Snowden? (Page 3)
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Expert ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by Aarondb4 Originally posted by DanielG Originally posted by KateTri1 The vast, VAST majority of people who don't like the administration want the treasonous bastard beheaded. The people who are holding him up as some sort of idol are the ones who tend to vote in line with the current administration. Bad assumption on this one. Originally posted by Aarondb4 Originally posted by Left Brain Dude....just do some reading....it's all out there. The guy is a high school drop out who worked for the CIA for a number of years before quitting to do contract work for the govt. He walked out on his fiance when he fled the country. It'll be interesting how this all plays out....because someone is backing him financially, and most likely paid him a huge sum for the leak. This guy is no crusader.....he's an azzhole. Haha calm down, just diggin on your ability to know my wife's favorite ice cream flavor by seeing my license plate.
Okay, so he is a useful azzhole then. Character traits aside I am glad he climbed high enough to get the info and then inform the people what the government we pay for is really up to. They work for us and exist by our grace, they seem to think and operate the opposite. come on... People like Snowden because they feel like he's putting some kind of bad light on an administration they didn't like in the first place. You may want to check your assumption as well. Amazing how everyone gets to speak for the majority all of a sudden. Actually, there have been plenty of polls conducted since this issue came to light. I guess it would depend on how much one trusts polls taken but... in some sense they do reflect the views of many and can be somewhat reliably used to base an opinion or two. |
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Expert ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by KateTri1 Originally posted by Aarondb4 Originally posted by DanielG Originally posted by KateTri1 The vast, VAST majority of people who don't like the administration want the treasonous bastard beheaded. The people who are holding him up as some sort of idol are the ones who tend to vote in line with the current administration. Bad assumption on this one. Originally posted by Aarondb4 Originally posted by Left Brain Dude....just do some reading....it's all out there. The guy is a high school drop out who worked for the CIA for a number of years before quitting to do contract work for the govt. He walked out on his fiance when he fled the country. It'll be interesting how this all plays out....because someone is backing him financially, and most likely paid him a huge sum for the leak. This guy is no crusader.....he's an azzhole. Haha calm down, just diggin on your ability to know my wife's favorite ice cream flavor by seeing my license plate.
Okay, so he is a useful azzhole then. Character traits aside I am glad he climbed high enough to get the info and then inform the people what the government we pay for is really up to. They work for us and exist by our grace, they seem to think and operate the opposite. come on... People like Snowden because they feel like he's putting some kind of bad light on an administration they didn't like in the first place. You may want to check your assumption as well. Amazing how everyone gets to speak for the majority all of a sudden. Actually, there have been plenty of polls conducted since this issue came to light. I guess it would depend on how much one trusts polls taken but... in some sense they do reflect the views of many and can be somewhat reliably used to base an opinion or two. That would be the key. Also I missed the part of the article where the poll asked people what they thought of Snowden and then asked them what they thought of Obama. |
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Expert ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by Aarondb4 That would be the key. Also I missed the part of the article where the poll asked people what they thought of Snowden and then asked them what they thought of Obama. Well, I'm guessing most democrats would somewhat support their democratic president, and that republicans... wouldn't. And the poll basically was based on whether people thought Snowden did the wrong thing by leaking classifyed documents to the press. Them saying, I think he did the wrong thing.. would be an indication. My personal opinion is, since no one's prolly polled this and few would prolly openly admit to it, but, I don't think I'm being wrongly assumptive when I have the opinion that many of those who oppose the president (this administration), or those of a different political leaning don't mind seeing his administration smeared by scandal. I'm guessing I could make a good argument of it. |
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Master![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by KateTri1 Originally posted by Aarondb4 Originally posted by Left Brain Dude....just do some reading....it's all out there. The guy is a high school drop out who worked for the CIA for a number of years before quitting to do contract work for the govt. He walked out on his fiance when he fled the country. It'll be interesting how this all plays out....because someone is backing him financially, and most likely paid him a huge sum for the leak. This guy is no crusader.....he's an azzhole. Haha calm down, just diggin on your ability to know my wife's favorite ice cream flavor by seeing my license plate.
Okay, so he is a useful azzhole then. Character traits aside I am glad he climbed high enough to get the info and then inform the people what the government we pay for is really up to. They work for us and exist by our grace, they seem to think and operate the opposite. come on... People like Snowden because they feel like he's putting some kind of bad light on an administration they didn't like in the first place. Correction: he's putting a bad light on every post-cold war administration. When the Soviet Union broke up, and eastern europe started being less of the "axis", the NSA's requirements over there were slowly reduced. At the same time, computing power has massively increased over the past 20 years. When was the last time you heard of a U.S. government agency willingly downsizing? It's entirely unsurprising that they started spying on Americans. Snowden just finally got the press to pay attention. |
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Expert ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by NXS My biggest surprise is that the Europeans are more outraged about the NSA spying on them than American citizens seem to be. If Snowden tried to "blow the whistle" by going to his superiors, does anyone honestly believe anything would have been done to correct abuses? Heck this monster is still collecting data on all of us. I guess the only privacy right the gov. still recognizes is abortion, and that isn't even mentioned in the constitution. From spending to spying we have a gov. out of control. It all makes me sick. Here is what I think, pure opinion. American citizens are not outraged because the information that the NSA has at it's disposal has not been used, so far as I understand, in a malicious way. Americans are not being rounded up, as far as I know, and being charged without probable cause. As far as I understand, our judicial system still works relatively well. So we all go on our merry way and worry about stuff like paying mortgage/bills and keeping our jobs. Europeans are outraged because, in my opinion, based on my travels, many of them seemed to have a love/hate relationship with this country. I always found it amusing how they seemed to revel in explaining to me, in great detail, their extreme criticisms of the the people and problems of our country. |
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Elite ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by BigDaddyD79 Originally posted by BrianRunsPhilly Can I play? Here's my take: 1. This country really needs to wake up and pay attention to the erosion of rights in the name of 'national security.' Guess what? You can record every single conversation, every email, and have people spying on each other, like the good old days of East Germany, and some zealot will still find a way to kill people. 2. I'm glad that the Snowden saga is making people think, although I fully expect it will fade into the background as we go back to worrying about the Kardashians, football season, and other mindless drivel. (Note - don't hate on me, I love football, I'm just saying we as a nation have short attention spans and lack of interest in real problems). 3. Snowden is a creep and a traitor, and in this case shooting the messenger is a likely outcome. I also think LB is correct in that this is more than a one person vendetta. As little as I believe in conspiracy theories, I have a very hard time believing this guy is acting alone and without resources. Personally I think your point 1 is a little off. I'm not American, I'm Canadian, and I'm a police officer. Here's my take. I hope the government is recording every call. I want them to be able to track patterns to stop as many terrorist acts as possible. The government doesn't care what you do, who you talk too, or what you talk about, Unless its about killing people. I could care less who listens to my conversations. Fill your boots. Then again I'm a law abiding citizen that thinks that the government has gone to far trying to appease the 5% of people who whine and complain about every right under the sun being infringed on. These are the first people to complain that the police/courts didn't do their job when killers walk out of the court room free because of a legal loop hole. I feel the government can listen to as many calls as they want as long as it saves me from having to explain to even one person why their loved one is dead. Just my two cents, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, it's their right. I personally hope Snowden is caught and tried. He just cost your government millions, if not billions of tax dollars and has most likely set back countless national security investigations. I just hope no one dies because of information not being gained now. I disagree. We do have a thing called the 4th amendment here which is contrary to what you are asking for. Also, while I'm sure most police officers like you and LB have good intentions, I don't trust anyone in the high levels of our government. Clapper is out there directly lying to congress with no repercussions whatsoever. I look at this the same way I look at our electoral system. There are people/corporations (they're one and the same now!) that are shelling out their own dough to get people elected. It costs literally, billions to run for president. You don't think those people are calling in favors once their guy is in office? If we allow the government to have all of this info it is more than ripe for abuse by the types of scumbags who are in DC. |
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Expert ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by KateTri1 Originally posted by Aarondb4 That would be the key. Also I missed the part of the article where the poll asked people what they thought of Snowden and then asked them what they thought of Obama. Well, I'm guessing most democrats would somewhat support their democratic president, and that republicans... wouldn't. And the poll basically was based on whether people thought Snowden did the wrong thing by leaking classifyed documents to the press. Them saying, I think he did the wrong thing.. would be an indication. My personal opinion is, since no one's prolly polled this and few would prolly openly admit to it, but, I don't think I'm being wrongly assumptive when I have the opinion that many of those who oppose the president (this administration), or those of a different political leaning don't mind seeing his administration smeared by scandal. I'm guessing I could make a good argument of it. Your "assumption" is exactly what is wrong with the electorate in this country these days. Rather than focus on the fact that the government is out of control and is seriously degrading the constitution, no matter who is in charge. Remember Bush signed the Patriot Act which opened the door for a lot of this crap. But rather than realize that the government is out of control you would rather talk partisan politics and play the dems vs. repubs game, which is exactly what both parties want. If you keep the electorate playing the my guy vs. your guy game then the government can continue to grow no matter who is in charge. Government growth typically means more taxes, more regulations and less freedom. Exactly the situation the writers of the constitution warned about. The BS partisan game plays directly into their hands and allows them to ignore the real issues and keeps the electorate from making good decisions in the booth. The whole point of the Snowden saga is that the government is taking liberties that it shouldn't. If someone wants to make a pressure cooker bomb and leave it at the next marathon the NSA is not going to stop them. Heck, rather than pay attention to the warning they received about the guy they completely ignored him and went through your phone records instead, that did a lot of good didn't it? The Snowden story has absolutely nothing to do with who is in the Whitehouse atm as both parties have proven time and time again they are out of control. The same durn thing has happened with the IRS deal. This time it is one side pissed that the IRS targeted them. According to your train here they are only mad because it was their side that was picked on, this would mean that the other side shouldn't care at all. What happens in 2017? Say the other side is in power and doing the same thing with the IRS. So now the roles are reversed, one side pissed and the other complacent. The whole time no one figures out that both sides should be pissed as this should not be happening to either side. Everyone needs to step away from the BS partisan game and stop defending their guys while both sides happily screw us over. |
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Expert ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by Aarondb4 Everyone needs to step away from the BS partisan game and stop defending their guys while both sides happily screw us over. In light of the fact that our country seems to be a party system.. how exactly is that done? |
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New user![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by JoshR Originally posted by BigDaddyD79 Originally posted by BrianRunsPhilly Can I play? Here's my take: 1. This country really needs to wake up and pay attention to the erosion of rights in the name of 'national security.' Guess what? You can record every single conversation, every email, and have people spying on each other, like the good old days of East Germany, and some zealot will still find a way to kill people. 2. I'm glad that the Snowden saga is making people think, although I fully expect it will fade into the background as we go back to worrying about the Kardashians, football season, and other mindless drivel. (Note - don't hate on me, I love football, I'm just saying we as a nation have short attention spans and lack of interest in real problems). 3. Snowden is a creep and a traitor, and in this case shooting the messenger is a likely outcome. I also think LB is correct in that this is more than a one person vendetta. As little as I believe in conspiracy theories, I have a very hard time believing this guy is acting alone and without resources. Personally I think your point 1 is a little off. I'm not American, I'm Canadian, and I'm a police officer. Here's my take. I hope the government is recording every call. I want them to be able to track patterns to stop as many terrorist acts as possible. The government doesn't care what you do, who you talk too, or what you talk about, Unless its about killing people. I could care less who listens to my conversations. Fill your boots. Then again I'm a law abiding citizen that thinks that the government has gone to far trying to appease the 5% of people who whine and complain about every right under the sun being infringed on. These are the first people to complain that the police/courts didn't do their job when killers walk out of the court room free because of a legal loop hole. I feel the government can listen to as many calls as they want as long as it saves me from having to explain to even one person why their loved one is dead. Just my two cents, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, it's their right. I personally hope Snowden is caught and tried. He just cost your government millions, if not billions of tax dollars and has most likely set back countless national security investigations. I just hope no one dies because of information not being gained now. I disagree. We do have a thing called the 4th amendment here which is contrary to what you are asking for. Also, while I'm sure most police officers like you and LB have good intentions, I don't trust anyone in the high levels of our government. Clapper is out there directly lying to congress with no repercussions whatsoever. I look at this the same way I look at our electoral system. There are people/corporations (they're one and the same now!) that are shelling out their own dough to get people elected. It costs literally, billions to run for president. You don't think those people are calling in favors once their guy is in office? If we allow the government to have all of this info it is more than ripe for abuse by the types of scumbags who are in DC. Thought I'd re-post a link to Maxine Waters bragging about Obama's data base having "everything on every individual" in light JoshR response above. http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-TV/2013/06/09/Breitbart-Flashbac... |
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Expert ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by NXS Originally posted by JoshR Thought I'd re-post a link to Maxine Waters bragging about Obama's data base having "everything on every individual" in light JoshR response above. http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-TV/2013/06/09/Breitbart-Flashbac... Originally posted by BigDaddyD79 I disagree. We do have a thing called the 4th amendment here which is contrary to what you are asking for. Also, while I'm sure most police officers like you and LB have good intentions, I don't trust anyone in the high levels of our government. Clapper is out there directly lying to congress with no repercussions whatsoever. I look at this the same way I look at our electoral system. There are people/corporations (they're one and the same now!) that are shelling out their own dough to get people elected. It costs literally, billions to run for president. You don't think those people are calling in favors once their guy is in office? If we allow the government to have all of this info it is more than ripe for abuse by the types of scumbags who are in DC. Originally posted by BrianRunsPhilly Can I play? Here's my take: 1. This country really needs to wake up and pay attention to the erosion of rights in the name of 'national security.' Guess what? You can record every single conversation, every email, and have people spying on each other, like the good old days of East Germany, and some zealot will still find a way to kill people. 2. I'm glad that the Snowden saga is making people think, although I fully expect it will fade into the background as we go back to worrying about the Kardashians, football season, and other mindless drivel. (Note - don't hate on me, I love football, I'm just saying we as a nation have short attention spans and lack of interest in real problems). 3. Snowden is a creep and a traitor, and in this case shooting the messenger is a likely outcome. I also think LB is correct in that this is more than a one person vendetta. As little as I believe in conspiracy theories, I have a very hard time believing this guy is acting alone and without resources. Personally I think your point 1 is a little off. I'm not American, I'm Canadian, and I'm a police officer. Here's my take. I hope the government is recording every call. I want them to be able to track patterns to stop as many terrorist acts as possible. The government doesn't care what you do, who you talk too, or what you talk about, Unless its about killing people. I could care less who listens to my conversations. Fill your boots. Then again I'm a law abiding citizen that thinks that the government has gone to far trying to appease the 5% of people who whine and complain about every right under the sun being infringed on. These are the first people to complain that the police/courts didn't do their job when killers walk out of the court room free because of a legal loop hole. I feel the government can listen to as many calls as they want as long as it saves me from having to explain to even one person why their loved one is dead. Just my two cents, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, it's their right. I personally hope Snowden is caught and tried. He just cost your government millions, if not billions of tax dollars and has most likely set back countless national security investigations. I just hope no one dies because of information not being gained now. She comes across like a blow hard ding bat with no clue.. honestly... I'm sure Obama does have a data base of his constituents . But having information on everything about everyone? lmfao |
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New user![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by KateTri1 Originally posted by NXS Originally posted by JoshR Thought I'd re-post a link to Maxine Waters bragging about Obama's data base having "everything on every individual" in light JoshR response above. http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-TV/2013/06/09/Breitbart-Flashbac... Originally posted by BigDaddyD79 I disagree. We do have a thing called the 4th amendment here which is contrary to what you are asking for. Also, while I'm sure most police officers like you and LB have good intentions, I don't trust anyone in the high levels of our government. Clapper is out there directly lying to congress with no repercussions whatsoever. I look at this the same way I look at our electoral system. There are people/corporations (they're one and the same now!) that are shelling out their own dough to get people elected. It costs literally, billions to run for president. You don't think those people are calling in favors once their guy is in office? If we allow the government to have all of this info it is more than ripe for abuse by the types of scumbags who are in DC. Originally posted by BrianRunsPhilly Can I play? Here's my take: 1. This country really needs to wake up and pay attention to the erosion of rights in the name of 'national security.' Guess what? You can record every single conversation, every email, and have people spying on each other, like the good old days of East Germany, and some zealot will still find a way to kill people. 2. I'm glad that the Snowden saga is making people think, although I fully expect it will fade into the background as we go back to worrying about the Kardashians, football season, and other mindless drivel. (Note - don't hate on me, I love football, I'm just saying we as a nation have short attention spans and lack of interest in real problems). 3. Snowden is a creep and a traitor, and in this case shooting the messenger is a likely outcome. I also think LB is correct in that this is more than a one person vendetta. As little as I believe in conspiracy theories, I have a very hard time believing this guy is acting alone and without resources. Personally I think your point 1 is a little off. I'm not American, I'm Canadian, and I'm a police officer. Here's my take. I hope the government is recording every call. I want them to be able to track patterns to stop as many terrorist acts as possible. The government doesn't care what you do, who you talk too, or what you talk about, Unless its about killing people. I could care less who listens to my conversations. Fill your boots. Then again I'm a law abiding citizen that thinks that the government has gone to far trying to appease the 5% of people who whine and complain about every right under the sun being infringed on. These are the first people to complain that the police/courts didn't do their job when killers walk out of the court room free because of a legal loop hole. I feel the government can listen to as many calls as they want as long as it saves me from having to explain to even one person why their loved one is dead. Just my two cents, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, it's their right. I personally hope Snowden is caught and tried. He just cost your government millions, if not billions of tax dollars and has most likely set back countless national security investigations. I just hope no one dies because of information not being gained now. She comes across like a blow hard ding bat with no clue.. honestly... I'm sure Obama does have a data base of his constituents . But having information on everything about everyone? lmfao No fan of Maxine here, but in the past she has opened her trap to let a few democrat plans out in the open that weren't supposed to be. I just find it a little too ironic after the Snowden disclosures. I'd like to see her explain the democrat data base that has the same ability and info as the NSA does. Edited by NXS 2013-07-09 3:42 PM |
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Master![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by KateTri1 Originally posted by Aarondb4 Everyone needs to step away from the BS partisan game and stop defending their guys while both sides happily screw us over. In light of the fact that our country seems to be a party system.. how exactly is that done? Make them accountable. Yeah I know the troubles with voting in our two party system.
... of course Snowden tried to get some accountability from them a different way. But what he did is small potatoes to Congress. He really needed to release a bunch of information the NSA had collected about their families -- medical histories or something they would go bonkers over. But would they go after the NSA for collecting the data in the first place, rather than shooting the messenger? Not holding my breath. |
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