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2010-06-24 11:39 AM
in reply to: #2940743

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Master
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Subject: RE: Swimming experts
TriAya - 2010-06-24 7:50 AM
aquageek - 2010-06-24 9:02 PM
sand101 - 2010-06-20 4:35 PM

...and you lost all credibility on your 18th post on BT.  Turns interrupt the stroke, period.  I do nothing but open turns in the pool (I find open turns much less energy expensive when compared to flip turns).  I may not be a "real swimmer" but my last three swim finishes haven't been awful.    Given those, what kind of finishes do I need to be a "real swimmer"?  Inquiring minds want to know.


As far as why OWS allows someone to go further without being winded, IMO it is all about being able to get into a rhythm.  Just set your pace and keep going.  Love it.  I have so much more energy in open water.


You only do open turns and the best you can do in the swimming leg is not awful.  Time to re-evaluate the swim plan there amigo.  It must suck to be satisfied with not awful.


We play nice here at BT.

That is not constructive, well-supported swimming advice TO THE ORIGINAL POSTER ON THE TOPIC HE ASKED FOR.

That is a personal put-down, to a completely different person, and off-topic.

Please direct your comments TO the original poster (not AT the original poster), on what he asked for, and preferably (though not necessarily, we all just offer opinions here backed up or not to varying degrees) with some kind of plausible reasoning or evidence. Thank you.


Eh, the put down doesn't really upset me.  I was being snarky and find it funny that AG didn't actually look at my recent swim results.  It makes his response pretty darn funny.  Or maybe he did and that is why he deleted his post. ;-)

AG needs to back off of the podium a bit and realize he isn't the be all end all of swimming discussion.  Particularly when Gary Hall peeks in.

And just to keep this on target with the OP.  Since he has found what a joy open water swimming is I would highly recommend he find an OWS event in his area and enter - just to have fun swimming in a setting like that.  I had a blast when I did mine.


2010-06-24 12:14 PM
in reply to: #2941383

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Elite
4048
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Gilbert, Az.
Subject: RE: Swimming experts
sand101 - 2010-06-24 9:39 AM
Eh, the put down doesn't really upset me.  I was being snarky and find it funny that AG didn't actually look at my recent swim results.  It makes his response pretty darn funny.  Or maybe he did and that is why he deleted his post. ;-)

AG needs to back off of the podium a bit and realize he isn't the be all end all of swimming discussion.  Particularly when Gary Hall peeks in.

And just to keep this on target with the OP.  Since he has found what a joy open water swimming is I would highly recommend he find an OWS event in his area and enter - just to have fun swimming in a setting like that.  I had a blast when I did mine.


I would wager that he wasn't the one that deleted the post. ;-)

And yes, OWS events are a ton of fun. If you have them available, I highly recommend them, either as competitive events or OWS familiarization.

John
2010-06-24 12:19 PM
in reply to: #2941383

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Pro
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Camp Hill, Pennsylvania
Subject: RE: Swimming experts
sand101 - 2010-06-24 12:39 PM
TriAya - 2010-06-24 7:50 AM
aquageek - 2010-06-24 9:02 PM
sand101 - 2010-06-20 4:35 PM

...and you lost all credibility on your 18th post on BT.  Turns interrupt the stroke, period.  I do nothing but open turns in the pool (I find open turns much less energy expensive when compared to flip turns).  I may not be a "real swimmer" but my last three swim finishes haven't been awful.    Given those, what kind of finishes do I need to be a "real swimmer"?  Inquiring minds want to know.


As far as why OWS allows someone to go further without being winded, IMO it is all about being able to get into a rhythm.  Just set your pace and keep going.  Love it.  I have so much more energy in open water.


You only do open turns and the best you can do in the swimming leg is not awful.  Time to re-evaluate the swim plan there amigo.  It must suck to be satisfied with not awful.


We play nice here at BT.

That is not constructive, well-supported swimming advice TO THE ORIGINAL POSTER ON THE TOPIC HE ASKED FOR.

That is a personal put-down, to a completely different person, and off-topic.

Please direct your comments TO the original poster (not AT the original poster), on what he asked for, and preferably (though not necessarily, we all just offer opinions here backed up or not to varying degrees) with some kind of plausible reasoning or evidence. Thank you.


Eh, the put down doesn't really upset me.  I was being snarky and find it funny that AG didn't actually look at my recent swim results.  It makes his response pretty darn funny.  Or maybe he did and that is why he deleted his post. ;-)

AG needs to back off of the podium a bit and realize he isn't the be all end all of swimming discussion.  Particularly when Gary Hall peeks in.

And just to keep this on target with the OP.  Since he has found what a joy open water swimming is I would highly recommend he find an OWS event in his area and enter - just to have fun swimming in a setting like that.  I had a blast when I did mine.


LOL!!
Sand101, I can't believe you're satisfied with swim splits of only 1st in your AG in your last 2 races.  Slacker.

Nice job!

Don
2010-06-24 1:06 PM
in reply to: #2931154

New user
61
2525
Westlake Village, California
Subject: RE: Swimming experts
I find the swim debates to be pretty funny because in the context of a triathlon, it really doesn't matter. If you're a pro - sure, then you need to shave the minutes. But most folks here don't need the absolute most efficient swim stroke / technique.

With minimal form improvements (and time invested), you can get probably 80% of your potential efficiency gains. The amount of time and energy it takes to squeeze out that extra 20% is exponentially more than the initial time investment, and buys you maybe another minute or two in an oly? Alternatively, you could spend that energy improving your bike or run pace, which will shave a lot more from your overall time.

just muh two cents. 

  
2010-06-24 2:24 PM
in reply to: #2941730

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Subject: RE: Swimming experts
djfiii - 2010-06-24 1:06 PM I find the swim debates to be pretty funny because in the context of a triathlon, it really doesn't matter. If you're a pro - sure, then you need to shave the minutes. But most folks here don't need the absolute most efficient swim stroke / technique.

  


Just to play devil's advocate, I'd argue that it does matter.  Being efficient in the water means being better rested on the way out of the water.  It isn't all about speed.  (I'd also opine that the arguments about turns in the pool are useless - I don't care about turns.  I work hard on stroke drills, though.)

But then again I'm a swim guy, so I'm admittedly quite biased.
2010-06-24 2:44 PM
in reply to: #2940763

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Member
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San Diego
Subject: RE: Swimming experts

In the ocean, your higher position (buoyancy) may also be allowing you to turn your head to breathe more easily, taking in more oxygen.


This is best response imho.

The buoyancy of a wetsuit / salt water can make a huge difference in a swimmers overall stroke and "feel" of the water.  I would guess that the buoyancy put you in a much more effective swimming position then you get in the pool.

Cheers,
-j



2010-06-24 3:06 PM
in reply to: #2942017

New user
61
2525
Westlake Village, California
Subject: RE: Swimming experts
sand101 - 2010-06-24 2:24 PM
djfiii - 2010-06-24 1:06 PM I find the swim debates to be pretty funny because in the context of a triathlon, it really doesn't matter. If you're a pro - sure, then you need to shave the minutes. But most folks here don't need the absolute most efficient swim stroke / technique.

  


Just to play devil's advocate, I'd argue that it does matter.  Being efficient in the water means being better rested on the way out of the water.  It isn't all about speed.  (I'd also opine that the arguments about turns in the pool are useless - I don't care about turns.  I work hard on stroke drills, though.)

But then again I'm a swim guy, so I'm admittedly quite biased.


I agree - I focused on speed gain in my post, but the point applies equally to use of energy (and I meant it to address both but sometimes what's in my head and what I actually type are two different things ). For most of us, I'd say the conservation of energy for use in the bike / run is the most important of the two so your point is well taken.

 
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