$1.79's Mentor Group FULL of fast people (Page 9)
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![]() | ![]() kcarroll - 2009-05-17 7:21 PM Congrats to Lisa B!!! Jessica, make sure you post how today's race went. Still had enough left to play in my soccer league this afternoon. We remain undefeated, but most importantly no injuries on the field this week. Last week was pure carnage. Hope everyone gets off to a good start this week.
2 mins from your PR is awesome! Congratulations! |
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Champion ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() NEW WEEK! People who raced...let us know how it went. And fire away the questions.... Workouts: How is everyone feeling? Run down? Mentally? Physically? This week I am doing a bit more recovery work. I had a nice 90 minute massage last night to loosen up the body. I am visiting the chiro this afternoon. Hopefully I will have a green light this weekend. I am thinking of doing part of a century ride (TN). Not sure I will do the fully 100...the 62 option sounds good. And it is really flat, so I might do full on race prep. Plus, I am on vacation next with Tri Take Me Away (Yippee) |
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![]() | ![]() Recovery week for me as well. Just had a 20 minute ART session. Most of my workouts this week will be on the easy side. I'll go to Masters swimming twice, run a few times, figure out if I'm going home for part of the Memmorial Day Weekend, etc... Enjoy your vacation Andrew. |
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Pro ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() I feel really good, other than a massive bruise on my thigh from soccer yesterday. My week will be a bit unstructured. I leave tonight for Barcelona and have a crazy work schedule, including business dinners most evenings which typically start at 9pm. Will bring the run and swim gear and do what I can. My hotel is close to the beach, so I'm hoping to get in an OWS. Otherwise, will run when/if I can. No point fighting it. Not sure I'll have lots of BT time either this week, but at some point would like to hear from Andrew and Lisa B how they use coaches. When did you start working with one? How did you chose? What certifications are there and what do they mean? On-line or local? I am toying with setting a goal for a HIM next year and think I may need someone to kick me in the help me stay focused, or frankly tell me to stick with olys for another season. Have a good week! |
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Member![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() I am still alive! I can't believe how badly I needed to do this for me. I had a blast, and I am already kicking myself in the butt for not pushing myself hard enough (especially in the swim). I was very excited when I heard that I placed 3rd in my AG only to find out there were 3 of us! Oh well, I did not finish last overall and that was a goal (123/148). Here are my times: |
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Expert ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Great job Jess !! Congrats on finishing and feeling good, and you were faster than 25 people in your first race. That is great !! Don't be doing the Monday "I should have done this or that" analysing that we all do.... you are supposed to feel good coming out of the water and you did. I think you paced the race well to have a decent run. I also got 3rd in my age group once the same way you did but I was happy anyway. |
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Champion ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() GREAT job Jess. Keep in mind that you can't control who shows up on race day. 3rd place is 3rd place! ![]() A couple of things I want to comment on: 1. Your body reacted once you gave it time. The first 1/2-1 mile of the run is always difficult because you are forcing you brain and muscles to switch gears. Give it time and your body will respond. You did and the next few miles were easier. 2. Practice transitions. This is for EVERYONE. Triathlon may be about 3 disciplines but it is 5 events. You would be surprised how much time you can save if you know what you are doing. You did a good job in T1 and T2. Now do a great job. Set up transition in your driveway and practice it over and over. It sounds simple but most people fumble their way through it. 3. One of my biggest tips for transition is to invest in a race belt for your number and then clip it to your hat/visor. Don't stand there put it all on. Run while putting it on. When I hit T2, I am already out of my bike shoes, I carry my bike, throw it on the rack, slide on socks, slip on the shoes and grab what I need. If I have gels, I put them in my hat, Once running out of T2, I get situation. At Gulf Coast, the volunteer was yelling at me because I didn't have my number on. I yelled back, it is in my hand. I was running a 7:30 pace while making these adjustments. That is how you can cut your transition time in half. 4. Sign up and do it again. You had a blast and that is what matters. Between now and then think about what you need to improve on. More running? More biking? etc. I am willing to bet you can shave 3-5 minutes off your time with just a bit more training and focus. And feel free to ask questions..... |
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Pro ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Congratulations to Jessica!!! Great job. I did get my OWS in yesterday. My hotel in Barcelona is a block from the ocean, so grabbed the goggles and went down there. It was cccccold. According to google, water is only about 60 degrees. I managed to stay in 45 minutes and was a popsicle when finished. |
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Expert ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() I've been doing well and following my plan for 3 weeks, until yesterday when I got bit by a dog... now taking a couple unplanned rest days. I have a question about swimming. The other day I did 20 X 50m with odds RPE3, evens RPE8. I didn't time every repeat but did time #9, 10 & 19, 20. The difference between my easy pace and hard pace was 7 seconds, which doesn't seem like much, keeping in mind that I am slow (1:03 and 1:10 per 50 metres). That would be 14 sec/100m and 4 1/2 minutes over HIM distance swim. I'd rather swim at the easier pace and make up the 4 1/2 minutes on the bike/run/transitions. What should the difference be between my easy swim pace and a hard effort? Edited by cathyd 2009-05-20 6:58 AM |
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![]() | ![]() cathyd - 2009-05-20 6:57 AM I've been doing well and following my plan for 3 weeks, until yesterday when I got bit by a dog... now taking a couple unplanned rest days. I have a question about swimming. The other day I did 20 X 50m with odds RPE3, evens RPE8. I didn't time every repeat but did time #9, 10 & 19, 20. The difference between my easy pace and hard pace was 7 seconds, which doesn't seem like much, keeping in mind that I am slow (1:03 and 1:10 per 50 metres). That would be 14 sec/100m and 4 1/2 minutes over HIM distance swim. I'd rather swim at the easier pace and make up the 4 1/2 minutes on the bike/run/transitions. What should the difference be between my easy swim pace and a hard effort? I don't have an answer for you on this, but I know exactly what you're talking about. I think part of it, for me at least, is that as an inexperienced swimmer I lose my form a bit when I try to go really hard. When I'm not thinking about going fast I can make sure my form is perfect/as close to perfect as possible. I think the good form is better than expending huge amounts of energy because it's gives me the blend between speed and efficiency. |
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![]() | ![]() Congratulations Jess! Sounds like a good race! |
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Champion ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() cathyd - 2009-05-20 7:57 AM I've been doing well and following my plan for 3 weeks, until yesterday when I got bit by a dog... now taking a couple unplanned rest days. I have a question about swimming. The other day I did 20 X 50m with odds RPE3, evens RPE8. I didn't time every repeat but did time #9, 10 & 19, 20. The difference between my easy pace and hard pace was 7 seconds, which doesn't seem like much, keeping in mind that I am slow (1:03 and 1:10 per 50 metres). That would be 14 sec/100m and 4 1/2 minutes over HIM distance swim. I'd rather swim at the easier pace and make up the 4 1/2 minutes on the bike/run/transitions. What should the difference be between my easy swim pace and a hard effort? The is a really good question Cathy. In fact, my coach and I were talking about this the other night. First, I would ask if you have ever done any type of t-pace testing? You really need to establish a base line before analyzing you pace. If you haven't, I can provide more details on HOW to conduct the test. I would also add that most of us underestimate our abilities in the water because it is VERY easy to become complacent. I would say that 14s per 100 is a significant difference in time. For instance, my t-pace is about 1:32/100. If I am swimming 1:47/100 then I am totally sandbagging. In generally, I adopt the rule of thumb that t-pace is hard, t-pace + 5s is moderate, t-pace + 10s is easy. My (rhetorical) question would be, why would you give up 4-5 minutes in the water that you are capable of doing? Training at a higher RPE on occasion is to help prepare you for race simulation. The reality is that on race day you will swim at an RPE of 7-8 if not 9-10. Your swim is coming along well. Keep hitting the pool. Think about your form and position to the water on the harder sets. And remember, there should be a larger time gap between sets 19 & 20 if you are pushing the pace and taking short rest intervals. Otherwise you aren't working hard enough. ![]() |
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Master ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() kcarroll - 2009-05-20 3:46 AM Congratulations to Jessica!!! Great job. I did get my OWS in yesterday. My hotel in Barcelona is a block from the ocean, so grabbed the goggles and went down there. It was cccccold. According to google, water is only about 60 degrees. I managed to stay in 45 minutes and was a popsicle when finished. Wow! Great job! And I'm jealous - Barcelona! |
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Master ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Congrats Jess on a great race! This tri thing is addicting isn't it? Sign up for more! You'll improve with every race. |
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Master ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Hey guys- here is a recap of my race this weekend. Distance was an Oly (have only done 2 of this in the past) and I have to say this was probably my best race ever since I started doing Tris as far as effort, how I felt, overall results go and everything coming together like it should.
Bike was rolling with a few long climbs. This is my strongest discipline and I had a really good bike – avg was 19+mph!
Run – When I left T2 I knew I had to go to the bathroom and wouldn’t be able to run if I didn’t. Spotted porta john after crossing the run mat and started my watch cause I knew time doesn’t wait for those that must pee! Checked my watch after bathroom break and I was already at 2:30 (bummer). After that this was my best run in a race I think ever. First mile or so I felt like my quads were going to lock up cause they were cramping from the bike but somehow I got into a rhythm and just ran. Mentally I never gave up and just kept pushing. If it had not been for the xtra 2:30 my time would have been within :30 or so of my stand alone 10K time!
Interesting point – my HR avg for the bike and run were the same (which equated to Z4 for the bike and Z3 for the run). Which I felt the opposite as far as effort went. Andrew - does that make sense? Does this happen to anyone else?
My overall time was 2:48:xx and this is more than a 20 min PR over my best OLY distance race from last year. To tell the truth, I shocked myself – thought I’d be lucky to do it in 3:00. I also got 2nd Place AG (I would have kicked myself had I missed first by 2:30 but it was more than that).
I have been practicing my nutrition and I think this had a lot to do with my success as I never bonked. I took a gel about 15 mins before the swim. On the bike I had about 1.5 bottles of Infinit and took a gel about 2 miles before I got off the bike. On the run I had a gel at the halfway turnaround point. On the run I barely took in any fluids (it was maybe 70 degrees and drizzled some) but I know I need to work on this – Andrew – any ideas on this?
Only negative about the whole day is that I got some kind of tightness in my butt/hamstring and had to stop and stretch it during the run. That night and next day it was pretty darn sore. I did a lot of stretching and foam rolling and was smart (took me years to get to this point) and skipped my bike on Sunday. I’m happy to say that it’s now gone!
Next race is non wetsuit so I need to get other there an practice OWS this weekend without the wetsuit and hope that my first race without will be panic free and I’ll be over the hump!
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Champion ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Couple thoughts LisaB 1. Arnett should know your HR data so ask him that question. Does it shock me? No. It could be a number of things like pushing the bike really hard but holding back just a bit on the run. I know at GC, my first few miles were in solid z3. I would have guessed z4. 2. Learn to pee on the bike or invest in a larger bladder. :p 3. On the hydration, you did what you needed to do. I am a heavy sweater so I need more fluid than the typical person. The day was cool but probably a bit humid. As you move into warmer races, you will likely need to start taking stuff from the station. Why do you think you didn't take/need water? 4. Keep an eye on the tightness. It probably wouldn't hurt to ice it or pop a few advil after tonights bike just for precautions sake. Great race. It sounds like you had a good race plan and you executed it!!! |
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Expert ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() ADollar79 - 2009-05-20 9:14 AM cathyd - 2009-05-20 7:57 AM I've been doing well and following my plan for 3 weeks, until yesterday when I got bit by a dog... now taking a couple unplanned rest days. I have a question about swimming. The other day I did 20 X 50m with odds RPE3, evens RPE8. I didn't time every repeat but did time #9, 10 & 19, 20. The difference between my easy pace and hard pace was 7 seconds, which doesn't seem like much, keeping in mind that I am slow (1:03 and 1:10 per 50 metres). That would be 14 sec/100m and 4 1/2 minutes over HIM distance swim. I'd rather swim at the easier pace and make up the 4 1/2 minutes on the bike/run/transitions. What should the difference be between my easy swim pace and a hard effort? The is a really good question Cathy. In fact, my coach and I were talking about this the other night. First, I would ask if you have ever done any type of t-pace testing? You really need to establish a base line before analyzing you pace. If you haven't, I can provide more details on HOW to conduct the test. I would also add that most of us underestimate our abilities in the water because it is VERY easy to become complacent. I would say that 14s per 100 is a significant difference in time. For instance, my t-pace is about 1:32/100. If I am swimming 1:47/100 then I am totally sandbagging. In generally, I adopt the rule of thumb that t-pace is hard, t-pace + 5s is moderate, t-pace + 10s is easy. Your swim is coming along well. Keep hitting the pool. Think about your form and position to the water on the harder sets. And remember, there should be a larger time gap between sets 19 & 20 if you are pushing the pace and taking short rest intervals. Otherwise you aren't working hard enough. ![]() Ok, this makes sense that I need a baseline number to work from. Prior to last week all my swimming (since I started in Oct '06) has been at pretty much the same speed/effort. I've never done any kind of speed intervals before so this is new to me. My plan has a 1000 metre TT in week 13 (I'm on week 17 now). It's the BT RPE based plan so they give you a RPE to hit in each part of the workout. Do you think I'd do better if I was swimming a certain pace instead? (after testing of course). My (rhetorical) question would be, why would you give up 4-5 minutes in the water that you are capable of doing? Training at a higher RPE on occasion is to help prepare you for race simulation. The reality is that on race day you will swim at an RPE of 7-8 if not 9-10. This plan describes intensity of 9 as 'cannot hold effort for more than a minute or two' - how could I swim at that intensity for 1.2 miles? RPE 7 they describe as 'very strong; breathing very labored, but can still maintain pace for some minutes without slowing'.... that sounds more doable. |
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Champion ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() cathyd - 2009-05-20 3:13 PM ADollar79 - 2009-05-20 9:14 AM cathyd - 2009-05-20 7:57 AM I've been doing well and following my plan for 3 weeks, until yesterday when I got bit by a dog... now taking a couple unplanned rest days. I have a question about swimming. The other day I did 20 X 50m with odds RPE3, evens RPE8. I didn't time every repeat but did time #9, 10 & 19, 20. The difference between my easy pace and hard pace was 7 seconds, which doesn't seem like much, keeping in mind that I am slow (1:03 and 1:10 per 50 metres). That would be 14 sec/100m and 4 1/2 minutes over HIM distance swim. I'd rather swim at the easier pace and make up the 4 1/2 minutes on the bike/run/transitions. What should the difference be between my easy swim pace and a hard effort? The is a really good question Cathy. In fact, my coach and I were talking about this the other night. First, I would ask if you have ever done any type of t-pace testing? You really need to establish a base line before analyzing you pace. If you haven't, I can provide more details on HOW to conduct the test. I would also add that most of us underestimate our abilities in the water because it is VERY easy to become complacent. I would say that 14s per 100 is a significant difference in time. For instance, my t-pace is about 1:32/100. If I am swimming 1:47/100 then I am totally sandbagging. In generally, I adopt the rule of thumb that t-pace is hard, t-pace + 5s is moderate, t-pace + 10s is easy. Your swim is coming along well. Keep hitting the pool. Think about your form and position to the water on the harder sets. And remember, there should be a larger time gap between sets 19 & 20 if you are pushing the pace and taking short rest intervals. Otherwise you aren't working hard enough. ![]() Ok, this makes sense that I need a baseline number to work from. Prior to last week all my swimming (since I started in Oct '06) has been at pretty much the same speed/effort. I've never done any kind of speed intervals before so this is new to me. My plan has a 1000 metre TT in week 13 (I'm on week 17 now). It's the BT RPE based plan so they give you a RPE to hit in each part of the workout. Do you think I'd do better if I was swimming a certain pace instead? (after testing of course). My (rhetorical) question would be, why would you give up 4-5 minutes in the water that you are capable of doing? Training at a higher RPE on occasion is to help prepare you for race simulation. The reality is that on race day you will swim at an RPE of 7-8 if not 9-10. This plan describes intensity of 9 as 'cannot hold effort for more than a minute or two' - how could I swim at that intensity for 1.2 miles? RPE 7 they describe as 'very strong; breathing very labored, but can still maintain pace for some minutes without slowing'.... that sounds more doable. Keep in mind that the BT plans are one size fits all. And the scale for RPE will vary from running, biking to swimming because of the sports impact on the body. I personally like to test early and often. It is a sure fire way to see improvement. If you want, you could hit the pool on your next swim and do the 1000y TT. The key is you want to do this at a hard but steady rate. Then take your time and divide it by 10 (or use the BT pace calculator). This becomes your t-pace. Ideally, t-pace is probably a 7-8 on the RPE scale. From there I might develop RPE 4-6 as t-pace plus 5 seconds and RPE 1-3 at t-pace plus 10 seconds. In other words, if t-pace (from the test) is 1:50, then RPE 5 becomes 1:55 and RPE becomes 2:00. 5 & 10 seconds are general rule of thumbs. Once you have the base line set, you can begin to alter the 5 & 10 rule. You might be more of a 7 & 12 or something like that. What you want to do is retest every so often. And track it to remember. For instance, I haven't tested in a while. But when I did, my improvements looked like this: 1/15 TT 1000y 18.01 1.48 pace 2/24 TT 1000y 16.44 1.40 pace 6/17 TT 1000y 16.07 1.37 pace As someone who doesn't enjoy swimming, I found this VERY rewarding to watch the times improve. I have a feeling the coach has a test on my schedule very soon. And I am eager to see what I can do. My goal for the season is to get sub-15. Does this make sense? |
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Champion ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() kcarroll - 2009-05-18 3:43 PM Not sure I'll have lots of BT time either this week, but at some point would like to hear from Andrew and Lisa B how they use coaches. When did you start working with one? How did you chose? What certifications are there and what do they mean? On-line or local? I am toying with setting a goal for a HIM next year and think I may need someone to kick me in the help me stay focused, or frankly tell me to stick with olys for another season. Have a good week! I haven't forgotten about this question. I have been thinking about it all week. In fact, I have tried to blog about it in the past. It is a very relevant questions, I just have a different perspective than most people on the subject and want to make sure I give you an unbiased answer. ![]() |
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Expert ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() That does make sense and I think having a goal pace would be easier for me than the RPE which I find a bit difficult to assign. My long swims are at the beginning of the week so I'll plan to do a TT on my first swim of next week. (plus I'm not sure if I'll get into the pool before then. Thanks Andrew. |
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Master ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() ADollar79 - 2009-05-20 2:25 PM Couple thoughts LisaB 1. Arnett should know your HR data so ask him that question. Does it shock me? No. It could be a number of things like pushing the bike really hard but holding back just a bit on the run. I know at GC, my first few miles were in solid z3. I would have guessed z4. 2. Learn to pee on the bike or invest in a larger bladder. :p 3. On the hydration, you did what you needed to do. I am a heavy sweater so I need more fluid than the typical person. The day was cool but probably a bit humid. As you move into warmer races, you will likely need to start taking stuff from the station. Why do you think you didn't take/need water? 4. Keep an eye on the tightness. It probably wouldn't hurt to ice it or pop a few advil after tonights bike just for precautions sake. Great race. It sounds like you had a good race plan and you executed it!!! I should have mentioned that I know how to pee on the bike and did it in Chattanooga and it took months to get rid of the smell of amonia in my expensive tri shoes! So I made the executive decision not to do that again and not to pee on the run into my $400 orthotics! On the run hydration what you say makes sense about thirst and the weather. I did stop at 3 water stops but only had a couple of little sips of fluids and felt like it was enough. When I do my long runs I use a fuel belt so I can sip as I go but Dan said unless I'm drinking something special (like infinit) at this distance that it was not necessary to wear it. And I am happy to report I think the tightness in my butt is gone. I rode last night too and I can't feel it anymore. Have not run yet since the race but will do that tomorrow night. And speaking of biking - I missed you tonite yelling at me across the road! |
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Master ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() ADollar79 - 2009-05-20 8:50 PM kcarroll - 2009-05-18 3:43 PM Not sure I'll have lots of BT time either this week, but at some point would like to hear from Andrew and Lisa B how they use coaches. When did you start working with one? How did you chose? What certifications are there and what do they mean? On-line or local? I am toying with setting a goal for a HIM next year and think I may need someone to kick me in the help me stay focused, or frankly tell me to stick with olys for another season. Have a good week! I haven't forgotten about this question. I have been thinking about it all week. In fact, I have tried to blog about it in the past. It is a very relevant questions, I just have a different perspective than most people on the subject and want to make sure I give you an unbiased answer. ![]() I missed this question. So I'll answer now. I have a coach for a lot of different reasons. Some that come to mind right now: 1) I want to use my time as efficiently as possible and not waste time doing workouts that don't get me to where I'm going 2) I am my own worst enemy and would do way too much at too hard a pace all the time - in other words I have no self control and I feel like if I'm not going all out all the time I'm wimping out. This is not correct and in indeed counter productive and I need someone to reign me in 3) I have been a competitive athlete all my life and have always had a coach - I like someone else figuring out what will make me the best at what I am doing. I am really good at executing someone else's plan! 4) I love having someone who actually cares about each and every one of my workouts and races and who will listen to me without judging and put up with me and my endless questions and problems 5) I have learned and continue to learn so much about this sport thru my coach who totally rocks! A note - when I first got a coach for tris I picked a coach because lots of people I knew were using him. Turned out to be completely the wrong coach for me and I luckly found Dan at a packet pick up for a race and switched (best thing I have done for myself on many levels). If you are to use a coach make sure you do your research and pick a coach that is right for you. Understand how much communication you get, what they expect from you and make sure they know what you expect from them. For me having a coach makes my tri and athletic experience complete on many levels. And I have improved way more and am much more of a triathlete with Dan than I would be on my own. |
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Champion ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Lisa B - 2009-05-20 9:54 PM And speaking of biking - I missed you tonite yelling at me across the road! Work was slow so I bolted around 3:30. I hung around talking for a while in case you showed up. |
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Member![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Congratulations on your great race, Lisa. |
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Champion ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() JessRod - 2009-05-23 7:42 PM Congratulations on your great race, Lisa. Welcome to the club. Hi I am Andrew and I have been clean for about 2 weeks. I fear I will have a relapse in another two weeks. ![]() TT stands for time trial. A TT is an all out effort and most commonly used in the sport to set some type of benchmark for testing--heart rate(HR), rate of perceived exertion (RPE). In this case, a swim time trial is typically 1000 yards all out. From there you divide your time by 10 to determine your speed over 100 yards. This becomes your t-pace. T-pace is your threshold swimming pace. It is defined as the sustained effort that I can hold over an "X" distance (in this case 1000y). I use this to decipher how to perform my workout. I know that my t-pace is a HARD effort, or RPE 8-ish. So when I am given a workout that looks like this, I know what to do: Warmup: 300 easy, (rpe 3, t-pace + 10 seconds) Main set: 5x200, hard ( rpe 8, t-pace) 10x50; odds moderate (rpe 5, t-pace + 5), evens hard (rpe 8, t-pace) Based on my 6/17 test, I would swim the 5x200 at a 1.37/100 pace. For the moderate sets, it would be a 1.42/100 pace. Think of it as sprints in the water. Does this make sense? If not, let me know and I will try to explain it differently. Also if you EVER have any questions on acronyms, terms, etc PLEASE ask. |
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