Update on The Great Leg Turnover Experiement

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2005-08-22 1:52 PM

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Master
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Ann Arbor, MI
Subject: Update on The Great Leg Turnover Experiement
As I posted the other day I got tired of reading how leg turnover makes you faster. I read and re-read the section of The Triathlete's Training Bible so often I wore the pages down. IT also said, and this is a paraphrase, you would look dorky. Well in the end that was not a problem because I always look dorky when I run.

So Saturday I went out and today I went out. I have always run better in the cold (a little too cool this morning). Saturday it was 65 and 100% humidity and today it was 51 with 87% humidity. Because of the MS thing the heat matters a lot.

OK so I started out with the short choppy strides on Saturday trying to make them as fluid as possible and not brake at all. Result? Easily ran my 5 miles in 57 minutes. I had been in te 58-59 minute range but only on cool days. I could not keep up the strides the entire training run I had to revert back to the old strides at some point.

Today I did the short strides the first 2.5 miles and then alternated my longer slower stride with a fast leg turnover from utility pole to utility pole (same method I used to run/walk back in June). I did a fast turnover, breathing hard but not puffing, and alternated it with my longer smoother stride. I did not push the longer stride, just kept running.

Today I did the entire 5 mile run in 55 minutes. Chopping 3 - 4 minutes off my relgular time. I have never run 5 miles in 55 minutes before. EVER. It might have been the cooler weather but the leg turnover is really helping. I thought to run faster you had to run faster but every time I tried that I would only shave off a few seconds overall except for the gut buster 3 miler I did a few weeks ago but I was about to puke after that. Today the strides were more effortless. I had a little hip flexor soreness Sunday morning but it was 100% gone by today and I don't have the feeling I will be sore tomorrow.

I will conitnue to keep you posted and I know I am discovering electricity all over again. This is no secret but many people, me included don't turn our legs fast enough. Seems so rational in hind sight huh?


2005-08-22 2:01 PM
in reply to: #230870

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Master
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Subject: RE: Update on The Great Leg Turnover Experiement
I joined a training group for a 25k last spring and noticed the best runners with those short strides that keep the heels close to the ground. It looks almost effortless. Like you, I alternate with my former long stride running. I figure it's like changing hand position on the bike so as not to overwork a particular area.
2005-08-22 2:19 PM
in reply to: #230870

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Veteran
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Washington DC
Subject: RE: Update on The Great Leg Turnover Experiement
Congratulations on such a HUGE improvement ... especially so quickly. Keep working wih it and you'll see continured improvement. That run is just the tip of the iceburg! Ken
2005-08-22 2:33 PM
in reply to: #230926

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Master
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Ann Arbor, MI
Subject: RE: Update on The Great Leg Turnover Experiement
KenMierke - 2005-08-22 3:19 PM

Congratulations on such a HUGE improvement ... especially so quickly. Keep working wih it and you'll see continured improvement. That run is just the tip of the iceburg! Ken


It is a big improvement huh? I was thinking well it is only a few minutes but like Trixie said, "taking a minute off a mile is hard"
2005-08-22 3:06 PM
in reply to: #230870

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Lethbridge, Alberta
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Subject: RE: Update on The Great Leg Turnover Experiement
Just like spinning a faster cadence on the bike, I had to use a lower gear to increase my turnover during the run. I'm taking shorter strides, much shorter. Sometimes I feel like I'm almost running on the spot. However, I can keep the turnover rate up there without pushing my heart rate up and keep going for hours, literally, though it doesn't add up to much distance yet. I'm still very slow, just taking lots of short, fast steps to teach my legs the rate. And yes, it looks dorky but my 5k race times have been coming down too.

Try shortening your stride until you can keep your heart rate down and maintain the faster turnover rate for longer runs.
2005-08-22 8:13 PM
in reply to: #230870

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Master
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Gulf Shores, AL
Subject: RE: Update on The Great Leg Turnover Experiement
holy S($%$#$#$, that is an unreal improvement. I am now committed to finishing both of the books that sit on my nightstand. They are Mr Mierke's book and Chi running.

2005-08-22 8:37 PM
in reply to: #230870

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Master
2005
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South Florida
Subject: RE: Update on The Great Leg Turnover Experiement

From what I've read, you want to shoot for 90 foot strikes (on same foot) per minute...after you're warmed up, try timing a minute of regular paced running and see where you fall...I came in the low 80's..I guess I'll be needing some quicker turnover.  That's great improvement on your time! 

PS-do you stretch your hip flexor?  PM me if you need a good one for it..I used to get out of bed every day with hip flexor pain until I incorporated the stretch into my routine...

2005-08-23 4:49 AM
in reply to: #231372

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Master
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Ann Arbor, MI
Subject: RE: Update on The Great Leg Turnover Experiement
Mimir98 I have to work my PF and hip flexors a lot so I have a bunch, well a few stretches. My right quad is a little ouchie today so I am going to go slow and easy. I will work on the leg turnover 2x a week.I have a 10 mile race on Sunday I cannot get injured for. Sort of my A race till the marathon.
2005-08-23 6:03 AM
in reply to: #231511

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Master
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Ann Arbor, MI
Subject: RE: Update on The Great Leg Turnover Experiement
OK so I went out today and tried to be slower.

1. Speed is addictive.

2. I am a little faster now

I admit I have a hard time slowing down and not doing my very best.

OK now the caveats and words of doom.

There is no one book, no one technique that will work or should work for everyone. Chi Running, Pose Running, Leg Turnover, Mid-Heel Strike, Rear-Heel strike etc. I am a mid heel striker. If I try to move to my rear heel I get hellacious tendon issues. Anyone who tells me I must hit rear heel is setting me up for injury. No one should look to change their running technique overnight.

With Chi-Running everyone can benefit with his arm "rules". Do not cross your midline (wastes energy) and move your elbow like you want to hit someone behind you, not reach in front of you. For some people the lean is wonderful. I can't do it and should not. It's too hard on my ankles.

I believe we are pretty much able to do the best running stride for each of us inherently. I also believe we pick up bad habits as we age. So, Fine tune your own stride. If you are a heavy overpronator then that issue can be addressed (that is learned) but almost everyone pronates to some degree or another. It is biomechanically normal to strike the heel and roll forward towards the large toe as we run. Most people do that.

So. Don't try to reinvent yourself as a runner. Pick up what works for you with caution. Make small changes and then do it for a day and see how you feel the next day. Don't be all "I will up my leg turnover tomorrow and never look back". Up your leg turnover but treat it like a speed workout till you are more used to it.

That's all folks. Lecture over.
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