any religious people coming to terms with new found atheism? (Page 7)

John 1:14 "The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth."

The bible is the example left for us through the life, teachings, and ultimate sacrifice of Jesus.  So, the Bible is the owners manual on how to live the perfect life, in the eyes of God.

Ever thought of trying a Unitarian Universalist congregation? I joined one about a year ago precisely for some of the things you mention above. It's been helpful for me so far both with respect to my own beliefs, and teaching my kids.

Very kind of you to make the recommendation! I'm good though. I'm content knowing that I'm addressing what some folks would argue is the primary reason any religion exists: B/c humans are inherently afraid/saddened by the thought of death. I believe I am successfully "extending" my life by making myself important in others peoples' lives (e.g., my son) so that my "essence" will continue to live beyond my passing (my son will pass on my morals and so on). I don't think it's necessary to introduce, what to me is a vague idea of intelligent creator for either reassurance about death or morality.

E.g.: In a state of unorganized nature, eventually humans will choose to not kill one another not for altruistic reasons, but because it is a self-interest decision. By not killing x, x will reciprocate my "kindness" & y will learn by example....

I don't have kids but I can imagine that as a parent, if your kid doesn't show you gratitude for giving him life, caring for his needs and loving him that you'd be pretty ticked off.  I look at praise and worship as a way of thanking God.  Asking your kid for a thank you once a week doesn't seem like asking too much.

Sure.. no problem.  I mainly joined because my X started taking them to one of those right-wing evangelical megachurches that are so prevalent here South of the Mason-Dixon line, and I felt that it wasn't quite enough to tell them that I did not believe. I felt they needed to hear a different message, one that encouraged them to use their own brain and come to their own conclusions about larger questions.

I like your thought process in terms of extending your life, so to speak. That's a very helpful thought.

I don't think the Bible talks about "worship and praise" being a once a week event. 

This may shock you, but I feel the same way.  My kids have gone to church with us, but we have never forced them to go and I strongly encourage them to be critical thinkers.  The last thing I want is for them to believe something because Mom and Dad say so because if that's all their belief is then it will fail.

My oldest (18) is pretty firm in the agnostic camp, and we have a lot of fun talks.  He knows where I stand and challenges me all the time, and I do the same.  I certainly want him to believe, but he is going to have to find it in his own way.  I think it makes our relationship stronger because he knows he can talk to me about anything and I'll never judge him.

My other two kids are more active in the church and I'd classify them as believers, but they made their own choices and we never forced anything on them.

Your kids are clearly lucky to have you as a mom. 

Even if you/I/anyone was part of those megachurches or any religion, I think it's the parents' responsibility to REALLY answer their kids questions w/more than the "because that's what the bible/pastor says." IMO, that does not encourage responsible, intelligent, & truely good-natured citizenship.

I suppose more accurately I should have said something like "not have a set of beliefs forced upon them." I don't believe that this concept and Christianity or any other religion are mutually exclusive.

I recall one time I was talking with my 6-year old, and she mentioned how my X was trying to tell her what to believe in her heart, and how could anyone do that? I was proud and blown away to hear that coming from her, at such a young age.

Well, to be fair, even when telling her to believe anything she wants to believe you are still telling her what to believe.

Yeah, but that's a human reaction. Why reduce God to reacting like us lowly humans?

Fixed.

Needless to whom? You don't like what your ex is telling her to believe so that's not ok. I'm guessing your ex doesn't like what you tell her to believe? At the end of the day, both parents are telling the kid what to believe.

I get what you're saying, but look at it from the other side.  If your kid didn't thank you or show you gratitude, would you cast him in to a burning pit for all of eternity out of spite?  Sort of contradicts the whole unconditional love thing in my opinion.

Oh, you know, you're so right.

Thank you, thank you for showing me the error of my ways.

What if God doesn't cast you to a burning pit, but maybe it's something equally as bad.

Maybe hell is actually banishment from the ability to enter Heaven and be with God and in communion with him, based on choices that you made.

Much like a child may decide to sell drugs, kills someone and get locked up for life. That parent may still love their child unconditionally, but the child made decisions of their own free will, which led to them having to spend a lifetime separate from their parents and in a personal hell called jail.

As JPII stated:  "hell is the ultimate consequence of sin itself... Rather than a place, hell indicates the state of those who freely and definitively separate themselves from God, the source of all life and joy".

In the end, we cannot comprehend  the meaning of  "God" as humans.  We can only come to understand him as best we can with what we have.

Another thought:  the search for knowledge, wisdom and truth through Science or other means are not separate from God. It's quite  possible, that God has set us on this  path, in search of him.  We can only comprehend what we can conceive as humans to date.  If God is in fact infinite, and created the Universe, it's possible that he created all Universes, etc.

For me, Sociology, Philosophy, and Anthropology (and to a large extent life experience) answers most of these moral questions.  No book taught me not to lie, being lied to taught me not to lie.  And just because something is not "wrong" doesn't mean it's ok to do it, there are still consequences to every action taken.

Physics addresses the "explanation" of things for the most part.

If one of my sons grows up and kills someone, they should be incarcerated.  I will still love them, but they should absolutely be in prison.  If one of my sons grows up and doesn't love me, or doesn't want to talk to me, or doesn't constantly praise me and thank me for giving him life, I do not get to have him arrested and tossed in jail.  And even if I could, I would not.  Because I want my children to be happy.  I would never turn my back on my child just because he turned his back on me.

Obviously, I do not believe in God or any gods.  I wish I did, but I do not.  Quite frankly, my belief of the afterlife (which is to say I do not think any such thing exists) is pretty depressing.  I'd love to know that there are souls that spend eternity in some wonderful spiritual plane, or get reincarnated over and over again, or that I can just float around the local haunted house scaring teenagers.  I'd love to know that it doesn't all just end.  But that would take faith.  I've been to various churches, looked at different eastern and western religions, read a good chunk of the bible.  At the end of the day, I do not have any faith.  If I could fake it, I would.  But if there actually was a god, he's gonna know I'm faking so there's really no point.

Maybe I didn't look hard enough.  But I spent my time looking for god(s), and at this point in my life I'm comfortable living with the belief that he/they don't exist.  My Christian friends have told me he's all around, and I just haven't opened my eyes or my heart and realized it yet.  Ok.  Maybe I'm not smart enough to pick up what God is throwing down.  If he loves me and wants me to love him back, he can light a bush and say hi.  If that happens, I'll humbly drop to my knees and beg his forgiveness. It hasn't happened yet, and I'm not gonna hold my breath.

I'm not trying to offend anyone.  I married a Christian, she's (with my blessings even) raising our sons Christian.  She prays for me, my in-laws pray for me.  Maybe some day I'll find that light that everyone talks about.  

I was making no judgment about you.

Just wanted to bring an alternate analogy to the burning pit!!!

I know for Christians that sounds terrible, but for Atheists, that doesn't sound half bad.

If hell is the ultimate consequence of sin itself...and I put that together with the commonly repeated refrain that humans are all sinners...does that not mean we're all going to hell?

If I understand it correctly you will not "go" to hell.  You will simply "be" hell.  Or just separated from god.

I can totally relate to the bolded part above.  I was a pretty hard core Athiest for about 10 years and my Dad passed away during this period.  It really messed me up, because I couldn't reconcile with him just being gone.  This didn't have anything to do with my conversion later, but I still remember the feelings I had.  Just from a coping with somebody dying standpoint religion is pretty handy.  He's in a better place, is a lot better than "he's just a rotting corpse and everything he was is no more".  Not saying you feel this way, but it's exactly what I was thinking when he died.

As to your friends telling you he's all around, I used to have the same thoughts.  I would tell them, if God's real then he can come up to me and introduce himself and I'll be more than happy to believe in him.  Well he did come up to greet me one day, but he had a 2x4 and beat me over the head with it in a jail cell before I actually opened my eyes and saw him.

Once I became a believer I see him almost every day because I'm looking for him and I notice him.  He's not a flying spaghetti monster or somebody that I "see" but I see the things that are unexplainable continuing to happen over and over and over again since I became a believer and I recognize and give credit where credit is due. 
When I started my business and I just put my website online and say a prayer for God to bring me business and 30 seconds later my phone rings from a Pastor in a church I've never heard of telling me he just found my website (that I just finished creating and wasn't searchable on anything) and becoming my first customer.  One could say coincidence, but I don't see it that way. 
One week later I get a wrong number call from a guy in California who was friendly and I talk to him anyway.  He ends up needing the exact product we sell and I'm flying to California two weeks after I started my business selling almost $200k of product.  Oh, and when I get there he's got christian stuff all over his office and I find out he's a missionary part of the year.  I could name off 100's of things like that happening to me over and over again.  I'm either an exceptionally lucky guy with really good Karma or there's some greater power influencing the direction of my life.  I believe the latter. 

All I want is for my son to have a fear of SOMETHING, a bit of conscience, and not be a narcissist. One cannot believe how bratty selfish and overall entitled orientated kids can be, and that includes my son's best friend and many of the kids I teach at school. 

I started teaching him about character when he was old enough to communicate. He's almost a teen and it's ongoing... The kids that know how to work their butt off and be respectful of others and adults, are the ones who can be the most successful. If religion helps in this process then I'll encourage him in his faith.