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2005-11-23 11:07 PM

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Master
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The real USC, in the ghetto of LA
Subject: errr.... we are not a democracy
we, in the USA do not live in a democracy. we have a representitive deomcracy. in a rebulic we elect people to decide the laws. in a demoocracy we ALL vote on the laws. in a representitive democracy we do both. which is what we have in the us. watching a supreme court justic call us a democracy just gout under my skin. my rant is over.


2005-11-24 5:28 AM
in reply to: #291599

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2005-11-24 8:21 AM
in reply to: #291599

Master
1938
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La Crosse
Subject: RE: errr.... we are not a democracy

To be pedantic, which I am good at: Our form of government is a representative republic.

We use the electoral institution of democracy to choose our representatives; the people who wrote the constitution chose certain places to encourage mass political action (see the Great Compromise) and other places to deemphasize it (limits on suffrage, electoral college).

We, very occasionally, use a second system of direct democracy (ballot initiatives, referendums, recalls) on the state level. The people who wrote the constitution didn't come up with this system; it was a development of the Progressive Era, more than a century after the fact.

Sometimes the two systems come into conflict; in Florida the citizens of the state have repeatedly voted for a ballot initiative for high-speed rail between major cities, and their representatives in the state legislature keep saying no.

Sometimes Americans are surprised at the limits on direct democracy that show up in the system of the representative republic, because we occasionally forget that we're not a pure democracy. This is understandable; we talk about democracy so reverently that you'd forget that the people who wrote the constitution were a little afraid of it. So when we discuss the electoral college, we forget that it is actually an intentional limit on direct democracy, not just an anachronism.

2005-11-24 9:23 AM
in reply to: #291648

Champion
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South Jersey
Subject: RE: errr.... we are not a democracy
I hate the electoral college, and I wish the citizens of the U.S. could vote on Supreme Court Justices and major issues at the federal, not just state, level (e.g., drilling for oil in Alaska, a new social security plan, etc.). I guess this system was devised so that the underinformed didn't carry too much weight in major decisions, and I guess it would be a logistical and fiscal nightmare to send every major initiative to national vote, or to wait until election day and make everyone vote on hundreds of items. It makes sense for some things, but I still hate the electoral college and wish we could vote on supreme court. I guess we just have to have faith in our elected officials.

A government only works if the people it governs allows it to. . .
2005-11-25 9:39 AM
in reply to: #291599

Veteran
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Morris
Subject: RE: errr.... we are not a democracy
As long as we only have 2 parties, Rep or Dem, we are in a losing fight.

Take me for instances, I think I'm a common guy type, I believe in saying "One nation under God", which makes me a right winger.

I believe the church should'nt be considered when making public law, which makes me a left winger.

I believe, personnally that I couldn't agree to have my wife or girlfreind or daughter to have an abortion, which makes me a right winger.

However, I believe everone else should be able to make thier choice, Which Makes me a left winger.

I believe we all(who does not have a crimminal background) should be able to own and carry a firearm, which makes me a right winger.

I believe 2 people should be able to marry whom ever makes them happy, which makes me a left winger.

I believe in tax breaks, which makes me a right winger.

I believe in everyone should be able to get health care, which makes me a left winger.


I explained this once to my 9 year old nephew and he told me that I was good. I asked him why. He stated if you only have one wing you can't fly you just crash and you have both right and left wings so you should be able to fly good.

He then told me he was going to start a new party called the Constitarian Party, he said the only pre-requisite to join his party is you must have both wings.
2005-11-25 10:26 AM
in reply to: #291599

Expert
770
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acton, Ma
Subject: RE: errr.... we are not a democracy
ah, the wisdom of youth...


2005-11-25 12:24 PM
in reply to: #291599

Extreme Veteran
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Allen, TX
Subject: RE: errr.... we are not a democracy
don't get me started on my theories of Direct Democracy in the US.

we have the technology and capability to have an Athenian Democracy in our modern nation, but that is surely a frightening thought. this is a nation full of egoists that think that they know the best, but their next door neighbor is an idiot. we would all love to get to vote on every issue, but wouldn't trust the education level of those around us to vote intelligently (read: vote the way we want them too).

so is what we have a perfect solution? hah. instead we elect career politicians to represent us. in a technological age made up of a diverse culture we are electing predominantly middle aged white males to tell us how its gonna be. thats why we have terrible garbage like the Patriot Act and the (thankfully expired) Assault Weapon Ban. each lil representative focuses on getting their election votes, and the one or two little pet projects they hold dear.

if you've ever heard a new bill get introduced its conducted in the manner of high school classroom. no one besides the presenter is actually aware of the "problem" that needs fixing and they all have to sit through a crash course to get a very biased education on a "solution" (read: new law).

of course these are my opinions, and in a very ranterly format (which has something to do with my poor performance at the Turkey Trot yesterday I'm sure), so take them with a grain of salt.

for those of you non-Texans, just be glad that every little piece of law you guys want doesn't have to come in the form of a Constitutional Amendment. arg its so ****** up here.
2005-11-27 10:04 AM
in reply to: #291648

Master
1249
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Lexington, Kentucky
Subject: RE: errr.... we are not a democracy
stupidnickname - 2005-11-24 8:21 AMTo be pedantic, which I am good at:


I think you mean "at which I am good" 




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