Newbz' group is FULL (Page 2)

Hello, if there is room, I would like to join!

Name: Matt (mbeall2)

Story:  I've been a big dude most of my life, in high school I was pushing 300, but I dropped down to around 220-215 for a while in my early 20's.  BTW, I'm 6'4".  Now I have just turned 30 and have been talking about doing a triathlon eventually and decided now is the time.  I'm a full time teacher, in grad school, and a soccer coach, but I get up early and head to the gym before I head to work.

Family Status: I just recently married my girlfriend of 10 years, we live in Crofton MD, with our two labs.

Current training:  I work out about 5-6 days a week, lots of strength and cross training.  I currently weigh about 230, I started working out again back in late August and I was 256 when I began.  I work out in the morning, and have been doing lots of cardio, but changing it up with bike then run, or spin then run, swim, then bike, and so on and so on.  I also have been adding core training to my workouts and I can really feel and notice the difference.

Race: There is a sprint triathlon on 6/27/10 in Columbia.  .62 swim, 17.5 bike, and 5k.  that is my goal right now.  I planned to start real training in March, about 12 weeks out.  Now I have just been trying to get my body ready for the endurance aspect.  I have never even done so much as a 5k, but plan to work those in during my training sessions. 

Weight loss:  I don't have a specific goal in mind for an ideal weight, but I think i would like to get down to about 215 again, which is about 15 pounds away.  I just want to be healthy.

Why I'd like to join:  I need some guidance through this process.  I am a soccer coach myself so I understand the need for a mentor through a training process.  I am also in need of some constructive criticism, and swimming techniques.

chris, the only time as of yet i have flown with my bike i borrowed a hard case from a local tri team. most bigger bike shops, tri teams, etc can rent out boxes for races. i have no idea what airlines are charging now, or if you can get away without being charge by some still or not.

most of the bike boxes will also fit the wheels inside so no need for an extra package.

I'll start with your specific question then move onto periodization next and how to pick races from there.

If i were in your shoes, i would set the training schedule (if you use one), to focus on the half. If you want the best results you can, i would look towards the may 8th half. being a bit newer to the sport, my concern is not so much with how you recover from the olympic race, but rather the more training you can get in before the half the better off you would be. racing the later one would allow you to do the olympic, get in a bit of easier work after and still have time to get in a few weeks of training before the half.

they are not really close enough together to go through them both without changing much (at times epople will pick a shorter race 1-3 weeks out from a longer goal race, train hard up to the short race, then start their taper right after. training hard up to and not resting for the shorter race ensures you dont push too hard during it, and then you have the 1-3 weeks to recover, i think these are both too far apart for that to work).

my vote would be to get in the extra training time. however, its not a large enough diff for that to make the choice on its own, if one is closer to home, looks like more fun, is cheaper, whatever, i would pick the race you want to do, its a week diff and both are a month after the oly so not close enough to hurt you really, we are looking at small diff between the two.

Scheduling training/picking races and periodization:

before i jump into this, there is a bit of art as well as science that goes into this, and this is my approach/what i have seen to work the best through my own training/coaching/experience

the first thing to do is pick a goal race/races that you want to be in top shape for. for most people you can normally pick two times per year for this, a weeks to months apart. this is not to say you cant race more and be fast in others, but assuming you follow the training well this will be the time you peak and are in your top form.

the three main components of this are the base, build, and peak phase.

Base, or general fitness phase: think of a pyramid. this is how the three phases work in regards to workouts and how they relate to your races. the base phase/gen fitness is used to lay a base for the work to come later. it is the least specific in regards to workouts relating to races, and the goal here is simply to improve overall areobic fitness and have a foundation to grow on for later in the year. Workouts dont have to be all long and easy. this is a good chance to get in some short hard rides, and save the longer stuff for when the weather warms up and races get closer. also a good time to work on swimming speed. running is normally kept easier, and frequency is key here. overall volume is going to depend on the person, but you dont need to be maxing out here, i tend to recomend athletes stay around 2/3 of what they could be doing so as not to overdo it.
this is typically around half of the total training cycle if you are starting around now and planning on a end of may (or around there) race.

Build phase: this is the next step up in the pyramid. training load is going up, intervals on the bike are getting a bit longer, and you should be progressing through harder swim workouts. day to day here no one workout should be wildly hard, but rather the overall training load is going to be your focus. consistancy and getting in a solid amount of training as you slowly add distances makes it important to pay attention to how your body is reacting, and rest as needed. you will start focusing some on your goal race here, IE long course epople start adding in a bit more distance, etc. this phase and the peak will take up the other half of the training cycle with the build about 2/3of it

Peak phase: this is where you hone all of the work you have put in until now into race specifc speed. more higher intensity work in the run, a decent amount on the bike and swim. volumes can range around a bit more here depending on the athlete and their goals. this is a good time to throw in some shorter races to see how things are progressing. typically a month or so long if you follow a schedule starting around now.

taper: this is going to vary wildly from athlete to athlete, their goal race, and many other factors. depening on the race distance can last anywhere from 3 weeks to a few days.

normally the best races of the year will come during the peak phase/and just after. during the build its ok to race but you'll often see results not quite to what your fitness will allow due to needing to keep the training volume up.

after the goal race, you can go one of two ways to see best results. you can either try and keep the peak there for a bit and race a few times close ogether, or you can back down and do another build up to the next peak.


typically i try to peak twice, once in the end of may/early june, and again for a later season race around mid/late aug or mid sept.
i'll race a lot through late april/june. again heavy race schdule in later july/aug.

i can go into the types of workouts you would typically see in each next if you would like.

I'm in too!!

STORY:  I'm in the final stages of my CMA designation so in addition to working full-time I have allot of homework to do during the week.  So my time is quite valuable.  I have convinced my husband to do this tri with me and a girlfriend might as well.

CURRENT TRAINING: I love to weightlift I'm doing NROL right now and I'd like to keep my weightlifting to 3Xper week in addition to my tri training.  Currently I'm doing lots of intervals (on the treadmill or stepmill, not allot of steadystate).

THIS YEAR'S RACES: I ran a 10K in May 2009.  That is about as far as I'd like to run at one time.

2010 RACES: I plan on doing a sprint tri on June 20 in Edmonton, Alberta.

WEIGHTLOSS: I've been physically active since high school.  My problem has been my diet.  About 1 and a half years ago I was weighing in at 178lbs (at 5'6) and a size 12 I made it down for my wedding in September to about 150lbs and a size 6 (almost 4).  Right now I'm sitting around 160lbs. 

FAMILY STATUS: Married, two dogs.

WHY I'D LIKE TO JOIN: I've never done a tri before and I'm looking for some motivation as well as training tips.  I've never really been a swimmer, so that's where I'll be focusing allot of my training.

Monica

Edited by Scoobydoo963 2009-12-18 1:52 PM

bicycling magazine had a recent article about flying with your bike (link below). There are also bike shipping companies. You take you bike to your local bike shop and they ship it to a bike shop near your race - they then put your bike back together for you. I always drive to my races - but my furthest away race was 'only' a 10 hour drive.

http://www.bicycling.com/article/0,6610,s1-3-12-21401-1,00.html

this is a good point, and actually most of the bigger races have host bike shops that will do this for you, just check and see which is going to be the easiest/cheaper option for you. race website may have this listed if you want to g this route

David,

I'd be interested in how you adjust your swimming through the different periods (base/build/peak).  Also, any thoughts on strength training?

assuming the athlete knows how to swim/has already done some real swim workouts, i try to get myself/others in the pool somewhat regularly before the bas phase starts up, even if only for a short swim, somewhat frequently.

as an example, last winter once base started up i wanted to be around 15k a week in the pool spread over 6 days. so for the 3 weeks leading up to i tried to get in the water 4-5 days a week even if only for 800-1000yards jsut to get used to swimming.

from there, base workouts consist of a bit more drills and threshold/tempo sets. these are mainly in the form of 100-300 yard repeats on short rest. something like 10x100 on 10-15 sec rest. kicking and pulling also is included.

as we move into base workouts, more speed/max pace stuff will mix in. threhsold sets will get longer, with the 10x100 moving up to workouts up to 20x100, as well as adding to the length of some, more 200s, 300s, 400s, etc. two workouts a week like that.
one day a week with faster threshold work, something like 15-40x50yards on 15-20 sec rest

one day a week of speed work, 50, 75, 100, maybe 150 on a lot more rest, twice the time it takes to do the interval. something like 4x100 on 2 min rest, followed by 8x25 on 20 sec rest.

as races get closer, later build through peak, i try to keep a balance about equal of shorter and longer threshold work, 1 day of speed work, and start adding in some longer pull sets and kick sets as the season approaches.

for those not used to swim workouts, we start off with intervals early in the year on short rest, middle distance stuff. this allows you to get in near or at race pace swimming, but with just a short rest to ensure form stays together. as the training progresses we'll add in some more intervals each week, and lengthen some. still keeping shorter rest. this will keep improving the amount of time you can hold that speed, and to a lesser extent your the speed you can hold.

as the speed work/short fast intervals come in, this developes your top end speed, or how fast you can go.

the longer pulling sets help to work on shoulder strength, and mimick a bit more what it feels like to swim with a wetsuit, and give your legs a break.

the ratio of hard to very hard swimming you do will depend a lot on how much you have swam before and your weekly totals. the more you are swimming, the more you need to balnce out. if you are just swimming a small amount, most of it should be hard as there is very little risk to injury from this compared to running/biking.

also make sure each swim is accompanied by a good warm up and cool down.


LIFTING/STRENGTH:

you'll get a lot of answers here depending on who you ask. personally, i believe that strength/lifting has very little use to the endurance athlete if the goal is to make you faster. that said, i do think it serves a purpose if used correctly. it can be a big help in coming back from an injury, for older people looking to maintain muscle mass/bone denisity, and because its fun.

that said, the type of lifting most triathletes do wont help at all in terms of race speeds. most of us are not swimming enough to ever see the help there, and on the bike/run its not really going to help at all, as your power (force applied over time) and aerobic capacity are going to determine your speed, not your strength.

look at it like this, i am normally in the top 1-2% of bike splits at the races i do. i put out something like 270 watts of power at the speeds i raced at last year. 500 watts of power, is something like 40 pounds of force. to put into prespective how much that is, i think lance armstrong in shorter time trials put out around 350 or 370. i can hold 500 watts for about one min.
strength for most of this is simply not an issue.

personally i think most of the strength work you need for this can be done through core work.
that said, if you enjoy lifting, its not something i would cut out, just understand its strenths and drawbacks in terms of what you use it for.

Thanks. I will definitely look into the local bike shop for renting out a bike case...it looks like it will wind up costing me extra no matter how I go about it...at the very least, it will be a good learning experience for me and I will certainly write down all of what I learned, for our group, after the race weekend.

Btw, how long are we going to be keeping this group-forum open? Will we be sharing our experiences throughout the race season, or is this just for the winter training months?

I am a true "newbie" and I really love the idea of this mentoring-forum website for beginners to have an opportunity to ask questions and learn a lot from people who have gone through the basics before...you guys are great and keep up the hard work!

Cheers,
Chris

Thank you microspawn for the link to the website. I just finished reading it and it definitely had the most information that I have been able to find on the subject. I will be driving to all of my other races as well, but I just thought that the Miami International Triathlon would be a great beginning to my first full Triathlon season, a good way for me and my wife to take a mini-vacation, and motivate me throughout the winter to train hard to be ready for my first Olympic distance triathlon...Hopefully, it wasn't a mistake Thanks again!

as far as how long the group will run, i'm not sure when in the spring this is scheduled to stop, but normally they run one from now till sometime in mid spring, another over the summer, and sometimes a 3rd. i'll keep this one going until the next time starts up, as i will be starting a new group then.

at that point, you have the option to do a few things, 1, they often put the active groups now into the archives and you can keep using it through the beleive the next session. some people do that, i'm prob not going to be able to keep up with this group and the new one, so that would be up to you guys.

option 2, whenever this coming summers group starts, either jump into another (you are welcome back in mine, or to try someone else), or start your own! the mentor groups open right now are a mix of very active racers down to those that jsut started recently includding some of my group from last eyar

David,
As you have been talking about swimming, I would like to ask a more specific swim question.  I have been in the water for a few months now and I think I have a decent base but I wonder what specific things I might do that would produce the most for me?  I.E. workouts, drills, intervals, etc.

When you get a chance could you check out my logs and provide some insight?  I really have no idea how to put together my swim workouts.  My logs are public already.

Also, I am for sure going to do some tri's this season but the "real deal" for me this year will be the MCM in October.  I plan on doing an Oly and maybe a Sprint early then ???????? 

David,

Thank you for all of the feedback on scheduling races!  I feel more confident with my choices now.

Yeah the dreaded "Dreadmill!"  It pretty much sucks, thats for sure.  I do everything I can to stay off of it but I have run as many as 9 miles on the darn thing.  It is a necessary evil however, but it doesn't make it easier to get on.  About the full mary, my wife thinks I should do something closer to home like the Air Force Marathon in Dayton but I checked the course out and it looks like it would be kind of boring.  Besides, I have 3 Marines in the family and I would like to honor them and a friends brother who died in VeitNam by running this race.

Tom Worrel USMC KIA-VeitNam
Jeremy Reilly USMC (3 tours Iraq)
Jeff Reilly USMCR
Michael Denlis USMC (In Afghanistan??)

Hey Chris,
Thanks for your service in the Army so I can have my freedom.  There is little more honorable a person can do than serving this country. My brother was Army Airborne (Bragg) and nearly went SF but political games during his service prevented it.  Oo Rah!

on the swimming,
first, assuming the pool is in yards (if its meters you are flying),

the 500s you just did in 7:50, quick math puts that at about 1:35 per 100, which is a solid pace. was that hard, easy, moderate?

assuming you have the time, you should try and get in the pool 2-3x a week to see any real improvment on that.

a few main sets i would look at adding in (woarm up and cool down up to you),

some sort of threshold paced work, these can be 75 through 200 in length
something like 10x100, 4x200, or you can mix the distances up and do a ladder, 100, 200,300 then back down, etc. these are done on fairly short rest, this will boost your abilty to hold speed over distance/endurance. this should be a staple style of wokrout for you/anyone looking to get faster. there are a million and one ways to mix this up so you dont get bored, but the format of mid distance intervals with short rest stays the same.

one faster day of over paced work. can include repeats from 25 yards through 150 (those newer to swimming i would recomend sticking with a bit longer and not sprinting all out).
something like 15-20x50 on 25 sec rest or so. try and keep the pace even and hard on all of these. the first few will be easy, and it will progressively get harder through the set. this will bost endurance some, and up the paces you can swim.

if you are swimming 3x a week, i would do two workouts like the first, one of the 2nd.

at this point in the year you will gain almost nothing by doing longer slow stuff other than getting used to swimming long and slow.

drills are a bit harder to recomend without seeing what you are actualy doing in the water.

if you are looking for some specific workouts let me know and i can put a few up.

Thanks, you're quick and that appreciated!

I'll lie and say the pool is in meters then.  Do you think I'll be in the next olympics?

The pace for today's workout would have been moderate I guess.  If I were racing I might have been able to cut 30 sec. or something like that, I guess.  I do try to get at least 2 workouts in each week but my schedule for the past couple of weeks has been not very co-operative.  I am going for a longer swim workout tomorrow morning and will apply the principles you are suggesting.

I am off work for the next 2 weeks and will be doing extra swim and run workouts prior to my recovery week the first week in January.

something to look at, if you can, in one of your swims in the next week or so, do a 500 yard TT, after a good warmup. ie 500 as fast as you can. that will give a good idea of where thigns stand now, and where to focus/interval times a bit more if you want to be that specific.

Hi David,
If there is still room, I would like to join your group if there is still room.

Story:  I started running in 2007 in an effort to get healthly and loose weight.  I dropped about 80 pounds in a little over a year.  I started triathlon in 2008 with a sprint.  I loved it even though the swim TERRIFIED me.  I raced two sprints, 1 oly, 3 half marathons, and a marathon in 2009.  I decided to cap off a great year by signing up for the Augusta 70.3.  I love triathlon, but I still fear the swim.

Location:  Indianapolis, IN

Family Status:  A wonderful husband, two dogs, a cat, and a horse

Current Training:  Running 2x/week, swimming 1x/week, biking 2x/week

2010 Races:  Still planning for 2010.  Most likely:  2 half-marathons, 1 full-marathon (AFTER Augusta!), 3 sprints, 1 oly, 1 HIM

Weightloss:  I want to loose another 20 pounds but I found that I actually am slower lighter....

welcome!

we'll take one or two more then that hsould fill us up

I would love to join in if there is still room. I come from a bodybuilding background and have switched to triathlon training for the last two years. I really have enjoyed learning a whole new way to push myself.

I am married and have 2 beautiful daughters, ages 6 and 1. I live in Port Orange near Daytona Beach Florida. I have been focused on my running for the last few months and my last race was a half marathon on 11/29 and I finished in 1:49. That is a huge improvement for me over last years 2:10. In 2009, I raced 4 sprints and 2 olympic tri's as well as a couple 5 and 10k's and a half marathon.  

I am ready to start hitting all 3 sports (4 including transitions) again for 2010. I have a new bike (QR TiPhoon) and have plans for St. Anthony's and Florida 70.3 as well as a few sprints thrown in.

craig i think you are our last.

welcome!

Thanks. I'm glad I made it. Hello to everyone.

Its been a crazy couple days but I finally had time to fill out a profile.

NAME: uclamatt2007/ Matt

STORY: I had been wanting to do a triathlon for few years, and after a few failed attempts, I finally managed to run one this year. I will use the term run liberally though, since the run was more of a death march . I fell off the wagon in terms of training a few months before the race and when I tried to gear back up I injured myself and managed almost no run training going into the race. I did finsh though and I will be running the same course again in June.

FAMILY STATUS: Single (Know any single women in their mid-20's in Northern California?)

CURRENT TRAINING: Currently, nothing due to having a mole removed on my calf last week. I am more or less banned from running, biking, or swimming until after xmas, possibly til New Years. I don't know if I can use that as an excuse for my lack of training for the months prior to this though. I was just starting to gear up again when I had this come up (I know, there is a pattern here)


2010 RACES:So far, my only scheduled race is the sprint in June. There is going to be a group of about 10-15 friends and family who are going to be doing it, so I want to make a good showing. I will make that an A race i think. I want to through some running races in during the spring and I want one more A race for the fall.

WEIGHTLOSS: I hit maximum density at 212 pounds in June '08. I last 40 pounds over the nect 9 months getting down to 172. I am currently at around 180 and I am hoping to down to around 155 by middle of the summer.

Dirk, I appreciate it...unfortunately I understand the miserable politics of the Army all-too-well and I just turned down my slot for officer candidate school after 3 years of the Army losing my paperwork and other mishandlings of my applications school dates...I just applied to Law School in Boston though and I plan on continuing my service in the National Guard when I get out this summer, because I do believe in what we are doing around the world and the freedoms that we have...so thanks!

ANYWAY, newbz, I have a few questions about nutrition for the endurance athlete. Since I am 3 days removed from my shoulder surgery and I cannot yet workout aerobically, I plan on spending the next few weeks focusing intently on recovery and nutrition, in order to set me up properly for 2010 season. I am 5'9" and I weigh about 165-170 lbs. For the past year or so, I learned quiet a bit about - how to eat in order to gain muscle while working out with weights - but...I have been finding it a little difficult to find information on how to eat right as an "endurance athlete" rather than a bodybuilder. For example, some articles I have read mention that you should balance your daily macronutrient intake to:

Carbohydrates = 60-70% of daily calories
Protien = 12-15% of daily calories
Fat = 15-28% of daily calories
(Runner Triathlete News - October 2009)

But, Joe Friel, in his book, The Triathlete's Training Bible, in the section on FUEL, recommends a "periodization seesaw" that sees Protien stay the same throughout the year, at 25%, and carbs and fat changing throughout the season, based on the Base, Build, Peak, or Race period of training that you are in at that particular time...

I tend to subscribe to whatever Friel says, until I experiment with it and it is proven wrong by my own experience, because he definitely has done his research on all things triathlon...not to say his word is set in stone though...so...I figured I would throw this out there for the group.

So, I was wondering if anyone out there had any advice as far as: (a) How many calories per day do you generally take in during the base, build and peak periods? Do you change the amount of calories you take in during different phases? (b) Has anyone experimented with the seesaw method of nutritional periodization before? Does it work? (c) any advice as to some of the better foods to take in the week of the race, day of the race, etc...

Thanks,
Chris