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2009-07-08 9:03 AM
in reply to: #2269318

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Modesto, California
Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
fleetfeet_ch - 2009-07-08 4:14 AM Cool pictures Stuart and thanks for offering to answer my questions.  I need to finish the book first and practice a bit, but I think that my form might be closer to being correct than I think.  The body lean and foot plant reminds me a lot of the Galloway glide.  That definitely helped me with endurance and a lack of injury, but turned me into a chronically SLOW runner.  It's taken me about a year to get faster by lifting my feet and knees.  Have you seen any decrease in your speed when ChiRunning?

To everyone else, I saw the Osteopath today and I'm out of training for at least a week.  .  The whole knee joint is affected, including the base of my hamstring.  Worst case is I've got a small meniscus tear but she wants me to stay off it, ice 3 times a day and not do anything other than freestyle swimming while I'm on vacation next week.  If not significantly better by the 20th, she wants to see an MRI.  But, being a triathlete herself, she knows how much I want to get back out there (notice how I call myself a Triathlete already?!?), and she reassured me that I'll have enough time to get back into my training before the 23 August race.

So much for my bold and wonderful training plan for a week in the Austrian alps with my kids.  I guess I'll be taking a stack of books and working on my tan instead.  Have a good training week and I'll check back in after the 18th.

Laura 

Sorry Laura about your knee, I have had my share of injuries and can say its better to get better instead of making it worse!
At the workshop we went over changing gears, the more you lean the faster you will go. I am a slow runner anyway until I get a decent base built up, even then I am slower than most in my AG. I did not change any in speed, only energy, it does feel effortless eliminating all braking forces and completely relaxing using core and good body alignment. I just hope Chi Running gives my form a foundation to continue to build on.
Be patient with your injury!


2009-07-08 10:06 AM
in reply to: #2099961

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Master
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Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
i wish you a speedy recovery laura! can you still bike, or just some swimming?  as far as Chi running - remember that it will work for some people and not for others.  it is just one style or one idea of how to run.  i am not apposed or in favor of it - i think it has both pluses and minuses.  i have read some of the book, and adapted some of the ideas into my running - but for the most part - i am believe that I should run how i naturally do - under the thought that my natural running form is how my body is built to run.  will i get injured more or less with this approach? who knows. . there is no way to tell.
2009-07-08 10:20 AM
in reply to: #2269941

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Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
No biking, no running until end of next week, UNLESS I am pain and irritation free for 24 hours.  I wanted to hike and get my Nordic sticks out but the Dr. says only if I go a full 24 hours without any pain.  I am going to have to be patient.  The time off will give me time to catch up on my reading and play with my kids. 
2009-07-08 12:04 PM
in reply to: #2099961

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Master
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Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
Has anyone watch the Total Immersion seminar videos on swimming: http://www.beginnertriathlete.com/cms/article-detail.asp?articleid=1792

I knew as humans we were ineffectient in the water, but holy cow, only 3 percent of our energy exertion translates to forward propulsion!  I think I will be taking a slightly different approach to my training in the future.  I like the part about de-emphasizing (sp?) the kick (since my kick stinks anyways)!  I found the kinetics of synchronizing hip drive and stroke extension interesting too.

Any thoughts?
2009-07-08 12:15 PM
in reply to: #2099961

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Master
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Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
laura, sorry to hear about the knee.  Injuries just suck!  I had a tibia plateau fx with meniscus damage two years ago.  I'm just starting to feel good again.  I know it can be frustrating not to train, but relax, give it time, and listen to the injury.  You will recover faster in the long run.
2009-07-09 7:34 AM
in reply to: #2270366

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Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
I really like the TI training tips.  I've been trying to swim more and more with a side kick, but can't really tell if I'm doing it correctly.  Regarding inefficiency, yes, I believe the numbers.  I'm not at all efficient so I can only improve with the TI approach.  Stroke extension is what I'm working on right now because there's a huge difference between my right (dominant) arm and my left arm.  I also waste energy when I breathe because I apparently lift my head slightly when I turn it, rather than just turning it and changing the shape of my mouth to get a breath of air.  

Remember when swimming was just getting in the pool and having some fun?  There's so much to remember when you're trying to make these kinds of changes. 


2009-07-09 7:38 AM
in reply to: #2270423

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Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
Two years?  Oh, my gosh.  Saw my family doctor today and he's upped the ibuprofen to 600 mg 3x per day for 5 days.  I'm nervous about taking that much but the pain has changed overnight from being mostly outer knee and hamstring, to sharp pain on the inside of the knee.  If it doesn't improve in the next week, we'll do an MRI.

I asked the doc if I should start worrying about making the start of the tri and he said (don't laugh), "Not yet.  If it's a real problem, they can do a quick arthoscopic surgery and have you back on your feet in no time.  Or you can just bike and run through the pain."

No pain, no gain... 
2009-07-09 12:58 PM
in reply to: #2269941

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Modesto, California
Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
ultrahip_00 - 2009-07-08 8:06 AM i wish you a speedy recovery laura! can you still bike, or just some swimming?  as far as Chi running - remember that it will work for some people and not for others.  it is just one style or one idea of how to run.  i am not apposed or in favor of it - i think it has both pluses and minuses.  i have read some of the book, and adapted some of the ideas into my running - but for the most part - i am believe that I should run how i naturally do - under the thought that my natural running form is how my body is built to run.  will i get injured more or less with this approach? who knows. . there is no way to tell.

Chi Running is definately not for 22 year old's who are fast and can rely on natural run ability!
2009-07-09 2:42 PM
in reply to: #2273509

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Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
nevergivin - 2009-07-09 10:58 AM
Chi Running is definately not for 22 year old's who are fast and can rely on natural run ability!


haha - well, i wasn't fast to begin with - but fast is all relative. i have came quite a long ways!  i was just trying to play a little devil's advocate and mention that there are many different techniques etc, and i don't know which is 'right' or 'wrong' or if right/wrong exist with these types of things.  . know what i mean?   
2009-07-09 10:31 PM
in reply to: #2099961

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Elite
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Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!

can I just say that I ran tonight.  Slow as hell but still I ran!  Just me n dog   Felt great to be OUTSIDE!

2009-07-10 2:06 AM
in reply to: #2275091

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Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
That's great Lynne!Cool 

Zurich Ironman is on this weekend.  Biggest Euro qualifier for Hawaii, so it's always a massive road closer.  Check it out (especially the IronKids link) at www.ironman.ch.


2009-07-13 9:18 AM
in reply to: #2099961

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Elite
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Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!

Well good morning.

 

Did everyone have a nice weekend?  I did NOT stop all weekend. Friday I swam 2.4 miles OW.  Saturday I did a Sprint triathlon, I wasn't going to do it because of everything that happene to me, plus because of the swelling in my head I couldn't get a helmet on but thankfully it went down an awful lot so I decided to do it. It was HARD! Hardest sprint ever for me but it was FUN! Such a nice course, every corner we turned on the bike you could see Mt Rainier in all it's glory. Just spectacular!  This was a freebie for me, I just had to pay $20 for a shirt, which is actually rather nice.   Yesterday I worked on my house ALL DAY. My parents arrive from Scotland today and we had to make sure everything was A-OK.  Didn't get it all done but we did good.

What's everyone's plan for the week?

2009-07-13 3:11 PM
in reply to: #2099961

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Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
glad to see you had a good weekend lynne!  i am doing an OLY this saturday - so this week is a little bit of a taper week! hoping to throw down a good time and have fun
2009-07-14 8:38 AM
in reply to: #2099961

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Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
My first Tri is this weekend (Sprint distance). Its supposed to be great weather. Im really looking forward to it - but im quite nervous.
2009-07-14 8:52 AM
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Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
^^^Good luck this weekend.  Couple tips I learned at my first event:  go early to get your transition area, set-up, and check things out.  Good chance to look at the other competitors processes too.  When the race starts, control your anxiety and adrenaline rush.  I dashed out on the swim and tired quickly.  If you don't have alot of OWS experience like me, try to relax and really try to focus on your mechanics and pace.  Lastly, have fun!  I found the whole experience very addicting.
2009-07-14 9:39 AM
in reply to: #2280667

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Modesto, California
Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
Triathlynne - 2009-07-13 7:18 AM

Well good morning.

 

Did everyone have a nice weekend?  I did NOT stop all weekend. Friday I swam 2.4 miles OW.  Saturday I did a Sprint triathlon, I wasn't going to do it because of everything that happene to me, plus because of the swelling in my head I couldn't get a helmet on but thankfully it went down an awful lot so I decided to do it. It was HARD! Hardest sprint ever for me but it was FUN! Such a nice course, every corner we turned on the bike you could see Mt Rainier in all it's glory. Just spectacular!  This was a freebie for me, I just had to pay $20 for a shirt, which is actually rather nice.   Yesterday I worked on my house ALL DAY. My parents arrive from Scotland today and we had to make sure everything was A-OK.  Didn't get it all done but we did good.

What's everyone's plan for the week?


Awesome things are going well! Great job last weekend!
for the record Ive been to Scotland four times, its a great place!


2009-07-14 10:35 AM
in reply to: #2283881

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Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
I leave for a week and everyone else is off doing triathlons!  Envious!  Lynne, nice to hear you're getting out there and WORKING at it.  Well done.  I went adventure tree climbing with my kids this morning.  You know those squirrel parks where you get into a harness with ropes and carabiners and go through an obstacle course strung way up in the trees?  Do they have those things in the US?  Would think it would be very popular and it's good cross training for balance, speed and COURAGE.

Good luck for those of you racing this weekend. 
2009-07-14 11:15 AM
in reply to: #2283695

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Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
brick94513 - 2009-07-14 9:52 AM ^^^Good luck this weekend.  Couple tips I learned at my first event:  go early to get your transition area, set-up, and check things out.  Good chance to look at the other competitors processes too.  When the race starts, control your anxiety and adrenaline rush.  I dashed out on the swim and tired quickly.  If you don't have alot of OWS experience like me, try to relax and really try to focus on your mechanics and pace.  Lastly, have fun!  I found the whole experience very addicting.


Thanks for the tips. It feels good to be super excited for a race. Running races have become routine - I think im going to be a big fan or Tri's.
2009-07-14 11:51 AM
in reply to: #2099961

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Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
good luck this weekend! another note on OWS - if swimming in open water hasn't been practiced a lot, i recommend starting near the back of the swim pack and wait 5 or 10 seconds until you start (from when they shoot off the gun), that way, you won't get mauled by the other swimmers - that can be tough if you are not prepared.  also, one thing to think about is that you will need to sight every 5-6 or so strokes - this really threw off my breathing during my first race - since you essentially lift you head up and look forward and then have to continue your swim rythem. 
2009-07-15 9:26 AM
in reply to: #2284387

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Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
Please keep reminding me of the OWS issues.  I still haven't been in OW in two years, so I'm feeling apprehensive about that and definitely plan to start in the back of the pack.  Why is sighting such a big issue?  I would think it's pretty easy to follow the pack when swimming in OW.  Won't the chop and noise die down if you start swimming off course?  Can someone please explain what I'm obviously missing?
2009-07-15 9:38 AM
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Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
Next weekend, in the Austrian village where I'm staying this week, they're running the 9th Extreme Berglauf up the Zugspitz mountain.  This is the tallest mountain in Germany and it straddles the German/Austrian border.  I've put a picture of it's 9717 feet on my profile page.  Wish I was going to be here to see that race!


2009-07-15 10:02 AM
in reply to: #2286513

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Modesto, California
Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
fleetfeet_ch - 2009-07-15 7:26 AM Please keep reminding me of the OWS issues.  I still haven't been in OW in two years, so I'm feeling apprehensive about that and definitely plan to start in the back of the pack.  Why is sighting such a big issue?  I would think it's pretty easy to follow the pack when swimming in OW.  Won't the chop and noise die down if you start swimming off course?  Can someone please explain what I'm obviously missing?


Back of the pack for the most part is safe , just remember that most swim starts are in waves and now you will have the faster swimmers from the later waves swimming through.
It is very risky relying on other swimmers for sighting, they dont always swim in the right direction, there is packs but for the most part its everyone for themselves, and when you are at water level you will see swimmers everywhere and swimming in every direction, tons of splashing too.
Sighting is critical, when you swim off course you waste time and energy going off course and the same trying to get back on course. Nothing is worse than getting to your transition exhausted because you swam the entire course zig zagging. When you sight you are raising your head, this causes your lower body to sink causing drag, so it pays to practice and become proficient at it to conserve energy. Practicing in open water gets you very comfortable with that enviroment, this is key, then on race day you are comfortable overcomming issues such as goggles bieng ripped off or filling up with water, passing people that block you, choking on water, getting hit, swimming off course,etc.
2009-07-15 4:52 PM
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Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
fleetfeet_ch - 2009-07-15 9:26 AM Please keep reminding me of the OWS issues.  I still haven't been in OW in two years, so I'm feeling apprehensive about that and definitely plan to start in the back of the pack.  Why is sighting such a big issue?  I would think it's pretty easy to follow the pack when swimming in OW.  Won't the chop and noise die down if you start swimming off course?  Can someone please explain what I'm obviously missing?


I can understand your confusion.  Growing up around the water and performing in all kinds of water sports, I thought the OWS would be no big deal.  Intuitively, you would think water is water and you swim in both the same.  Well, I was wrong.  For starters, it can be disorienting.  Not only to you not have a black line to follow in the lake-ocean, but you lose you peripheral vision too.  I find it hard to establish and maintain my pace too.  Then you throw chop, waves, people, etc. into the mix and it becomes a real adventure.

Sighting definately takes practice.  Really strong swimmers can incorporate the sighting into their breath stroke.  I've been working on this form, but if you don't clear your head above the water enough, not only do you swallow water, but fail to site and then have to recover quickly with another breath stroke.  Presently, I find it easier to sight on a non breath stroke, albeit my pace slows.  Try to use landmarks you can see above the water line to navigate.  Because like Stuart mentioned, once everyone starts splashing, those buoys become harder to see.  Also, I wouldn't trust other swimmers...seen to many videos where a whole pod of people deviate off of the course.
2009-07-15 5:18 PM
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Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
when i sight, i just use it as breathing, so instead of going up for a breath, (when i need to sight again, not all the time), i just raise my head up and look forward,breath and sight, then put my head right back into the water and resume my swim rhythm. . definitely takes some practice though.
2009-07-17 8:54 AM
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Subject: RE: ultrahip_00's Mentor Group - Closed Again!
Yesterday when I swam I tested my sighting and imagined people around me. I've been swimming in a lake for all my swim workouts, and I found I sight right before I breath. I lift my forehead up to sight and in the same motion turn my head and take a breath. Its kind of high in the water and inefficient but it works.
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