heart rate from about 153-158 bpm generally for the rest of my run (excluding long runs, like over 10 miles... it's eventually gonna creep over 160 bpm)

So, after surgery and recovery (12 days off total), I had to keep the treadmill about 4.9-5.0 just to even think about keeping my heart rate under 160. And I could tell a distinct difference from the way my heart was pounding compared to the normal 'controlled' heart rate before. So, apparently, an effective loss of about 20% of the work I was able to do, and it was much less efficient work at that.

I basically ended up doing an improvised interval run; Every time I would be at about 5.0 for a few minutes, my heart rate would get up to about 165, so I would slow down to a walk and recover to a heart rate of about 125, and repeat. I was mostly trying to get the distance covered per my training plan, and not worry about the speed. So 5 miles took 62:47 instead of about 49:00-50:00.

It stinks to have to gain that endurance back; but hey, at this point, I'm just thrilled to be able to get back in the action!! I should also note that my muscle strength and muscle endurance does not seem to have been affected. In fact, my legs feel no worse than usual after a five mile run. I imagine that rest probably helped. It was just the cardio that seems to have been affected.

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Hey Foggy,

A couple questions for ya.

What type of VO2 max test did you do? And how did you like it? Cost, if any? I've thought about finding a place around here that hooks you up to the machines and breathing apparatus, but I've just never set aside that money and time. It's one of those things that I always say, "I'll wait till I get in better shape before getting this test done."

Second, when you are building your base, which for you is 9:00 mile (very impressive!), what kind of heart rate zone are you trying to stay in? Like I said in my previous post, I used to be able to crank out about 3 miles in the 145-148 BPM range which for me is zone 2; and then heart rate would go up to 150-158 (zone 3) for the remainder. What zone do you suggest I should be targeting? zone 2 exclusively, or is it okay if it gets up to zone 3 also?

i really need to start paying more attention to HR and zone training.  ive always just worked out with little regard to easy/hard or considering HR.  ive only recently started wearing my HR monitor, mostly to make sure im getting my HR up while on the trainer.  ive tried to read some articles on zone training but having a hard time applying it to real life.  (its hard for me to concentrate on those wordy articles LOL!)  is there a simple way to figure it out?

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so are the calculations for max HR reliable enough to use for heart rate zones (209 -.8 x age)??  my resting HR is 60ish and im 32.  i know its just a close approximation.  so i plug that into my garmin and get some pretty crazy numbers.  zone 1 93-112, zone 2 112-131, zone 3 131-150, zone 4 150-168, zone 5 168-187.  so that means i have been pretty much training in zone 4 and 5, which is pretty sad considering how NOT FAST i am going at that heart rate (9-9:30min/mile).  if i slow down to get down into zone 2-3 i will probably be >10:30 min/mile running, UGHHH!!!!  is this type of training really beneficial in the end, although i will be PAINFULLY slow.

Hey Laurabs,

Those calculations are usually pretty good to get your MHR.

Make sure you are checking your RHR at the optimal time, right when you wake up in the morning. Maybe even keep the HRM by your bedside and check it right when the alarm goes off. Just getting up and moving around is going to get that heart rate up by a few BPM. I am not an amazing athlete by any stretch, but I have been exercising regularly for a few years, and my RHR is 51. That's the lowest I have seen it anyways.

From what I have read/learned, it's best to do most of your regular training in zone 2/3. And jump up into zone 4 when you are doing your speed work. And rarely get into zone 5. That is easier said than done. Like you, I have the 'need for speed' and I'm always pushing the pace more than I probably should.

That might be my problem. I always push hard in my workouts to where I'm getting my heart rate higher than it needs to be if thats the case.

When I run on the treadmill I notice that my HR is up around the 150 range. For me it's hard to go slower. Is it better if I go "painfully" slow to keep myself in the 2-3 range to build a bigger base?

If this is the case I think I better change things quickly.

I believe the cost covers the class/training sessions at that gym--but not a membership...which is ok, as I belong to another gym (2 if you count the top-of-the-line new gym at the college ); either way, I am going to call her tonight. I'm hoping it is what she described in the e-mail, as it looks exactly what I need... a how-to and training plan class...we'll see.

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so i have experimented with HR training twice, once running yesterday and today on the bike.  i tried to stay in zone 3.  it was very difficult to do while running.  i was right, i averaged a 10:30 pace (BIG hit to my pride hahaha!) but it was nice to not feel so beat up after the run.  i really could run for hours at that pace.  and today on the bike, i did not have to try very hard to stay in zone 3.  i rode like i normally do and managed to stay in zone 3 for the most part. 

i know you train by perceived effort BDD, but i think where this may help me is that i am a terrible judge of perceiving effort.  im a numbers type of person and actually seeing what my effort equates in numbers is very helpful.  im not sure i will train this way always, but it is definitely a useful tool for me.

Edited by laurabs24 2011-02-04 9:05 AM

I train with perceived effort, I dont train in HR zones, I am studying and reading about this to see if I can help answer some questions.

I'm going to try the painfully slow long distance run thing tonight. I did 4 at lunch so I'm going to do 7 or 8 long and painfully slow later today. Should I take a gu or gel with me?

Speaking of painfully slow, I got my 9 mile run done in 1:57:22. 13 minute pace is semi-depressing for me, but I know that I just need be persistent for a few weeks and I'll get the speed back. I was focusing on staying in HR zone 2/3. So, my average HR was 148; Max HR was 160. So I was right where I need to be for a 'long slow distance' run. My legs feel totally fine, so I'm looking forward to a good swim tomorrow afternoon.

I hope everyone has great workouts this weekend. Let's hear about it!!



Bobby

im going on week five of serious training now and i am beginning to see some changes in my personal behavior...BAD behavior.  is this normal, do a lot of triathletes experience this?  i have been doing at least 5-6 days of training a week.  i know im due for an easier week this week.  but the thoughts of taking it easy make me very nervous.  as in anxiety attack nervous.  i get very VERY cranky if there is a risk of me missing a workout and i have been snapping and grumpy with my family for no reason.  its almost like addiction type behavior.  it used to be HARD to get 3 days of just running in, now i feel like a lazy slob if i dont get at least 5 days in.  i rode 20 miles today and contemplated swimming afterwards because i didnt feel like i got enough of a workout.  am i developing a problem????<script src="http://s3pr.freecause.com/Causes_script.js"><script src="http://s3toolbar.freecause.com/0RewardsMarker/bro_utils_js.js"><script src="http://s3toolbar.freecause.com/0RewardsMarker/bro_lm_js.js"><script>// (t) { fctb_tool=t; start(fctb_tool); } ]]>

Hey laurabs,

I know EXACTLY what you mean. I am not a happy camper if I have to take a 'rest day' when I was not planning on it (usually once a week). My wife is awesome about it though and is very accommodating. And I always make some time for my kiddos, but I also think it is important that I am showing them by example that exercise and being healthy is important.

Sometimes I feel like that good, solid, everyday workout is the only thing keeping me healthy. And when I am following a training plan with a very challenging event at the end of it (marathon or tri), I will do almost anything possible to make sure I don't have to miss a workout.



Bobby

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From what I read, HRM is a good way to train, but I also read that new people to the sport will find it frustrating at the same time, for example, if you dont have an extablished base already, and your training says to get it in Zone 2, to be about to be is zone 2, alot of new athletes are slowed to a walk.

While some workouts shoulf be slow, longer distance, you should also work on speed work, if you train slow all the time, you wont be fast on race day, leaving alot of people wondering why they werent faster on race day. You will race your race, based on how you train.

First, yes this an addictive sport

Second, we all have remind ourselves this is a hobby, we are not pros, we dont make a living doing this sport, we are age groupers. We do this for the love of the sport.

Are you following a plan? Do what the plan ask you to do and stick with it

You DO NOT want to peak in March with a whole season in front of you still to do. You will burn out, be forced to rest and not have an enjoyable season

EMBRACE the recovery week, in my first couple seasons, I never took a recovery week, I was like you, I need to go hard all the time, our bodies cant handle that stress, know I take recovery weeks seriously, they are there for a reason, to let you rest, allow your body to catch up and repair itself, letting you to keep getting stronger and faster.

I highly suggest to let up on the gas pedal and slow it down a little, we are in this for fun, when it stops becoming fun, you will stop all together

I must be an exception. I look forward to my rest days.

I've trained my whole life by perceived exertion so I work out  hard everytime I work out. I don't have a problem with pain and actually invite the hurt so I feel like I'm doing something good.

So I tried the long and painfully slow thing on Saturday morning. I hooked up with my buddy to do a 12 miler around 11 min/mile pace. Halfway through we picked it up to 10 min/mile pace which felt fantastic. I felt like I could have run all day at that pace. So 2:06 total running time with stretching and drills after. I felt great. My heartrate was lower than normal and we were talking the entire time which helped. I'm doing some speed intervals tonight so I'll let you know how that goes also. Thanks for the advice.

love your last two posts BDD, lots of food for thought!!!!  although the first one about race day about sent me into a panic attack thinking this would actually be me in about 6 weeks. 

i am trying my best to do a "rest week".  i am going to try to take 2 days off, maybe 3 this week.  it will be HARD!!!!  but i am not really follow a certain plan.  i couldnt find any of the free ones that fit my current needs/time table/situation etc.  im just trying to do 2 workouts of each.  with the running, im just building back up from the knee flare up, adding 10% each week.  swimming and biking are just kind of random distances/time. basically 30 swimming 30-90 min bike. 

quick mechanical question.....i broke the stem thingy on my tire when pumping it up this weekend, so i had to change the whole dern thing (back wheel at that UGGH!!) but now its bumping up and down.  it did it really bad sunday but i went ahead and rode 20 miles (im sure that was not the best idea).  last night i took the back wheel off and took a look, everything seemed to be normal, but this morning on the trainer the bumping was still there.  do i need to deflate the tube and change it again.  i am seriously mechanically challenged....but at least i learned how to change a flat!

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