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2020-02-19 6:25 PM


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Subject: Longest First Time Post
This is going to be long….

I've done a decent amount of reading but wouldn't mind getting feedback, questions at the bottom if you want to jump forward.

Intro: 41, 6-5+, 205-210 lbs
Health: Good
Fitness: Better than average in the USA…
Ailments: Lower back which can cause alignment issues which causes, sore knees, hips, but PT, yoga and stretching solve it. I love to golf and it sets everything off…
Swim: 30 yrs experience, college swimmer, now masters swimmer. Done numerous 2 and 5 mile events.
Bike: I have no experience. Last bike purchase was a mtb in ’96. I did a bike fitting and purchased a new XL - Trek SC. Arrived yesterday.
Running: I run for fun/exercise and in the last two years completed three events, (2) 13.1 and a 10 mile. These are the first organized events I’ve completed. Pace was around ~ 9:15 and I didn't train, it was social, I love to talk when I run.

My past go-to exercise regime:
M-W-F: 1.25 run to YMCA, weights for 30 minutes, swim 2 miles, run 1.25 home.
Sun: 1.25 run – 2 mile swim – 1.25 run.
I'll throw in Yoga, Orange Theory, Solid Core if time allows - priority in that order.

Now I’ve decided to do and train for a 70.3 – Lake Anna, VA.

I only want to train 5 days per week. I know I need rest, I get sore/tired, I take naps after a heavy days workout, arthritis runs in my family and now have it in my hands, I need a minimum of 8 hours of sleep per day. I’m at week 6 on my current training calendar and everything has gone well. I feel great. I’ve took pieces of training from multiple resources / my time availability - here goes.

Background of training
Week 1 totals: Swim 8m, bike 60m and run 12m, 90 minutes of weights.

Current week - Wk 6 totals: Swim 8 miles, bike 90m, run 21 miles.
Details
Sunday: Swim 2 – Bike Peleton 90 minute 5 x 15 min ride PE 3 /output ~215 – Run 2 miles immediately after at 8:30 pace on TM, 2% incline.

Monday: Run 1.25 – weights 30min – swim 2m – run 1.25 – kids to school – run 4 x 1.25 miles, 2% incline at PE 8: 1.25 at 7:30 pace with .25 rest between at 8:30 pace. Total run 6.15 miles

Tuesday: Rest Day

Today: Wednesday: Run 1.25m – weights 30min – swim 2m – run 1.25m – kids to school – bike 90 min 8 x 8 min PE8 – 2 minute rest between each 8 min push @ 150 output. PE 8 @ ~ 220 output - total 33 miles

Thursday: Run 6 miles @ PE 7 ~ 8 minute pace

Friday: Run 1.25 – weights 30min – swim 2 miles – run 1.25 – kids to school – bike 90 min Peleton endurance ride or two 45 minute rides to change it up. I may get outside based on weather ~31 mile goal.

Saturday: Rest Day

Totals for the week: Swim 8m – Bike 90m – Run 21m – Weights 90min.


This is the planned cadence for the next 10 weeks with distances and interval changing & increasing. Max per wk: swim 8 miles, bike ~100 miles, run ~ 26 miles. The interval training is much easier on my body then just logging miles. And way better for my mental state.

My goal: I want to beat the avg time for my age group, 5:48. In reality, finishing and feeling good will make me happy. I do not enjoy competing. This is for me.

Aggressive goal: 26m swim – 2hr 50 min Bike (20 mph) – 2 hr run (9 min): 5:16
Realistic goal: 26m swim – 3:10 bike (~17.5mph) - 2:10 run (9:30 min): 5:46

Questions – I know everyone’s different, it’s hard to answer, some questions are elementary...but these things have been on my mind and maybe you have encountered them. I don't know what to expect or how hard to train to meet my goals. Any great literature I should read?

General questions:
1) What your thoughts on my general training cadence? Strengths, weaknesses. Things I may be missing or should think about. Do I need to train harder to hit those goals? What is a good time for your first event? AM I realistic? I think my biggest struggle is I have no reference to what a 6 mile run tomorrow at 8 min pace should equal in a triathalon. Same goes for the bike which I guess I need to get on. Maybe I need to do some performance testing?
2) Sweat...I have a high sweat rate. I’m soaked after 1 hr of steady exercise, seriously soaked. I’m also blessed with Magnum PI chest hair. Do people shave chests/anything besides legs to help stay cooler, to help fabrics breath and dry better?
3) Water: How much water would one drink during the race? 2 bottles on the bike? 1 during the run? What’s normal? I want to start ingesting during my bike and runs.
4) I was told a one piece tri suit is easiest. I was told to try Desoto or Kiwamitri then use a belt for the numbers.
5) Transitioning between S – B – R. I can see myself wanting to take it slow/rest BUT is it better for your mind/muscle to keep moving with authority and pace. I know its “easy” time to lose and gain but would like opinions. Just relax? Don't worry about it?
6) If you have to go #1, do you pull over to a tree and go? What’s the real etiquette?
7) Any taller guy ah-ha advice? I'm not a clydesdale due to weight, more of an older giraffe that gets sore.
8) During the race, do you need to worry about cars or do they shut down the roads? I’m guessing it depends on the race.


Bike questions:
1) Should I get larger single rides in, say 50, 60, 70 milers? Remember, I have no bike experience. Feels like a possible weakness in my training. My single day ride max is currently 40 miles.
2) Do first timers normally pace too fast on the bike? I want to focus on negative splitting the bike and run first time out.
3) How close are stationary bike metrics to a road bike? I did buy a Wahoo unit for the SC but haven't tried it yet. I'm only going to get 8 weeks or so on the bike before raceday.
4) Flat tire. I can’t change one. What happens on race day if it goes flat? Should I have the bike store change out new tube’s and tires for the race?
5) I was told 90rpm is a good goal RPM but given my current stationary riding I’m comfortable a little slower, 83-86, but again its on a Peleton/Gym bike. Any tall guy opinions would be great or what people see.

Run Questions:
1) Any correlation to 1/2 marathon time to a 70.3 run split. Many factors I know, week 10 I have a 13.1 event.
2) To help with knee and hip pain I've started to speed up my cadence, with the help of new UA shoes and MapMyRun. I'm currently around 172-174 which I think is another reason knee and hip pain is down. Other ideas?

Well, I hope I didn't waste your time : ) I did search some of this but some of the material is a decade old and some redundant questions might give some background to my thoughts. I want the race to be fun.

I'd love feedback even if its simple. I'd do X to help, here's something that helped me..., can I have X info to give better advice.

Thanks for reading,
BC





2020-02-19 8:51 PM
in reply to: Bjcarls

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Subject: RE: Longest First Time Post
BC, I do believe you win the award for longest first time post! Great list of questions that I am going to throw some answers at. Others might say something different and thats fine, it's always nice to have different opinions so you can take and leave what works and what doesn't.

Biggest piece of advice I would give you is: Find a sprint or olympic distance triathlon before your 70.3, you will learn more from competing than from internet wisdom. There won't be near as much pressure on you during your 70.3 after you've had a dress rehearsal at a shorter distance. I learned a ton during my first sprint that I wouldn't have picked up from online reading.

Now, on to your questions:
General questions:
1) What your thoughts on my general training cadence? Strengths, weaknesses. Things I may be missing or should think about. Do I need to train harder to hit those goals? What is a good time for your first event? AM I realistic? I think my biggest struggle is I have no reference to what a 6 mile run tomorrow at 8 min pace should equal in a triathalon. Same goes for the bike which I guess I need to get on. Maybe I need to do some performance testing?

I think your general training is fine. Don't set too many expectations for your first race. So many things happen and you just have to be flexible and enjoy the fact that you are racing and the experience happening around you. You need to get in some longer single runs and rides. Endurance is the name of the game in 70.3 racing. The 90 minute rides are a good start, try and build up to 3-3.5 hours. Your swim numbers are great. Try to build up to a long run once a week in the 90-120 minute range.

2) Sweat...I have a high sweat rate. I’m soaked after 1 hr of steady exercise, seriously soaked. I’m also blessed with Magnum PI chest hair. Do people shave chests/anything besides legs to help stay cooler, to help fabrics breath and dry better?

Never heard of folks shaving their chest to stay cooler, guess you could experiment and report back! May not be a bad idea to find a place that does sweat testing. They can tell you how much to drink and how much sodium and other electrolytes you need to replace.

3) Water: How much water would one drink during the race? 2 bottles on the bike? 1 during the run? What’s normal? I want to start ingesting during my bike and runs.

Completely individual. Im not as heavy of a sweater as you are, but i try to take in 1 bottle per hour on the bike. I use tailwind nutrition in my drink bottles for calories/electroyle replacement and carbohydrates. Play around during your rides and runs and see how much you can stomach without getting sick/sloshy. I don't know how much I drink on the run, I grab 2 or 3 cups of water or gatorade and down them at each aid station. A lot of this is race specific as well. I race Augusta 70.3 where it is usually in the mid 90s with oppressive humidity. A cooler race won't penalize you as much for a slip up in hydration. In general you want to shoot for approx 300 calories and 50 carbs per hour while on the bike to ensure you have energy for the run.

4) I was told a one piece tri suit is easiest. I was told to try Desoto or Kiwamitri then use a belt for the numbers.

I prefer a two piece kit, again a very individual thing. Easier to use the restroom if needs be with a two piece kit and I like to wear my tri bottoms during swim training/trainer rides. Can't do that with a one piece as easily. Both the brands you mention are quality brands. I wear an Innerforce Sports kit, they do custom kits for about the same price as most other brands generic kits. A number belt is a great thing to get. Get one with a spot to store your gels. I ordered mine off of amazon for $6.

5) Transitioning between S – B – R. I can see myself wanting to take it slow/rest BUT is it better for your mind/muscle to keep moving with authority and pace. I know its “easy” time to lose and gain but would like opinions. Just relax? Don't worry about it?

Don't have a picnic but give your body time to get your wits about you, especially the swim to bike transition. You don't want to be jelly legged from the swim and be trying to mount a bike and fall over. I took my time in transition in my first 70.3 but was very intentional in my second and third go. This is where doing a sprint triathlon will give you an idea of how you want to tackle your transitions. And please, no 5 gallon buckets in transition!

6) If you have to go #1, do you pull over to a tree and go? What’s the real etiquette?

Most races have port a johns at the aid stations and in transition. I have seen people pulled over off the course to use the restroom however I would try to avoid doing that. Don't want to get dinged by a race marshall.

7) Any taller guy ah-ha advice? I'm not a clydesdale due to weight, more of an older giraffe that gets sore.

Can't help you there, I'm 6'0"

8) During the race, do you need to worry about cars or do they shut down the roads? I’m guessing it depends on the race.

Race dependent. Most Ironman brand races do a good job of blocking lanes for the bike portion. It is important to remember that if the lane is coned off, you can not go outside the cones or you risk a DQ. This is for your safety. You'll get an athlete guide in your email around 2 weeks out from race day with a lot of this stuff in it.


Bike questions:
1) Should I get larger single rides in, say 50, 60, 70 milers? Remember, I have no bike experience. Feels like a possible weakness in my training. My single day ride max is currently 40 miles.

For a 70.3, you typically want to have a few rides that are a little bit longer than you expect it to take you to finish the 56 mile bike ride. 60-70 miles is plenty, though completing a century ride is a cool accomplishment! I typically try to get in a 2 to 3 hour ride most weekends during my 70.3 training.

2) Do first timers normally pace too fast on the bike? I want to focus on negative splitting the bike and run first time out.

I would say yes and then they blame their run fitness for having a bad run, when in reality they just screwed up the bike. Go too hard on the bike and/or swim and you will have a less than ideal run. You can bike too hard and gain a few minutes but then end up walking on the back half of the run and give back 20-30 minutes really quick. It's best to finish the bike feeling fresh and then be set to attack the run.

3) How close are stationary bike metrics to a road bike? I did buy a Wahoo unit for the SC but haven't tried it yet. I'm only going to get 8 weeks or so on the bike before raceday.

My metrics are fairly close between road/trainer. This is very individual based on trainer, set-up, etc.

4) Flat tire. I can’t change one. What happens on race day if it goes flat? Should I have the bike store change out new tube’s and tires for the race?

You get a DNF. Most races have a car or two riding around to assist cyclists, but I wouldn't depend on them. You could be waiting a while or you may get looked over. I would go to your bike store and ask them to run through it with you. It isn't a difficult task once you practice it. I luckily have never had a flat during a race, but I have seen many racers sidelined waiting on someone to help them. It's an essential skill to have in my opinion.

5) I was told 90rpm is a good goal RPM but given my current stationary riding I’m comfortable a little slower, 83-86, but again its on a Peleton/Gym bike. Any tall guy opinions would be great or what people see.

Cadence is very individual. I gravitate towards 85 RPM and I don't worry with it. Go with what feels natural.

Run Questions:
1) Any correlation to 1/2 marathon time to a 70.3 run split. Many factors I know, week 10 I have a 13.1 event.

Assuming you pace your swim and bike well, you might expect to run around 10 minutes within your open half marathon time. I typically set 3 run time goals to keep myself motivated. First is the "if everything is going perfect goal", second is "this is your typical race goal", and third is "let's salvage this thing". As I mentioned earlier, go too hard on the bike or blow your nutrition and you may find yourself doing more walking than running for the "run" leg.

2) To help with knee and hip pain I've started to speed up my cadence, with the help of new UA shoes and MapMyRun. I'm currently around 172-174 which I think is another reason knee and hip pain is down. Other ideas?

As a therapist, I say get with your therapist and find the root cause of the pain. Low back stuff can be tricky. Have you looked into orthotics? Pick up a copy of Jay Dicharry's Anatomy for Runner's as well. It's a good resource for running injury free. Jay is a PT that does a lot of kinesiology and gait analysis at his lab.


Alright, I think I covered it all! Fire back with any other questions or if you need clarification. Again, these are just my thoughts and I am still learning. Best way to learn is through doing, find races and take part in them. I think I shaved more than 10 minutes off my first and second 70.3 just in transitions running smoother. Remember to have fun through all of this too. Each session is a chance to experience something. Don't grow numb to that because you are too worried about your cadence, pace, power, HR, etc. Enjoy the fact that you are able to do this and soak it up!

2020-02-20 5:58 AM
in reply to: Parkland

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, Pennsylvania
Subject: RE: Longest First Time Post
Practice Transition. Not sure if that was noted in the books above.

I did IMLP 70.3 and it was cold that day. T1 was almost 10 minutes, which is excessive I know but needed a lot of gearing up for cold & rainy downhills to come. T2 was maybe 6 minutes.

Your miles look fine and you're fortunate to be a strong swimmer.

I finished in 6 hours including the two slow transitions (cold weather clothing removal in T2) and my swim time was like 42 minutes, I feel like I swam the course twice with how much correction I had to do. I am a strong biker for mid pack, had to be off the bike 4 times for mechanical issues (was pissed with my LBS for that one).

I was cooked on the run, could have pushed harder but I don't like to live in the pain.

Longest training week I had was 11 hours. I did do a few long bikes, 50+ miles in training.

Training was about right for what I did in the race. Also allowed me to be back to run training on Tuesday after race, which was part of my goals.

Lastly, enjoy the hell out of the day. Talk to everyone, thank the volunteers.
2020-02-20 1:03 PM
in reply to: Bjcarls

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Subject: RE: Longest First Time Post

What your thoughts on my general training cadence?

I am right there with you.  I am 41 years old and prior to my first 70.3 the mountain bike that I got in 94' was my "A Bike".  Your swimming is your strength.  You are going to nail the swim.  At 100 miles a week on the bike and 26 miles a week running you have the fitness to get through the 70.3 race.  Especially if you are not racing. 

What is a good time for your first event? Am I realistic? 

My first triathlon was in 2015.  It was a 70.3 distance Triathlon.  My goal was to finish in under 5:15 with a 40 min swim, 2:55 bike, and 1:35 run.  The only discipline that I had ever races or even trained for prior to my triathlon training was the run and I had run a dozen half marathons in the 1hr 22min to 1hr 26min range.  

I did a 35min swim, 4:20 hr bike (two flat tires) and 2:00 run to finish right at 7 hours. It was the most thrilling accomplishment for me.  I couldn't have been happier if I had gone under 5 hours and been first place overall. 

I trained for another year and did a repeat the following year and the results were a 44 min swim (leg cramps), 3hr 3min bike, 2:00 run. for a  5hr 44 min finish. 

I didn't think my goals of going under 5:15 were unrealistic and everything I read said that my run time should be about 10% over my open half marathon time so I was a little discouraged with running a 2:00:05 in my first 70.3 after 8 months of training and then a 2:00:06 the following year 21 months into my transition to Triathlon.  My college running coach told me that it in his experience it takes athletes about three years to Peak in Endurance Sports.  So after the disappointing run at my second triathlon, I lightened told myself that I had to wait until I was 36 months into the sport before I start to work about race time.  The following year I choose to do an Olympic Race that I had friends doing. The run was still disappointed and I had the worst swim of my life (again due to leg cramps), but I had a great bike leg. The plan was to just do one race a year because at that point I wasn't fast and the more races I did the less improvement I could see at each event, but I lost all my motivation after my Olympic race having nothing to look forward to so I went ahead and signed up for a late-season 70.3 race 7 weeks before it was held.  I didn't think I would have enough time to get in shape for that race so the plan was to just run it for fun and not try to PR.  Well...I got a flat tire on the bike that lost me 11 minutes of time but I finished that race with a 5:10 finish time and a 1:50 run time.  So...37 months into triathlon I finally got under the 5:15 mark.  I was so encouraged that I could have gone under 5:00 hours if I hadn't got the flat tire that I made a goal to break 5 hours the following year.   I got a 5:07 at my 70.3 race but took another 9 minutes off my run time for a 1:41 run.  So I did the late season 70.3 again and got a 4:57 finish time with a 1:32 run time.  So don't change your goals.  They are really where they are, but if you don't hit them don't be discouraged.  The long triathlon does has a learning curve to it.  For my first race, I was doing 3000-4000 yards swimming, 90 miles a week cycling, and 25 miles a week running.  My volumes have not changed much in 4-1/2 years.  I am doing a lot more intensity now.  That comes with time though and you improve through consistency.   

Sweat...I have a high sweat rate...

If I am swimming shirtless then yes I shave the chest. You are a swimmer so you know what that means for drag (Yes us 40+ Masters Athletes have the Magnum PI hear going on).  If I am wearing a wet suit I just shave the legs and arms to decrease drag on the bike (my arms are hairier than my Magnum PI chest).  Shaving isn't going to keep you cooler.  I am a heavy sweater and so it took my a few races to figure out the nutrition (i.e. how much fluids to take in, how much electrolytes, etc.).  Nutrition was one of the big downfalls in my first few races.  I was getting cramps in the water, cramps on the bike, and cramps on the run.  It was a big part of the learning curve that lots of athletes don't consider in there race time goals for their first race.  

Water: How much water would one drink during the race? I had to learn this by trial.  In training, I was totally fine up to 60 miles on the bike with taking 20 oz every hour in the saddle. Races were different.  My first Race it was hotter than heck and the second race it was 50-55 deg F and raining. That makes a big difference in what you need and what you want.  What you want on the bike is not always enough though so you have to learn when to drink when to take electrolytes, and how much.  In training runs I was fine with nothing (not food not water) for up to 12 miles runs.  In the race...I was dehydrated and cramping before I even got off the bike so I started the run about in the condition I would be 20 miles into a training run.  I could get enough fluid, electrolytes, calories on the run. Again this is a learning thing, but I do about 32 oz of fluids with lots of electrolytes before the swim, can down another 32oz of fluids my first 10 minutes on the bike if it is a hot day.  Cool days I might be okay on 40oz of fluids on the bike and hot days I might be closer to 100oz of fluids on the bike.   On the run I just stop at every aid station on the course and get what I need.  If I am feeling good  I will take one paper cup of water or sports drink and drink in down in one gulp and be on my way.  If it is hot I may take as many as 5-6 cups as a single aid station before hurrying on.  Again this is a learning curve.  One thing I have learned is when I am going to cramp and when I am going to bonk.  I feel weak about 10 minutes before a bonk and if I am paying attention can get calories in (coka-a-cola works great) before I bonk.  The camps I can start to feel early craps.  If I ease up on the pace a little bit, relax and get some electrolytes I sometimes can prevent the full-on muscle spasms.   Cramps are a bigger challenge though.  One they start to come on I am going to have to slow down.  Pushing through will lead to spasms.  I looks more time with muscle spasms than I do from slowing down so slowing down saves my a lot of time (and pain) if I can paying attention and quickly adjust.  

 

Transitioning between S – B – R..... The longer I have races the more I hustle through a transition. I used to take them at a light jog, but now I take them at a quick run.  You are better off walking through every aid station (which I do) so you can spread out your mini-breaks than to take them all at once at the transitions.  You "rest"  over about 20 seconds have diminishing returns so do hang around in transitions.  Burn through there are fast as you can.  If you need to take a few extra seconds do it at the aid stations on the run. 

 

If you have to go #1, do you pull over to a tree and go? What’s the real etiquette?  There are outhouses every 15 miles or so on the bike and every 3 miels or so on the run.  Don't use a tree.  Don't wet yourself.  It is against the triathlon race rules and you will get time penalties or DQ'd if caught.  I have use the port-a-pot in the bike in about 1/3 of my races and on the run in about half of my races.  

 

During the race, do you need to worry about cars or do they shut down the roads? Yes...worry about cars.  Most races don't shut down the roads.  I don't mind riding with traffic since I am used to it but lots of the drivers are not used to driving with cyclists so even if you exhausted pay attention out there. 

Should I get larger single rides in, say 50, 60, 70 milers? For my first race I started at 25-mile rides on Saturday mornings and added 10% every week (with rest weeks every 3-4 weeks where I just did 25 miles).  I built up to 55-60 miles.  I was focused on just building the base.  I had zero cycling background.  My current cycling plan is a lot different.  It used to take me 3 hours to go 50 miles.  Now I can do 20-40 minute intervals at race pace take a 5-10 minute rest interval and do 2-3 intervals and get my 50 miles in 2-1/2 hours and then do a 30-minute brick run after my long ride.  I do higher intensity on the bike now for my long rides and a 3-6 miles running off the bike.  So I still have 3-1/2 hour workouts but am doing less time on the bike.  Tough call really.  Without analyzing data it would just be a coin toss to guess if more endurance or more intensity will yield better results.  I personally feel that you should focus on long slow miles for the first three years and after you have built the base to go to the higher intensity.  So...my vote would be yes for the longer rides.  Remember the race is going to be 5-6 hours long.  One of the things that first-timer struggle with is their attention span.  If their longest workouts are 3 hours or 4 hours long they get 3 hours or 4 hours into the race and even if their fitness is there they mentally feel like they are to the end with another two hours to go.  Your body may be holding up fine but your get bored with what you are doing and want to stop.  So in that light, you may even want to do a century (100 mile) ride to trainer your brain to a 6-hour window.  This again is one of those learning curve things with endurance sports.   

Flat tire. I can’t change one. What happens on race day if it goes flat?  My first race I had two flats.  My third race I had another flat.  It happens and it something that you need to be prepared for.  Carry a CO2 kit to inflate your tube and care a spare tube.  Oh and make sure you have changes an inner tube a few times before the race so you learn the feel for prying off the tire, fitting the tire back on the rim, inflating the tube etc.  In my first race there was no bike support at the aid station on the bike course.  I was shocked.  I stopped after my first flat hoping a pit crew you run out at the drop of a hat and check my air pressure and make sure I was where I needed to be.  What I found was a laddy who had a bike pump in her truck that had a Shrader Valve that she swore she used for Preston valves at home.  She held the valve and I pumped as fast as I could while hearing air escaping the whole time.   I got pumping fast enough for a while that the Pressure gage got close to 90 PSI so I signaled for the lady to pull the valve.  The tire felt okay so I went on my way but it was a waste of another 10-15 minutes and I got my second flat a little over a mile from the aid station which I feel was due to messing with the pump/air pressure.  I didn't have bike shoes and cycling in my running shoes and toe clips so I tried to run the bike 15 miles to the end of the bike course to start my 13 mile run.  The SAG (Support and Gear) wagon found me after about 30 minutes and was able to hook me up with another tube (I only had one) and they even had a pump with a Preston valve.  They however were NOT familiar with my wheels.  They offered to change the tire for me, but my tires were a tighter fit that they were used to and they struggled and struggle and struggled then told me they couldn't change the flat.  So I took over got it changed and was back on my way.  I road the last leg of the race very conservatively because I couldn't afford another flat.  Also due to being out on the blacktop for an extra hour with the second flat caused me to run out of water.  I was about 3 miles past the last aid station when the SAG Wagon found be.  I wasn't going back so I went forward with no water for the last 10 miles on a hot day.  I was getting cramps from dehydration before I got off the bike.  All part of the full race day experience.  I finished though.  Finishing was my real goal for my first race.  Once you have finished you know that you can do it and after that it is about how fast you can do it.  For your first, no other goal should take precedence over finishing.   

Any correlation to 1/2 marathon time to a 70.3 run split. Many factors I know, week 10 I have a 13.1 event.

I read 8-12% slower run times were good for a 70.3 race, but in open half marathons, I considered it a bad race if I didn't go under 1hr 25 minutes and I was over 2 hours on my first two 70.3 races. My last 70.3 race I was a 1hr 32min but it really comes down to how the swim and the bike ride go.  If you go too hard on the swim or the bike and are not going to be able to run well.  I can muscle out a +33% when I am hammered and I was a competitive runner for 30 years.  Since running is not your strength you need to make sure you don't over do it on the bike. Get to the run fresh and the day will be much more enjoyable that if you pace people on the bike on to be reduced to having to walk on the run. 

To help with knee and hip pain I've started to speed up my cadence, with the help of new UA shoes and MapMyRun. I'm currently around 172-174 which I think is another reason knee and hip pain is down. Other ideas?  I Blew out my knees pretty bad in a wrestling injury during my sophomore year of college.  I there reinjured my right knee wresting my Junior year and that time I ended up getting reconstructive knee surgery. My younger brother did his first Ironman in 2002 and I thought to myself.  I will never be able to do a Triathlon.  My knee would never hold up to the cycling required to do that and my shoulders (also bad from wresting) would never hold up to the swimming.  Well....my knees didn't like the water or the bike.  I took it easy on the bike and there was no pain being caused by what I was doing but I could feel the weakness in the right knee and after cycling, it would continue to feel weak for a long time.  In the water, if I kick straight up and down my knee was okay but any side motion for a scissor kicked side stroke or a breaststroke I could feel the knee wobble and move.  It was not a good feeling and again felt week.  A funning thing happened through between 6-10 weeks of consistent swimming and cycling my knee strengthened to where it didn't slide around in the water, didn't feel weak on the bike and didn't feel a week after a swim or a bike ride.  So... for me, triathlon has cured my bad knees.  I used to have the knee drive me crazy if I was in a car for more than 90 minutes or anywhere else that I could stretch it out or move it.  Now I am fine on car rides, fine of bike rides, fine anywhere.  I hope that as you strengthen your knee that you can cure yours too.  I don't have a clue what my run cadence is.  I do know what movements in the water my knee didn't like what movements on the bike my knee didn't like and I had to move the seat higher on the bike and make other small adjustments to keep the knee happy and that was what did the trick for me.   

 

Well, I hope I didn't waste your time : ) Yep...wasted a lot of time on this, but if it can speed up your learning curve I am happy to do it.   

2020-02-21 2:35 PM
in reply to: Bjcarls

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1144
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McAlester, Oklahoma
Subject: RE: Longest First Time Post

Originally posted by Bjcarls 4) I was told a one piece tri suit is easiest. I was told to try Desoto or Kiwamitri then use a belt for the numbers. 

I was reading through Parkland's response (I was glad to see we are on the same page with our responses) and see that I missed #4. 

I did my first Triathlon in Speedo Jammer swim trunks and an Under Armour compression shirt.  The compression shirt was NOT a quick-drying shirt so I didn't wear it in the water because I didn't want it to sponge up and slow me down, but I took half of my transition time trying to pull it on over wet skin so it cost me time either way.  Other than the extra half-minute in transition, it work pretty well for me in the races I used it. 

I got a one-piece as one of my up-grade later on.  It was an eBay deal that I got for about 25% off the retail cost because it had a small snag in it that was almost not even noticeable and after 3 years it is still almost not noticeable and has never been a problem.   I like the one-piece.  It is much better than what I started out with.

When I was looking for Racing Teams last year I decided I should choose one that had a good race kit because after three seasons I was ready for a new Tri suit.  One team that I was accepted to was offering Wattie Ink Team Kits and the Other was offering the Kiwami Spider 2 Race Kit.  It was not an easy decision to choose between two teams because they both were really good fits for me, but it came down to going with the one that was going to give me the most bang for my buck so I am now awaiting my new Kiwami Spider 2 Race Kits.  I feel very confident that I made the best choice.  In the past month, I also have picked up Kiwami Prima suits (one-piece) for my sprint distance races with pool swims.  I will use the Spider 2 or my long Triathlons.  I think this is technically a two-piece since the top zips open but I think it is attached at the back.  I am still awaiting the arrival of the Spider 2. I also have picked up two Kiwami suits for my daughters to use in their Kid Triathlons. I pretty to be working with Kiwami this year.

 

 

2020-02-24 3:31 PM
in reply to: 0

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Official BT Coach
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Indianapolis, Indiana
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Subject: RE: Longest First Time Post

Originally posted by Bjcarls General questions:

1) What your thoughts on my general training cadence? Strengths, weaknesses. Things I may be missing or should think about. Do I need to train harder to hit those goals? What is a good time for your first event? AM I realistic? I think my biggest struggle is I have no reference to what a 6 mile run tomorrow at 8 min pace should equal in a triathalon. Same goes for the bike which I guess I need to get on. Maybe I need to do some performance testing?

2) Sweat...I have a high sweat rate. I’m soaked after 1 hr of steady exercise, seriously soaked. I’m also blessed with Magnum PI chest hair. Do people shave chests/anything besides legs to help stay cooler, to help fabrics breath and dry better?

3) Water: How much water would one drink during the race? 2 bottles on the bike? 1 during the run? What’s normal? I want to start ingesting during my bike and runs.

4) I was told a one piece tri suit is easiest. I was told to try Desoto or Kiwamitri then use a belt for the numbers.

5) Transitioning between S – B – R. I can see myself wanting to take it slow/rest BUT is it better for your mind/muscle to keep moving with authority and pace. I know its “easy” time to lose and gain but would like opinions. Just relax? Don't worry about it?

6) If you have to go #1, do you pull over to a tree and go? What’s the real etiquette?

7) Any taller guy ah-ha advice? I'm not a clydesdale due to weight, more of an older giraffe that gets sore.

8) During the race, do you need to worry about cars or do they shut down the roads? I’m guessing it depends on the race.

Hi BC.  I'm gonna try and go through your questions one at a time.

1)  My first thought is find a plan.  There are several plans here on BT or you can simply Google 70.3 plans.  My advice is go with a plan written by an experienced coach. That will give you confidence you have a balanced plan that will prepare you properly for all of the disciplines.  One observation I have - this goes to your comment, "Do I need to train harder to hit those goals?"  The biggest single mistage I see age-group triathletes make is they don't go hard enough on hard days, and they don't go easy enough on easy days.  The general belief is that training harder is the way to go.  That methodology WILL NOT deliver success on race day.  It's during recovery that your body rebuilds itself and gets stronger.  Following a pre-writtne plan will help you avoid that mistake.

2-3)  The only true way to form a hydration plan is to know your sweat rate in race conditions.  Here's a link to an article that will talk about determining your sweat rate and calculating proper hydration - http://bscmultisport.com/blog/2018/06/06/know-your-sweat-rate/

4)  Personally I prefer a two-piece tri-suit.  I'm 6'5" tall and have an unusually long torso so most one-piece suits don't fit me well.  Best bet is to go to a quality triathlon store and try various suits on to find what works best for you.  While the manufacturers you mentioned are quality vendors, I wouldn't limit myself to a single vendor or vendors.

5)  A deliberate pace in transition will be faster than trying to go fast - if you try to go fast you'll likely make mistakes and end up taking longer to do what you're trying to do.  The key to a good transition starts with having your heart rate in the correct zone when you enter transition which goes to properly pacing the leg before entering transition.  You aren't going to bring your heart rate down in transition unless you sit and rest, which is contrary to a race environment.  When you get to transition, a methodical, deliberate pace so you don't make mistakes will likely yield the fastest transition time.

6)  There will be porta-potties spread through-out the course.  When you gotta go, you gotta go.

7)  I'm a tall guy.  I got nothin'!  Having a big wing-span helps in the water. 

8)  Depends on the race.  Although, you should ALWAYS be aware of your surroundings.  Just because a road is closed doesn't mean cars won't be on the road.  At Ironman Louisville, they'll close the roads at the far end of the course but the roads wind through a residential section.  Residents are still allowed to come and go.  Safety first - always assume cars will be present.

Originally posted by Bjcarls Bike questions:

1) Should I get larger single rides in, say 50, 60, 70 milers? Remember, I have no bike experience. Feels like a possible weakness in my training. My single day ride max is currently 40 miles.

2) Do first timers normally pace too fast on the bike? I want to focus on negative splitting the bike and run first time out.

3) How close are stationary bike metrics to a road bike? I did buy a Wahoo unit for the SC but haven't tried it yet. I'm only going to get 8 weeks or so on the bike before raceday.

4) Flat tire. I can’t change one. What happens on race day if it goes flat? Should I have the bike store change out new tube’s and tires for the race?

5) I was told 90rpm is a good goal RPM but given my current stationary riding I’m comfortable a little slower, 83-86, but again its on a Peleton/Gym bike. Any tall guy opinions would be great or what people see.

1)  I have all my 70.3 and 140.6 athletes do multiple race distance rides in the weeks leading up to the race.  For you, if I were your coach, I'd suggest a minimum of 4-6 60-mile+ rides.  That's 4-6 weeks worth of long rides.  Obviously you'll need to build up to that distance over a numer of weeks.  Those rides should be done at a relatively easy, conversational pace - meaning if you had a riding partner you could easily carry on a conversation.  If you are speaking in gasps or incomplete sentences, slow down a bit.

2)  Yup!  So do old-times.  Here's something to remember.  You'll likely show up at the starting line in the best physical shape of your life.  Assuming that's the case, if you have a bad run, it's because you pushed too hard on the bike.  Stated another way, you can't have a good run without having a good ride - a good ride being defined as the bike ride that sets up a good run.  The VAST majority of triathletes do not know how to properly pace the bike.  You can go to ANY long course triathlon and you'll see countless athletes turn in incredicle bike splits, only to end up walking a good portion of the run.  I'd rather see an athlete underpace the bike than over-cook it and sabotage their run.

3) Stationary bikes are not comparable to a road or tri-bike beyond you are pedaling.  I've had athletes that prepared for long-course triathlons using primarily a stationary bike or a spin bike, however you will be better served with time in the saddle of a road bike (or a triathlon bike).  An option is to purchase a trainer and you'd be able to ride your road bike in the comfort of your home - with the added benefit of being able to use virtual power to increase the effectiveness of your training (if you don't have a power meter) through an app like TrainerRoad.com or Zwift.com.  Even if you choose to get a trainer and train at home, you still need to get outdoor saddle time to learn bike handling skills.  I encourage my athletes to ride interval rides during the week indoors on the trainer and long rides on the weekend outdoors.

4)  Learn to repair a flat tire.  I encourage ALL of my athletes to sit down in their living room with a wheel and have them take the tube out, and replace it, over and over and over again, until they can literally do it in the dark with their eyes closed.  You CANNOT count on neutral service being available or timely at any race.  If you can't repair a flat on your own, you could be sitting for a VERY long time.  It isn't hard to do.  If you've never done it, go to your local bike shop and ask them to show you how to do it.  Most LBS' will be only to happy to walk you through the steps.  There are also countless YouTube videos showing the process.  Having new tubes and/or tires is no guarantee you won't flat during a race.  Best defense is learn to repair a flat which means learn how to replace a tube.  You should carry a flat kit on any rides that includes at least one (I carry two) tube, CO2 canisters to refill the tires and a multifunction tool at a minimum.

5) 85-95 is generally considered the cadence sweet spot, however, cadence is highly individual so you may be most comfortable at a different cadence.  Going uphill you will likely find a higher cadence to be a bit easier.  In any case, I suggest you mix up your cadence in training and become comfortable at a wide range of cadences.  I'd also suggest you occasionally do spin-ups to a very high cadence.  As your pedal stroke becomes more fluid you will be able to reach higher cadences and not have your power fall off.

Originally posted by Bjcarls Run Questions:

1) Any correlation to 1/2 marathon time to a 70.3 run split. Many factors I know, week 10 I have a 13.1 event.

2) To help with knee and hip pain I've started to speed up my cadence, with the help of new UA shoes and MapMyRun. I'm currently around 172-174 which I think is another reason knee and hip pain is down. Other ideas?

Well, I hope I didn't waste your time : ) I did search some of this but some of the material is a decade old and some redundant questions might give some background to my thoughts. I want the race to be fun. I'd love feedback even if its simple. I'd do X to help, here's something that helped me..., can I have X info to give better advice. Thanks for reading, BC

1)  This is a direct function of your fitness level and how well you pace the bike.  There really is no way to predict this outside of training.  In trianing, you should be doing occasional brick runs - where you run immediately off of the bike.  You don't have to necessarily do long brick runs, but they should be sufficiently long that you can guage how well you can run - e.g a 60-min race pace ride followed by a 20-minute race pace run.  That will give you a LOT of information and help you determine proper race paces.

2) A higher run cadence requires a shorter stride which will force more of a mid-foot strike - that will help your joints.  You're on the right track.

Hope all of that helps.  Good luck in your race!



2020-02-24 9:31 PM
in reply to: Bjcarls

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Champion
7431
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Placitas, New Mexico
Subject: RE: Longest First Time Post

Welcome!  

I read your long introduction and the long responses.    

Your goals are your goals, so the real question is how important are they?  I'm glad you're putting TIME GOALS out there, and please don't let well meaning people dissuade you from these.  You should anticipate a couple minutes for each transition, especially if the race has a lot of participants.  Based on what you've said, they're not unachievable.  If the goals are important, consider hiring a coach to work with you between now and the race, not just for the physical training, but also to get you mentally prepared for race day.  

A shorter race can give you transition practice, but you can also get this doing brick workouts, i.e. a bike ride immediately after swimming and running immediately after riding.  You don't have to do all 3 successively and the second workout doesn't have to be long.  A 2-3 mile run after the bike ride is sufficient to experience the wobbly legs.  

G1 (General question 1):  Everyone is different, and a coach can optimize your training.  Some say train to your strength, others train to your weakness.  

G3:  For a 5-6 hour race, you'll want nutrition in addition to hydration.  Practice during training and find what works for you.  This allows you to experience nutrition that works and nutrition that doesn't.  Practice some with what the race offers even if you bring your own nutrition.  (I had a friend doing his first IM and he FORGOT his nutrition on the way to the race start so he had to adapt to what the race offered.  

G4:  One-piece or two-piece is a personal preference.  If you can find a one-piece that fits (and by "fit" it doesn't chafe/bind/restrict/sag...)  Most HIM's don't have changing tents, so you'll S-B-R in the same bottoms unless you duck into a port-o-pot (Y-u-c-k) to change.  You might still use a race belt as you may be required to have the number in front on the run and you won't want it there on the bike.  

G6:  Please find a port-o-pot.  You can pee on yourself if you choose.  In most races, nudity (such as peeing on a tree) can get you DQ'd.  

G8:  Depends on the race...they may have open roads and they may not.  I crashed into a sign separating bike traffic from car traffic during my first IM (you can read my race report), so closed roads doesn't always mean "safe."  P.S. I've also seen a lot of carnage right at the bike mount/dismount lines.  

B1 (Bike question 1):  Make your training serve a purpose.  A leisurely 70 mile ride is probably less important than a training specific 50 mile ride.  

B2:  Yes.  

B4:  Learn to fix a flat tire (practice at home).  You might also invest in cut-resistant tires (Conti Gatorskins or Bontrager Hardcases) which is what I do even though I *can* fix a flat.  

B5:  Cadence is a personal preference, and it comes down to how you train.  If you habitually train at 85, race at 85.  If you can train at 90, race at 90.  Higher cadence puts more stress on cardiovascular systems while lower cadence puts more stress on leg muscles.  

R1 (Run question 1):  Not sure the correlation, but how soon is the 13.1 before your 70.3?  If it's less than a month, consider how to "race" the 13.1 so it supports your 70.3 goals.  Killing a 13.1 2 weeks before your 70.3 is a sure way to go into the race fatigued and less likely to hit your goal.  This assumes the 70.3 is your "A" or absolutely most important race...

 

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