GordoByrn's Group Full for the Spring (Page 5)

Just wanted to share... beautiful day in AZ -- albeit windy (April)...

Got in a nice bike ride midday -- 1 hour, 14.6 miles, Average HR 125.  Wind in the face on the return trip, but just a great day out there...

Have a great weekend!

Barb,

Think in terms of gears, "pushing fast" would be 4th or 5th gear -- what you want to develop is 2nd and 3rd gears -- so you'll be able to use them without having to dial the pace way down to recover.

It takes a little practices and you are getting more fit as you learn... so it is all good.

g 

G-

I don't think I was clear.  I was hit by a bike while running last August and spent months recovering.  According to to the sports med doc, 3PTs and runner's clinic I am good to go, but I will probably never be 100%.  I agree with the swimming comment and it will be a focus area and long distance running won't be.  Does that change your comment above?

Gordo,

Looks like an interesting site, will have to look into that more. I'm looking at the plans on BT too, but I don't think I'll start one of those until I am somewhere I can s/b/r. Right now I'm trying to get as much stuff planned out for when I get back so I can jump right into training and not be sitting around trying to figure out what I want to do. Finding a good triathlon training plan will probably be a lot easier than getting a good nutrition plan and sticking to it. At least I'll already be used to not eating fast food and drinking soda.

I wouldn't even try to run up this hill. Other than the fact that it's not a very good surface and I'd probably fall at some point, it's hard enough just walking. If I want to make it harder I figure I can just wear my body armor and walk it.

I'll type out a week plan once I get it figured out so you can take a look at it. I think you're right with doing less than I think I need and just getting in the habit of exercising daily. It'll give me less of an excuse not to do it because I won't need as much time, among other things. I also don't have the ability to eat properly for a vigorous training program right now.

Rob

The joys of internet -- sounds like I may have misunderstood, or imagined, you background.

I thought you had persistent lower leg pain that was causing consistent pain when running.

If that's the case then, within a ten week window, post marathon -- I'd focus on doing everything possible to reduce that pain and strengthen your overall movement chain.  I'd make that the priority, starting after two easy weeks that follow the marathon. Two weeks easier then an eight week focus on making yourself a biomechnically bulletproof as possible -- an excellent investment in long term athletic enjoyment.

If I misinterpreted your background (quite possible) then five weeks post marathon is too short of a window to have a specific goal - due to marathon recovery.  So use the sprint as a step along the way to your longer term goals -- you'll have the endurance so the main thing would be a couple of key workouts (swim and brick) to prepare your body for a different kind of exercise.  The endurance is inside you, you simply have to shift from run to SBR.

Marathons are challenging events, so be sure to recover before you shift into the triathlon phase of your year.

Hope this helps,
g 

Some Qs to consider...

Are you uncomfortable on your bike? If you are comfortable then you may not need to change anything.

What are they going to charge you?  Consider alternative uses for the cash in your life.  Bike fits have a pretty low return on investment unless you are uncomfortable.

Once you have a comfortable fit, aerobars, a HRM and a wetsuit -- the next tri gizmo that I recommend is a powermeter -- even before considering race wheels (which can nearly always be borrowed from a pal).

Which park you riding in?
g 

Babs Swimming...

Barbara, I was thinking about you while enjoying my 5x800 this afternoon.

Before moving to the "descending" workout phase, have you completed the race distance in a workout, and race distance without stopping phases?

I ask because establishing the endurance will make the descending a lot more easy.  What can happen when endurance is limiting is a few minutes of "fast" and you fell totally blown for the day.  If that's the case then a few more weeks of endurance will go a long way towards helping you avoid the dead-arms sensation that we all get when tired.

Wanted to share this.

g 

I don't really feel uncomfortable.  I guess it is a bit of thinking it is "what I should do" in order to improve efficiency on the bike.  The guy that works out of the LBS charges $165.  I am waiting for my HRM (hopefully be here Monday!), I don't have aerobars yet, I will check those out.

I live about 25 minutes from Joshua Tree National Park.  It is beautiful (who says the desert is not beautiful) and I like it because it is a great place out here to ride non-stop.  When I ride around my house I am stopping/starting all the time with stop signs, turns, etc.  Let me know when you are here in Southern California, I will gladly slow you down if you want to take a ride through the Park.

JTNP- http://www.nps.gov/jotr/

You in 29 or Yucca?  I have a couple of pals that used to be based close to there.

With your cycling (and tri, in general) -- main thing for improvement is create a habit of training as well as avoid doing anything that might injure yourself in the first couple of years, most critical is first 12-15 weeks.  Our muscles/aerobics adjust far quicker than our joints/connective tissue so many people get derailed by an overuse injury that was caused by their own enthusiasm.

A couple years back, I was a guest coach at a tri camp that was based out of the Yucca Inn -- Mitch Gold of CPC coaching hosted it.  A fun week of training.

I'm pretty old school with bike fit and your first set of aerobars -- find your most powerful position on your road bike, put clip on bars that let you hold that position, that's it.  That was pretty much what I rode when I did one of the top ten times, ever, at IM Canada.  Once you have than position as a basic starting point, you can play around a little bit with what you'll read on the net - the super aero positions work from some but those positions create biomechnical issues for most of the population and are not powerful for many athletes.

g

 

In the last group, we chatted a little about swim golf -- low strokes doesn't necessarily imply efficient swimming, we can glide or kick a lot to get stroke count down.

Below is a workout that you might enjoy to track (one measure of) your swim economy. 

++

Cool Down 

You know Yucca Valley?!?!?  Small world.  I live in YV.  The Yucca Inn cracks me up because it now has a sushi bar, pretty random for a small town in the middle of the desert.  You guys ride up to Pioneertown when you were out here?

I am really struggling with the over-enthusiasm thing.  I want to go big NOW, do a HIM, get ready for the IM.  I need to stop listening to Ironman Talk (except for your interviews on there of course).  I am trying to hold myself back, like you have said before we often have to learn these lessons ourselves before we believe what others (even experts like you) are telling us.  I am trying.

Could you take a look at the Word doc I attached?  It is Mary Eggers oly training plan that I modified to fit my schedule, I increased the bike stuff as I was riding the increased amounts before starting training for triathlon.  I did not increase the swim or run times and added core workouts.  Please let me know what you think.  Thanks.



Attachments
----------------
Olympic Triathlon Training Program.doc (70KB - 15 downloads)

x 10...she is going to ROCK Boston.  She is trained and she is READY.



Steve

Biked 1:30 today... 21 miles.... windy.  HR was up near 135-140 the whole time, so Gordo we'll see what effect that will have on my fatigue.  Feel good now after a shower and some Recoverite.

Just sitting down to map out my week -- work, family, training... and am hoping to get back into the pool this week.  Debating jumping right back into masters (I swim with a tri group).  Usually that's the best way to go, despite some soreness. 

Training wise -- I am going to go with my gut and stick with my PC Coach program rather than sticking to an actual "plan."  I can get too obsessive that way.  With the PC Coach, I have some flexibility to move around workouts, determine my hours for training, and up/download my HR stuff.  Simple, flexible.   Right now the program has me at 2X a week in each sport.

Some great news -- about a 6 weeks ago I did a treadmill mile test at my MAF HR of 135.  It was dreadfully slow.  Yesterday I ended up at the Y for my run (it actually heated up yesterday afternoon, so decided to run indoors)...  Just wanted to do a check on where my mile was at.  I kept my HR at 130 (which is where all of my aerobic training has been), and lo and behold -- I was running faster at 130 then I was six weeks ago at 135.  SO, something is working right!

Sorry for the long post, just wanted to share.  I like the bike talk Justin has started.  I have been on my Trek road bike for over 6 years, and am itching to go to a tri-specific geometry.  With a bad low back and inflexible hamstrings, I will be looking for a forgiving frame geometry -- and of course working on getting to fighting weight and increasing my flexibility before even thinking about looking at bikes.  Probably end of this year, beginning of next.  I also want to step up to carbon fiber.

OK -- planning my week -- hope everyone has a great 'rest' of weekend -- Gordo, hope it warms up soon in CO... I will be coming up your way in June to Lakewood, and would love to spend an extra day and check out Boulder...

ken

P.S.  Suzy -- good luck in Beantown!!! 

Edited by Ken in AZ 2009-04-19 2:19 PM

Plan looks good -- it is conservative on the running which is where most people hurt themselves.  You can supplement your running with hiking.

The main thing about fitness is being able to continue -- so... never do anything that compromises tomorrow's training

Also know that injuries talk a while to manifest -- often weeks of gradual breakdown before you break.  If you want to improve then you'll need to be humble and dial it down while your tendons/ligaments adjust.  I think we lost about 50% of the previous group due to excessive intensity -- we didn't do a survey, people just disappeared.  If we have given folks a scientifically optimal program we probably would have lost all but one or two athletes.  The moderate approach is the fastest way to improve.  I walked for YEARS before I could run.

I've done P-Town, Aberdeen Rd (?), JT as well as the "stop sign" ride where you head east from 29.  Rode through YV when we rode across the USA in 2003.  Can't really imagine a Sushi Bar at the Yucca Inn but enjoyed the place!
g 

As a general point you want to be quite careful with doing anything that makes it "easier" in the water (fins and pullbuoys are the big ones).  Couple reasons:

(a) we want your core to engage - with the PB especially we can 'sit in' and our core muscles turn off -- take away the PB and your body won't be used to maintaining a good swimming posture; 
(b) the other is that we want to build swim specific strength -- the capacity to pull straight back to move ourselves forward -- so with that core turned on, you want to be learning how to do relaxed, sustained aerobic work in the water.   Here's where the fins can be a distraction -- even if you don't think you are kicking, you are, if you don't believe me then use a pullbuoy with a thick rubber band (tight, an old bike tube will do) around your ankles.  The fin swimming will enable you to use your legs more and that's an inefficient habit.

So... best to learn to swim, first, then use the gear for specific issues that you want to improve.  As working athletes, we will be time constrained for our distance freestyle workouts in any event.  

That said... if those short fins mean that you are in the water longer each week and enjoy swimming more... then they are helping you get in the water more often and that will help you improve!  

Like most things.. it depends.

g 

Edited by GordoByrn 2009-04-19 8:00 PM

Today:

run

30m	2.15 miles

treadmill
walk
2x10:2
walk


swim

30m	1050.00 yards

4x25
2x50
2x75
2x100
200
3x100

all on 15 RI

G- when I run on the treadmill I seem to do better with any leg issues/injury.  It seems to be much more forgiving than the road.  Would it be a huge negative impact to fitness/races to run only on the treadmill?  My understanding is that the treadmill helps because the belt is always propelling you forward, when I run on the road it is clearly harder.

Treadmill is fine -- it's a little easier that outside but that isn't a concern for you right now.  I saw 10:2 -- you may get better results from 5:1 -- try that.
g

This is a good session -- a quick session is WAY better than no session!

g 

Hi All

Tough day at Boston yesterday even with better execution than last year, missed my CR goal, but BQ'ed so the day was not a total loss.  While I trained in the wind, strong 17-25mph ESE winds were my undoing.  First 17m were right on plan, but once we hit Commonwealth and the hills the wind picked up making things that much tougher.  I quickly realized I needed to revise the goal and hold on to the BQ.  I'm sunburned and sore, but heading home this morning.

G--what is the typical recovery period you suggest? any other practical advice for speedier recovery?

Suzy

Got it.

Today:

26m 850.00 yards -----

4x25 2x50 2x75 2x100 200 2x50 10 sec RI

Didn't feel the best in the pool today so I bailed out a bit early.

G- when you were first starting out, how did you set your goals?  In particular goals for a particular race.  Did you shoot for certain overall times, certain times on the bike or run, just finish, etc?  I struggle with how I should lay out my goals.

Congratulations, saw the little blurb ESPN had on the race and I thought of you.  Way to go.