Second Life - OK, what am I missing? (Page 2)

Problem I have with this is you are making an inaccurate judgement on peope who are not lonely...Yes there are some that spend too much time on SL and are lonely.  But on a whole I have found that most of the people that I run across, who I talk to, and some who I have met in real life, are not lonely, but well adjusted people.  Some people like to play video games and some people like to create things with their imagination while meeting people on line.  The friend of mine that got me into SL, is a very social person, I know him and his partner, and I happen to know that they have a happy physical life.  Second life is a way for him to meet people from around the world, people he would not be able to meet in person.  His partner, plays world of warcraft.  One of them is going for their masters in theatre and is artistic director of a theatre company, the other works for a large corp. in sales...they have many friends and are very personable...so how are the lonely?

How is meeting new friends, from other states and countries, even virtually is equal to lonely? 

My point from before still stands...how can you call them lonely if you have never gone into second life and talked to any of the people. 

My opinion?  Not at all. 

I think it's easy to draw the wrong conclusions when you parse/take my comments out of context.

What you should assume is that I have no opinion of you at all.

If a=b and b=c than a=c  

How would you know if they're lonely? Do they assure you of their lack of loneliness when they see you? I'm well adjusted and there are times when I'm lonely. Being well adjusted and lonely are not mutually exclusive states of being.

On the other hand, avoiding life, escaping into a computer and avoiding real people and all the messiness that comes with real life relationshis - yeah, these things are not healthy. If you see yourself in this, that's your thing, not mine. If you don't see yourself in this, then what's the problem?

If it makes you happy to pretend I have an opinion of you, knock yourself out.

I don't think that these online communities are ONLY populated with people who are lonely IRL.  Heck, Eric and I spend a couple of hourse (ok, more these days) playing our online "role playing" game, and have made some good connections with others who we play alongside.

And most of the people I've met who also play online games have very active "real lives".  But you have to admit that there are a few online folks who spend more time online and have more of an identity online than they do IRL.

Is that wrong?  No, not in my opinion.  Am I judging them?  Heck no.  Judge not, lest ye be judged.  Many people think triathletes are insane for spending 6+ hours a week training.  What's wrong with people spending 6+ hours a week playing a game, if it brings them happiness and a sense of satistfaction? 

because I know them very well...we talk about intimate things and the ups and downs of their relationships.  They are good friends who I have known for years...  Do I know all of their secrets no...but do I know if they are happy in their lives and with their friends, yes.  Its part of the camaraderie that happens when you connect with people both in RL and in SL...Do you consider the people on this site your friends?  Have you connected on an emotional level with people on this site?  I have....there are many people on BT I consider friends...

Why does it bother me...it bothers me, that people make false assumptions about me and my friends.  You have a right to your opinion that SL is an escape from real life and relationships...I have the right to an opinion that SL is a conduit to make new relationships that would otherwise not be available in real life.  

Are there lonely people on SL...yes...is everyone on SL lonely...no.  Thats my point...and I need to get back to work. 

But I think online games/communities get a bad rap, because they're new, and because they're so accessible now.

I have a very rich personal life. I have a good number of friends that I see regularly, and others that I keep in touch with via email and telephone.  And I have friends that I keep in touch with by chatting inside my game.  I don't see how that's any different than email, really.  Or from chatting with most of the people that I've met though BT, now that I think of it.

Reality is overrated, anyway.

"I reject your reality, and substitute my own. " -- Adam Savage

I might be in trouble...

There are some interesting things this brings up, and I was just chatting with a friend yesterday who works for the University system here, who is looking into using Second Life as a teaching tool... which brought to mind the articles I read not too long ago in my favorite magazine (Ode)...

Reading, writing and playing The Sims
Rylands has found a way to make writing fun for kids. Myst is a beautifully designed series of computer games set on a mysterious deserted island that can be endlessly navigated. According to Rylands, the visually rich landscape inspires his students’ creativity.

What my son is actually doing
“The summer after our son turned 16, we insisted that he get a job outside of the home, in part to limit some of his online time. He was no longer the shy boy that he was at 15 and felt comfortable having conversations that included many adults.”

If games had come before books...

Playing together

We go from the comment of:

QUOTE]Renee - 2007-02-23 7:40 AM

You have now found the answer to that Great Beatles Riddle: All the lonely people, where do they all belong?

I don't disagree with Renee's assertion that we've found the answer to "All the Lonely People" question.

I think it's GREAT that lonely people have a kind of social outlet.  But I also don't think she was saying that "Only the Lonely" were playing online.

"Judge not lest ye be judged."

Or somesuch.

*snerk* 

People are going to read into it what they want to read into. Let's be frank - nobody's looking for understanding here. They imagine they're playing a game of GOTCHA! Whatever. Have fun with the circle jerk.

I find it very interesting that people associate so many negative characterizations with loneliness. Talk about turning the mirror upon yourselves.

I don't judge loneliness. It's just there - within all of us at some point of another. It's a universal human condition.  I think the people who associate loneliness with loserville or being less than well adjusted - or are in denial that loneliness is endemic - are the ones doing the judging.

Interesting take there.  I agree that loneliness is a human condition.  And, really, we're all alone inside our own lives.  Sometimes I wonder if the people who surround themselves with lots of people and activities are just running away from themselves.  Just as I wonder if people who block out other people and activities are hiding INSIDE themselves. 

I'm staying out of the lonely or not debate, since that wasn't my point.  I am active on this board, and have met several triathletes through this board and trained with them.  I am also active on a scubadiving board (or two ) as well as an underwater photography board.  I have met (both virtually and in reality) many people this way, and in fact have traveled the world with them, some of whom I consider my best friends (and in whose hands I have, literally, placed my life, as have they).

I think online communities are fabulous, and many different types of people - lonely, gragarious, outgoing, wallflowers, intelligencia, idiots, etc. - use them.   For me, I do find it easier to relate to people on the net, since there isn't that immediate emotional contact.  But I also have live friends (that do not get blown up ).

I guess what I have a hard time with is paying "Linden Dollars" for something that does not exist.  For land.  What do you do with it?  I get paying $$ for weapons or tools to use in a video gfame, that actually has some value.  But virtual property?  I guess if there is a resale market, OK, but that just sounds pyramid schemish to me.

Runningwoof, I don't think I did, but bringing up the subject wasn't meant to judge or ridicule anyone involved.  Although I don't agree that I cannot have an opinion on it without trying it.  there are a lot of things in life I'm pretty certain are not for me without me having to go through the experience.

OK, back to your regularly scheduled flaming.

Well, sure. There are lots of way to cope, fight, mitigate or avoid loneliness. Some ways are constructive/healthy and some ways just perpetuate or exacerbate it.

Still find it very interesting that people think loneliness is such a dirty word and provokes such denial. We learn a lot about ourselves when we pay attention to our denial.

p.s. Eleanor Rigby wasn't a song which ridiculed loneliness. It was a song that simply cast light on a universal condition. There was no judgment in it. I think it's one of the saddest songs I've ever heard.

Chris, actually I think your original post was very valid, it was after that, where a negative tone (maybe I read into it a negative tone) that spending time online in a virtual world or spending virtual money was some how equal to being lonely.  My original statement was not to knock it until you try it.  but you in no way were knocking it, you were just stating you don't understand it, completely different.  In defense of spending linden $$$s, you buy things that you use in the virtual world...just like in games, you buy clothing (much of the things that you buy, you can get lower quality versions for free, so in order to enjoy SL, you don't really need to spend money), cars, homes...and then you decorate.  Think of it as a models (like cars or planes).  You buy model and glue and other tools, you finish it, and then you put it on display,  It sits on a shelf and often only a few people ever see your models, but they are fun for you to look at, and a sense of accomplishement when you have built one that looks really cool.  Well in SL many people come and see it, can visit it, talk about it, and you can buy more things.  Its a hobby, like any other.  Honestly, I have spent less than $10.00 buying what I wanted...I don't own land or anything, but if I had the money to do so, I think it would be fun to do.