So outraged I had to say something...

I would take this up directly with the big guy.

Sounds like a good reason to bring the subject up with your kids. Let them know your views, tell them the movie reflected a different view, and explain that other people have still different views....but hey, the butterflies were cool, huh?

There are "more better" things to get wound up about.....and "outraged"???.....I don't know if  I've ever been outraged. 

I'm glad you can see my point...I wish you could have seen/heard the dvd.  To say it was inappropriate is an understatement.  I guess I hold national wildlife refuges to a higher standard.  I expect science to be emphasized...not creationism.  What makes me most upset is that it was targeted at children.  Kids are sponges.  Heck, I get upset when marketers peddle garbage food to children...I can deal with that though as I can ensure as a responsible parent I am limiting exposure and help to explain what the marketers are up to. 

I find it hard to believe she could not find non-creationist media to show at this presentation.  She said she viewed the dvd beforehand and didn't think it would be a problem.  Would she have said the same if each reference to "The Father" "was substituted with "Allah?"  The presenter taught in the public school system for 30 years...she should know better in my opinion.

I always do make lemonade out of lemons.    We talked about science, religions, (including an amusing discussion involving an ancient ark that must have been absolutely gigantic!)...but I digress.  

I just found it interesting when she apologized for me being offended...but the thing is, I'm not offended...I was truly shocked.  

btw, my kids had no clue what my actual discussions were about.  I was polite and discreet.  btw, my wife pointed out that's the 2nd time I've been questioned for using the word "outraged" here at CoJ.  Outrage over extreme eyelash extensions was me being silly...this just seemed important to me.  Should intelligent design/creationism be taught to impressionable little kids in a federally funded wildlife refuge?  I really don't think so. 

That is funny stuff.  Good post.  

But, if you really examine that pic, you'll see a couple of things:  1: they do not like Israel, never have.  2:  apparently, they do not hate all of the United States, just 12 of them. (see the stars?)  Whether their hatred is aimed at blue states or red states, I'll save that for another thread.  

 Outstanding!!!

Would you have felt better if the DVD had an evolutionist tone?  Someone would have been bent out of shape about that too.  After 52 years I can't say which is right or wrong.....guess I'll just have to wait and see. I keep looking, but both sides have problems.

Ya see, when I said I take lemons and make lemonade I wasn't kidding!  Most folks see that flag-burner as a man who hates America...I see a guy who believes 76% of our country's states DON'T deserve to have their stars burned!  

As for what would I do if an imam popped in a dvd that taught the children the monarch butterfly was a "gift of Allah's grace," (over and over) I'd have had the same reaction...guaranteed.

Yo Claaaw, very interesting perspective.  I can totally see how more fundamentalist Christians would be more angry with you than an atheist/agnostic.  It's probably similar to what happens in families...I guess religions are a type of "family" in a way.  Who ends up killing whom most often?  Family members.  Inner-city killings give us "black on black" crime.  Islam has its apostates.  It's all apostasy in one form or another.  

Good question LB.  At the elementary school age level, no "tone" was necessary.  That said though, why not let the kids know what the earliest known butterfly fossils are dated to?  By mentioning the earliest fossil records of butterflies are dated at 40 to 50 million years ago, that's factual.  It's proven.  For a creationist dvd to tell me and all those kids that the majestic father's wisdom created butterflies at the same time as all other earthly creatures is horse-puckey.    

Unfortunately, yes, many will condense it down to "Creationism vs. Evolution."  (I find that a silly battle because one has mountains upon mountains of physical evidence in multiple scientific disciplines that has new discoveries occurring on a weekly basis...the other has words written down on paper or tablets with thousands upon thousands of different versions and interpretations with no scientific support)...hmm, I think I know which one I'd bet on if forced to...but here's the thing, it shouldn't come down to "one or the other."  God and evolution are not mutually exclusive...unless of course you are a fundamentalist and believe in a word-for-word translation of your chosen holy text.

Science is science.  Fossil records are fossil records.  Carbon dating works..."young-earth" creationists have as much credibility as those who believe the Earth to be flat.   

So LB, to fully answer your hypothetical...if the "evolutionist" tone was one merely stating facts, how would that be controversial?  It's been mentioned in COJ before, this war on science...we're stunting our nation's future with so many clinging to outdated fundamentalist messages.  Lay the facts out for the children.  Keep science about facts...save religion for philosophy class.  Just my 2 cents.  

Despite the mountains of evidence from many scientific disciplines supporting just that?  Despite the fact science can give you the age of the universe itself?  

Yes ma'am.

We're the fam that's at the library events, park events, etc.  Usually, it's wonderful stuff.  The last community program we attended at the wildlife refuge was amazing.  Owls, snakes, you name it!  Experts were on hand to answer all our questions...we could get up close and personal with the animals, just great stuff.   ...then, there was today's dvd.  I've seen snippets of Davey and Goliath episodes that had less religious slant.  I was checking the sleeve to see if it was Kirk Cameron-approved!  

Belief in a higher power and evolution are not mutually exclusive.  Creationism does not necessarily mean things were formed in their current state in 6 days, 6000 (or whatever it is) years ago.

If you read my post, I stated your 1st sentence already.  Granted, they are long posts, but the information is in there.  I stated:

Your 2nd sentence I'm having trouble understanding.  Are you saying some Creationists believe the higher power "created" different species at different times?  I can see some folks believing that...but when you say "formed in their current state" are you not implying today some species are in evolved states?  

I take it the "local national wildlife refuge here in Delaware" is a secular, non-religious, science-based company.  I've been in business a long time and can tell you that either that DVD was a personal choice by the presenter and was not screened or approved by that person's supervisor, or it was approved.

In the first case, the presenter should be fired.  Companies, businesses and organizations do not like controversy unless they take a specific public stance approved by their board.  Christian prayers before kids' games at the local YMCA, Chik Fil-A not being open on Sunday... perfectly fine.  I've even defended my local Y when they play Christian rock in the gym.  A person complained, saying it wasn't right and I said it was the ymCa.  Get used to it.  Their Christian mission is written all over the walls.

If the presentation was approved by a supervisor, that person should be fired as I would bet good money that executive leadership and the board would not approve.  Certainly not at a local science center.  Pretty ironic... "science" center if they show a video saying that insects were created at the same time as plant life!

I would feel misled and duped to have my children be fed such "intelligent design" BS when I never would image it to be so in that presentation.  I agree and support your actions and think you're doing the right thing.

And one other thing...

If you're shopping for nature videos, it's no accident that you purchase from a company like Crowes Nest Media.  Just check out their "About" page!

http://www.crowesnestmedia.com/pages/About.html

If I were in charge or on the board of that science center and I found our money was spent in this way - there would be pink slips.

Stupid question - I thought intelligent design meant evolution (as in SCIENCE) by design?  My thought on the matter is that without both, one wouldn't have the choice in what to believe.  Defeats the purpose of free will. (But that's another post entirely - hope I haven't offended anyone.)

And, I understand.  I'm currently teaching my kids that people believe different things than we do, but that it's okay, and that it doesn't mean that they're wrong.

My sister is teaching her kids that tattoos are bad, and make someone a sinner, damned to hell. She told me I shouldn't be surprised when her kids start criticizing me (which she seemed okay with).  I told her I'm currently contemplating my sixth tattoo (which I am).

I know my post isn't helpful.  But I understand how you feel and wanted to chime in.