Libya and Egypt Attacks (Page 8)
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2012-10-12 5:43 PM in reply to: #4448428 |
Subject: RE: Libya and Egypt Attacks jmk-brooklyn - 2012-10-10 10:51 AM crusevegas - 2012-10-10 12:33 PM You keep saying that the White House knowingly left these people in harm’s way “for political gain”. I guess what I don’t understand is why you think anyone in the government would think that it would be politically advantageous to deliberately allow our embassy to be overrun and our ambassador murdered. How would they expect for that to reflect well upon them? That seems counterintuitive. GomesBolt - 2012-10-10 10:24 AM crusevegas - 2012-10-10 1:07 PM I'm confused, the State Dept. is claiming they NEVER said, thought or told anyone that the attacks in Libya were due to some video? What? Where'd you hear that? I thought the head of the State Department is the Secretary of State. I'm confused. Maybe we need someone on the left to explain this to us... GEARBOY! Where are you? Well I heard it on Faux news, it was live or at least I was under the impression that it was live testimony during the Senate Hearings this morning. I looked at CNN and MSNBC and they were talking about the assult on Big Bird on MSNBC and I don't recall what CNN was covering at that time. In fairness to CNN they did for a short period cover the hearing. Looks like from what I've heard in the hearings the White House did in fact leave these people at risk for Political gain, and knowingly so. I did say and stand by what I said and I will be happy to go over why I think what I stated above. Before I go to the effort and spend the time to do so for you, I'd like your answer to a question. Do you think President Obama either himself or via his spokesperson('s) lied to the American people in the first week of the attack? |
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2012-10-12 7:01 PM in reply to: #4452049 |
Subject: ... This user's post has been ignored. |
2012-10-12 8:00 PM in reply to: #4452121 |
Elite 6387 | Subject: RE: Libya and Egypt Attacks UrsusAdiposimus - 2012-10-12 6:01 PM crusevegas - 2012-10-12 6:43 PM jmk-brooklyn - 2012-10-10 10:51 AM crusevegas - 2012-10-10 12:33 PM You keep saying that the White House knowingly left these people in harm’s way “for political gain”. I guess what I don’t understand is why you think anyone in the government would think that it would be politically advantageous to deliberately allow our embassy to be overrun and our ambassador murdered. How would they expect for that to reflect well upon them? That seems counterintuitive. GomesBolt - 2012-10-10 10:24 AM crusevegas - 2012-10-10 1:07 PM I'm confused, the State Dept. is claiming they NEVER said, thought or told anyone that the attacks in Libya were due to some video? What? Where'd you hear that? I thought the head of the State Department is the Secretary of State. I'm confused. Maybe we need someone on the left to explain this to us... GEARBOY! Where are you? Well I heard it on Faux news, it was live or at least I was under the impression that it was live testimony during the Senate Hearings this morning. I looked at CNN and MSNBC and they were talking about the assult on Big Bird on MSNBC and I don't recall what CNN was covering at that time. In fairness to CNN they did for a short period cover the hearing. Looks like from what I've heard in the hearings the White House did in fact leave these people at risk for Political gain, and knowingly so. I did say and stand by what I said and I will be happy to go over why I think what I stated above. Before I go to the effort and spend the time to do so for you, I'd like your answer to a question. Do you think President Obama either himself or via his spokesperson('s) lied to the American people in the first week of the attack?
Embassy and consulate security falls way, way, way outside the President's day-to-day purview. Decisions regarding Embassy security fall to State's Diplomatic Security Service, which is responsible for the safety of State personnel all over the world. It's not really plausible that the President would go out of his way to leave a consulate insecure to somehow score political points. That's not to say no one is to blame, but your theory is sort of like saying the CEO of Toyota orchestrated the accelerator problems their cars had a few years back in order to score some sort of points. Not the most logical of conspiracies. It isn't a conspiracy against the embassy... it is the conspiracy to cover his political rear and not call it what it actually is.. a terrorist attack... because he will then be taken to task on the only thing that so far has not been a problem for him. I actually find this quite funny.... Obama ran to end two wars so he could take care of everyone here at home. Yet he has not taken care of anyone here at home except his contributors... and the only thing he can claim success on he didn't actually do. If I have to hear the lie said one more time that Obama ended the war in Iraq I think my head will explode. Bush ended the war in Iraq and Obama escalated the war in Afghanistan. Yet now.... he ended both wars, secured peace, and killed OBL and Al Qaida. And now, he can't admit it was a terrorist attack which is plainly was, because that would actually mean the world isn't as safe as he says... and then of course he would actually have to deal with it instead of campaign.... which apparently was his problem with the debate...he was busy running the country and didn't have time to prepare. But ya, Romney lied and Big Bird died. At least we are on the important stuff. |
2012-10-13 1:40 AM in reply to: #4407320 |
Pro 15655 | Subject: RE: Libya and Egypt Attacks Wait......Big Bird is dead? I can't have nothing. |
2012-10-16 8:11 AM in reply to: #4407320 |
Pro 4277 Parker, CO | Subject: RE: Libya and Egypt Attacks Bill is out campaining for Mr. Obama, while Hillary is taking the heat over Libya. Of course, we all know when it comes to this president...it's always somebody elses fault. http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/clinton-tells-cnn-responsibility-libya-attack-010005118.html eta: to update link Edited by rayd 2012-10-16 8:12 AM |
2012-10-16 10:51 AM in reply to: #4452121 |
Master 1795 Boynton Beach, FL | Subject: RE: Libya and Egypt Attacks
Embassy and consulate security falls way, way, way outside the President's day-to-day purview. Decisions regarding Embassy security fall to State's Diplomatic Security Service, which is responsible for the safety of State personnel all over the world. It's not really plausible that the President would go out of his way to leave a consulate insecure to somehow score political points. That's not to say no one is to blame, but your theory is sort of like saying the CEO of Toyota orchestrated the accelerator problems their cars had a few years back in order to score some sort of points. Not the most logical of conspiracies. Agree that this hardly falls under the Presidents day to day responsibility. That said, what most people are discussing and what is area of focus is the handling of the matter post fact by the president. He was made aware of the incident well before you and I so there is a window of time that he has to get facts before addressing the matter publicly. I even give benefit of the doubt for another 24-48 hours to gather those facts. What is unfathomable is the matter in which it has been handled over the past 30 days and how the lies have backed the administration into a tight corner they can not come out of. Even with the relative free pass I see this getting from the media, it is not going away. So today Clinton comes out and takes some ownership, great. But the tight rope they have walked the past few weeks has caused major trust issues with administrations ability to handle foreign policy and I cant see how that can be defended. I am sure we will hear more about this tonight in debate. |
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2012-10-16 11:30 AM in reply to: #4455704 |
Austin, Texas or Jupiter, Florida | Subject: RE: Libya and Egypt Attacks cardenas1 UA Embassy and consulate security falls way, way, way outside the President's day-to-day purview. Decisions regarding Embassy security fall to State's Diplomatic Security Service, which is responsible for the safety of State personnel all over the world. It's not really plausible that the President would go out of his way to leave a consulate insecure to somehow score political points. That's not to say no one is to blame, but your theory is sort of like saying the CEO of Toyota orchestrated the accelerator problems their cars had a few years back in order to score some sort of points. Not the most logical of conspiracies. Agree that this hardly falls under the Presidents day to day responsibility. That said, what most people are discussing and what is area of focus is the handling of the matter post fact by the president. He was made aware of the incident well before you and I so there is a window of time that he has to get facts before addressing the matter publicly. I even give benefit of the doubt for another 24-48 hours to gather those facts. What is unfathomable is the matter in which it has been handled over the past 30 days and how the lies have backed the administration into a tight corner they can not come out of. Even with the relative free pass I see this getting from the media, it is not going away. So today Clinton comes out and takes some ownership, great. But the tight rope they have walked the past few weeks has caused major trust issues with administrations ability to handle foreign policy and I cant see how that can be defended. I am sure we will hear more about this tonight in debate. The quotes may be messed-up, sorry. Embassy Security is one thing. Yes, the president doesn't get a daily update on the number of Marine Security Guards or 3rd country nationals at every embassy in his daily intelligence briefing. But on 9/11, with one embassy having an angry mob scaling the wall and tearing the US Flag down and flying a black islamist flag, and other riots in Tripoli. Then, it's time for him to pay attention and say "What are my options." Maybe he did say that and chose option 3 "Do nothing, apologize to the muslim world for a film and hope it all goes away." I've said it before, Bill Clinton ordered the evacuation/securing of several embassies while he was president before any of them were overrun and before any ambassadors were killed. The MEU is sitting in Djibouti waiting for something like this to happen so they can get into the mix. The FAST Teams are sitting in ROTA eating Paella, waiting for this type of order. When the Ambassador and RSO are begging for security and they're told no and they're later killed because they lack sufficient security; that is a clear indication that the President didn't appoint competent people to run his administration. The extent to which he wants this to just go away and the extent to which the Media is allowing it to slip to page 83 (NYT) is wrong. This is a "big f-in deal" to paraphrase Biden.
Edited by GomesBolt 2012-10-16 11:31 AM |
2012-10-21 3:11 PM in reply to: #4407320 |
Austin, Texas or Jupiter, Florida | Subject: RE: Libya and Egypt Attacks Just wanted to pull this to page 1 in advance of the debate where this is sure to come up. The interesting thing to me is that reading through the first 4 pages of this, the talk started off both on BT and in the media about the video, and that went on for a long time. Instead of the focus being on why the ambassador was killed and how this security failure happened, we were all diverted to watch this kabuki theater about a film and the arrest of a US citizen. Dick Durbin this morning tried to draw a parallel between amb Stevens and the RSO asking for more security, not getting it, to the Marine Corps Barracks, Beiruit attack in 1983 which was a case of having plenty of people for security, but the security was not built correctly nor was it covered correctly. One is a State Dept decision not to support the onsite official, the other was an onsite commander who didn't do his job. The Marine Barracks, Khobar Towers, and USS Cole were all examples of commanders letting their troops take the easy way, not build the best fortifications, not cover the defenses by fire. That's clearly not the case in Benghazi where they had neither the manpower nor the defensive fortifications. I highly recommend a reread of the first few pages for a reminder of the real time thoughts. This may be one of the few forums where you get people from all sides of a political issue expressing thoughts in real time and arguing those thoughts directly. |
2012-10-22 3:53 PM in reply to: #4407320 |
Master 2447 White Oak, Texas | Subject: RE: Libya and Egypt Attacks So let’s sum things up since the story and the thread has expanded. Day one thru day many official position is it was a protest that got out of hand and turned violent over a movie trashing the prophet Mohamed. Now some weeks later we know the following. There was no movie just a youtube trailer of a movie some guy wanted to make. The protest never happened it was an all out attack from the start. The ambassador or his staff asked for and was refused additional security. The building serving as the consulate did not meet minimum standards for protection and a request for upgrades was denied. Several attacks had been made on American interests in Benghazi over the past several months but security was weakened anyway. This administration has been lying about what happened from day one and the lying has distracted us from asking Do any of you think the Ambassador woke up on the morning of September 11th 2012 and decided the place to be was in Benghazi, where he knew elements of terror groups wanted to kill him, where he knew he would have no armed escort, be housed in a substandard location, with guards armed only with night sticks? Who told him to go and for what reason? That is the big question. |
2012-10-22 4:42 PM in reply to: #4407320 |
Pro 9391 Omaha, NE | Subject: RE: Libya and Egypt Attacks Breitbart did a pretty comprehensive timeline of everything and the concerns with each stage. Granted it's a right wing website, but I haven't found any other descriptions laying out the timeline and concerns as well as they do. I'm not sure why the press hasn't done that? lol BENGHAZI-GATE: A TIMELINE OF GOVERNMENT DECEIT, DECEPTION, AND OUTRIGHT LIES So, when Obama resigns after the debate tonight will Biden automatically be the nominee on Nov 6?
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2012-10-22 6:27 PM in reply to: #4464169 |
Master 2447 White Oak, Texas | Subject: RE: Libya and Egypt Attacks tuwood - 2012-10-22 4:42 PM Breitbart did a pretty comprehensive timeline of everything and the concerns with each stage. Granted it's a right wing website, but I haven't found any other descriptions laying out the timeline and concerns as well as they do. I'm not sure why the press hasn't done that? lol BENGHAZI-GATE: A TIMELINE OF GOVERNMENT DECEIT, DECEPTION, AND OUTRIGHT LIES So, when Obama resigns after the debate tonight will Biden automatically be the nominee on Nov 6? That is about the only thing I can think of worse than Obama winning Biden as President!!! As far as him being the nominee I am not sure I think it would come down to the rules of the Democratic Party.
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2012-10-23 9:19 PM in reply to: #4464327 |
Champion 6056 Menomonee Falls, WI | Subject: RE: Libya and Egypt Attacks Looks like someone has some 'splainin' to do. And this time, it ain't Lucy. http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/10/24/us-usa-benghazi-emails-id... |
2012-10-23 10:07 PM in reply to: #4466402 |
Pro 9391 Omaha, NE | Subject: RE: Libya and Egypt Attacks scoobysdad - 2012-10-23 9:19 PM Looks like someone has some 'splainin' to do. And this time, it ain't Lucy. http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/10/24/us-usa-benghazi-emails-id... Never, let me repeat, Never throw the intelligence community under the bus. |
2012-10-23 10:11 PM in reply to: #4407320 |
Austin, Texas or Jupiter, Florida | Subject: RE: Libya and Egypt Attacks Yep. They're lucky the anonymous source didn't release the real birth certificate too. (Sarc) |
2012-10-24 7:05 AM in reply to: #4407320 |
New user 900 , | Subject: RE: Libya and Egypt Attacks The "splainin" really came days ago when we learned that a predator drone was there when the attacks were taking place. Someone (in reality prob more than one in mult. agencies) was watching in real time what was happening and we did nothing but watch American citizens get attacked and murdered over a seven hour period. This bunch in the White House make me physically ill. |
2012-10-24 7:50 AM in reply to: #4466442 |
Pro 5755 | Subject: RE: Libya and Egypt Attacks tuwood - 2012-10-23 11:07 PM scoobysdad - 2012-10-23 9:19 PM Looks like someone has some 'splainin' to do. And this time, it ain't Lucy. http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/10/24/us-usa-benghazi-emails-id... Never, let me repeat, Never throw the intelligence community under the bus. Your comments are (nearly) always very astute. The WH surely p*ssed someone off that they shouldn't have. That being said, I'm not sure it's such a big deal, unless they had independent verification from somewhere other than Facebook and Twitter. All the email says is that they were under attack, and that a group claimed responsibility on FB and Twitter. Which this group later recanted. |
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