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2017-12-19 2:55 AM

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Subject: Flip turn and oxygen debt solution?
I'm determined to do something about my terrible flip turn technique. I am in such oxygen debt when I do flip turns that my 1500m swim is well over a minute slower than when I don't use flip turns.

I heard about breathing to both sides before and after the turn, and after a search, I see that Sun Yang approaches things with back-to-back breaths going into and out of the turn. I tried this last week with only slightly better results.

I practiced this the other day (not a 1500m swim- flip turns again and again) and discovered that my breathing to my non-favored side is terrible, leading to not enough time to actually breathe and only enough time to complete my exhale. I think I've got everything worked out now and am looking forward to my next swim to test my new technique (basically making a conscious effort to leave my right arm extended while I complete exhalation and fully inhale to the left- something that comes naturally when I breathe to my favored side).

Has anybody else dealt with low oxygen after the turn? And if so, how did you fix things?


2017-12-19 10:13 AM
in reply to: Trilogy

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Subject: RE: Flip turn and oxygen debt solution?
1500m was my best event in HS....to be honest, if I was doing a time trial for that distance, I would mainly/mostly breathe to my dominant side for the entire thing, not just approaching the turn. By the end of that distance, if pushing it really hard, I'd pretty much be breathing every two strokes anyway, so it's going to be to one side or another, not bilateral. Any bilateral breathing would happen mid-lap, not coming into and out of the turn. My normal rhythm is 2-2-4 or 2-2-3, but I might do a couple extra rounds of breathing every 2 strokes when approaching the turn and after, especially late in the race, It's not like sprinting---breathing is not a waste of time. You don't want to go anaerobic in a 1500m until the very end. I'm sure others have different strategies, but that's what works for me.

You may also want to look at why you're getting so out of breath on the turns--it's normal to feel a little winded and need a few extra breaths coming out if swimming hard, but if it's worse than that, maybe it's taking you too long to flip over or something? It takes practice, and some core strength, to get it right.
2017-12-19 10:29 AM
in reply to: Trilogy

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Subject: RE: Flip turn and oxygen debt solution?

Originally posted by Trilogy  discovered that my breathing to my non-favored side is terrible, leading to not enough time to actually breathe and only enough time to complete my exhale

Just to clarify, you're not holding your breath when your face is in the water right? Are you exhaling while you're underwater in between breaths?

2017-12-19 12:28 PM
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Subject: RE: Flip turn and oxygen debt solution?

Originally posted by Trilogy

I'm determined to do something about my terrible flip turn technique. I am in such oxygen debt when I do flip turns that my 1500m swim is well over a minute slower than when I don't use flip turns.

I heard about breathing to both sides before and after the turn, and after a search, I see that Sun Yang approaches things with back-to-back breaths going into and out of the turn. I tried this last week with only slightly better results.

I practiced this the other day (not a 1500m swim- flip turns again and again) and discovered that my breathing to my non-favored side is terrible, leading to not enough time to actually breathe and only enough time to complete my exhale. I think I've got everything worked out now and am looking forward to my next swim to test my new technique (basically making a conscious effort to leave my right arm extended while I complete exhalation and fully inhale to the left- something that comes naturally when I breathe to my favored side).

Has anybody else dealt with low oxygen after the turn? And if so, how did you fix things?

You likely have a couple of things going on that are creating the problem - flawed technique and you aren't breathing enough.

Before you say, "There's nothing wrong with my technique;" I've been swimming for 45+ years, I competed at the national and international level back in the day and I have well in excess of 50,000,000 meters in my swim bank, yet I can improve my technique.  That isn't meant to be a subtle brag, rather to show that EVERY swimmer, can improve their technique.  If you have technique flaws, you aren't swimming as efficiently as you could which may cause you to quickly become anaerobic in the water.  As you become anaerobic your stroke will further break down.  All of that conspires against you to quickly place you into oxygen debt.  The first step is to improve your technique.

Next, bi-lateral breathing (the ability to breath to both sides) is a VERY important skill to have.  However, that doesn't mean you should necessarily be breathing bi-laterally during any particular swim.  Yes, you should work on bi-lateral breathing, but I submit you can do that by breathing to the left side on one lap, and the right side on the next lap.  Breathing every 3rd, 5th or more strokes merely puts you into oxygen debt.  It doesn't matter you ability level - if you swim far enough breathing every 5th or 7th stroke you WILL BE IN OXYGEN DEBT.  Consider this, the average respiratory rate of most runners and cyclists is 50-60 breaths per minute.  Even if you have a very fast turnover rate, when you are swimming and breathing every stroke cycle you are likely breathing at half that rate - meaning you are already behind the oxygen curve.  Breathing every 3rd, 5th, or more strokes only places you deeper into oxygen debt.  If you are swimming a 50m sprint, you can go the entire distance without breathing as you won't reach oxygen debt.  If you are swimming a triathlon, or training for a triathlon - an aerobic event - then breathing every stroke cycle is more advantageous.

Another thing that could be compounding the problem is HOW you breathe.  If you aren't inhaling, you should be exhaling.  That means whenever your face is in the water, you should be exhaling through your nose - no exception.  This has a number of benefits - a) when you actually take a breath, you are doing just that, efficiently breathing in - not explosively exhaling and inhaling, b) keeps water out of your nose, c) by breathing out during your stroke you reduce the buoyancy of your torso which will help prevent your legs dropping.

As to breathing too both sides as you approach the wall for a turn - that likely is going to cause more problems than it solves.  The act of breathing slows a swimmer down - even an elite swimmer.  For a triathlete that is somewhat technique challenged, the amount he/she slows will be even more pronounced.  If you breath to both sides going in to the wall, especially if you breathe less efficiently to one side then the other, all you really are going to accomplish is slow yourself down.  That will force you to overcome the inertia of your now slow momentum in the water which will further use the available oxygen.  It will be better to have proper breathing technique (breathing out underwater and in when your face is out of the water) and breathing every stroke cycle.

Hope that helps.



Edited by k9car363 2017-12-19 12:30 PM
2017-12-19 8:22 PM
in reply to: k9car363

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Subject: RE: Flip turn and oxygen debt solution?
Thanks all for your input. First of all, I don't think I was clear at all in my first post. I mean going into the turn, breathe right (my dominant side), immediately left, then possibly immediately right again. Then coming out of the flip turn, do the same. Check out the first 10 seconds of Sun Yang (in front). Going into the turn, he breathes right (his dominant side), immediately left, then turns. Coming out, again right then immediately left. I've seen him doing another immediately right coming out of the turn. Then he continues with breathing every time to his dominant side.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XvM3JYC--hM

So I've been practicing this and I'm determined to get it down. I also feel it's right for me since I like to breathe every time to my dominant side when in the middle of the pool. I can do bilateral breathing but find it slows me down. And to answer a question, "yes" I'm exhaling in the water. It's just that the immediate breathe to the other side results in a very short time. I think I've got that figured out though.

And to address a comment, I totally agree about always being able to improve form. Actually, I never find swimming laps boring because I'm so focused on all the different ways in which form can be improved: high elbow, just one goggle out, legs up, look more down so that the legs stay up, my legs are separating when I breathe, etc., etc., etc.
2017-12-19 9:10 PM
in reply to: k9car363

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Subject: RE: Flip turn and oxygen debt solution?
Originally posted by k9car363

As to breathing too both sides as you approach the wall for a turn - that likely is going to cause more problems than it solves.  The act of breathing slows a swimmer down - even an elite swimmer.  For a triathlete that is somewhat technique challenged, the amount he/she slows will be even more pronounced.  If you breath to both sides going in to the wall, especially if you breathe less efficiently to one side then the other, all you really are going to accomplish is slow yourself down.  That will force you to overcome the inertia of your now slow momentum in the water which will further use the available oxygen.  It will be better to have proper breathing technique (breathing out underwater and in when your face is out of the water) and breathing every stroke cycle.

Hope that helps.




It looks like you understood my original post! I will experiment with both. I can see how sneaking in an extra breath here and there would really benefit me, but maybe in the end, I'll end up agreeing with you here. I know I do a long open turn, tucking my head under my arms, pushing hard, and riding that for a good 5-8 meters before coming up. But this is with a large breath immediately before I start.


2017-12-20 12:31 AM
in reply to: Trilogy


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Subject: RE: Flip turn and oxygen debt solution?
Hypoxic drills and underwater drills will help. e.g 200m which will be 4 x 50, breathing every 3, 5, 7, 9. Underwater 10 x 25m underwater kick (with fins) 20s rest. Just make sure you have someone with you (shallow water blackout). I'd switch from bi-lateral to every stroke when doing a TT or fast paced stuff. I only breathe bi-lateral on drills or warm ups. Everything else is same side, including racing.
2017-12-20 12:45 AM
in reply to: zedzded

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Subject: RE: Flip turn and oxygen debt solution?
Originally posted by zedzded

Hypoxic drills and underwater drills will help. e.g 200m which will be 4 x 50, breathing every 3, 5, 7, 9. Underwater 10 x 25m underwater kick (with fins) 20s rest. Just make sure you have someone with you (shallow water blackout). I'd switch from bi-lateral to every stroke when doing a TT or fast paced stuff. I only breathe bi-lateral on drills or warm ups. Everything else is same side, including racing.


I thought about that but the possibility of blackout scares me. Also, I'm convinced that I can get this flip-turn technique with more practice.

As for bilateral breathing, just to be clear, I'm talking of breathing every stroke (right-immediately again left-possibly immediately again right), and doing this only into and out of the turns. Then going back to breathing to one side every two strokes.

I do think there are benefits to bilateral breathing every three strokes for someone with some serious dead spots, but I worry about bringing this up as it will only cause more confusion!
2017-12-20 8:16 AM
in reply to: Trilogy

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Subject: RE: Flip turn and oxygen debt solution?
I wouldn't get too fancy. You should be able to comfortably do a flip turn, streamline and take a stroke before taking a breath. Something much more fundamental is going on causing you to be O2 deprived, and it's probably as simple as not properly exhaling (re-read Scott's post). I'm a pretty adept swimmer and I wouldn't try the right/left breathing in and out of a turn thing. Sun Yang makes it look easy and smooth, you and I will look like a drunk manatee trying to do a back flip. Stick to the fundamentals.
2017-12-20 8:46 AM
in reply to: Trilogy

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Subject: RE: Flip turn and oxygen debt solution?
There's no getting over the fact that flip turns are an oxygen suck. In the midst of an aerobic threshold effort, you go without breathing for ~ 4 seconds while simultaneously engaging the biggest, strongest, most oxygen-hungry muscles in your body to rapidly decelerate your body mass from your cruising speed to a dead stop, then rapidly accelerate your body weight, against the resistance a fluid that is roughly 800x more dense than air, from that dead stop to the maximum speed you will experience in a swimming event other than the start entry. In a short course pool, repeat every ~30-45 seconds.

On a distance swim (400 or longer), I sometimes double-breath into a turn, but I don't count on being able to do it because, as much as I'd like to swim every length exactly the same, I don't always come into the wall in the same part of the stroke cycle. I've found that trying to double breath every time often leads to a botched turn entry if I'm a half or even quarter cycle off. I've started breathing back to back strokes on the way out because there's no need to synchronize the timing. It takes discipline, though, to not hang on to the first breath too long, and/or to not hurry the second breath.

One strategy to cope with the oxygen suck of flip turns in a long distance event is simply to back off the actual swim effort a little. You make up the lost time, and hopefully a smidge more, with high quality turns, good streamlining off the walls, and stall-free breakouts.
2017-12-20 3:31 PM
in reply to: Trilogy

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Subject: RE: Flip turn and oxygen debt solution?

I was going to casually sit back and watch as a back channel flip-turn thread unfolded.  Except now a couple of comments have been made that kind of forced me off of my comfortable chair.

Originally posted by zedzded

Hypoxic drills and underwater drills will help. e.g 200m which will be 4 x 50, breathing every 3, 5, 7, 9. Underwater 10 x 25m underwater kick (with fins) 20s rest. Just make sure you have someone with you (shallow water blackout) . . .

Not trying to be snarky but I respectfully disagree.  Intentionally placing yourself into a hypoxic state is an invitation to the emergency room or worse.You even make reference to that fact - shallow water blackout.  The human breath reflex is triggered by high carbon-dioxide levels, NOT low oxygen levels.  Typically when people are about to do a hypoxic set they will take several deep breaths.  That does very little to increase the available oxygen but dramatically lowers the blood CO2 concentration.  Then, when that individual is swimming, they run out of oxygen but because of the low initial CO2 concentration, the CO2 level has not risen to the "take a breath" threshold and the swimmer faints.  It's pretty obvious that fainting while underwater can have catastrophic consequences.  Swimming hypoxically does NOTHING to improve aerobic performance.  The human body simply doesn't work that way.  It is true that swimming while breathing every  3rd, 4th, 5th or more strokes can be faster because the act of breathing momentarily slows even the fastest most elite swimmer.  It is also true that using controlled breathing in a workout can be of benefit while working on technique as there is a longer period of time between breathes that typically can cause technique issues for a vast majority of triathletes.  However, to suggest hypoxic sets to improve lung capacity or improve the ability to hold one's breath is simply contrary to physiological fact.

http://www.redwoodsgroup.com/safety-resources/aquatics-guidance-and-tools/safety-guidance/swimmers-endurance-technique-can-be-deadly-ymcas/

https://www.swimmingworldmagazine.com/news/shallow-water-blackout-the-silent-killer-of-swimmers/ (While giving some good information, this article also debunks the notion having someone on deck will be beneficial if you experience shallow water blackout as there were were trained lifeguards on-deck, yet the swimmer still died).

https://aquaticpros.org/news/hypoxic-training-and-breath-holding-practices-

Originally posted by gary p

There's no getting over the fact that flip turns are an oxygen suck. In the midst of an aerobic threshold effort, you go without breathing for ~ 4 seconds while simultaneously engaging the biggest, strongest, most oxygen-hungry muscles in your body to rapidly decelerate your body mass from your cruising speed to a dead stop, then rapidly accelerate your body weight, against the resistance a fluid that is roughly 800x more dense than air, from that dead stop to the maximum speed you will experience in a swimming event other than the start entry.

That's not an entirely accurate description of what happens when your flip-turn properly.  When you are running, with each stride you land and the muscles in your leg absorb the shock - effectively becoming a coiled spring that unloads as you push off for the next stride.  In exactly the same way, when you come into the wall at full speed, you load your legs and then unload as you push off.  There really isn't a rapid deceleration and rapid acceleration - it's one fluid movement in which your body stores kinetic energy and then releases that kinetic energy.  The oxygen requirement of muscles involved in a turn is not much different then while swimming since when you are swimming properly you are using the large muscles in the back and core.  If you find yourself in oxygen debt coming off the wall after a turn, it isn't because of the turn, it's because of stroke technique flaws or improper breathing.

Originally posted by Trilogy

I do think there are benefits to bilateral breathing every three strokes for someone with some serious dead spots, but I worry about bringing this up as it will only cause more confusion!

This doesn't cause additional confusion and if the someone "with serious dead-spots" happens to be you, this merely confirms what I said in my original reply.  The problem is most likely technique related.  You can try all the fancy patches you want, if your technique is sub-standard, the quick-fixes aren't going to work.  Look collectively at what swimmers do.  You don't see them breathing left/right/left or right/left/right coming into the wall or going away from the wall.  To point to Sung Yang and say, "See? He does it, so I'm going to do it"  is taking a somewhat tunnel vision view.  You AREN'T Sung Yang.  I absolutely guarantee, as surely as the sun will come up tomorrow, that your catch/EVF is NOWHERE near as efficient or effective as Sung Yang's.  He can easily overcome the slight reduction in speed brought about by breathing every stroke going into the wall and coming away from the wall.  The very best thing you can do is to improve your technique.  Once your technique is solid, the difficulty with flip-turns will take care of itself.  A flip turn should be nothing more than an extension of your swimming stroke.  The actual turn itself should be as fluid as taking another stroke.  One final thing to consider, you mentioned bi-lateral breathing every third stroke.  If you can do that, you can already hold your breath long enough to do a proper flip turn.  Smooth technique combined with breathing properly will eliminate any oxygen debt you are experiencing while doing flip turns.

I'm going back to my comfortable chair now.



2017-12-20 7:20 PM
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Subject: RE: Flip turn and oxygen debt solution?
I would suggest doing 50s and increasing your strokes between breathes. Start at 4 and then go to 6, 8, 10. Depending on your speed, you should be able to get from one end to the other. That could help you out a bit.

Are you exhaling right away? That'll be something you'll figure out as you do these sets.

2017-12-20 7:44 PM
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Subject: RE: Flip turn and oxygen debt solution?
Thanks all. I know my flip turn technique is bad. I would actually go further and say that it's perhaps laughable on a good number of my turns during a 1500m swim.

I will take the advice of most and continue to work on this without the back-to-back breathing. I thought maybe I had found a trick that many use, but I guess I'm wrong about that. But......I will reserve the right to sneak in an extra breath while I'm working on this, especially coming out the turn as was suggested above.

Just to put some numbers to this. I'm 50 years old and started swimming seven years ago. In a 25m pool, I swam 1500m in 26:50 last week (I can get that down to 26:30 or better easily but I'm only swimming once a week now as I focus on running). When I did flip turns two weeks ago for the whole distance, I came in at 27:58. So yeah, there's some bad flip turn technique going on there. I'm not kidding myself. But when I do open turns, I feel solid the whole way through and swim each 500m at about the same pace (I check the watch quickly at that point).

Edited by Trilogy 2017-12-20 7:46 PM
2017-12-21 10:35 AM
in reply to: Trilogy

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Subject: RE: Flip turn and oxygen debt solution?

Originally posted by Trilogy

In a 25m pool, I swam 1500m in 26:50 last week (I can get that down to 26:30 or better easily but I'm only swimming once a week now as I focus on running). When I did flip turns two weeks ago for the whole distance, I came in at 27:58. So yeah, there's some bad flip turn technique going on there. I'm not kidding myself. But when I do open turns, I feel solid the whole way through and swim each 500m at about the same pace (I check the watch quickly at that point).

Just curious why you are swimming 1,500's in training?  I swam competitively for a very long time and rarely swam longer then 200 in training.  Maybe the occasional set of 400 IM's for those of us that swam individual medley's in competition but that was only once every few months.

Many triathletes, especially newer triathletes, are under the mistaken impression that to swim a long triathlon swim, you need to do long continuous swims in training (not saying YOU necessarily, but you metaphorically).  In reality, you are better served swimming intervals.  When swimming a long continuous swim, you will fatigue.  That fatigue will cause your technique to break down.  If you are technique challenged, then you are likely swimming anaerobically even at a slower pace which will further degrade technique.  Every stroke you take is reinforcing muscle memory.  As your technique breaks down during a long swim, that poor technique is reinforcing muscle memory.  On the other hand, if you do intervals, you are able to swim longer with proper technique.  When doing intervals, you are more likely storing proper technique to muscle memory.

I will acknowledge that for some people there is value in swimming a continuous swim equal to the race distance in training so they know psychologically they can do the distance.  That would be once.  Not repeatedly.

The obvious question is, "What about my endurance?"  You don't need to swim long continuous swims in training to complete a long continuous swim on race day.  15 x 100 will actually be more beneficial then a continuous 1,500 swim.  During the intervals, you will likely be able to maintain a steady pace instead of gradually slowing.  During the intervals you will be able to maintain proper form longer rather then technique degrading.  To build endurance, you can do intervals at your threshold pace with 15-20 seconds rest.  For example, your average pace per 100 during your 1,500 swim is likely a few seconds per 100 slower then your threshold pace.  You swam 1,500m in 26:30 which works out to 1:46/100 so your threshold pace is likely around 1:40-1:42/100.  If you were to do a 15 x 100 set at a send off of 2:00 you will be building endurance while improving technique.  Your target pace in that example would be 1:40-1:42/100.  To build proper endurance, in a perfect world, you will build to a minimum of 1.5-2.0 times the race distance in each workout.

Good luck!  At 1:40-1:42/100 you have some low-hanging technique fruit you can pick that will improve your pace.  I know your original question had nothing to do with endurance training, however, swimming long continuous swims in training is a common mistake among beginner triathletes and since this is after all BeginnerTriathlete I thought I'd comment (again, this isn't necessarily directed at you personally but more generally to beginner triathletes).

2017-12-21 5:00 PM
in reply to: k9car363

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Subject: RE: Flip turn and oxygen debt solution?
Agree with the above. I was MOP in the swim until I started doing short stuff. Went from 1:45/100 yd pace to 1:25/100 pace in a couple years.
2017-12-21 5:15 PM
in reply to: Trilogy


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Subject: RE: Flip turn and oxygen debt solution?

I had this problem for awhile in my earlier days. 

 

The solutions didn't take much practice after I realized what I had to do, but they were a bit counterintuitive to me. 

 

- ACCELERATE into the wall and flip with your last 2-3 strokes prior to the wall/flip. It will feel at first a little dangerous, but do it a few times and you'll see it's anything but that. 

What you are likely doing right now (as do most early folks learning flips), is SLOWING down your stroke before the wall, which actually makes the flip much harder and slower. This is one of those cases where the 'easy, slow and careful for clean technique' approach could actually be counterproductive early on. 

 

- FLIP FASTER. Make a conscious effort to make that flip faster than you are doing now, likely substantially so. You should feel like you are swimming into the turn with power, and then executing the flip with power, not lollygagging at a semirelaxed pace. Get that body flipped, and launch so you can get the next breath sooner!

 

- (Advanced): Once you can do this, you can breath on both the left and right strokes immediately coming out of the flip, but you are likely not ready for this if you can't do a flip comfortably without the extra breaths yet. 

 

Basically, you want to go into that flip and do the flip a lot faster than you are doing right now. That should solve most of your oxygen debt issues when swimming easy, and with practice, should also be doable at hard intensity.

 

 

 



2017-12-21 6:33 PM
in reply to: yazmaster

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Subject: RE: Flip turn and oxygen debt solution?
This is what I meant by technique. Newer swimmers often approach the wall too slowly so they don't have much momentum, fail to get into a tight tuck so their legs are all over the place, and maybe lack the core strength to "snap" the legs over quickly on the turn. In my mind you should be accelerating coming into and out of (since you are streamlining and kicking after pushing off the wall), not decelerating.
2017-12-21 6:49 PM
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Subject: RE: Flip turn and oxygen debt solution?
Originally posted by k9car363

The obvious question is, "What about my endurance?"  You don't need to swim long continuous swims in training to complete a long continuous swim on race day.  15 x 100 will actually be more beneficial then a continuous 1,500 swim.  During the intervals, you will likely be able to maintain a steady pace instead of gradually slowing.  During the intervals you will be able to maintain proper form longer rather then technique degrading.  To build endurance, you can do intervals at your threshold pace with 15-20 seconds rest.  For example, your average pace per 100 during your 1,500 swim is likely a few seconds per 100 slower then your threshold pace.  You swam 1,500m in 26:30 which works out to 1:46/100 so your threshold pace is likely around 1:40-1:42/100.  If you were to do a 15 x 100 set at a send off of 2:00 you will be building endurance while improving technique.  Your target pace in that example would be 1:40-1:42/100.  To build proper endurance, in a perfect world, you will build to a minimum of 1.5-2.0 times the race distance in each workout.

Good luck!  At 1:40-1:42/100 you have some low-hanging technique fruit you can pick that will improve your pace.  I know your original question had nothing to do with endurance training, however, swimming long continuous swims in training is a common mistake among beginner triathletes and since this is after all BeginnerTriathlete I thought I'd comment (again, this isn't necessarily directed at you personally but more generally to beginner triathletes).




Thanks for that. I started doing intervals again this year after stopping the last year or so. I got (am getting) some great results in running with intervals, whereas I have been stuck at my times with swimming, and so I thought I would try to apply what worked in running to my swimming. However, I see from your post I was doing some things wrong. First of all, I was doing these intervals every third or fourth swim, and my 1500m continuous distance on all other swims. I'll at least switch that ratio around (maybe cut out my continuous swim altogether except maybe right before a race to build confidence and also to do my favorite brick workout of a swim and head out to the track). Secondly, I see I was going out way too fast. 10 x 100 and I was just dead on the last two sets. I see that's exactly the opposite of what I want to be accomplishing with these (i.e., I would be reinforcing bad technique with those last sets using my approach).



Edited by Trilogy 2017-12-21 6:52 PM
2017-12-21 6:51 PM
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Subject: RE: Flip turn and oxygen debt solution?
And thanks yazmaster and Hot Runner. Yes, I was decelerating as I approached the wall. I'll try to change this around this weekend.
2017-12-24 9:52 PM
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Subject: RE: Flip turn and oxygen debt solution?
Originally posted by yazmaster

ACCELERATE into the wall and flip...What you are likely doing right now (as do most early folks learning flips), is SLOWING down your stroke before the wall, which actually makes the flip much harder and slower. This is one of those cases where the 'easy, slow and careful for clean technique' approach could actually be counterproductive early on. 


Yes, yes, and yes! And thank you! Much better yesterday on my swim. I did 10 x 100m in a 25m pool (so lots of flip turns) and was feeling starved for oxygen on only two to the turns. I went toward the wall fast and pushed off as quickly as I could (I realized I was hesitating for just a second with my feet on the wall previously). Wow, what a difference!

I still messed up a few times with the distance of when I start the flip, the angle coming off the wall, and some other minor issues, but I feel very encouraged that my lungs didn't feel like they were about to explode every time I did the turn.

I hope that with a month or two practice, I can see some improvements with my times. And I like the intervals that give me a bit of rest: I could focus on EVF efforts and all the little details to improve form for the whole time I was swimming. Thanks for the tips everyone.

Edited by Trilogy 2017-12-24 9:53 PM
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