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2009-02-22 7:27 PM
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Subject: RE: esteil's Group - OPEN Ultras (iron on up 50k on up)
esteil - 2009-02-22 4:59 PM

Miss Kelly :-) hope you are doing good. Signing up for both the 50 k and the 40 miler sounds great (depending on the timing between the two?)! If the 50 k is first will give you a starting ground and intro to ultras, and the 40 miler will be that little carrot for the end of season. Check with both races though and see if either one typically sells out. With most ultras (this is changing as of late) you can typically sign up right before the event. That way you can evalutate if your body is ready without losing funds. Of course having it on the schedule and something to look forward to and committed is not a bad option either.

Signing up is a big deal when you accept something you don't know if your body is ready for yet. I commend you for taking that step :-)



There's actually only a week between the two so I wouldn't plan on doing both. I don't know if these races will sell out and I was thinking of signing up for both so I would have the option of doing either. I suppose contacting the race administrators makes a lot more sense though.


2009-02-23 9:15 AM
in reply to: #1975950

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Subject: RE: esteil's Group - OPEN Ultras (iron on up 50k on up)

esteil - 2009-02-22 4:53 PM aluminum - keeping it brief but with your schedule try to figure out what is your most important race you want to go for speed and which ones you will be using for base. The triple is the type of event with that many races it will either be a getting through it (as most do) or it will be the only target race. Realize everyone has different goals. Some take it way too seriously (it should be serious on a certain level for safety reasons) but just know you have your goals for the event. My only concern with that packed of a schedule is feeling like crap at the start line and being burnt out. Nutrition is of course key and recovery between is even bigger. You will get all kinds of advice anything from do nothing (feel this one is wrong) to train through the irons. Think there is a happy ground between the two. I really like using other races as training time for my key events. Just be smart about which ones you use. If you start to notice your snap disappearing, you might be over reaching and just know to back down and keep your eye on your key events. I don't know you, and since you are going into some land you have never been to before, you don't know you. But do know to look for all the typical signs of overuse/burnout/ect. You might find yourself in the middle of it, and not even know it. Do realize that at the end of the season is when you can look back at it all and marvel at just what the body is capable of, or be saying, wow, that was pretty foolish, I want more :-), or even, that was really foolish, what was I thinking? None of those are bad, it is nothing more than a fun journey and an adventure to see what you can accomplish. Just be smart enough to know when to say, back down, don't push too hard, and of course the opposite too. There is more, but I only logged on to get some directions and info today, so no time for the net. I will find some more time later this week. I blew up the engine in my sports car (out of town of course) and have been dealing with those details - happy its the car though and not the body :-)

Thanks for the advise Esteil.

A few thoughts of mine.  When I did IMLP 2007 I finished in 12:24 and felt that I never pushed myself.  I had a relaxed attitude, took bathroom breaks and felt way too fresh crossing the finish line.  Waiting til October to do the Double was the worst.  3 months of trying to train for distances that were unknown to me made motivation hard to keep. 

I'm fortunate as far as nutrition because I can eat chilli at a start line and nothing seems to bother me.  I do use Ensure Plus for Longer races.  I can't recall ever having G/I issues. I seem to recover well from races.  A few years ago I did a race everyweekend for the whole summer (sprints, olympic and halfs)

I don't have a number one or A race out of the 4.  My goal is to keep the 3 Ironman under the 13 hour mark and not go balls to the wall on any one of them.  Hopefully then I will be able to do the Triple with some sort of Dignity.  (finishing is definetely the goal)  Last time around I had a 3 month downtime in between my races which made training almost undaunting.  Hopefully with this schedule I will not have that problem.  Definetely balance is going to be key and alot of massages in between races. 

Yes people say I'm nuts but I agree with your comment about seeing how far you can push your body and see where it can take you.  Nobody knows the limits of our mind and bodies until we push them to the edge.

 

2009-02-24 11:03 AM
in reply to: #1864660

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Subject: RE: esteil's Group - OPEN Ultras (iron on up 50k on up)

Hey there, I know I am late to the show but I have been lurking here and would like to hang out a bit.

I started running in January of 2007.  I have done one 10 k, 2 half mary's, one sprint, one oly, one HIM and one IM (14:25).  My longest bike is 200km.  I have discovered that I really enjoy running long, although I am not great at it.  I have done 2 50k races, one last feb (7 hours) and one this feb (6:34, so a slight improvement).

I carry some weight, 6 feet 208 right now, but I feel in the best shape of my life.

My goals are:

2009:  Just a HIM in August here in Calgary.  Expecting our first child in 9 days so figure I won't be training much.  My goal this year is to get better at running, build a serious base.  Bike a bit in the summer, swim when I have time.

2010:  I want to do my 50k in feb again, but the day before they usually have a 1/2 mary, so I think I am going to aim to do both.  Then maybe a HIM and Ironman Canada then the Lost Soul Ultra (100km trail race) which is September.

2011 (august): Grande Cache Death Race (125 km trail race)

I have been thinking about this for some time.  I wanted to do the Lost Soul in 2009 and the Death Race in 2010 but I figure that my lack of base and complete lack of trail running would work against me.  Frankly, it is all about the Death Race for me, the idea of completing that is beyond cool.

I have been very fortunate in staying uninjured.  I run slow, I am not afraid of taking walking breaks although I have been transitioning those out of my runs.  I have never like intensity work.

I stay awake late at night imagining myself doing an unsupported double ironman.

Anyways, like I say I have been lurking, I think you are all super cool.  I am looking for some ideas about how to put myself in the best position to complete the Lost Soul and then the Death Race, how to move from someone who just recently (read August 08) started running 30 mile weeks to someone who can finish a 125 km race.  I have years to train and am looking forward to the journey. 

2009-02-24 12:20 PM
in reply to: #1976184

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Subject: RE: esteil's Group - OPEN Ultras (iron on up 50k on up)
hey kelly
With a week seperating then yes, contact the rd's and figure out terrain as well as close out. If you do not intend on doing both don't pay for both :-)
Give yourself a cutoff as to when to register and then do
The deed. You'll feel better once you set on a race and pay
The start fee.



Edited by esteil 2009-02-24 12:26 PM
2009-02-24 12:25 PM
in reply to: #1976870

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Subject: RE: esteil's Group - OPEN Ultras (iron on up 50k on up)
Ahhhh grasshopper you have learned the most important tool of them all - knowing what
Is needed to keep you going forward.

The recovery between ky and wisc is going to be the physical
Challenge. Have more but am physically at lunch on the iPhone.
2009-02-24 12:40 PM
in reply to: #1979159

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Subject: RE: esteil's Group - OPEN Ultras (iron on up 50k on up)
welcome home darren. As you can tell this isn't a daily
Hold your hand group - it is whatever you want to make of it. You've got
A variety of talent on here when they check in.

My goal is to give whatever insight and motivation I can and
For others to share their wisdom. I try to check in once a week (I limit online usage).
Sorry in advace for anything cryptic as often cheking in on the handheld.

You've got great goals with plenty of safe build time. It's going to be worth the journey!
Hope your wife is doing good and may the birth go safe and smooth!



2009-02-24 12:53 PM
in reply to: #1976870

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Subject: RE: esteil's Group - OPEN Ultras (iron on up 50k on up)
aluminum - completly forgot to say "screw whatever anyone has to say" ignore the naysayers and the armchair quarterbacks. Part of this process is learning to filter out the excess noise and run from the negative, energy vampires. You will need that energy no use in giving it away to the negatives in the world.

Is it possible you might be crazy? I just think the majority does not function on the same plane and that's a great thing. Vanilla is safe but my is it fun to see what is your limits. I love it when people step out of their comfort zone and peak into the unknown. Be it my 13 yr old patient Climbing mt. Ackinagua (sp?) or one of my other pts learning to stand for the first time in 8 mths. There all unique challenges and it doesn't make you crazy it makes you alive!

2009-02-25 4:59 PM
in reply to: #1979409

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Subject: RE: esteil's Group - OPEN Ultras (iron on up 50k on up)

esteil - 2009-02-24 11:40 AM welcome home darren. As you can tell this isn't a daily Hold your hand group - it is whatever you want to make of it. You've got A variety of talent on here when they check in. My goal is to give whatever insight and motivation I can and For others to share their wisdom. I try to check in once a week (I limit online usage). Sorry in advace for anything cryptic as often cheking in on the handheld. You've got great goals with plenty of safe build time. It's going to be worth the journey! Hope your wife is doing good and may the birth go safe and smooth!

Thanks.

Not so much looking for hand holding but I do have some general questions that I would appreciate some feedback from the group members, if you have a chance.

So, like I said I did the 50k last year and again this year(2 weeks ago).  Now last year I had this training program that had me doing back to back long runs on Saturday and Sunday, I think I got up to 4 hours on Saturday and 2 or 3 hours on Sunday.  Slow stuff.  All 10 min run 1 min walk.  Then I was lucky to get a run or 2 in during the week.  For this year I switched things up, tried to run 4-5 times a week (mostly 5) with a long run (2-3 hours) on the weekend and some cross training.

So that is were I am at, trying to move up my training to a 9-10 k every lunch hour (basically I want to run for an hour, I hope the distance increases over time) and a 20k on Sunday morning.

Of course the next run I am training for is the 50k next February, but I want to be in prime fighting shape for it you know.  Then I got 6 months for my 100k in September 2010.

What would you do for training.  Work on base plus the long run?  Make my long run longer?  Throw in some strides/temp/vo2 max stuff?  Work on base for a while then change? 

 Thanks guys.

 

2009-03-03 2:19 PM
in reply to: #1982006

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Subject: RE: esteil's Group - OPEN Ultras (iron on up 50k on up)
Darren - d. all of the above. You have plenty of time, and as you know, frequency is very important to help prevent overuse injuries. Using the 50k as planning for the 100k is very wise (and fun since its a race you like).

I am very slow - but what has worked is finding that perfect pace you can just sit back in and groove for days. Every event carries a different pace, and the sooner you train the neuromuscular fibers in your body how to handle a set pace the easier it will be for the body to know where to go to when you are exhausted/drained. Which is why I said d. all the above. I feel it is important to work on all of it. If you want to run fast, you have to train fast. If you want endurance you need to build the body up to endurance.

Perhaps at some point this year, find an activity - any physical activity - and try to do it for a bit longer than you think you can. This may or may not work, but from a n=1 experience just doing something physical for a long time has built up resistance in the body.

~eileen
2009-03-03 3:12 PM
in reply to: #1864660

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Subject: general thoughts for the week
Ok amigos - just some general thoughts for the week. Hope everyone is training and playing accordingly. Races are decided upon, entries paid, and training plans loosely put in place. If you are in need of crews, those are coming around smoothly too. Feel free to ask away anything you got.

Last week hit kinda hard on a personal level. Going about my normal daily events and bam what a week. Started off with one of my favorite patients' Dad passing away and attending my first ever Greek Funeral. Ended with the opportunity for one of my businesses to grow on a level I never dreamed of, which means hitting the nose to the grindstone yet again - this is truly going to be a fun adventure.

As in training/racing - life just happens. In the 'off season' the ability to apply the skills you have learned/learning for ultras to real everyday life is a pretty cool experience. This applies to whatever level the athlete is at as they develop new skills. Afterall, if you aren't learning, what are you doing?

Sitting back at the Funeral, just sitting there and physically palpablly able to feel the love in the room and the warmth was truly something magical. In Death comes birth and growth. Hearing the stories of a Man I never met, but only knew already through the patient and her 3 family members I've treated for 7 yrs, I felt as if I knew that man, because essentially at the root I really did. What I witnessed - that applies to everyone - is the unbelievable strength and courage the family displayed. Knowing there would be a crash in the end I prepared a small package for the family of goods that have seen me through the rough times in races - Sharkies, Emergen C packets, Larabars, incense sticks, Mustard bath. As silly as that sounds it is objects the family would never turn to, but would need. Of course, as expected, the whole family got sick. They are on the mend now - the physical, emotional, ect. All of them are stronger for it, as Death is a given for every one of us. It is just a question of are we fortunate enough to be able to bury our parents and not the other way around.

Today I got the pleasure of seeing 2 of the family members, and even though it is has only been a week, it's been a great week for them. To remind the Mom how much she accomplished in a VERY small window. How it is as draining as a Wedding (only the opposite feelings), and at the end the Newlyweds essentially go on a Honeymoon to, well do what lovers enjoy doing, and to recover from the Months of preparation, and for the Funeral it is the celebration of life (or whatever for each Religion). How in basically 2 days they planned an entire service for the burial of her Father - a Huge Greek Service. There were about 200-300 people there, both at the Prayer service and the Mass. It was the most uplifting (if a Funeral can be uplifting), love filled room I personally have ever witnessed. All of this at the conclussion of bed side time for about 10 days for roughly 14 hr days.

My patient and her husband are not athletes, but they performed smarter and stronger than most athletes ever need to perform. I had to remind her today that I was happy she got sick because finally the body would rest and she could sleep and recover. She was thrown into the thick of it and just performed. I have to say, her Husband is awesome - he quoted Leonard Skynard AND Wicked in his Eulogy - thats a true talent.

If you have never been to a Greek Funeral, it was something to be a part of. The part that caught me the hardest was knowing the family was having their last time in Mass with their loved one. The service was held at the Greek Cathederal and to witness everyone pay their respect to the deceased as they walked past the open casket was something else. The line went on forever. To see the strength of not only the family, but in particular the youngest on the aisle with all those people going by her - what a strong young Lady.

The take away from this - You really CAN do more than you think you can, especially when you need to. You can be strong when the time calls. Your body however, can only handle so much before it says - enough I need a break. Enjoy life, live to your fullest, make friends, love and be loved, don't waste your time on anything negative, exercise, and breathe. Our time is precious here, affect and effect those around you, leave a legacy, share what you know, learn from others, and most importantly enjoy life and those around you.

Happy SBRing. Next time, won't be so somber as my Favorite man in my life has been working with Music choices and different notes and what they evoke. He's an incredibly talented musician/artist and gaining some goods for the earbuds.
2009-03-14 6:15 PM
in reply to: #1864660

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Subject: RE: esteil's Group - OPEN Ultras (iron on up 50k on up)
Had my longest training run today.  28 miles in 6:45 with a couple other people running McNaughton.  First 10 miles were good with solid footing (it was 25F when we started).  The last 18 were a slog-fest as the ground thawed.  Tri training is going pretty well (except I did miss my 4200 yard swim today due to the run). 


2009-04-12 6:43 AM
in reply to: #1864660

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Subject: RE: esteil's Group - OPEN Ultras (iron on up 50k on up)

OK, 

I finished my first 50-miler yesterday.  Rain on Friday made the trails pretty muddy, but the weather was otherwise just about perfect for something like this, lows around 30 and highs around 50-55.  My finishing time was 11:32:12, about 30 minutes slower than I'd hoped, but 30 minutes faster than the *other* goal I'd set for myself.  I finished 21st overall and about 100 started the race. 

I'll write a full race report, but for now, I'm glad to be alive. 

2009-04-12 8:38 AM
in reply to: #2078915

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Subject: RE: esteil's Group - OPEN Ultras (iron on up 50k on up)
McFuzz - 2009-04-12 6:43 AM

OK, 

I finished my first 50-miler yesterday.  Rain on Friday made the trails pretty muddy, but the weather was otherwise just about perfect for something like this, lows around 30 and highs around 50-55.  My finishing time was 11:32:12, about 30 minutes slower than I'd hoped, but 30 minutes faster than the *other* goal I'd set for myself.  I finished 21st overall and about 100 started the race. 

I'll write a full race report, but for now, I'm glad to be alive. 



Congratulations!! Definitely post the link to the race report as soon as it's done.



Edited by MissKelly 2009-04-12 8:38 AM
2009-04-16 1:14 PM
in reply to: #1864660

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Subject: RE: esteil's Group - OPEN Ultras (iron on up 50k on up)

Esreil:

I have a question in regards to sleeping or rest breaks in the Triple Ironman.  I didn't take any breaks in the Double and found that to work out fine.  I'm curious if it is possible to do the same for the Triple.  Will I need a short nap or is it possible to go straight through.  I tend to do well with little or no sleep, (I have bouts of insommnia from time to time)but I definetely have not put this distance to the test. 

2009-04-16 9:57 PM
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Subject: RE: esteil's Group - OPEN Ultras (iron on up 50k on up)

Mcfuzz awesome job! I second misskelly plz provide rr link really cool to read first perspectives.
Be sure to rest up feed and fuel the body properly - congrads!!

March was an interesting month and have some things that are probably timely - recovery and the unexpected :-)
But on the iPhone will write more soon!
2009-04-16 10:18 PM
in reply to: #2089215

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Subject: RE: esteil's Group - OPEN Ultras (iron on up 50k on up)
will write more when I get to a landline (really limited time to net right now with my businesses and growth)

I can't remember what your prs are for the 2x and 1x and if you've ever done a century run. These facts can better help me suggest an eta.

The only ones I've seen not rest are the overall 3 in Germany (world record holders). Everyone HAS to rest as the wr I think is low 30s. 3x the whole rest thing really becomes part of the chess game. As your first triple you have no idea what your head, body, and crew are all going to hold up. That's not even taken into count weather, equiptment, nutritional - did I mention weather?

The only triple I've finished was one in a deca year as training and not in oct - those are typically used for base mileage and last kinks b4 A races. So I can't really point u to my rrs. Read as many others so long as they aren't from the core that uses va3x as final prep 4 Mex (basically just about everyone is safe to learn from but the euros, serge, betto, and mine).

I've got more for you but I've got someone giving me that evil eye.
Oh- hope you are signed up as I think the majority of ultras are sold out. I think only 2x hung, 2xslov and Mex are all that's still open (?) this really makes me smile!


2009-04-17 4:46 PM
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Subject: RE: esteil's Group - OPEN Ultras (iron on up 50k on up)
2009-05-26 2:10 PM
in reply to: #2092743

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Subject: RE: esteil's Group - OPEN Ultras (iron on up 50k on up)
McFuzz - awesome on the first :-)

To the group - wasn't expecting the economy to hit (who was?) and 2 of my businesses did the reverse of most. Apparently athletes care about taking care of their bodies (thank God!) so with a move, doing close to 16-18k of damage to my sports car and dealing with some not so nice injuries from Mexico I'm just now crawling out from under a rock. Hey look the sun shines :-)

I do not forsee my practice and one of my businesses to slow down (again, thankfully!) so still limited with time however, structure has been forced into my lifestyle. Think that is a good thing.

So...have committed to take care of my dearest guy friend in Virginia for his triple as prep for the 10 in 10. I'm putting this out there as I know some of you are doing Virginia - just want to give a heads up that I will physically be there - along with my massage table and maybe my bike if I can get it into my car. Granted my friend requires my personal attention (he's funny like that) but would love to get the group of BTers that are going and if you need some assistance during - I'm pretty good at multi tasking. Most likely M will be 'requesting' for only one or two cat naps from me. Which will be good to work on my sleep dep stuff. Love the man dearly so whatever he wants he gets.

Think one of the biggest things on the forefront of my mind (again, thanks to the athletes under my thumbs) is injury prevention and then the inevitable post race recovery.

Part of planning with ultras is not just getting to that start line, but recovering. I know this is backwards with the info the ultraites are looking for right now, but its been thrown at me for about 4 months now. I suffered the most nastiest of injuries this last event and am now dealing with the worst scar tissue damage and still a slight infection on my pinky toe from blisters. Nothing is knocking it out, just time.

Think that is all I really wanted to warn you kids about this stuff - even if you are in Z negative 3 the body still suffers overuse stuff. Even if you are seasoned. Think its normal that most have no clue what the body is capable of or the outcome but reality is picking up the pieces.

Think about the only other thing that has been on my mind this past month (thanks to one of my dearest male friends) is focusing so much on the obvious (preparing for the event) that normal cues that would prevent you from being in a stupid situation goes over your head. If a situation is getting to the point where you are asking yourself - when is enough enough? It's time to listen to your brain not your heart.

Ok - need to get my butt back to work as that apparently what is on the schedule for today.
Any of the group that is still around have anything specific post away or e me. Little removed right now from where everyone is at as just trying to stay ahead of laundry :-)



2009-06-29 3:16 PM
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Subject: RE: esteil's Group - OPEN Ultras (iron on up 50k on up)
2009-08-21 12:49 PM
in reply to: #1864660

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Subject: RE: esteil's Group - OPEN Ultras (iron on up 50k on up)
Anyone kick off anything big this summer, I haven't really been keeping up.

Me, myself, thank you for asking, am hitting a marathon that takes me up and down a mountain (1000 meters) at the end of the month. Going to kick my , going to brutal, going to make me cry. Not sure if it is going to be more difficult than my IM or not, but man that is a lot of climbing. I have been doing some hill training and trail training but.....well we will see if there is still a finish line when I get there.

Hope all is well.
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