Trouble with Teens

Since you can't change them, try changing your attitude and approach. Adopt a sense of humor. Show some compassion for what they are going through - growing into their bodies, trying to figure out who they are, learning to live with their mistakes. They are going to be a pain in the butt for several more years so you might as well break out the popcorn and enjoy the show.

As far as getting their chores done, treat them as if they are already adults. Don't nag them. Instead, create agreements with them and hold them to their word. Don't lose your cool (that right there will throw them). By this time of their lives, they have developed very strong defenses against nagging so you need to give up that approach. I find this always works well with my stubborn nephews: "I'm confused. We have an agreement and you're not holding up your end of the bargain. All I'm asking is that you live up to your word." They will do their skillful feint and dodge but I don't chase that which throws them off. I also don't raise my voice; stay cool - it confuses them. Also, they have developed very fine tuned button-pushing skills, so have a look at your buttons and figure out which ones you can live without.

I'd ask you to re-read Renee's post very carefully and see if you can't adopt some of the ideas she suggests.  I can't comment directly as my story relates to my 9-year old son.  We were tearing our hair out until taking on similar advice from a professional that Renee just gave you for free.

You have a cool, rational conversation about expectations.  You question ONCE if they are not done and you question in a cool and rational manner.  No drama.  And, most importantly, walk away, ignore ALL THE DRAMA, discussion, verbal and non-verbal cues that make your blood boil and get you into a humongous discussion.  Let 'em say I hate you and I hate my life or whatever else.  It's all to get a rise out of you, which they feed on at some level.  Doesn't get done, later, ask a SECOND TIME, in the same manner.  Third time, "since you weren't able to do as promised, I'll have to take away zzz" and again, walk away and ignore all the peripheral crap. 

Conversely, when the DO the stuff, especially initially, big thanks and smiles from you.  THAT's how they get their internal pay from you from then on.

Again, Renee may have described it better, but it worked like a CHARM, especially with my wife and son, as they'd engage in these battles with each other over everything.  Say what you want and then dis-engage.

When my sister and I were horrible teens, my Mom would tell us, "I hope God gives you kids just like you." She believes in Karmic retribution a lot more than the average Catholic, I guess.

Anyhow, maybe you're being punished for what you did to your parents when you were a teen? (I know, not helpful. But welcome to COJ!)

Heh. My mom used to say that to me! I'd mutter under my breath "God, I hope so" then she'd snap "What did you say?" and of course I'd say "Nuttin."

My kids aren't teens yet but I've been a volunteer leader/mentor with teens for more than a decade, so I think I can speak with some experience on this. 

Sounds like you have a couple of overall pretty well-behaved teenagers who (a) like to  play the mom vs dad game and (b) need to learn the connection between responsibility and money.

Don't have any specific advice for (a) except stick to your guns and put the nagging on ignore, but I do have some advice for (b): Make the money a function of their ability to follow the policies of the house. Make a chart and put it on the fridge. Chores complete = money to go to the mall. Chores incomplete = less or no money. Keep your wallet on you to prevent their temptation to sneak money from it. They will catch on fast - teenagers are smart that way

Just wanted to comment specifically on this - please don't give in to the temptation to phone it in. Teens need the role model of a dad who can stick to his principles. It might seem like you are being a hardash sometimes but they will respect (and love) you for it in the long run.

Hmm Some good stuff - here thanks for letting me vent -  Renee - will try that but need to get all 4 parents on line if bahaviors gonna change...

 Tony - Thx for the laughs! I needed them!

Actually, you don't need all four. If you talk with your spouse about changing your way of dealing with them at your house, and stick to it, you will see results. They will have to have a different response to your new behavior, because their old response won't work anymore. They are fully capable of following different rules at different houses.

Get their input on the chores so you can say, "You agreed this was fair and you would do it..."

Then put the schedule on the fridge or whatever.

When the X comes back on you, "They agreed that they would do Y, and they haven't. You need to talk to them about why they don't feel they need to honor agreements." This way everyone is responsible for only their own part.

No kids myself, but I totally played this game as a teen and then as young adult at home from college temporarily. And got the following lecture from Mom and stepdad on a couple occasions: "You are a part of this household and you get the following benefits... In return for this and for being part of a family, you need to do your part. Your part includes.... We love you, but you are not doing your part. This is a problem because it causes everyone a lot of stress and needs to be solved." 

At the teen stage, asking what it is that makes it hard for them to do whatever it is that you are most concerned about. That will help them think about what really is hard to do about it and give their own suggestions on how to solve it for themselves.

At the young adult stage, the "you can move out" option can be offered. You're not there yet.

As a side comment - my Dad's rules were different than my mom's. I had no chores there and little participation in other areas of the household. One result is that I have never felt much of a part of his life/family. 

Grit your teeth and pick your battles. This too shall pass.

I have two boys... pretty much same story.    Ages 11 and 14.

It took a rude awakening for me to realize I was giving them the wrong attitude myself (See Renee's post).  Made me take a long hard look at myself and realize I was going about it all wrong.   Yelling, nagging, spiting, demeaning, blah, blah and I didn't even know what I was doing.  Maybe cause my daddy was the same way? 

Well, now, that's all changed, we have a happier household, stuff is getting done without argument,  rules are being followed.

The only exception is they always act like a pair of monkeys in the car.   sheesh......    

Ditto Renee's advice, and add my own "happy memory of the day":

When I was ... 16? 17 maybe? I was doing something annoying and my dad took me aside and said "Look. We are your family and we will always love you. Always. That is a given and a constant. However, we may not always like you. We WANT to like you, we usually do, but when you do stuff like x (or y. or z), it makes it harder and harder. Please don't make it hard for me to like you"

I still remember that. It was a good lesson. In fact, I uttered that to a boyfriend in a past relationship when we were fighting "I may love you but DAMN you're making it hard for me to like you right now!". Heh.

FWIW, my sister had a lot of trouble with her daughter and now that she is 19 they get along great.

I believe it is our biological imperative to be extremely annoying during our teen years so that our parents throw us out of the nest. Otherwise, we might never leave.

all great posts!! Thanks for the feedback

 I dunno though...I figured out early how to work the system, - yea I was smoking, drinking, cussing, fornicating 15 year old, who did all his chores, got good grades and was home on time. heck i used to hoep fro rain or snow so I couldmow the lawn and shovel the driveway without being asked cuz I knew i was banking credits for future use...

I even told me kids that!  - well minus the snmoking/drinking/fornicating they still don't get it.

No kids, but I'll tell you what a guy at my office did, and it worked! He sat his 2 boys down and said, by law he had to give them a place to sleep, clothes to wear, and food to eat. But nothing more. So each time they didn't do what they were supposed to, he'd remove something. Didn't make their bed? Pillow is gone. Next time, the blanket, then the sheet, until all that was left was the mattress.

Then the clothes. By the time the kids got the message they were down to a couple of pairs of underwear, white t-shirts, and one pair of jeans.

One made the mistake of slamming his bedroom door. 5 minutes later, Dad was removing the door from the hinge.

It only took a couple of weeks of this before the boys were on the straight and narrow. Now both are college graduates and productive members of society!

Of course, mileage will vary. 

I had two boys and they could be difficult at times, but I'll echo some of the other suggestions.  Spend time with them, even if it means doing stuff you don't like or they act in a way that you don't agree with.  Be flexible, be firm, and be loving.  They will do OK.  Both mine ended up graduating as Valedictorians of their respective class.  Above all, don't cash it in!

OK...MarkK and I DO have teenagers, twin 15 y/o girls and a 12 y/o girl...I feel your pain. 

Although the "keep your cool" advice is excellent, PLEASE don't beat yourself up if you can't do it. It's HARD!  And being separated from the other parent doesn't help.   If you have a "button pusher" like I do...staying calm is sometimes an impossible goal. Also, I think kids need to know that when they intentionally push someone's buttons, they have to accept the consequences of doing that.

My biggest piece of advice, though, is that you will get what you give.  Give respect, you'll get it.  Maybe not today or tomorrow, but eventually.  Show your kids that you care about thier opinions, even if you don't agree with those opinions. Treat them like the intelligent, beautiful young women that I'm sure they are.   Having high expectations is great, but they need to know that you are confident they can achieve them, and that you're ALWAYS there to back them up. 

Chores...well, we fight with this one too. Simply put, they don't go anywhere if chores aren't done.  They have the same chores they have always had, same schedule for years, it's on the fridge so nobody can say "I didn't know".  That being said, we will bend the rules for reasonable requests...for example, when Casey was in marching band practice for 12+ hours/day, we suspended her chore duties.  Now that marching band is over, if I need help, I go to her.   I find that if I show my kids that I care about thier priorities, they are more likely to cooperate with mine.

 I could go on for a long time, but one other thing...respect your children's friends.  Teenager's friends are all important, criticize your child's friends and you are criticizing your child.    This next thing isn't for everyone, but we have a pretty open household.  Thier friends are welcome to come and go quite a bit...and I get the joy of knowing thier friends, and knowing where my kids are

 I hope that I don't sound preachy.  I"m not a perfect parent, no where near it.  I"ve had plenty of days when I've sent my kids - one daughter in particular - off to school, only to sit down and cry in frustration.  (As some on this board know! )   My daughters ARE NOT angels, and this summer has been particularly trying.  But what I said above is how we're getting through the rough spots

Good luck to you!