Asphalt Junkies CLOSED AND GETTING OUR FIX (Page 59)

Dirk....thanks for the advice regarding my run training schedule.  I am rearranging my weekly workouts beginning in mid June to see how it will work.  It'll take a bit of getting used to but I think it's workable.

On a (somewhat) side note.  I'm trying to find reliable childcare during the week so I can move my long run to a weekday.  I'd really like to do my long run on a Tuesday and my long ride on Saturday.  If I'm able to swing it, does this sound good?

David and Tracy thanks. I will pay more attention to my alignment as you are suggesting on my next ride as it is very likely I am not doing this. I will also take a look at the gel pads. They sound like a really good idea. 

Sorry I've been MIA but i have been out of town for work.  BTW, I'll be gone next week too   But I have been getting my training in.  I've been focusing on swimming since it is finally warm enough to get in and not be shivering.  I am still struggling swimming but not nearly as bad.  I'm still not ready for a tri but at least I'm enjoying getting in the pool now.   It has turned HOT here, running in the mid 90's w/ high humidity is tough, just have to harden up..lol

David, I tried to cut and pste but i'm to stupid, so I read ur post about your 1st tri and how it took time from ur family.  I understand, that is why I quit professional bass fishing, however if you can get them to train w/ you that would be great.  Get ur family to do tri's w/ U and that way, U can go to some nice vacations as a family and get to do tri's...  just a thought.

Tony, the radial nerve of the arm ultimately works on the pinky and half of the adjacent ring finger.  You seem to be pinching this nerve at the point it travels through the wrist.

Try wearing a wrist brace designed for carpel tunnel syndrome.  And notice the position that brace holds your wrist in.  If you don't/can't ride with that brace on, at least memorize the wrist position and hold your wrist that way manually.

If this is ignored because you think you can tough your way through it, you will just damage the nerve and result in a pretty much permanent situation like you now feel temporarily after a ride.  Take care of that.

Here's a little description of what's been going on with me.

For a few months now I haven't felt right mentally.  I can't concentrate at work and find it hard to focus on anything...mind is in neutral.  Also been cranky and tired/sleepy and have trouble sleeping.  Just figured it was sleep deprivation from my very early mornings.  But it hasn't gotten better when I catch up on the weekends either.

I have also noticed an inability to push hard physically (especially noticed in my last race).  I have been in the habit of doing intervals on Thursday afternoons with my daughter and noticed when wearing my HR monitor that despite a 10 out of 10 effort on 400s (getting in to pass out territory) that my max HR won't exceed 162bpm.  Then by the time Jordan finishes the 400 about 40 seconds later, my HR is under 100 and down in the 70s before the next one...but I'm still winded and shakey.

So the HR doesn't seem to be high enough to support my demands.  So autonomic nervious system?

Anyway, it's gotten bad enough that I made a Dr. appointment and got in Friday for lots of blood tests.  My Dr. is assuming that I'm overtraining.  It's possible, but I don't feel the physical symptoms of it.  I do know that sometimes overtraining results in a depressed central nervous system before the body breaks down...this can be especially true if your training program is carefully designed to avoid injury, yet maximize volume.

I'm not so sure.  I've taken some days off and spent the last 5 or so days doing decreased training plus getting loads of sleep.  I took 2 vacation days last week in addition to the long weekend and don't feel different.  I'm wondering if I'm not suffering from clinical depression.  It's not a sense of sadness, but I hear that depression can work that way anyway.

You've also noticed that I'm a lot less communicative lately than I used to be....

Well, the blood tests should come back today and I will see what the Dr. thinks.  My Dr. is an avid cyclist who has done a HIM and understands athletes plus he's a great diagnostician so I'm in good hands.

When I took days off, I did feel upset/anxious so resting won't be a solution I think.

Jeff thanks and I was thinking the same thing that it might be carpel related. I was wondering if my job might be a contributing factor as I am on the computer(s) all day. It's not repetitive all day typing but I have been doing this for the last 25+ years so I am thinking it hasn't helped and the bike rides are just bringing this to the surface in a bad way. I will look into doing that as well.

Jeff,

I assumed you might be on vacation or something work related that was keeping you away from us.  Either way, you obviously need to take of yourself long before any of us but we have come to know how valuable a resource for advice you are to all of us.

As I think I have told a mentor sometime in the past (not sure which group) I have suffered from over-training too, only mine was caused during a time unrelated to triathlon.  I was  heavy into power lifting as most of you know but maybe some don't know that I was lifting every day without breaks or recovery time.  The short end was that my body wasn't allowed to recover and it resulted in a decrease in my strength over time (incidentally right before a large meet).  The result was much the same as you are describing; lack of sleep, poor workouts, very grouchy, etc.  I didn't knowingly suffer from the decreased HR because I didn't pay attention to such things at the time. So my message is that it could very well be an issue with over training.

Also, knowing the time it takes our bodies to go into this type of distress, I wonder if the beginnings of this came from when we were all trying to loose weight during the last mentoring session.  I wonder if you were to calorie deficient during that time and your body never caught up and now with the peak training season underway your increasing the demands further.  Only you can answer that one.

Take your time to back into the saddle, so to speak, and keep us updated.  If you need to take time away from the group feel free to do so with no ill feelings.  While your input has proven to be invaluable to each of us it is more important to me that you remain healthy.  Despite never actually meeting you I have come to know you well in the world of athletics and respect and think of you as a friend.  So, take of yourself, friend, and Warren, Jonathon and I will mind the group or help you as you may need our assistance.

Thanks Dirk.  There's nothing stressful about posting here but I find myself at various times either lacking in the emotional energy to even post, or seriously unable to string together a coherent paragraph (honestly...).

I am my most lucid during and right after workouts and fading in to fog between.

The Dr. said he ordered a cortisol test (or perhaps a panel that includes cortisol) which he seemed to indicate would either confirm or deny overtraining....but I had just done 2.5 hours of workout before the office visit.  Which brings up a problem with medical diagnoses for athletes.  Intense training can cause a host of false positives on tests.

I had a complete physical at work last year as part of a wellness program.  The blood tests came back with about 5 things out of the normal range...3 of which indicated liver failure---or muscle breakdown.  Duh.  It too was immediately after 2.5 hours of brick workout.

Karl, Leah likes to run, and the girls enjoy biking or scootering on the trails with us, so that isn't an issue.  But no one else wants to do long bike rides, and only one of my daughters swims.  So, if I want to include the family in training, I think that limits me to running.  Really, that's okay with me since I don't enjoy the biking all that much.  I'll still include one or two swims a week just because I feel like it's a really good upper body alternative workout.

Jeff, given the amount that you train, I think that looking at whether you've been overtraining is the place to start.  It would make sense that you don't feel like you've been overtraining, because you've trained your mind to be accustomed to things like always having sore muscles, as you've said here.  So you may not realize it when your body really needs a break.

Also, some German scientists released a study a couple weeks ago hypothesizing that many of us are suffering from self-induced jet lag.  By drastically altering out sleep times and wake times from the weekdays to the weekends, we throw off our bodies' naturay rhythms, which can replicate jet lag, and can cause a variety of physical ailments.  Here's the article: http://www.cnn.com/2012/05/10/health/social-jet-lag-obesity/index.html

Jeff, thanks for letting us know what's been happening, and definitely update us when you hear the results. It's great to have a doc you can trust and who knows the endurance athlete.

I also thought that work or something had been consuming you.  No problem wandering away for any reason at all.  There's no doubt you're more than a name on the net to many of us.  Even though I'm an old man of the group, I feel like I've learned so much from you on a wide range of topics, not all training related.  Take care of yourself first and foremost.  We got you covered.

David – I had to add a quick note to you.  I agree that family time is very important.  I struggle with this same thing.  I’ve been able to work out some training things so that the actual training part isn’t so bad, but it was the constant thinking/fretting/commenting that was wearing on my wife (and to some extent my boys).  So this year I’ve really worked hard to keep my thinking and comments in here and only minimally reflect to my clan on all the silliness that triathlon can become for us AG'ers.  That’s one of many reasons I really appreciate all of you and really appreciate when each of you shares your races and training victories and as well as the challenges.

But the real message is – don’t let your hobbies (and this one especially) interfere with that family time.  You won’t regret spending more time/energy on them, ever.  Only you can decide on the right and proper balance.  And that was a great debut race, by the way.

I agree 1000X with this assessment!  As I was getting ready for my first marathon last season it began to be obvious in a "Mr. Obvious," oblivious kind of way that I needed to shut up about my running.  My wife and girls got completely sick of hearing about my new weekly mileage running records, how far I was able to run at a fast pace, my longest run other than a marathon ever, blah, blah, blah...................  Since that time I too have reduced the amounts of comments and discussion I have about my recent training successes and so on.  Maybe you could practice a little bit of the same thing and see how that works out.

But, just as Warren is communicating, no one ever laid on their death bed and wished they had spent less time with their kids and more time training for triathlon.  If this is your passion, so be it but it's not necessarily going to be your family's passion and you have to find the balance to keep everything in check.

One final note about family:  I am now experiencing the beginning of the end of life without kids in the house and I am disappointed that it's coming to a close.  I have had some miserable failures as a father and many of them have been missing some of the things that the family life has needed while I was pursuing my own agenda.  I mention this so that others may hear my message and pursue the right path's of fathering their children.  Consider what the world might look like if fathers were more actively involved with their kids.

Jeff, your presence has definitely been missed.  I'm glad you are in good hands with your doctor.  We'll all be thinking of you and hoping that you are properly diagnosed and treated. 

Jo63 - 2012-05-29 9:53 PM So...... I ran with my niece on Sunday who has been my run training partner and she told me she is pregnant! She is signed up for the Marine Corp Marathon and can't fly or drive because she will be late in her third trimester so she said I can have her bib I am pretty excited!!!! I will have about 7 weeks after my IM so I think I should be ok.

You will love the Marine Corps Marathon!  That was my first one and my favorite by far.  I was running it for a special reason and purpose so it will probably always be my favorite race for those reasons.  There is a RR in my race log if you would like to read about it.

7 weeks should be plenty of time to recover from your IM and be able to run a full marathon too.  Heck, a marathon will feel like a 5k race compared to full IM at that point.

My wife did the Marine Corps and LOVED it!

Here is a real newbie question.  I'm looking at training plans and some days they have swim for a certain time and bike for a certain time.  Is that supposed to be done at the back to back or 1 in the morning and the other in the afternoon.  I can see where it would be better back to back but time constraints are really tough to get that much time in at once?

Another ???  I saw a few post back tht Aquasphere is the preferred goggle but which one is best, i don't recall seeing that.  My goggles leak so bad right now and I need something...

OK 1 last one for now.  I don't have a tri top, what is recommended?  Bike top?  running top? or tri top and really waht is the difference?  I've been going in just t-shirts...

Powerful stuff going on in the mentor group this week. Interesting to read about the issues of overtraining and Jeff I echo everyones sentiments. Take care of yourself but we miss you. I think I can safely say I do not have to worry about overtraining .

Dirk thanks for the reminder to enjoy the years with the kids while they are home with us. They are so needy during these younger years, it is easy to get bogged down with feeling like a servant and looking forward to them growing up a little.

I'm in a bit of a training doldrum. Just kind of blah about my workouts. Still going, just don't feel like pushing myself so hard all the time to swim fast or bike fast. Running is still a struggle. I have not been able to add much volume at all due to this cyst near my ankle. I tried a few 5 mile runs and the thing doubled in size. It looked like I had two ankles. So I'm back to the drawing board with the super short runs, maybe some aqua jogging and just trying to manage this issue so I can race again in July. I have no races planned for June because we'll be on vacation in the middle of the month when all the races are going on here.

My children are both playing ball this summer, if you call what they do playing ball. My daughter had her first T-ball practice last night. She sat on 2nd base and hid herself in her baseball hat then called to the team - "Look, am I silly?!" She was constantly walking off the field to play with the dog accross the street, singing in the outfield, running the wrong way, throwing the ball with her gloved hand LOL. Funny, we'll be gone a lot of evenings but I will be checking in with everyone as usual.

I'm a big proponent of separating the long run and long bike.  I know all the arguments in favor, but I think it's more important to get the most out of your training time and the long run will have more quality on fresher legs.  I don't think doing a long run the day after a long bike emulates the feeling of running after a long hard bike (like 70.3 or ironman race day).

That's kinda what I'm thinking.  Thank you.

I have the Aquasphere Vista.  They're awesome!

Typically you’d break up two workouts by doing one AM and one PM.  Bricks (back to back workouts) are usually specifically called out in the plan to be done back to back if that’s the intent.

In terms of tops – bike tops sometimes have zippers in the front and they have pockets in the back to carry stuff, or stow things like arm and legs warmers.  I’ll often start a morning ride with the arm warmers and then stash them in the pockets as I warm up, and the zipper gives you the chance to get some ventilation if you get even hotter.  The pockets can be a good place to put empty gel packs or other “stuff” you might accumulate during a ride.  And the running or tri tops work to wick away sweat, while most t-shirts will just accumulate the water and get heavy/uncomfortable.

For a race, you probably don’t want to put a top on after the swim (it’s hard to put anything on a wet body) so you’ll be wearing the same shirt the whole race.  Tri tops or even tight running tops are great for not retaining the water and they dry very quickly on the bike.

I have these Aqua Sphere Vista goggles , and for me they are perfect.  But like bike seats, swim goggles can be very personal, so try some and don’t be surprised if what works for someone else isn’t perfect for you.

We all go through training down times, and with some injury concerns it gets even worse.  Just do what you can and know better times are ahead.

I love your t-ball story.  I always tried to coach my son’s teams when they were really young.  It was a blast teaching them to have fun at all costs.  My theory on coaching/teaching younger kids is that if they learn to enjoy the sport, they are more likely to stick with it, or at last stick with some physical activity, and associate it with fun and not work.  We could use more kids playing sports of some sort, than a few playing really well while 98% sit on the couch by the time they reach high school.  Mini-rant over.