Other Resources The Political Joe » Cohen Rss Feed  
Moderators: k9car363, alicefoeller Reply
2018-08-22 7:44 AM

User image

DC
Subject: Cohen
TOTALLY missed this forum!

What say you re Cohen. Will the house step up?


2018-08-22 8:03 AM
in reply to: Porfirio

User image

Champion
10157
500050001002525
Alabama
Subject: RE: Cohen
Originally posted by Porfirio

TOTALLY missed this forum!

What say you re Cohen. Will the house step up?


Step up to what?

I'm no lawyer.....but enough bragging. I've been reading a lot about Cohen's plea. Here are some of what I've read:

"“Any candidate has the right to contribute unlimited amounts to his own campaign,” said Dershowitz. “Any candidate. It may sound terrible, and it may be terrible, but any candidate has the right to pay hush money to somebody to influence the outcome of the election.”

“Not if it’s unreported,” interrupted Rodgers.

“Well, that’s the next question is whether it has to be reported, and is that a technical violation?” Dershowitz responded. “Do you know how many technical violations has the Obama campaign committed and every other campaign committed? Failure to report a contribution by the candidate itself is essentially jaywalking.”"


“Say a candidate had said we owe vendors a whole lot of money. We have had disputes with them. But I want you to go ahead and pay them. I’m a candidate, I don’t want the negative publicity. So he says to the private lawyer, you pay them, I’ll reimburse you, get it done. Is that illegal? It’s perfectly legal. Yet according to the prosecution of the Southern District of New York, it’s paid at the direction of the candidate to influence the election. Yes, Mr. Prosecutor, how stupid is your point?”


“It is a plea bargain between a prosecutor and criminal. A criminal who doesn’t want to spend the rest of his life in prison.....just because a prosecutor says that somebody violated a campaign law doesn’t make it so. He is not the judge. He is not the jury. We didn’t adjudicate anything.”


My opinion is this is just the latest "Aha! We finally got him!" hype by the media. The whole Russian collusion thing has failed to produce anything on Trump so now we are looking at campaign finance laws? Over $6.8 Billion-with-a-B was spent on the 2016 election and we are looking at $130k payment to hush porn star? Also, if Trump paid the money out of his own pocket there is nothing wrong with that. Even if it wasn't reported they will just say it was a minor accounting error. No way they would impeach over this.






2018-08-22 8:21 AM
in reply to: Rogillio

User image

DC
Subject: RE: Cohen
Originally posted by Rogillio

Originally posted by Porfirio

TOTALLY missed this forum!

What say you re Cohen. Will the house step up?


Step up to what?

I'm no lawyer.....but enough bragging. I've been reading a lot about Cohen's plea. Here are some of what I've read:

"“Any candidate has the right to contribute unlimited amounts to his own campaign,” said Dershowitz. “Any candidate. It may sound terrible, and it may be terrible, but any candidate has the right to pay hush money to somebody to influence the outcome of the election.”

“Not if it’s unreported,” interrupted Rodgers.

“Well, that’s the next question is whether it has to be reported, and is that a technical violation?” Dershowitz responded. “Do you know how many technical violations has the Obama campaign committed and every other campaign committed? Failure to report a contribution by the candidate itself is essentially jaywalking.”"


“Say a candidate had said we owe vendors a whole lot of money. We have had disputes with them. But I want you to go ahead and pay them. I’m a candidate, I don’t want the negative publicity. So he says to the private lawyer, you pay them, I’ll reimburse you, get it done. Is that illegal? It’s perfectly legal. Yet according to the prosecution of the Southern District of New York, it’s paid at the direction of the candidate to influence the election. Yes, Mr. Prosecutor, how stupid is your point?”


“It is a plea bargain between a prosecutor and criminal. A criminal who doesn’t want to spend the rest of his life in prison.....just because a prosecutor says that somebody violated a campaign law doesn’t make it so. He is not the judge. He is not the jury. We didn’t adjudicate anything.”


My opinion is this is just the latest "Aha! We finally got him!" hype by the media. The whole Russian collusion thing has failed to produce anything on Trump so now we are looking at campaign finance laws? Over $6.8 Billion-with-a-B was spent on the 2016 election and we are looking at $130k payment to hush porn star? Also, if Trump paid the money out of his own pocket there is nothing wrong with that. Even if it wasn't reported they will just say it was a minor accounting error. No way they would impeach over this.




Excellent! I think Trump's train of thought is relevant. Re Russia, in my mind, the circumstantial evidence is telling... for now at least. Also circumstantial evidence, why hasn't Trump fought back in tweets as of now?

Anyway, we are clearly on opposite sides of the isle. But thank you for sharing. This is the kind of intelligent response I'm looking for. Helps me attain a better perspective.
2018-08-22 8:41 AM
in reply to: Porfirio

User image

Champion
10157
500050001002525
Alabama
Subject: RE: Cohen
Originally posted by Porfirio

Originally posted by Rogillio

Originally posted by Porfirio

TOTALLY missed this forum!

What say you re Cohen. Will the house step up?





Excellent! I think Trump's train of thought is relevant. Re Russia, in my mind, the circumstantial evidence is telling... for now at least. Also circumstantial evidence, why hasn't Trump fought back in tweets as of now?

Anyway, we are clearly on opposite sides of the isle. But thank you for sharing. This is the kind of intelligent response I'm looking for. Helps me attain a better perspective.


I honestly don't even see circumstantial evidence of Russian collusion. The Trump Tower meeting with Jr was a meeting to get dirt on Hillary. Nothing wrong with that. In fact, Hillary went waaay beyond that spending $1M on the Russian/Steele dossier. Popdopolis also met with someone claiming to have dirt. Again, so what. That's what campaigns do. Roger Stone met with someone claiming to have dirt, yet again, so what. Trump said on national TV, "Russia, if you have Hillary's email...." This to me points more towards no collusion than collusion. If he was working with the Russians he would be weapons-grade stupid to give them direction on national TV.

Oh, I also read that Trump serves Russia vodka in his hotel lounges and that he is said to use Russian salad dressing. :-)

Seriously, if I've missed other circumstantial evidence implicating 'Russian collusion', please let me know. The above are the only things I've have heard asserted that is said to circumstantial evidence. I have an open mind. If he is found guilty of treason I will provide the rope. But so far, I've seen nothing....not a smidgeon of evidence. Doesn't mean there won't be.....just so far, after 2 years of investigations at the FBI, House, Senate, Mueller and 10,000 libs in media looking for dirt, we've yet to see any Russian/Trump collusion or conspiracy evidence.




2018-08-22 9:01 AM
in reply to: Porfirio

User image

Champion
10157
500050001002525
Alabama
Subject: RE: Cohen
If anyone is looking for a good lawyer, I would strongly suggest that you don’t retain the services of Michael Cohen!

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) August 22, 2018


Now that is funny I don't care who you are!
2018-08-22 9:45 AM
in reply to: Rogillio

User image

DC
Subject: RE: Cohen
Originally posted by Rogillio

Originally posted by Porfirio

Originally posted by Rogillio

Originally posted by Porfirio

TOTALLY missed this forum!

What say you re Cohen. Will the house step up?



The Trump Tower meeting with Jr was a meeting to get dirt on Hillary. Nothing wrong with that.



Normally, I would agree. But this was done in concert w/our sworn enemies! And, as far as we know, Trump senior got involved in attempting to establish the narrative about the occasion. If it's not a big deal, why would he go through the trouble!? In my mind, respectfully, I see this as circumstantial evidence.


2018-08-22 9:46 AM
in reply to: Rogillio

User image

DC
Subject: RE: Cohen
Originally posted by Rogillio

If anyone is looking for a good lawyer, I would strongly suggest that you don’t retain the services of Michael Cohen!

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) August 22, 2018


Now that is funny I don't care who you are!


Agree w/this.
2018-08-22 10:02 AM
in reply to: Porfirio

User image

Pro
15655
5000500050005001002525
Subject: RE: Cohen

Originally posted by Porfirio
Originally posted by Rogillio
Originally posted by Porfirio
Originally posted by Rogillio
Originally posted by Porfirio TOTALLY missed this forum! What say you re Cohen. Will the house step up?
The Trump Tower meeting with Jr was a meeting to get dirt on Hillary. Nothing wrong with that.
Normally, I would agree. But this was done in concert w/our sworn enemies! And, as far as we know, Trump senior got involved in attempting to establish the narrative about the occasion. If it's not a big deal, why would he go through the trouble!? In my mind, respectfully, I see this as circumstantial evidence.

Why does Russia have to be our "sworn enemy"?  They actually have a bigger stake than we do (because of geography) in stopping Islamic extremism/terrorism.  Why can't we be allies in that fight?  Talk about sworn enemies.....our problem with Islamic extremism is still in it's infancy when you look at their history.  Those folks aren't EVER coming over to our side.

2018-08-22 10:21 AM
in reply to: 0

User image

Champion
10157
500050001002525
Alabama
Subject: RE: Cohen
Originally posted by Left Brain

Originally posted by Porfirio Originally posted by Rogillio
Originally posted by Porfirio
Originally posted by Rogillio
Originally posted by Porfirio TOTALLY missed this forum! What say you re Cohen. Will the house step up?
The Trump Tower meeting with Jr was a meeting to get dirt on Hillary. Nothing wrong with that.
Normally, I would agree. But this was done in concert w/our sworn enemies! And, as far as we know, Trump senior got involved in attempting to establish the narrative about the occasion. If it's not a big deal, why would he go through the trouble!? In my mind, respectfully, I see this as circumstantial evidence.

Why does Russia have to be our "sworn enemy"?  They actually have a bigger stake than we do (because of geography) in stopping Islamic extremism/terrorism.  Why can't we be allies in that fight?  Talk about sworn enemies.....our problem with Islamic extremism is still in it's infancy when you look at their history.  Those folks aren't EVER coming over to our side.




You picked up on the same thing I did. In 2010 we took a Baltic cruise and spent 2 days in Russia. I found the Russian people to be very cordial. They are people just like us. Regardless of who rules the country, the people of Russia go to work, have lunch with friends, drop their kids off a school, take their kids to the soccer game. We toured the huge Hermitage Museum and found the vast majority of people there were Russians and loved art and the museum has over three million items including the largest collection of paintings in the world. I would love to take a week-long trip on the Tran-Siberian railroad. someday.....getting off in small towns along the way to meet the locals, do some hunting or fishing and drink some vodka in the local pub.

The point is, and Trump hit on this recently, Russia-paranoia has become the new McCarthyism. It behoove us to have good relations with Russia.....especially since they have the second (or maybe the first) largest nuclear weapons arsenal in the world. Putin may be a thug but at least he is in control and you don't have to worry about terrorist stealing their nuclear weapons. Americans look down our long snoots and Russia and act like we are better than everyone else....forgetting we've had some ugly times in the US too. e.g. slavery. Russia is NOT the former communist USSR and we need to stop seeing them as such.




Edited by Rogillio 2018-08-22 10:23 AM
2018-08-23 11:11 AM
in reply to: 0

User image

Buttercup
14334
500050002000200010010010025
Subject: RE: Cohen

It's actually a crime for a campaign to accept anything of value from a foreign national. That is the immediate issue/jeopardy for Cohen and Trump.

Details here at Federal Election Commission website. I clipped this:

In general, foreign nationals are prohibited from the following activities:

  • Making any contribution or donation of money or other thing of value, or making any expenditure, independent expenditure, or disbursement in connection with any federal, state or local election in the United States;
  • Making any contribution or donation to any committee or organization of any national, state, district, or local political party (including donations to a party nonfederal account or office building account);
  • Making any disbursement for an electioneering communication;
  • Making any donation to a presidential inaugural committee.

Persons who knowingly and willfully engage in these activities may be subject to an FEC enforcement action, criminal prosecution, or both.

 

The question of whether a country is a "sworn enemy" is relevant within the context of charges of treason. We're not there yet. If Russia continues it's acts of hostility via cyber warfare, it runs the risk of being declared an enemy of the US.

To clarify what constitutes an enemy:

According to 50 USCS § 2204 [Title 50. War and National Defense; Chapter 39. Spoils of War], enemy of the United States means any country, government, group, or person that has been engaged in hostilities, whether or not lawfully authorized, with the United States;

(3) the term "person" means

(A) any natural person;

(B) any corporation, partnership, or other legal entity; and

(C) any organization, association, or group.

 Here's a quick explainer of what does/doesn't constitute treason. The article provides helpful links, such as text describing declared or open war.

***********************************************************

Sorry, forgot to address your first question (above was in response to your comment re "sworn enemy").

Campaign contributions from an individual to a candidate or candidate committee are limited to $2,700. By paying Stormy Daniel $130k (or so) in order to influence the outcome of the election, Cohen violated the $2,700 limit. Likewise, when the National Enquirer paid off another woman (in excess of $100k), that was also a campaign contribution violation. Further, they falsified documentation to hide these contributions.

Here's a law topic website that goes into more detail about Cohen's crimes to date.



Edited by Renee 2018-08-23 11:23 AM
2018-08-23 11:25 AM
in reply to: Renee

User image

Pro
6838
5000100050010010010025
Tejas
Subject: RE: Cohen
Renee is back!! Good to see you.



2018-08-23 11:50 AM
in reply to: Renee

User image

Champion
10157
500050001002525
Alabama
Subject: RE: Cohen
Hey, Renee is back! We are in the presence of greatness!

I am a not a fan of Trump but am a huge fan of his policies - both foreign and domestic. As I've said, if they can prove treason, I will provide the rope. But so far all we have seen is allegations and innuendos and I'm inclined to give him the benefit of doubt, the presumption of innocence.

So here is a question I have been pondering. Trump has the authority to declassify the FISA warrant and/or order the FBI to hand over the unreacted but still classified FISA warrant to Congress. He has not done so. Why not? I have 4 theories.

1. The skeptical/cynical/suspicious side of me says he is afraid it has damaging information in there that would bolster the claims of a Russian/Trump Conspiracy.

2. He thinks the non-stop 'Russian thing' is helping him politically. IOWs, he gets to play the 'victim' at all his rallies and rail about how the 'establishment', the 'deep state' and the liberal/biased MSM are all out to get him. People LOVE to root for the underdog.

3. He knows what is in the FISA warrant and he knows he can in-redact it but he playing 3D chess. He is keeping his powder dry and will order it released as an October surprise 2 weeks before the November elections.

4. He has been advised by his attorneys that the action would be seen as obstruction of justice.


On a related note. Trump said he is not going to fire Mueller. And I think that is a wise move politically. (See #2 above) But.....if the GOP keeps both houses of Congress, I predict he will fire Mueller. Or at least give him "2 weeks notice" to finish up and submit his report to the FBI.


2018-08-23 12:00 PM
in reply to: Rogillio

User image

Buttercup
14334
500050002000200010010010025
Subject: RE: Cohen

My interpretation of the law is that they cannot prove treason because Russia is not (technically or legally) our enemy. Since treason is something you do with/for an enemy and Russia has (not yet) been declared an enemy, the acts committed thus far do not meet the test of treason.

That does not eliminate conspiracy with a foreign national or government, or a whole host of other crimes.

Seemingly illegal acts continue to be brought to light. We shall see where this leads. Donald certainly doesn't tweet like an innocent guy. Rather, his flailing, gnashing, and hysteria makes him seem like he's in very, very deep doo-doo. We shall see.

2018-08-23 12:09 PM
in reply to: Renee

User image

Champion
10157
500050001002525
Alabama
Subject: RE: Cohen
Originally posted by Renee

My interpretation of the law is that they cannot prove treason because Russia is not (technically or legally) our enemy. Since treason is something you do with/for an enemy and Russia has (not yet) been declared an enemy, the acts committed thus far do not meet the test of treason.

That does not eliminate conspiracy with a foreign national or government, or a whole host of other crimes.

Seemingly illegal acts continue to be brought to light. We shall see where this leads. Donald certainly doesn't tweet like an innocent guy. Rather, his flailing, gnashing, and hysteria makes him seem like he's in very, very deep doo-doo. We shall see.




Well ok then. I will take my rope back to Lowes and see if I can get my money back....
2018-08-23 12:14 PM
in reply to: Rogillio

User image

Buttercup
14334
500050002000200010010010025
Subject: RE: Cohen

Keep the rope! I'm not trying to pooh-pooh the idea that conspiring with Russia to subvert our democracy isn't an offense to our country. I consider it an act of hostility.

Many people throw around the word treason because conspiring with a country committing acts of hostility against our country really feels like treason. It's outrageous and despicable that Americans would conspire against the country.

However, treason has very specific legal meaning, so I am careful not to use that word. It muddles the issues, IMO.

2018-08-23 1:04 PM
in reply to: Renee

User image

Champion
10157
500050001002525
Alabama
Subject: RE: Cohen
Originally posted by Renee

Keep the rope! I'm not trying to pooh-pooh the idea that conspiring with Russia to subvert our democracy isn't an offense to our country. I consider it an act of hostility.

Many people throw around the word treason because conspiring with a country committing acts of hostility against our country really feels like treason. It's outrageous and despicable that Americans would conspire against the country.

However, treason has very specific legal meaning, so I am careful not to use that word. It muddles the issues, IMO.




My thinking is, conspiracy is a hard thing to prove. Unless you have Trump on tape saying, "If you help me win the election by hacking the DNC server or Hillary's emails I will lift sanctions on Russia and I will build a Trump tower in Moscow and put Putin's name on it." it would be hard to prove. But if they had any such evidence they would have already delivered their report. They could not and would not 'sit on that' for 18 months. So if there is no obvious smoking gun of conspiracy then you have to find way to prove your theory and presumption of guilt. Usually special councils are established to investigate a crime. This SC was established to find a crime.


2018-08-23 1:34 PM
in reply to: Rogillio

User image

Buttercup
14334
500050002000200010010010025
Subject: RE: Cohen

It's pure speculation to try to game out what Mueller should have done, when he should have done it, why he didn't do it, what he knows, doesn't know, what he can prove, etc. We don't know what he's discovered or what he can prove. For instance, just today it was revealed that the Natl Enquirer dude has been cooperating with prosecutors. We can infer that Mueller must know lots about other hooker payouts, but we don't actually know.  Of course, that doesn't stop cable programs from spending hundreds of hours speculating, so you're in good company.

It will all unfold in due time. Maybe there was a conspiracy against the US. Maybe it was just sloppy, fly-by-seat-of-their-pants, dirtbags just shooting off their mouths. Maybe something in between. Some pieces of the puzzle have been revealed, but so much still remains unknown.

2018-08-23 2:19 PM
in reply to: Renee

User image

Champion
10157
500050001002525
Alabama
Subject: RE: Cohen
Originally posted by Renee

It's pure speculation to try to game out what Mueller should have done, when he should have done it, why he didn't do it, what he knows, doesn't know, what he can prove, etc. We don't know what he's discovered or what he can prove. For instance, just today it was revealed that the Natl Enquirer dude has been cooperating with prosecutors. We can infer that Mueller must know lots about other hooker payouts, but we don't actually know.  Of course, that doesn't stop cable programs from spending hundreds of hours speculating, so you're in good company.

It will all unfold in due time. Maybe there was a conspiracy against the US. Maybe it was just sloppy, fly-by-seat-of-their-pants, dirtbags just shooting off their mouths. Maybe something in between. Some pieces of the puzzle have been revealed, but so much still remains unknown.




The problem I see with special councils are they have too much latitude. The only reason to have a SC is if there is a potential conflict of interest. If the SC 'stumbles' on other crimes it should immediately be turned back over to the FBI. They did this with Cohen....but not with Manafort. What Manafort was charged with an convicted was bread and butter FBI/IRS work. The only reason IMO that Mueller did not turn it over to a US Attorney is because he needed a 'win' to justify the SC's existence. The 25 Russian indictments is a joke. They should never have been brought. They should have been turned over to the intel community. If the SC finds Putin directed the 'election meddling' will they indict him too?

The SC 'authority' is like the game 7 degrees of separation....you always find 'connection' to investigate whatever and whomever you want to investigate.
2018-08-23 2:55 PM
in reply to: Rogillio

User image

Buttercup
14334
500050002000200010010010025
Subject: RE: Cohen

So, let me dissect and tackle this one bit at a time. (Feels like old times!)

If the SC 'stumbles' on other crimes it should immediately be turned back over to the FBI. They did this with Cohen....but not with Manafort.

Unless, of course, those crimes are pertinent to their overarching case.

What Manafort was charged with an convicted was bread and butter FBI/IRS work.

The evidence was gathered in the process of following the Special Counsel's mandate. They can't just overlook crimes if it's not the case they are working on. To my knowledge, the FBI and/or IRS had no basis for investigating Manafort's earnings and tax filing prior to this investigation, so it wasn't exactly a bread/butter case.

The only reason IMO that Mueller did not turn it over to a US Attorney is because he needed a 'win' to justify the SC's existence.

He's building a case. He followed protocol. I see nothing untoward here. More importantly, the judges have allowed the cases to proceed.

The 25 Russian indictments is a joke. They should never have been brought. They should have been turned over to the intel community.

1 Why should the Russians be spared the indictments? Prosecutors uncovered crimes committed by Russian individuals (25) and by Russian intelligence/GRU (12 agents). We are still a country that observes the rule of law, no? Why not apply our justice system in these cases?

2 You have things backwards. The intel community gave the information to the prosecutors. The intel community doesn't prosecute cases; their mission is to gather intel.

If the SC finds Putin directed the 'election meddling' will they indict him too?

Gosh, I hope so.

In any event, I believe the allegation that Putin directly ordered the cyber attacks has already been established by our intel community.

The SC 'authority' is like the game 7 degrees of separation....you always find 'connection' to investigate whatever and whomever you want to investigate.

That's what we have courts for - to ultimately decide those cases.

2018-08-24 8:31 AM
in reply to: Renee

User image

Champion
10157
500050001002525
Alabama
Subject: RE: Cohen
Originally posted by Renee

So, let me dissect and tackle this one bit at a time. (Feels like old times!)

If the SC 'stumbles' on other crimes it should immediately be turned back over to the FBI. They did this with Cohen....but not with Manafort.

Unless, of course, those crimes are pertinent to their overarching case.

What Manafort was charged with an convicted was bread and butter FBI/IRS work.

The evidence was gathered in the process of following the Special Counsel's mandate. No so. The FBI had an ongoing investigation of Manafort even before he joined the Trump campaign. One has to ask why the FBI did not inform the Trump campaign that Manafort was under investigation? One can only imagine.... They can't just overlook crimes if it's not the case they are working on. To my knowledge, the FBI and/or IRS had no basis for investigating Manafort's earnings and tax filing prior to this investigation, so it wasn't exactly a bread/butter case.

The only reason IMO that Mueller did not turn it over to a US Attorney is because he needed a 'win' to justify the SC's existence.

He's building a case. He followed protocol. I see nothing untoward here. More importantly, the judges have allowed the cases to proceed.

The 25 Russian indictments is a joke. They should never have been brought. They should have been turned over to the intel community.

1 Why should the Russians be spared the indictments? Prosecutors uncovered crimes committed by Russian individuals (25) and by Russian intelligence/GRU (12 agents). We are still a country that observes the rule of law, no? Why not apply our justice system in these cases?

2 You have things backwards. The intel community gave the information to the prosecutors. The intel community doesn't prosecute cases; their mission is to gather intel.

If the SC finds Putin directed the 'election meddling' will they indict him too?

Gosh, I hope so.

In any event, I believe the allegation that Putin directly ordered the cyber attacks has already been established by our intel community.

The SC 'authority' is like the game 7 degrees of separation....you always find 'connection' to investigate whatever and whomever you want to investigate.

That's what we have courts for - to ultimately decide those cases.




I can't unclutter all the quotes in this post so I will use a line from My Cousin Vinny, "Everything you just said is BS." :-) Just kidding.

I've lost the bubble on why a special counsel was needed in the first place. SC are needed to investigate crimes. What is the crime they are investigating.


2018-08-24 10:51 AM
in reply to: 0

User image

Pro
15655
5000500050005001002525
Subject: RE: Cohen
They're investigating how they can't figure out why the country elected Donald Trump as President.....and they still can't figure it out. Just keep feeding them rope. LMAO

Edited by Left Brain 2018-08-24 10:52 AM


2018-08-24 11:14 AM
in reply to: Renee

User image

Champion
7553
500020005002525
Albuquerque, New Mexico
Subject: RE: Cohen

Welcome back Renee!!

Originally posted by Renee

So, let me dissect and tackle this one bit at a time. (Feels like old times!)

If the SC 'stumbles' on other crimes it should immediately be turned back over to the FBI. They did this with Cohen....but not with Manafort.

Unless, of course, those crimes are pertinent to their overarching case.

 

 The justification for a SC is the conflict of interest (even apparent) for a normal prosecutor.  As such, the scope is theoretically limited and this case *should have* been turned over to normal prosecutors. 

What Manafort was charged with an convicted was bread and butter FBI/IRS work.

The evidence was gathered in the process of following the Special Counsel's mandate. They can't just overlook crimes if it's not the case they are working on. To my knowledge, the FBI and/or IRS had no basis for investigating Manafort's earnings and tax filing prior to this investigation, so it wasn't exactly a bread/butter case.

 

The IRS has basis for investigating tax fraud.  The FBI has basis for investigating bank fraud (and, I think, foreign agency violations).  It isn't the SC's responsibility to pursue these cases if the normal prosecution channel chooses not to do so or to pre-empt their prosecution.  To retain prosecution, the SC is inferring there is some apparent conflict of interest from the normal prosecution (unless the goal is to leverage the subject).

The only reason IMO that Mueller did not turn it over to a US Attorney is because he needed a 'win' to justify the SC's existence.

He's building a case. He followed protocol. I see nothing untoward here. More importantly, the judges have allowed the cases to proceed.

The 25 Russian indictments is a joke. They should never have been brought. They should have been turned over to the intel community.

1 Why should the Russians be spared the indictments? Prosecutors uncovered crimes committed by Russian individuals (25) and by Russian intelligence/GRU (12 agents). We are still a country that observes the rule of law, no? Why not apply our justice system in these cases?

2 You have things backwards. The intel community gave the information to the prosecutors. The intel community doesn't prosecute cases; their mission is to gather intel.

If the SC finds Putin directed the 'election meddling' will they indict him too?

Gosh, I hope so.

In any event, I believe the allegation that Putin directly ordered the cyber attacks has already been established by our intel community.

The SC 'authority' is like the game 7 degrees of separation....you always find 'connection' to investigate whatever and whomever you want to investigate.

That's what we have courts for - to ultimately decide those cases.

 

New Thread
Other Resources The Political Joe » Cohen Rss Feed  
RELATED POSTS

Cohen

Started by Rogillio
Views: 471 Posts: 14

2018-07-25 2:45 PM Left Brain