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Dealer service vs. Generic Auto Repair
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 2009-02-09 12:00 PM |
Expert  1244    New York |  Subject: Dealer service vs. Generic Auto RepairMy fabulous little 1999 Honda Civic has had its check engine light on for a while now--the oxygen sensor is kaput. The dealer, who I go to all the time for service, being the brand-loyal customer that I am (also, I bought my car there and they give me 10% off all service) and is generally awesome, has told me it'll cost in the neighborhood of *gulp* $475 for parts and labor. Blah. Being funemployed right now (what recession?) it's a bit steep for me, even with the *incredible* 10% discount.  So I called Midas, who says they could just replace one of the sensors (pre or post catalytic converter, don't ask me what that means, I just understand there are two sensors and I could choose to just replace the one that's actually broken, though the other might also go at any time as well) for anywhere from $97 - $167 for the part, and $93 for the labor. Like I said, I'm loyal to the dealer because they've taken good care of me in the past. The pricetag is killing me, but I'm also afraid to use a generic auto repair place, since I've never done that before and am imagining horror stories of being ripped off and the car not being fixed properly. Anyone have experience with this kind of thing and advice on which way to go? |
| 2009-02-09 12:08 PM in reply to: #1952674 |
Champion 14571   the alamo city, Texas | Subject: RE: Dealer service vs. Generic Auto Repair i would ask around friends/neighbors, who they go to, then call THOSE places and say "friend/neighbor SO AND SO recommended you, what would this work cost?" if you are worried about reputation, people you trust probably don't bring their car to sketchy guys.
i use meineke/jiffy lube/midas all the time for car stuff and have never had a problem, but neighborhood mechanics are often even cheaper and just cooler to deal with. |
| 2009-02-09 12:25 PM in reply to: #1952674 |
Slower Than You 9566 Cracklantaburbs | Subject: RE: Dealer service vs. Generic Auto Repair First things first - just because it's giving you the "oxygen sensor" code doesn't necessarily mean the sensor is gone. Something is wrong that is causing the computer to give you that code. It could be a vacuum leak causing the engine to run rich, catalytic converter getting plugged, etc. Finding a good mechanic to properly diagnose the problem is the first step. No need to replace the sensor, only to get the code again in a couple weeks. Second, if your car is not under warranty, the LAST place you want to take it is to a dealer. You will come out of there with a very sore rear end (if you get my drift). Finding a reputable, local independent Honda mechanic (YES THEY DO EXIST) will be worth its weight in gold. Check a couple Honda forums in the regional sections. Don't be afraid to ask questions. Ask for a recommendation. You might be surprised how many techs and mechanics are onthe forums. Third, oxygen sensors are kinda pricey if you get them from a place like Midas, and that $39 quote for labor is ridiculous. The sensors are usually in very easy-to-reach places and take about 5 minutes to remove/replace. Let me know if you need any help. Edited by bcart1991 2009-02-09 12:28 PM |
| 2009-02-09 12:30 PM in reply to: #1952733 |
Slower Than You 9566 Cracklantaburbs | Subject: RE: Dealer service vs. Generic Auto Repair Oh, I would not let Jiffy Lube touch my car with a ten-foot pole. I've heard way too many horror stories of ruined engines due to plain ignorance and negligence. |
| 2009-02-09 12:38 PM in reply to: #1952700 |
Elite 3371 | Subject: RE: Dealer service vs. Generic Auto Repair meherczeg - 2009-02-09 1:08 PM i would ask around friends/neighbors, who they go to, then call THOSE places and say "friend/neighbor SO AND SO recommended you, what would this work cost?" if you are worried about reputation, people you trust probably don't bring their car to sketchy guys.
i use meineke/jiffy lube/midas all the time for car stuff and have never had a problem, but neighborhood mechanics are often even cheaper and just cooler to deal with. x2 on everything. My car broke down once and I had to get it towed. It was an independant towing service. All he did was tow, no mechanics involved. I asked him where he takes his vehicles. I was refered to a (scary looking) little shop. BUT...they do great work for decent prices. And the best part, they don't feed me BS to get me to pay to "fix" stuff that isn't needed. |
| 2009-02-09 12:38 PM in reply to: #1952674 |
| Extreme Veteran 562 | Subject: RE: Dealer service vs. Generic Auto Repair Find a good local mechanic. |
| 2009-02-09 12:41 PM in reply to: #1952743 |
Champion 14571 the alamo city, Texas | Subject: RE: Dealer service vs. Generic Auto Repair bcart1991 - 2009-02-09 1:30 PM Oh, I would not let Jiffy Lube touch my car with a ten-foot pole. I've heard way too many horror stories of ruined engines due to plain ignorance and negligence. the only thing jiffy lube does is oil change and tire rotations. well, not anymore because there are much cheaper places for these things and once i dropped off my car and the guy couldn't drive a standard. sorry, can't trust a mechanic that can't drive my vehicle. |
 2009-02-09 12:56 PM in reply to: #1952768 |
| Subject: ... This user's post has been ignored. |
| 2009-02-09 1:04 PM in reply to: #1952674 |
| Expert 1244 New York | Subject: RE: Dealer service vs. Generic Auto Repair I *really* hate playing the helpless damsel here, but I have to admit I don't really know what to look for in a "good local mechanic." There are some rinky dink lookin' places around this area that I could stop in and check out, but I wouldn't even know where to begin or what to ask besides price. I've tried my darndest to understand why I need to have my oxygen sensor replaced and to understand why/how/whether both need replacing or just one. I've done a lot of research online and calling around to places like Midas and Meineke to get quotes. (I'm also bringing the car to the dealer tomorrow for an oil change, because it's inexpensive at the dealer's, so I'll ask about the exact computer code that the engine is generating). I've looked on a few Honda forums, but not much by way of "good local mechanic" on those sites. Should the mechanic be specifically trained as a Honda mechanic, or will just any good car repair person do (whatever that means--"So...are you good with repairing oxygen sensors...?"). |
| 2009-02-09 1:04 PM in reply to: #1952826 |
| Mountain View, CA | Subject: RE: Dealer service vs. Generic Auto Repair AcesFull - 2009-02-09 10:56 AM randym - 2009-02-09 12:38 PM Find a good local mechanic. x 1,000,000 Build a good relationship with a local mechanic (like you would with your LBS). Good guys know that if they treat you right and develop a relationship they will make more $$ in the long run. Dealers are for warranty repairs only... unless you hate money, then you should use the dealer every time. x2. Get some recommendations, find a shop you trust, and build a relationship with them. The one time I got a repair done at a dealership around here was when my usual guy couldn't get the part for a few days, and the dealership had the part in stock. I told them what the independent mechanic was going to charge for it, and they matched the price. |
| 2009-02-09 1:45 PM in reply to: #1952674 |
| Champion 4942 Richmond, VA | Subject: RE: Dealer service vs. Generic Auto Repair just put some tape over the check engine light
the trick to finding a good mechanic is word of mouth - ask everyone you know with a car no longer under warranty. |
| 2009-02-09 2:35 PM in reply to: #1952843 |
| Champion 14571 the alamo city, Texas | Subject: RE: Dealer service vs. Generic Auto Repair swishyskirt - 2009-02-09 2:04 PM I *really* hate playing the helpless damsel here, but I have to admit I don't really know what to look for in a "good local mechanic." There are some rinky dink lookin' places around this area that I could stop in and check out, but I wouldn't even know where to begin or what to ask besides price. I've tried my darndest to understand why I need to have my oxygen sensor replaced and to understand why/how/whether both need replacing or just one. I've done a lot of research online and calling around to places like Midas and Meineke to get quotes. (I'm also bringing the car to the dealer tomorrow for an oil change, because it's inexpensive at the dealer's, so I'll ask about the exact computer code that the engine is generating). I've looked on a few Honda forums, but not much by way of "good local mechanic" on those sites. Should the mechanic be specifically trained as a Honda mechanic, or will just any good car repair person do (whatever that means--"So...are you good with repairing oxygen sensors...?"  .you ask your friends/coworkers/neighbors. the same way you look for a hairstylist, the same way you look for a gyno, the same way you find ANY service provider. get recommendations from people you trust. |
| 2009-02-09 5:31 PM in reply to: #1952674 |
| Pro 4339 Husker Nation | Subject: RE: Dealer service vs. Generic Auto Repair Here's a way to check if it's the o2 sensor - if your car is getting terrible mileage [or considerably worse than normal] or if it is running sluggishly, then you probably need a new oxygen sensor. What it does is measures the composition of the exhaust fumes and adjusts the air/fuel mixture accordingly. If it gets skunked up [which they have a tendency to do - they're in the exhaust after all] then it could get a false reading, causing your car to run too "rich" [using more gas than it needs to go put-put]. Using too much gas = sluggish car and bad mileage, but ultimately causes carbon to build up in the engine cylinders and definitely ruin your engine if left to go on too long. The reason there are two o2 sensors is because of the Environmental Protection Agency and emissions standards for automobiles. The one before the catalytic converter does what I said above. The one after the cat measures how well the catalytic converter is working. If the catalytic converter wasn't working like it should you should smell a terrible smell when the car is idling [the exhaust fumes lingering around]. Normal exhaust smell means the cat is fine. I found a good shop by asking a great source - my realtor friend. Since realtors drive their little butts off taking every potential buyer to every potential home, they're a prime source of mechanic referrals! Hope everything works out okay for you. |
| 2009-02-09 5:33 PM in reply to: #1952674 |
| Subject: RE: Dealer service vs. Generic Auto Repair Just be happy you don't live in California where they just banned after market emissions equipment (HAVE to buy from the dealer.... now who do you think was behind that law????), AND two of your sensors didn't go (actually, resonators for me, whatever those are) over $2K, thank you very much |
| 2009-02-09 5:41 PM in reply to: #1953373 |
| Expert 1244 New York | Subject: RE: Dealer service vs. Generic Auto Repair Bripod - 2009-02-09 6:31 PM Here's a way to check if it's the o2 sensor - if your car is getting terrible mileage [or considerably worse than normal] or if it is running sluggishly, then you probably need a new oxygen sensor. What it does is measures the composition of the exhaust fumes and adjusts the air/fuel mixture accordingly. If it gets skunked up [which they have a tendency to do - they're in the exhaust after all] then it could get a false reading, causing your car to run too "rich" [using more gas than it needs to go put-put]. Using too much gas = sluggish car and bad mileage, but ultimately causes carbon to build up in the engine cylinders and definitely ruin your engine if left to go on too long. The reason there are two o2 sensors is because of the Environmental Protection Agency and emissions standards for automobiles. The one before the catalytic converter does what I said above. The one after the cat measures how well the catalytic converter is working. If the catalytic converter wasn't working like it should you should smell a terrible smell when the car is idling [the exhaust fumes lingering around]. Normal exhaust smell means the cat is fine. I found a good shop by asking a great source - my realtor friend. Since realtors drive their little butts off taking every potential buyer to every potential home, they're a prime source of mechanic referrals! Hope everything works out okay for you. Yeah, I've done a little digging online since the light first came on (cough cough) last year. There hasn't really been any change at all that I can tell in how the car is functioning, although I did read recently that funky idling was a symptom, and I have noticed the car being a little shakey in that area. Other than that, my little gas sipper runs just fine. So, technically, I don't think I need to get it fixed, except I've read the occasional article that says if you don't get it fixed after a while, it can murder the engine by backfiring or something not fun like that. I will ask around and see what everyone thinks. So far, one opinion has been to go to one of the generic places, but insist that they use a certified Honda part, that actually replacing the O2 sensor itself is not highly technical or involved, so there shouldn't be a real issue with not going to the dealer except for the quality of the part. Sound like sound advice? |
| 2009-02-09 5:43 PM in reply to: #1953377 |
| Expert 1244 New York | Subject: RE: Dealer service vs. Generic Auto Repair ChrisM - 2009-02-09 6:33 PM Just be happy you don't live in California where they just banned after market emissions equipment (HAVE to buy from the dealer.... now who do you think was behind that law????), AND two of your sensors didn't go (actually, resonators for me, whatever those are) over $2K, thank you very much Funny...when I called Meineke for a quote, they asked me to see if the engine said "California emissions" or "Federal emissions" on it (I couldn't find either one, but the dude said it made a difference...) |
| 2009-02-09 5:45 PM in reply to: #1953392 |
| Pro 4339 Husker Nation | Subject: RE: Dealer service vs. Generic Auto Repair swishyskirt - 2009-02-09 5:41 PM Yeah, I've done a little digging online since the light first came on (cough cough) last year. There hasn't really been any change at all that I can tell in how the car is functioning, although I did read recently that funky idling was a symptom, and I have noticed the car being a little shakey in that area. Other than that, my little gas sipper runs just fine. So, technically, I don't think I need to get it fixed, except I've read the occasional article that says if you don't get it fixed after a while, it can murder the engine by backfiring or something not fun like that. I will ask around and see what everyone thinks. So far, one opinion has been to go to one of the generic places, but insist that they use a certified Honda part, that actually replacing the O2 sensor itself is not highly technical or involved, so there shouldn't be a real issue with not going to the dealer except for the quality of the part. Sound like sound advice? Sounds good to me. The sensor is basically inserted into the exhaust pipe much like a meat thermometer into a roast and tightened into place, so the only issue with removal/installation is it can be kinda rusty down there and be a pain to get the old one off - I like to do a lot of my own auto repairs but that is one of the few things I'd leave up to the professionals. |
| 2009-02-09 5:46 PM in reply to: #1953377 |
| Pro 4339 Husker Nation | Subject: RE: Dealer service vs. Generic Auto Repair ChrisM - 2009-02-09 5:33 PM Just be happy you don't live in California where they just banned after market emissions equipment (HAVE to buy from the dealer.... now who do you think was behind that law????), AND two of your sensors didn't go (actually, resonators for me, whatever those are) over $2K, thank you very much oh wow.. that's a pretty penny. A resonator is just a pre-muffler muffler. They aid in further quieting the exhaust noise. Some of them have the catalytic converter built-in, I wonder if your particular model had that? We had to get a resonator replaced on our 1996 Acura Integra and it ran, I wanna say, about $300 +/- parts & labor. |
| 2009-02-09 8:22 PM in reply to: #1952674 |
| Extreme Veteran 591 New Port Richey, FL | Subject: RE: Dealer service vs. Generic Auto Repair |
| 2009-02-10 9:14 AM in reply to: #1952674 |
Veteran 264 Wilmington, NC Gold member | Subject: RE: Dealer service vs. Generic Auto Repair I would echo that your best bet is to ask around and see where your friends and co-workers take their cars for service. Any shop that does Japanese imports should be able to take care of the problem for you. Driving with a bad O2 sensor can cause more expensive problems if left undone, catalytic converter failure would be about the worst case scenario. Here in NC the car would also fail a state inspection with the check engine light on. If you decide to get the part from someone other than the dealer I would recomend using the origional part manufacturer, Nippondenso, other than a generic brand. Honda's and Toyota's seem to be a bit more sensetive to some brands of aftermarket parts. |
| 2009-02-10 10:56 AM in reply to: #1952674 |
| Extreme Veteran 385 shenandoah valley | Subject: RE: Dealer service vs. Generic Auto Repair Swishy, For your car, an Oxygen Sensor should be around the price quoted by Midas. I'm guessing the $93 is their hourly charge. A sensor swap doesn't take an hour to complete but they'll charge for the hour anyway. The $475 charge by the dealership is WAY overpriced. Ask anyone you meet that has a Honda where they get their car serviced and if they would recommend them. |
| 2009-02-10 4:42 PM in reply to: #1952674 |
| Elite 3650 Laurium, MI | Subject: RE: Dealer service vs. Generic Auto Repair I will agree with the notions about avoiding chains. Check out this site: http://locator.ase.com/blue/ It is a database of all ase certified repair shops. These are the places you need to be calling and talking to. |
| 2009-02-12 11:53 AM in reply to: #1952674 |
| Champion 16151 Checkin' out the podium girls | Subject: RE: Dealer service vs. Generic Auto Repair If you want confirmation that it IS the O2 sensor (or any engine light problem), Auto Zone will plug into the diagnostics and read the codes for free. They're hoping you'll buy the part from them, but don't need to. Good to rule in / out which component is acting up. |
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