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The new BO health care plan
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 2009-06-25 8:55 AM |
Elite  2768     Raleigh |  Subject: The new BO health care planSo this morning while watching tv, there is a story about the new BO Health plan that he is trying to get approved. Of course the usual talking point of "this will provide health care for roughly 50 mil uninsured americans" and we are going to do it by cutting $300 million is costs and then raising $300, million by raising premiums on the wealthy to help support the plan. Four 4 years I was uninsured by my own volition, I used the extra money to go to my 401K and I never had to go to the doctor. I am still self insured for dental. I am very upset about this madate on participating in a program and have no outlet to opt out. Sounds like Social Security to me and we already know that the SS program does not work very well. I cannot opt out of it and will propably not see any of the money I have paid into this broken and bankrupted system. |
| 2009-06-25 9:03 AM in reply to: #2241995 |
Expert 810 | Subject: RE: The new BO health care plan Yes it bothers me. 1 and 2 are my favorites. I was lisening to a BBC broadcast last week and they were discussing how thier helathcare is the root of a lot of their financial problems. |
 2009-06-25 9:05 AM in reply to: #2241995 |
| Subject: ... This user's post has been ignored. |
| 2009-06-25 9:05 AM in reply to: #2242029 |
Slower Than You 9566 Cracklantaburbs | Subject: RE: The new BO health care plan This plan is a very very very very very very bad thing. |
| 2009-06-25 9:06 AM in reply to: #2242029 |
| Subject: ... This user's post has been ignored. |
| 2009-06-25 9:11 AM in reply to: #2242035 |
| Elite 2768 Raleigh | Subject: RE: The new BO health care plan AcesFull - 2009-06-25 9:05 AM You are already involuntarily paying into a system through higher premiums that cover uninsured people when they show up at the hospital. As to your claim that other countries' systems do not work, you need to look at the research and not the pundits. People who live in countries with national healthcare plans (meaning EVERYONE ELSE) by in large LOVE their systems and often ridicule the US for our failure to provide basic coverage to our citizens. No I am not... 4 four years I was uninsured by choice and never had to go to the doctor. I never paid a cent to a health care professional or anything to do with the health care system. So no I was not involuntarily paying for anything because I chose not to use the sytem. |
| 2009-06-25 9:16 AM in reply to: #2242040 |
| Slower Than You 9566 Cracklantaburbs | Subject: RE: The new BO health care plan AcesFull - 2009-06-25 10:06 AM Imjin - 2009-06-25 9:03 AM Yes it bothers me. 1 and 2 are my favorites. I was lisening to a BBC broadcast last week and they were discussing how thier helathcare is the root of a lot of their financial problems. And is the #1 cause of bankruptcy in the US. Talk about a drain on the system! Yes, it's only health care that causes financial problems. Not living above their means and running up credit card debt they can't pay. Screw health insurance, I need a new Escalade! I see it all the time. |
| 2009-06-25 9:16 AM in reply to: #2241995 |
| Extreme Veteran 606 | Subject: RE: The new BO health care plan So the US is: 24th in Life expectancy worldwide 37th in overall health system performance And 2nd in health expenditures as a % of GDP 1 in health expenditures per capita |
| 2009-06-25 9:20 AM in reply to: #2242082 |
| Houston | Subject: RE: The new BO health care plan bcart1991 - 2009-06-25 9:16 AM AcesFull - 2009-06-25 10:06 AM Imjin - 2009-06-25 9:03 AM Yes it bothers me. 1 and 2 are my favorites. I was lisening to a BBC broadcast last week and they were discussing how thier helathcare is the root of a lot of their financial problems. And is the #1 cause of bankruptcy in the US. Talk about a drain on the system! Yes, it's only health care that causes financial problems. Not living above their means and running up credit card debt they can't pay. Screw health insurance, I need a new Escalade! I see it all the time. So you're complaining that they won't use their money for health care, but ridiculing a plan that would force them to have it? I'm confused. |
| 2009-06-25 9:28 AM in reply to: #2242104 |
| Slower Than You 9566 Cracklantaburbs | Subject: RE: The new BO health care plan pengy - 2009-06-25 10:20 AM So you're complaining that they won't use their money for health care, but ridiculing a plan that would force them to have it? I'm confused. Why are you confused? We have the liberty to make personal choices in this country. Those choices include where we live, what we do for a living, and what we choose to say about anything and anyone. It also includes personal choice regarding how you take care of yourself and your family. If you make poor choices, the bill for fixing those choices should not be passed on to others. Why should I be forced by the government to participate in paying for everyone's health care if I don't want to? I can't currently afford to purchase a new car, should everyone be forced to pay into a system so I can have a new car when I want one? Didn't think so. If you choose not to provide health insurance for your family, don't come crying to me when you can't afford the times you actually decide to see a doctor. Edited by bcart1991 2009-06-25 9:30 AM |
| 2009-06-25 9:32 AM in reply to: #2242132 |
| Houston | Subject: RE: The new BO health care plan bcart1991 - 2009-06-25 9:28 AM pengy - 2009-06-25 10:20 AM So you're complaining that they won't use their money for health care, but ridiculing a plan that would force them to have it? I'm confused. Why are you confused? We have the liberty to make personal choices in this country. Those choices include where we live, what we do for a living, and what we choose to say about anything and anyone. Why should I be forced by the government to participate in paying for everyone's health care if I don't want to? I can't currently afford to purchase a new car, should everyone be forced to pay into a system so I can have a new car when I want one? Didn't think so. If you choose not to provide health insurance for your family, don't come crying to me when you can't afford the times you actually decide to see a doctor. But don't you see. You're already having to pay for other people's health care. When someone without insurance goes to the doctor for some reason and they are unable to pay their bills, who do you think absorbs the cost? I mean, bravo for trigods being able to go 4 whole years without paying insurance, but if something had happened to him beyond his control and he was forced to go bankrupt because of it guess who absorbs the cost. Those people that do have insurance and those of us that pay taxes. Edited by pengy 2009-06-25 9:32 AM |
| 2009-06-25 9:40 AM in reply to: #2242035 |
Master 1895 | Subject: RE: The new BO health care plan AcesFull - 2009-06-25 10:05 AM You are already involuntarily paying into a system through higher premiums that cover uninsured people when they show up at the hospital. As to your claim that other countries' systems do not work, you need to look at the research and not the pundits. People who live in countries with national healthcare plans (meaning EVERYONE ELSE) by in large LOVE their systems and often ridicule the US for our failure to provide basic coverage to our citizens. Just because they "say" they love their system and ridicule the U.S. doesn't mean they are right. First, they don't know any different. Second, we're the freakin United States of America. We are supposed to lead....to innovate....to embrace free markets and capitalism. Why are we now concerned with doing what other nations are doing? I agree that we have some issues with our health care system. But creating a Government mandated universal healthcare system which REQUIRES everyone to participate is not the better option. |
| 2009-06-25 9:45 AM in reply to: #2242132 |
| Giver 18427 | Subject: RE: The new BO health care plan bcart1991 - 2009-06-25 10:28 AM If you make poor choices, the bill for fixing those choices should not be passed on to others. Well..someone's gotta pay for your seven-figure cancer. Do the docs, nurses, hospitals, drug companies, etc just eat it? |
| 2009-06-25 9:46 AM in reply to: #2242148 |
| Master 1895 | Subject: RE: The new BO health care plan pengy - 2009-06-25 10:32 AM bcart1991 - 2009-06-25 9:28 AM But don't you see. You're already having to pay for other people's health care. When someone without insurance goes to the doctor for some reason and they are unable to pay their bills, who do you think absorbs the cost? I mean, bravo for trigods being able to go 4 whole years without paying insurance, but if something had happened to him beyond his control and he was forced to go bankrupt because of it guess who absorbs the cost. Those people that do have insurance and those of us that pay taxes.pengy - 2009-06-25 10:20 AM So you're complaining that they won't use their money for health care, but ridiculing a plan that would force them to have it? I'm confused. Why are you confused? We have the liberty to make personal choices in this country. Those choices include where we live, what we do for a living, and what we choose to say about anything and anyone. Why should I be forced by the government to participate in paying for everyone's health care if I don't want to? I can't currently afford to purchase a new car, should everyone be forced to pay into a system so I can have a new car when I want one? Didn't think so. If you choose not to provide health insurance for your family, don't come crying to me when you can't afford the times you actually decide to see a doctor.I don't know if this is an answer....or a viable option....or if it would work at all. But my feeling is that if we had fewer Government supported entitlement programs, we would see more private charities pop up to help these people that need it. Does anyone else feel this way? I'm with someone that posted in another thread yesterday....I would be much more willing to give my money to help someone in need if I had the choice to do so. I would be much happier making the decision to donate money, than being required to do so by my Government. This too could potentially lead to fewer people taking advantage of the system....because the private groups can regulate how they see fit (rather than relying on a huge govt agency to do so). Just a thought. |
| 2009-06-25 9:51 AM in reply to: #2242200 |
| Slower Than You 9566 Cracklantaburbs | Subject: RE: The new BO health care plan run4yrlif - 2009-06-25 10:45 AM Well, someone's gotta pay for your seven-figure cancer. Do the docs, nurses, hospitals, drug companies, etc just eat it? I like to think that most people are intelligent enough to have some sort of plan in place should something like this happen to them (read: have health insurance). Apparently I am thinking incorrectly. My mother is a ten-year survivor of cancer. She is smart enough to make sure she has insurance that covered that sort of thing. Personal choice. Planning ahead. It's there if you want it, but don't force me to pay for it. Edited by bcart1991 2009-06-25 9:52 AM |
| 2009-06-25 9:56 AM in reply to: #2242040 |
| Master 2006 Portland, ME | Subject: RE: The new BO health care plan AcesFull - 2009-06-25 9:06 AM Imjin - 2009-06-25 9:03 AM Yes it bothers me. 1 and 2 are my favorites. I was lisening to a BBC broadcast last week and they were discussing how thier helathcare is the root of a lot of their financial problems. And is the #1 cause of bankruptcy in the US. Talk about a drain on the system! I don't think it is either Obama's plan or nothing. I think everyone agrees the current system has problem. It is more appropriate to argue over the different solutions in my opinion. Edited by Jackemy 2009-06-25 9:56 AM |
| 2009-06-25 9:57 AM in reply to: #2242228 |
| Giver 18427 | Subject: RE: The new BO health care plan bcart1991 - 2009-06-25 10:51 AM run4yrlif - 2009-06-25 10:45 AM Well, someone's gotta pay for your seven-figure cancer. Do the docs, nurses, hospitals, drug companies, etc just eat it? I like to think that most people are intelligent enough to have some sort of plan in place should something like this happen to them (read: have health insurance). Apparently I am thinking incorrectly. My mother is a ten-year survivor of cancer. She is smart enough to make sure she has insurance that covered that sort of thing. Personal choice. Planning ahead. It's there if you want it, but don't force me to pay for it.Some people wh can afford it, like Chris, choose not to. Lots of people plain can't afford it, like the millions of people Wal-Mart won't hire full time so they don't have to get benefits, for example. Seriously...how do you work 35 hours at minimum wage and afford literally hundreds of dollars a month for health insurance? |
| 2009-06-25 9:57 AM in reply to: #2242062 |
| Subject: ... This user's post has been ignored. |
| 2009-06-25 9:57 AM in reply to: #2242245 |
| Giver 18427 | Subject: RE: The new BO health care plan Jackemy - 2009-06-25 10:56 AM AcesFull - 2009-06-25 9:06 AM Imjin - 2009-06-25 9:03 AM Yes it bothers me. 1 and 2 are my favorites. I was lisening to a BBC broadcast last week and they were discussing how thier helathcare is the root of a lot of their financial problems. And is the #1 cause of bankruptcy in the US. Talk about a drain on the system! I don't think it is either Obama's plan or nothing. I think everyone agrees the current system has problem. It is more appropriate to argue over the different solutions in my opinion. Yes. Thank you. |
| 2009-06-25 10:00 AM in reply to: #2242184 |
| Subject: ... This user's post has been ignored. |
| 2009-06-25 10:00 AM in reply to: #2242132 |
| Master 2006 Portland, ME | Subject: RE: The new BO health care plan bcart1991 - 2009-06-25 9:28 AM pengy - 2009-06-25 10:20 AM So you're complaining that they won't use their money for health care, but ridiculing a plan that would force them to have it? I'm confused. Why are you confused? We have the liberty to make personal choices in this country. Those choices include where we live, what we do for a living, and what we choose to say about anything and anyone. It also includes personal choice regarding how you take care of yourself and your family. If you make poor choices, the bill for fixing those choices should not be passed on to others. Why should I be forced by the government to participate in paying for everyone's health care if I don't want to? I can't currently afford to purchase a new car, should everyone be forced to pay into a system so I can have a new car when I want one? Didn't think so. If you choose not to provide health insurance for your family, don't come crying to me when you can't afford the times you actually decide to see a doctor.Say you got really hurt or sick. Do hospitals have the right to refuse care if they determine that you do not have the financial ability to pay? |
| 2009-06-25 10:03 AM in reply to: #2241995 |
| Expert 810 | Subject: RE: The new BO health care plan Has anyone figured out why they say they can overhaul current governemnt programs and save X amount but they cant just do that anyway to save money? Old article but first up on Google for those that didnt understand what Iwas talking about http://www.statesman.com/news/content/news/stories/nation/2009/06/14/0614health.html |
| 2009-06-25 10:04 AM in reply to: #2242265 |
| Expert 810 | Subject: RE: The new BO health care plan AcesFull - 2009-06-25 10:00 AM hamiltks10 - 2009-06-25 9:40 AM AcesFull - 2009-06-25 10:05 AM You are already involuntarily paying into a system through higher premiums that cover uninsured people when they show up at the hospital. As to your claim that other countries' systems do not work, you need to look at the research and not the pundits. People who live in countries with national healthcare plans (meaning EVERYONE ELSE) by in large LOVE their systems and often ridicule the US for our failure to provide basic coverage to our citizens. Just because they "say" they love their system and ridicule the U.S. doesn't mean they are right. First, they don't know any different. Second, we're the freakin United States of America. We are supposed to lead....to innovate....to embrace free markets and capitalism. Why are we now concerned with doing what other nations are doing? I agree that we have some issues with our health care system. But creating a Government mandated universal healthcare system which REQUIRES everyone to participate is not the better option. Then suggest one, because right now we are paying through the nose for a system that is not keeping us nearly as healthy as those others. Our great advantage is that we CAN look at what other countries have done. Frankly, I'd like to see us slow down and design a new system from the ground up, rather than rush a weak system into place. This should be a multi-year process an NOT something cobbled together over the summer. Amen |
| 2009-06-25 10:06 AM in reply to: #2242266 |
| Giver 18427 | Subject: RE: The new BO health care plan Jackemy - 2009-06-25 11:00 AM bcart1991 - 2009-06-25 9:28 AM pengy - 2009-06-25 10:20 AM So you're complaining that they won't use their money for health care, but ridiculing a plan that would force them to have it? I'm confused. Why are you confused? We have the liberty to make personal choices in this country. Those choices include where we live, what we do for a living, and what we choose to say about anything and anyone. It also includes personal choice regarding how you take care of yourself and your family. If you make poor choices, the bill for fixing those choices should not be passed on to others. Why should I be forced by the government to participate in paying for everyone's health care if I don't want to? I can't currently afford to purchase a new car, should everyone be forced to pay into a system so I can have a new car when I want one? Didn't think so. If you choose not to provide health insurance for your family, don't come crying to me when you can't afford the times you actually decide to see a doctor.Say you got really hurt or sick. Do hospitals have the right to refuse care if they determine that you do not have the financial ability to pay? Private hospitals, yes. Public hospitals, no. Take it back: Private hospitals are required to provide treatment for emergent cases. Once emergent patients are stabilized, they are sent to public hospitals. |
| 2009-06-25 10:09 AM in reply to: #2242292 |
| Master 2006 Portland, ME | Subject: RE: The new BO health care plan run4yrlif - 2009-06-25 10:06 AM Jackemy - 2009-06-25 11:00 AM bcart1991 - 2009-06-25 9:28 AM pengy - 2009-06-25 10:20 AM So you're complaining that they won't use their money for health care, but ridiculing a plan that would force them to have it? I'm confused. Why are you confused? We have the liberty to make personal choices in this country. Those choices include where we live, what we do for a living, and what we choose to say about anything and anyone. It also includes personal choice regarding how you take care of yourself and your family. If you make poor choices, the bill for fixing those choices should not be passed on to others. Why should I be forced by the government to participate in paying for everyone's health care if I don't want to? I can't currently afford to purchase a new car, should everyone be forced to pay into a system so I can have a new car when I want one? Didn't think so. If you choose not to provide health insurance for your family, don't come crying to me when you can't afford the times you actually decide to see a doctor.Say you got really hurt or sick. Do hospitals have the right to refuse care if they determine that you do not have the financial ability to pay? Private hospitals, yes. Public hospitals, no. Take it back: Private hospitals are required to provide treatment for emergent cases. Once emergent patients are stabilized, they are sent to public hospitals. Jim, I know the law. It was a theoretical question based on one's individual choice to self insure. If one has the right to self insure and choose their own care do doctors have the right to not provide their services without fair compensation? |
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