3 dead in mall shooting in Oregon

Champion

16151

Checkin' out the podium girls

Subject: RE: 3 dead in mall shooting in Oregon

tuwood - 2012-12-13 1:49 PM

ejshowers - 2012-12-13 12:06 PM

tuwood - 2012-12-13 11:19 AM

gr33n - 2012-12-13 10:13 AM

True story. I admitedly know very little about guns. I think most people that own one act responsibly. I have no strong feelings about them although probably fall a little more against then pro except when it come to random acts of violence that involve guns and then I have very strong feelings.

As I'm sitting here reading all this debate yesterday and finding it all pretty interesting, my wife calls in a panic. She had just gotten home and our house had been broken into. I fly home and the place was a disaster of a mess. Stuff broken and closets emptied and stuff scattered all over. The guy took some small cash that was laying around and barely anything else. Thank god no one was home at the time. My first thought after that was oh my god, I gotta get a gun.

Here's the question. Its a serious question so please serious answers if anyone chooses. If one wants a gun for home self defense why choose a gun and not something like a taser ?

Sorry to hear about the burglary and glad everyone's safe.

The taser route is certainly an option, but it's obviously an up close and personal device. If a 6'2" bad guy with a heavy leather coat on comes running at you, there's a high likelihood that your taser will be completely infective and you won't be able to even get in contact with his skin. Plus, he may even rip it out of your hand and use it on you.

So, as the others have said, it's a force with force type of thing. Rule number one of a gun fight is to bring a gun. If the bad guy only brings a knife to the gun fight then it's advantage you.

My business partner has a son whose graduating college soon. He had somebody break into his apartment and held a gun to his head for a good 10 minutes as he marched him around gathering all his valuables. He was a big time anti gun guy and didn't see why anyone needed to own a gun. Shortly after that encounter he went out and took a gun safety class, got his permit and now owns a gun. It's amazing what violent crime does to ones thoughts on gun ownership.

I don't understand how having a gun would have helped the college kid - unless the gun was loaded without a trigger lock and either on his person or sitting out handy or in an unlocked drawer or something - which goes against all the "rules" of responsible gun ownership. Just last week a 4 year old here in Mpls shot his 2 year old brother in the head killing him after finding daddy's gun - that he had bought and kept handy to protect the family - in the nightstand.

If my gun is locked in a gun safe with trigger locks on and my ammunition is locked away somewhere else, how can I possibly USE my gun to protect my family if someones breaks in?

I skipped over the first part of the story. The guy started beating on their door in the evening and eventually broke through the door forcing his way in. He was apparently trying to break into some rival drug dealers house to steal his drugs and had the wrong address. My buddy's son was home with his roommate and scrambling around the apartment trying to find something to defend himself with while he was calling the police. He found a bat, but as soon as the guy broke through the door with a gun he was forced to drop the bat and hang up the cellphone call prior to getting through to the police. Then the rest of the story went on from there.

In hindsight had he had a gun there's no telling what the outcome would have been. He did make it out alive without one, but only because the PO'd drug dealer decided to let him live. He has some serious psychological scars from the event though.

I don't understand. He has time to find a bat, but not to dial 911 send? You don't even really have to talk to the operator, the dispatch would send someone.

Sorry, I just know far more people who died tragically from the family's gun (n=3) than a perpetrator's or have ever even pulled one on a criminal. In my experience, having a gun has been far more deadly to the owner's family.

My Race Log

Elite

6387

Subject: RE: 3 dead in mall shooting in Oregon

NXS - 2012-12-13 3:28 PM Never said that. Do you tell your patients to lock up their prescription meds? More people die everyday in the U.S. from presciption meds than from guns.

It is a public safety/health problem I do not see why it is so easy for me to get deadly substances. Anywhere I go Doctors give the stuff away like candy... then they insist when I refuse. It's ridiculous. Now with all the kids having "pharm" parties.. perhaps we should require medicine safes in everyone's house to protect people from them selves.

My Race Log

Expert

3126

Boise, ID

Subject: RE: 3 dead in mall shooting in Oregon

powerman - 2012-12-13 3:40 PM

NXS - 2012-12-13 3:28 PM Never said that. Do you tell your patients to lock up their prescription meds? More people die everyday in the U.S. from presciption meds than from guns.

It is a public safety/health problem I do not see why it is so easy for me to get deadly substances. Anywhere I go Doctors give the stuff away like candy... then they insist when I refuse. It's ridiculous. Now with all the kids having "pharm" parties.. perhaps we should require medicine safes in everyone's house to protect people from them selves.

Of course, anyone with any sort of medicine in their house is irresponsible if they don't have it in a safe. What if someone with small kids came over.

Or what about kitchen knives? Those should definitely be locked in a safe too, don't want kids getting to those.

Seriously these arguments are ridiculous. Also the judgments are getting a bit old. Do what you want in your house, I'll do what I want in mine. Oh and no kids have died in my house as of late, guess I am okay.

My Race Log

Pro

9391

Omaha, NE

Subject: RE: 3 dead in mall shooting in Oregon

pitt83 - 2012-12-13 4:38 PM

tuwood - 2012-12-13 1:49 PM

ejshowers - 2012-12-13 12:06 PM

tuwood - 2012-12-13 11:19 AM

gr33n - 2012-12-13 10:13 AM

True story. I admitedly know very little about guns. I think most people that own one act responsibly. I have no strong feelings about them although probably fall a little more against then pro except when it come to random acts of violence that involve guns and then I have very strong feelings.

As I'm sitting here reading all this debate yesterday and finding it all pretty interesting, my wife calls in a panic. She had just gotten home and our house had been broken into. I fly home and the place was a disaster of a mess. Stuff broken and closets emptied and stuff scattered all over. The guy took some small cash that was laying around and barely anything else. Thank god no one was home at the time. My first thought after that was oh my god, I gotta get a gun.

Here's the question. Its a serious question so please serious answers if anyone chooses. If one wants a gun for home self defense why choose a gun and not something like a taser ?

Sorry to hear about the burglary and glad everyone's safe.

The taser route is certainly an option, but it's obviously an up close and personal device. If a 6'2" bad guy with a heavy leather coat on comes running at you, there's a high likelihood that your taser will be completely infective and you won't be able to even get in contact with his skin. Plus, he may even rip it out of your hand and use it on you.

So, as the others have said, it's a force with force type of thing. Rule number one of a gun fight is to bring a gun. If the bad guy only brings a knife to the gun fight then it's advantage you.

My business partner has a son whose graduating college soon. He had somebody break into his apartment and held a gun to his head for a good 10 minutes as he marched him around gathering all his valuables. He was a big time anti gun guy and didn't see why anyone needed to own a gun. Shortly after that encounter he went out and took a gun safety class, got his permit and now owns a gun. It's amazing what violent crime does to ones thoughts on gun ownership.

I don't understand how having a gun would have helped the college kid - unless the gun was loaded without a trigger lock and either on his person or sitting out handy or in an unlocked drawer or something - which goes against all the "rules" of responsible gun ownership. Just last week a 4 year old here in Mpls shot his 2 year old brother in the head killing him after finding daddy's gun - that he had bought and kept handy to protect the family - in the nightstand.

If my gun is locked in a gun safe with trigger locks on and my ammunition is locked away somewhere else, how can I possibly USE my gun to protect my family if someones breaks in?

I skipped over the first part of the story. The guy started beating on their door in the evening and eventually broke through the door forcing his way in. He was apparently trying to break into some rival drug dealers house to steal his drugs and had the wrong address. My buddy's son was home with his roommate and scrambling around the apartment trying to find something to defend himself with while he was calling the police. He found a bat, but as soon as the guy broke through the door with a gun he was forced to drop the bat and hang up the cellphone call prior to getting through to the police. Then the rest of the story went on from there.

In hindsight had he had a gun there's no telling what the outcome would have been. He did make it out alive without one, but only because the PO'd drug dealer decided to let him live. He has some serious psychological scars from the event though.

I don't understand. He has time to find a bat, but not to dial 911 send? You don't even really have to talk to the operator, the dispatch would send someone. Sorry, I just know far more people who died tragically from the family's gun (n=3) than a perpetrator's or have ever even pulled one on a criminal. In my experience, having a gun has been far more deadly to the owner's family.

He did dial 911 and just as he started talking to them the dude put the gun to his head and told him to hang up. With cellphone technology they knew it was him and an approximate location, but he was in an apartment complex. The police didn't get there until after the guy left and they went to a neighbor to call 911 because he stole his phone.

They never caught the guy.

Just remember, even if he did call 911 and they knew exactly where he was they're still minutes away when seconds count. You're on your own up until they get there.

I totally respect your decision to not have a firearm, and they're not for everyone. We didn't have guns in our house for many years because my wife wasn't comfortable with them in the same house as our toddler sized kids. It wasn't until 2010 that I got one for the house again. I just get bent out of shape when people start pushing their opinions on me. I don't like guns so you can't/shouldn't have guns. (not saying you're saying that, just speaking generically)

My Race Log

Pro

9391