Yet another BO promise broken (Page 4)

What happened to the "I'm going to go through the budget line by line and remove the wasteful spending" (paraphrase) that BO promised during the debates.

I cannot believe he has the gal to dress down Wall Street executives with claims of "financial irresponsibility" (I don't necessarily disagree) but then support this spending bill?

Unless the government pulls it's head out of it's butt and realizes this is not play money they are dealing with the US is going to be bought up by Canada and Mexico at a rummage sale.

Me?  I'm stocking piling firearms, gold, food and investing the wilds of northern Montana.

You missed my point.  If he claims he is going to "cut the waste" in the budget, why is he letting this pork laden bill sail through?  Shoudln't he start with the things he has control over?

Of course I do not expect him to have reviewed the annual budget yet.

No, what I am asking for is a 'stimulus" bill that actually stimulates the economy.  According to most articles there is only about 12% of the current stimulus bill actually allocated to things that would stimulate the economy.  The rest is just meant to cement a 'tax consumer" mentality and therefore the voting base that will never have an incentive to vote out their free handouts.

Yeah ...well you don't audit a budget by first adding vast amounts of ADDITIONAL spending.  You go through it FIRST...

Seriously people, have you READ the bill you are talking about...

http://www.readthestimulus.org/

Here are some highlights:

http://www.glennbeck.com/content/articles/article/198/20639/

How does the following really "stimulate" the economy in a timely fashion?

$6 billion: High-speed Internet access for rural and underserved areas  - so people in the middle of nowhere Kansas can check their facebook pages (no offense to Kansas, just picked a rural state)

$6 billion: Funding to weatherize modest-income homes  - insulation?  This is going to fix the economy?  Lowering someone's electric bill a little each month.  Sure it's a noble project but it's not going to stimulate the economy.

$43 billion for increased unemployment benefits and job training - raising unemployment benifits is going to have the OPPOSITE effect of stimulation.  If you can stay on unemployment LONGER then what incentive do you have to find a job?

$850 million will go to hazardous fuel reductions to stop forest fires - essentially clearing scrub to prevent fires.  How does this stimulate the economy?

$200 million to rehabilitate the National Mall   - I'll be happy that the mall looks nice when my 401(k) hits $0

Take a look at this...(the list of requests from various cities)

http://www.usmayors.org/mainstreeteconomicrecovery/stimulussurveyparticipantsdata.asp?City=Tampa&State=FL

You can search for your town as well.

$2.5 million to create 10 jobs? $2.0 million for 30 jobs?

I really do not think that ANYONE in government at ANY level has any idea what is going on.  You cannot keep spending at this rate 

Want to stimulate the economy?  Give companies tax breaks on new equipment and R&D efforts.  Allow companies to band together to get health care for their workers.  You need to help small businesses who employ a large majority of Americans.  This bill "starts" some of these plans but does not go near far enough.  Take this wasteful spending and put it to good use.  Not entitlement and welfare programs.

Bahh... this makes me so angry..... (stomp stomp stomp)

Just out of curiosity, how does the above stimulate the economy?  So the companies get to lower their costs on health care and get more money to spend.  What prevents them from just giving their top teir bigger bonuses?  Nothing says that they will create more jobs when the people they have now are being so productive (because they have to be)

I can see both sides of this.  But most of the things you listed would create jobs.  Who's going to weatherize those homes?  Who is going to put that Lan Line in?  Who's clearing the brush?

I'm still looking at this with a jaded eye.  But those are just some thoughts.

You can take ANYTHING and look at it from a cynical perspective.  Sure there will be a few that abuse the system.  However 99.9% of companies... wait for it... WANT TO MAKE MONEY.  So how can they make more?  By hiring more people and making more product.  More product = large factories.  Larger factories = more machinery.  More machinery = profits for those companies that make machinery.  It all trickles down.

The US has not taken care of its manufacturing sector for many years.  Manufacturing actually MAKES something tangible.  Manufacturing produces goods.  Not like banks or wall street that just trade money here and there.

These things I listed will not create jobs on the scale of the amount of money being spent on the items.  Comcast hiring an extra 1000 installs does not apreciably stimulate the economy.

Now image if EVERY manufacturing company in the US suddenly found themselves with 10% extra because of tax breaks and  other incentives.  These companies provide the jobs and provide the products for export.

I could see that and it makes sense.  That's why I am asking.  Because I don't know.  But I would also say that the US has moved away from manufacturing a lot of products because they can be made cheaper overseas.  If I remember correctly (dept of labor study) 85% of the manufacutring jobs that have been 'lost' in the US have not shown up overseas. 

What are these factories going to be producing and will they actually be purchased?  And like Pengy noted:  Don't we have enough 'stuff'? 

I'm really trying to see both sides here.

Actually no I'm not.

People ALWAYS are buying.  They are just buying cheaper.  The Walmarts of the world are still open.    US manufacturers have to be competitive to get the dollars that are out there.  The US's policies towards manufactruing does not promote manufactuers to be innovative or to expand their facilities.

So in your opinion since people are not buying things we should just shut down these manufacturers?  OK there goes even more jobs.  Now people are not going to buy even more things.  OK more jobs gone.  Pretty soon they are ALL gone.

It's not all about producing MORE stuff.  It's about producing the same stuff but at a lower cost.  That CNC mill or automated machine can help a company produce the same goods for less money.  If there were incentives for companies to buy this equipment then they could possibly be more competitive with foreign products.

One thing that a lot of people forget is that a lot of foreign manufacturers are subsidized by their governments.  It's hard to compete against a government.

US manufacturers also have to deal with things like the EPA, OSHA and other government regulations where products in China, Mexico etc.. do not have these regulations.

Riiiight.....thats why you give the money BACK to the people.  You don't spend more money as the Gov't.  You want stability, let me keep more of my check....so that I can spend more if I spend more than the demand goes up and the companies NEED more people.....See the problem.....GOVERNMENT!

You DON'T have an immediat effect.  We didn't get here overnight and it won't be fixed overnight. 

It's money...it's not rocket science.  What do normal people do when their in a financial drought.  You cut back...save more...and hunker down until you get through it and build yourself back up.  THEN you prepare better so that it doesn't happen again.

If we cut the fat and stopped funding idealogical projects and cut back to survival.  Cut foreign spending and foreign aid.  You can't give money away when you can't pay your own bills, etc.

 It would work. It will just take time...probably a lot of it.  Again...the problem is GOVERNMENT...we have gotten ourselves in this position by decade after decade continuing to overcomplicate and allow the government to get involved in facets that it was never intended to have it's grimy hands in the first place.

And who will make these things that you want people to buy?  Elves?

I believe i said ... let the people keep more of their money...and yes.  Jobs will be created.  The american people are entrepreneurial.  When you give the money back...people will create opportunities for themselves that in turn create opportunities for others.

YES...It is NOT The government's job to BAIL ANYONE OUT!  Not you, not me, not GM or AIG.

You see....the government doesn't MAKE any money....it only SPENDS MONEY.  So... if the money they spend only comes from it's tax base, in essence the government is only pulling money OUT of the economy to turn around and spend it how IT sees fit. All the while reducing the incentive to work and grow businesses.

We call this a viscous cycle and history tells the story...