Yanti & Salty RidiculoSnarky Almost Intelligent-Charming Manatees PART 4 - Full (Page 14)

Not bad at all.

Not negligible for propulsion, but indeed the kick's main role in triathlon swimming is to set up body rotation and the stroke.

Not sleep at all. My ears perked right up and my tail started wagging when I saw the picture of you.

I have been totally digging Nike's "Find Your Greatness" videos. 

These are my two favorite:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LAZyJEzZpJk&feature=youtu.be

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LsXRj89cWa0

It's too bad Paula is out. Grrrr! 

By the way, everyone know's the women's marathon is this weekend, right? They start with a 2(ish) mile loop followed by 3 eight(ish) mile loops. I think there is 100-some odd turns in the course so it's going to be incredibly technical.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_Olympic_Marathon_Course

I concur. Pony up, buttcrack boy.

BTW Salty ... I finally got the pics to show ... 1) THANK YOU and 2) they may be NSFW but they are perfectly Olympic-thread friendly!

I know! Obviously we have August covered for the calendar. 

Any time my dear, any time.

I'm staying away from the Olympic thread. I get too carried away 

Thanks for the heads-up. I'll have to look for it to dvr.  I wish I'd known the TT was today

Awwww, you guys are so sweet . 

Yanti, you don't a ton of stock in bricks?  I guess it makes sense that being stronger on the bike will naturally set you up for a better run, I just figured if my body was more used to running off the bike, I would have struggled less.  I do this after every race, I always wonder if I gave it my all, or if I wussed out a bit and should have been mentally stronger...I guess that's what keeps me training and racing!!

You're not asking me but your limiters in both biking and running are going to be, well, more running and more T.I.T.S. Not bricks. 

I can't say none, but not much more than that. Transition runs (running just a few minutes off the bike) can help if you struggle with the feeling in your legs running out of T2 or consistently overpace when you do.

But bricks will not help your run overall. Not at all. In fact, any longer than transition runs creates a recovery cost that is certainly not offset by the fact that it's sub-optimal run training anyway.

In a triathlon, the bike is dictated by T.I.T.S. and not outpacing the size of T.I.T.S. on race day (bike execution). The run is dictated by the overall volume and quality of run training, and bike execution.

The reason the run doesn't really depend on run execution (odd as that may be but it is true in beginning long course, meaning the first few HIMs and IMs unless you're at the pointy end) is that you've pretty much got only one way of executing the run by the time you get to it. Slowly and evenly.

Nothing magical about bricks, and in the case of long bricks it'd be black magic anyway. Learning how to run on "tired legs" for triathlon is another myth. Optimizing run physiology is optimizing run physiology. You don't get better running by running tired.

A focused, occasional (as in, once) long brick can be helpful to nail down nutrition.

Well, there you have it.

Salty = concise

Yanti = long, blathering, pedantic

(even this short post reflects it!)

Hahaha but I wouldn't be Salty without something short, concise and filled with profanity and you wouldn't be Yanti without something very technical, beautifully written and using the T.I.T.S. acronym as many times as possible. 

Good to know.  Honestly, I felt really good about my bike in that I felt as though I kept it within my abilities.  Then when I struggled on the run, I figured it was because I hadn't done much running off the bike.  So maybe I was just a bit optimistic about my bike ability . 

Exactly!  I get something from both posts because of your respective strengths (both athletic and posting-wise).  Salty says do more, consistantly.  Yanti gives me the explanation that I crave.  Same thing on the race.  While I was running, I was thinking about Salty and how I needed to run more to get better.  While I was swimming I was thinking about my kick initiating my hip rotation.  You guys are the perfect mentor pair!!

You were spot-on with your bike ability. And I say that, as I said it in your race report, outright.

Gauging your bike ability as a triathlon bike leg is somewhat different. You did great, and the experience you gained and thought you're putting into it now means you now know in terms of effort (which will not change even though your speed will) that you need to keep it not just within your abilities, but even a notch or two lower than that.

As they say about long course (let's say for HIM) ... in the rare event you underpaced on the bike, you now have 13.1 miles to correct that error anyway

Hot damn. Well, now I'm crying.

I agree.

Thanks for the talk about bricks too; I was recently thinking about them in general, as I often have 2-3 longish bike or swims followed by short run bricks scheduled for me every week. I much prefer to do the long workouts with single focus, just because it does feel more helpful to me. Also, as I tend to do most of my workouts alone, it can make for a LONG transition if I have to lock up my bike while I head out on a 20 minute run...(I just don't trust people around here, after all, somebody here stole LA's bike during the Amgen tour!). But as I was saying, my thoughts were that they didn't seem to be particularly helpful overall.

I think both "Time Crunched Triathlete" and "Be Iron Fit" talk about the benefits of bricks and how run training on fresh legs isn't as helpful.  I'm glad to hear the anti-thesis to that theory.  I prefer to separate my training but was afraid I was doing myself a dis-service.

Oh, Kirsten, I forgot to mention on my comment related to your RR that I like to do the mind games too when the body wants to stop.

In Be Iron Fit, it's essentially one badly-written sentence. If Fink really believed that "running on fresh legs has limited training benefits," he wouldn't schedule the vast-vast-vast majority of the running as stand-alone runs (and almost all of the bricks are very short, meaning that they are, as he interchanges the terms, transition runs).

The science, evidence, and collective experience simply do not back that up.

Nope. Sounds good. Does that running fit in with your schedule generally and your HIM schedule specifically?

Also ... doing the HM WITH your friend, that doesn't mean RACING your friend, right?

Yeah, I agree. That'll get you to the finish for sure.

Well define racing?   For the most part no, but I mean c'mon; to say that I wont try to be first across the line would be lying. He is about the same level of runner as I am, when I train consistently, so it's not like trying to beat Salty in a HM and get carried out on a stretcher we would be about the same pace so mostly running WITH then sprint at the end?