Penn State's mentor group - CLOSED! (Page 96)

2010-08-08 5:54 PM

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759

Subject: RE: Penn State's mentor group - CLOSED!

KATHLEEN KELLAMS

BIB	AGE	STATE/COUNTRY	PROFESSION
1557	47	HIGHLANDS RANCH CO USA	COUNSELOR

SWIM	BIKE	RUN	OVERALL	RANK	DIV.POS.
42:58	2:52:37	3:10:37	6:53:08	1004	38

LEG	DISTANCE	PACE	RANK	DIV.POS.
TOTAL SWIM	1.2 mi. (42:58)	2:15/100m	894	32

TOTAL BIKE	56 mi. (2:52:37)	19.47 mph

FIRST RUN HALF	6.55 mi. (1:27:47)	13:24/mile	1004	38
SECOND RUN HALF	6.55 mi. (1:42:50)	15:41/mile	1004	38
TOTAL RUN	13.1 mi. (3:10:37)	14:33/mile	1004	38

TRANSITION				TIME
T1: SWIM-TO-BIKE				4:01
T2: BIKE-TO-RUN				2:55

2010-08-08 5:55 PM

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759

Subject: RE: Penn State's mentor group - CLOSED!

way to go guys!

Ironman 70.3 finishers!

kenj

2010-08-08 6:48 PM

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5123

Canandaigua NY

Subject: RE: Penn State's mentor group - CLOSED!

dharris13 - 2010-08-08 6:55 PM way to go guys!

Ironman 70.3 finishers!

X2!!!

Congratulations to both of you!!

2010-08-08 7:13 PM

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2010-08-09 7:54 AM

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2010-08-09 8:53 AM

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Master

3546

Millersville, MD

Subject: RE: Penn State's mentor group - CLOSED!

Congrats to our 70.3ers!!! Looks like a smoking fast bike split... must have been exciting!

2010-08-09 9:12 AM

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Master

3546

Millersville, MD

Subject: RE: Penn State's mentor group - CLOSED!

calimavs - 2010-08-06 7:31 PM Thanks for all the thoughts on running and consistency. I want to try to build my run durability over the winter which is why I'm trying to move from running 3x a week to 4x a week. I think one of the reasons my running was a problem earlier this year is that I was trying to run half marathon training mileage while not running frequently enough to sustain it.

Agree that it's hard to try to go slower, especially when some days me trying to go slower means walking rather than running. I think I'll have to come to peace with that knowing that if I keep running more, albeit slowly, I'm going to get faster. My friends are trying to get me to go to track but I think I'm at the point where just running more frequently will probably lead to the greatest benefit for me.

Josh - I agree with Fred you would be a great mentor!

Please DONT go to the track with your friends. A 3x wk runner does not need trackwork to get faster at endurance paces... at least that is not the best bang for your buck, plus will greatly reduce your chance of injury.

Don't be afraid of slow miles if they are necessary to increase your volume through consistency. My blog for the first several months of the year was titled "the discipline to go slow" because I was making a very concerted effort to increase my running mileage without getting injured (something I had historically been unable to do).

I ran A LOT of miles with a HR in the 112-120 range. For me at the time that was about a 10 minute mile. It felt so easy... and that made it so tempting to run harder. But over the course of a few months I was able to build up to 50+ mile weeks... and it felt easy the whole time. I didn't take rest days or recovery weeks... I was just consistent through repeatibility. I was running 7-9 times per week, with 100% of those miles during the build phase with a HR below 140.

In April I raced cherry blossom 10 miler after having done virtually no speedwork, no tempo work, and absolutely no track repeats... and was able to average 6:40 per mile with an average HR near 170. I had not run a single mile in prep for the race anywhere near that pace, and certainly hadn't done repeats at faster than that pace to get to there. I also had not done any running at a HR anywhere near that level, yet had the fitness to hold it for 10 miles.

Where did it come from? It came from the increased aerobic fitness and running economy from running 7-9 times a week at slow speeds.

If I was preparing to race 10 miles right now, my run training would include a weekly tempo run for most of the prep, and a tiny bit of lactate threshold work in the month or so prior to my taper. The difference is that I have a pretty big base (I'm over 1000 running miles for the year) and my body can continue to do big miles + a little speedwork. If I was training for a marathon, I would probably do a tiny bit of tempo work but mostly seek to increase my weekly mileage through consistency... as in I believe that the best thing you can do to be faster at the marathon distance, even if you are already running 50+ miles a week, is build your volume through low intensity runs... even if that means you run twice per day multiple days per week.

Totally unsolicited advice, but if I was coaching you I would increase your volume by adding a short 4th run per week, and then increase it again by adding another short 5th run, and then increase it again by adding another short 6th run. Only after that point would I start increasing the distance of your long and medium runs each week.

2010-08-09 9:24 AM

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Master

3546

Millersville, MD

Subject: RE: Penn State's mentor group - CLOSED!

PS - thanks for the mentor thoughts... it is something I am considering, though to be honest I am being very realistic about my ability to follow through on the committment it would be... will I be able to give it the time the people who sign up for it deserve.

Right now I am leaning towards pursuing a Kona slot with eveyrhting I've got in 2011, and then taking a break from the IM distance after that. I think a post-Kona mentor group might be a better option for everyone.

Then again, I don't underestimate how much the mentor likely gets out of doing the job. There's the reward of being appreciated and watching people grow under your watch, but I suspect it would also be a good way to remind myself of the basics... that the principles of training that work for a less experienced athelete are likely going to be the same ones to get me the 20 minutes I need for Hawaii... whereas without the mentor environment I could see myself getting sucked into all sorts of training fads and sabotaging my efforts.

PPS - my wallet got $603.75 lighter this morning... I have a feeling most of you know what that means.

Edited by JoshKaptur 2010-08-09 9:35 AM

2010-08-09 9:30 AM

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2010-08-09 9:33 AM

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Kath2163

2010-08-09 11:48 AM

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943

Highlands Ranch, CO

Subject: RE: Penn State's mentor group - CLOSED!

PennState - 2010-08-09 6:54 AM Morning team!

I have yet to hear from our 70.3 finishers but am curious to see if the heat played a big role in the race?

I got a brief swim in this am, but am on-call now.

Happy training

Hi Guys!
Thanks for all the inspires and encouragement. For me the heat was definately a factor on the run. I was fortunuate to have cloud cover for most of the first bike lap but when that cleared up it warmed up fast. It didn't bother me on the bike but the run was another story. Since I was so undertrained for this (especially the run) my goal was to just go out there, do the best I could do and hopefully finish without suffering some heat related illess that has been plaguing on much shorter distances. My goal for the run was to walk the hills run as much as I could beyond that and do whatever I had to do to try and keep myself cool and hydrated (I have never drank so much Gatorade in my entire life as I did the days leading up to the event). I stopped at every aid station to pour water on me fill my hat and shirt with ice and grab spunges. This worked for the most part on the first lap. When I was running I was doing an ok pace for me. The second lap things got worse. As much as I tried to run, I just wasn't getting very far. I spent even more time at the aid stations trying to cool off and even tried a few pretzels and some coke a couple of times as the thought of eating another Gu or Gu Chomp was not at all appealing. There was no shade at all and from the few race reports and comments I have read, that was a factor for people. While I put some sun screen on before the run, I have a pretty good sunburn (certainly all the water I poured on my didn't help). I used Salt Stick and I think that helped. I really wanted to run more the second lap and I really think that is was the conditions more then my fitness that was a limiter. My legs could do it but I just was depleated. The medic at the finish line asked me if I was ok as I apparently had blue lips. I told him I thought I was and indeed felt better after awhile. My shoes were completly soaked and everytime I bent down to tighten them up, I would get really dizzy when I stood back up. That was a huge indicator for me that things were getting worse.
My swim was ok and I am happy with my bike time. I left the 12-27 on my bike as I figured the pay off for the easier gear was worth giving up a more powerful gear. I am not sure that that was the best choice. I kept spinning out so quickly that I know I lost some good time just waiting to be able to pedal. (this happened numerous times).
I went into this race worrying about even finishing due to the heat issues I have been having so I can't be dissapointed with my result. I would have liked to run more as my legs were ok but I just didn't have anything left.

As a side note, 1700 people signed up for this race and there were a little over 1200 starters. That seems like an awful lot. There were quite a few pros that never even started. Is this normal for this type of race?
Thanks again for the encouragement!

2010-08-09 11:53 AM

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kenj

2010-08-09 1:39 PM

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5123

Canandaigua NY

Subject: RE: Penn State's mentor group - CLOSED!

Kath2163 - 2010-08-09 12:48 PM

Great job Kathleen!

furiousferret

2010-08-09 2:51 PM

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Master

2404

Redlands, CA

Subject: RE: Penn State's mentor group - CLOSED!

Congrats on the finish Pete and Kathleen!

I'm officially a wetsuit stripper for IMAZ 2010. By the time Pete puts his first foot out of the water his suit will already be gone!

Edited by furiousferret 2010-08-09 3:46 PM

2010-08-09 3:57 PM

in reply to: #3031550

Master

3546

Millersville, MD

Subject: RE: Penn State's mentor group - CLOSED!

PennState - 2010-08-09 10:33 AM My advice for you Josh on the KQ thing is this:

You have the talent and the drive. Your running and cycling totals were astounding this year.
*I* think you need to work heavily on the swim.

Also, whatever time you think will get you a Kona spot will be even harder with each succeeding year.

LPM40-44 KQ to last rolldown slot (approx.)
2006: 10:26
2007: 10:22
2008: 10:19
2009: 10:12
2010: 10:02
2011: ?

You get the picture. ie; the other guys finishing where you did at LP are also getting ready to mount a huge effort at the Kona spot. We aren't in the same AG, but placed in our respective AGs fairly similarly.

I expect a race like LP to be 9:5x next year and all the other ones getting increasingly competetive.

Thanks for your thoughts, Fred. Interestingly enough, checking the M30-34 age group results over the last few years seems pretty consistent. It was about 1 minute faster this year, which is easily explainable by course/weather. Historically, sub 10 got you in, 10:01 and you missed it. This year there were two 9:59:XXers that did not make the cut.

Curious why you believe the swim hurt so much. I concede that it cost me 10-12 minutes (between swim itself and crowded transition). I wonder if you suspect it cost me more than that in terms of using too much of my energy during that event (I swam a very relaxed/controlled pace, but was tired by the end since I basically doubled my long swim of the year in the race).

I think I can get 5 minutes on the swim with minimal work, 8-10 with a lot of work.
I think I can get 2-3 minutes in my transitions (combined)

That leaves me needing between 8-15 minutes on the bike and run. I don't know how much more running prep I could have done this year. But even though I put in some big bike miles, I could have done more (especially during the early/off season) on the bike. I'm hopeful I can have the bike fitness to go 1mph faster (~16 minutes) and still run, or have the fitness to go faster but bike about the same pace as this year but be able to hold on to the 3:15 marathon. My guess is that it will work out to some combination of the two... a slightly faster (but still reserved) bike, and a slightly faster run.

All of this starts with a smart off-season in my opinion. I can't decide right now whether I should lay the foundation of a giant LSD base, then work on speed in the spring... or whether I should really focus on speed in the off-season, and then add volume in the spring. Right now I'm leaning towards major run mileage but almost all LSD, and lots of bike speedwork but minimal volume. Then in the spring I throw more tempo workouts in on the run, and start getting my long rides in. Oh and maybe I'll swim some too

I know this - my race this year was 9 months after being an overweight couch potato. If I can avoid starting from there again (ummm, it's called consistency/repeatability Josh) it will make a huge difference in where I am on race day.

Of course all that has to be balanced against burnout/injury risks.

Sigh - who wants to coach me????

furiousferret

2010-08-09 5:07 PM

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Master

2404

Redlands, CA

Subject: RE: Penn State's mentor group - CLOSED!

Josh, I'm far from an expert in the swim, but one thing I remember reading from ST is that starting at the front and hammering the swim to get in open will pay a huge benefit for your times. Seems to make sense.

phxphotog

2010-08-09 5:51 PM

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937

Subject: RE: Penn State's mentor group - CLOSED!

I got my 100 miles in on the bike while I was on vacation. That was my goal and I finished it up yesterday. I can tell that if I can keep up that volume that it will pay big dividends on my speed. I have also started to fine tune my nutrition on the bike and that has made the longer rides more comfortable after about an hour and a half.

The heat here is still causing problems getting workouts done outside. It suppose to be about 110 for most of the week and our gym is still going through renovation. The pool there may not be open for another 4 weeks or so.

Congratulations to our 2 HIM finishers this weekend. I thought your times were great considering the heat and altitude.

2010-08-09 6:39 PM

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zionvier

2010-08-09 9:28 PM

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1116

Thornton, CO

Subject: RE: Penn State's mentor group - CLOSED!

Thanks for the support everyone.

As Kathleen said, the heat really did a number on us out there. Like she said, the sun came out and for those not familiar with Colorado, it's not always cold and snowing here.

People tend to not realize we are technically "high desert" here. There are no trees or any other kind of shade on the course, we only got a couple gusts of cool breeze every so often, but I remember thinking that every other breeze that came along seemed to just be hot air and not cool. I walked the aid stations because of the heat (something I never thought I'd do in a race, but I knew within that first mile of the run that this race had just changed my mind). Cold sponge under my hat, cold sponge in the back of my shirt, water over the head and back, even started throwing ice in the front of my shirt (tight tri shirt + HR strap helped to keep the ice at chest level most of the time). I can't blame my poor run performance solely on the heat though, I know my training leading up to it was below par, but I also didn't consider this a priority race for the year.

I'm a little disappointed with my performance since it was so far off my goal, but I found other aspects to be happy about. 1) It was only my second HIM, so I'm still learning that distance 2) Although only by a few minutes, it still technically is a new PR for a HIM 3) Following my HIM last year I had to use my arms to lower myself into a chair because my legs couldn't support my weight while the knees were bent, I struggled to walk up any steps and struggled to walk in general... but after this race I didn't feel anything like that. I was sore at first and need to recover and rehydrate a lot, but today I feel good and am about to go out for an easy 2-3 mile jog.... something that didn't even cross my mind for nearly 2+ weeks after the race last year.

2010-08-09 9:34 PM

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759

Subject: RE: Penn State's mentor group - CLOSED!

JoshKaptur -

PPS - my wallet got $603.75 lighter this morning... I have a feeling most of you know what that means.

SAWEEEEEEET!

2010-08-09 9:37 PM

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759

Subject: RE: Penn State's mentor group - CLOSED!

Congrats agtain Ironman 70.3'ers.

On a side note i ran for the first time since LP (have done some elipical work..but no actual running) and def got a little emotional....first time running since one of the greatest days in my life

I only did 10 minutes...but i was smiling the whole time!

WittyCityGirl

2010-08-09 10:18 PM

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Master

1471

Dunedin

Subject: RE: Penn State's mentor group - CLOSED!

Congrats Kathleen and Pete! Doing your first HIM is QUITE an accomplishment-especially in the HEAT!

I have been busy-not training, but studying and searching for schools. I've been pursuing psychology PhD programs for the last 5 years... it has been SO frustrating to want something so bad and get rejection after rejection after rejection. So, I decided that if I can be disciplined enough to sit my butt on a bike for hours upon hours then I can be disciplined to sit my butt on the couch and study vocab, math formulas and seek out a school that really fits my research interests. My GRE scores suck (I've taken the general test three times already) and so I've tried to study at least a little bit every day.

I have the inaugural Syracuse 70.3 next month-man, I thought Lake Placid was HILLY! I'm racing it as an Athena and I had hoped to really put up impressive times for this category, but I'm still slowly recovering from Lake Placid.

Tonight I did have a HUUUUUGE breakthrough! I was at open water swim and felt a pull in my lower left side each time I'd pull and breathe on that side. I kind of had an "a-ha!" moment and decided to see what happens if I only breathe on the right side. Lo and behold-no pain. I feel like my swim form is messy, but I'll take that over having a nagging hurty feeling all the time. =) This week I'm going to start running and I may have to actually start following a plan sooner rather than later before this HIM.
I'm also doing the Wineglass Marathon in October. I have a friend in my age group that qualified for Boston twice and she said that she'll hold off on her speed so that I can pace off her and see how close I can get to qualifying. I went a 4:06 in Philly last fall and so now that I have more running under my belt I bet that with training I could go sub 3:40 (although, I've heard from people with faster 5k times that it's really hard to drop THAT much time off of a mary the 2nd time around). I held an 8:09 pace this past April for a 15k just because I had a guy from our tri club to pace off of (I had been asking around to see who was going an 8:30 pace because I forgot my Garmin-so I actually thought I had been running the race at an 8:30 pace!). We'll see!

WittyCityGirl

2010-08-09 10:23 PM

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Master

1471

Dunedin

Subject: RE: Penn State's mentor group - CLOSED!

Josh-that's awesome about Ironman Canada! You no doubt can shed some major time on your swim if you put as much effort into it as you have biking/running. I never got to see you swim so I don't have any particular comments on your stroke, but do you ever count your strokes per length? I'm wondering if you might like the "challenge" of "swim golf". Also, would you consider swim-specific strength training in the "off season"? Even just doing some strengthening with stretch bands so that you can mimic some of the instability of the water might be helpful. Just a thought.