Why do the Pros get to go earlier??

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2007-10-13 10:09 AM

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Subject: Why do the Pros get to go earlier??
Seems to me that if they are truly pros, they should be ahead of the pesky regular folk anyway, or if they are not, they should be able to deal with whatever happens.

Isn't that why they are pros? As a professional teacher, one who may be up for tenure, I don't get to only teach the best kids, right? It seems odd.


2007-10-13 10:51 AM
in reply to: #1006177

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2007-10-13 11:00 AM
in reply to: #1006209

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Subject: RE: Why do the Pros get to go earlier??
Ah, I get it. The top amature men will try to beat the pro women, and could probably be dangerous to all. That makes more sense, because I figured the guys are strong enough to handle almost anything. The women are strong, obviously, but some men might make it tough and unfair for them.

Thanks!
2007-10-13 11:05 AM
in reply to: #1006209

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Subject: Oops - double post!!!
Ah, I get it. The top amature men will try to beat the pro women, and could probably be dangerous to all. That makes more sense, because I figured the guys are strong enough to handle almost anything. The women are strong, obviously, but some men might make it tough and unfair for them.

Thanks!

Edited by nancylee 2007-10-13 11:05 AM
2007-10-13 11:07 AM
in reply to: #1006177

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Subject: RE: Why do the Pros get to go earlier??
I've heard the pros could hide in the swim with the top AG swimmers. Having them start first allows them to see each other and really race against each other from start to finish.
2007-10-13 11:58 AM
in reply to: #1006177

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Subject: RE: Why do the Pros get to go earlier??
A few years ago the pro women complained. The problem wasn't so much the swim for them, as they could draft the faster age groupers. The problem was the bike as the pro women were getting blocking and drafting penalties as they tried to get through the good age group swimmers. Ironman balked for a while as splitting the race defeated the true spirit of the race. After a few years of top women getting penalties they made the change.

tj

2007-10-13 7:46 PM
in reply to: #1006209

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Subject: RE: Why do the Pros get to go earlier??
JeepFleeb - 2007-10-13 10:51 AM

And most off all it's to seperate the top amateur men from the pro women.



JeepFleep being hitting on the pro women too much?

Actually if I was a great swimmer I would porbably try to beat the pro out of the water. I can see it now. First out of the water is chirunner. Now coming in last on the bike is chirunner.

I think its also to make sure no a/g wins it all also and if you do you have to win by over 15 minutes.
2007-10-13 8:18 PM
in reply to: #1006866

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Subject: RE: Why do the Pros get to go earlier??
chirunner134 - 2007-10-13 7:46 PM
JeepFleeb - 2007-10-13 10:51 AM

And most off all it's to seperate the top amateur men from the pro women.

JeepFleep being hitting on the pro women too much? Actually if I was a great swimmer I would porbably try to beat the pro out of the water. I can see it now. First out of the water is chirunner. Now coming in last on the bike is chirunner. I think its also to make sure no a/g wins it all also and if you do you have to win by over 15 minutes.
I think AG can still win it all but it would be pretty hard.  Isn't the race chip timed?  Watch the results and some AG will place pretty high.
2007-10-14 9:38 AM
in reply to: #1006925

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Subject: RE: Why do the Pros get to go earlier??
kproudfoot - 2007-10-13 8:18 PM

chirunner134 - 2007-10-13 7:46 PM
JeepFleeb - 2007-10-13 10:51 AM

And most off all it's to seperate the top amateur men from the pro women.

I think its also to make sure no a/g wins it all also and if you do you have to win by over 15 minutes.
I think AG can still win it all but it would be pretty hard.  Isn't the race chip timed?  Watch the results and some AG will place pretty high.



That would be quite a feat. I remember 1986 an age grouper finished 4th, but I think that may have been the last time and age grouper (at least male) cracked the top 10 in Hawaii. I am thinking that if you are training that much to be that good, you might as well make a little money at it and turn pro.
2007-10-14 1:34 PM
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2007-10-14 9:29 PM
in reply to: #1007467

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Subject: RE: Why do the Pros get to go earlier??
JeepFleeb - 2007-10-14 1:34 PM

It wouldn't matter if an AGer crossed the line first; the money and the title go to the first pro.  Part of the rules for elites is that they're the only ones eligible for prize money and therefore they get credited as the winner.

A friend (arch-rival) of mine had this happen a few weeks ago.  He raced in the elite wave, came in first, but an age grouper was a few seconds faster than him on the results.  He still got the first place trophy.

Well, as my 4 year old says, "THAT'S NOT FAIR!" Sure doesn't ring of true sportsmanship. Man, if I had trained my butt off and ran head to head with pro's and won --- I'd not care about the money but would sure want to be acknowledged as NUMERO UNO and get my huge honkin' TROPHY!! wooo HOOOO!



2007-10-14 9:38 PM
in reply to: #1007889

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Subject: RE: Why do the Pros get to go earlier??
BbMoozer - 2007-10-14 9:29 PM

JeepFleeb - 2007-10-14 1:34 PM

It wouldn't matter if an AGer crossed the line first; the money and the title go to the first pro. Part of the rules for elites is that they're the only ones eligible for prize money and therefore they get credited as the winner.

A friend (arch-rival) of mine had this happen a few weeks ago. He raced in the elite wave, came in first, but an age grouper was a few seconds faster than him on the results. He still got the first place trophy.

Well, as my 4 year old says, "THAT'S NOT FAIR!" Sure doesn't ring of true sportsmanship. Man, if I had trained my butt off and ran head to head with pro's and won --- I'd not care about the money but would sure want to be acknowledged as NUMERO UNO and get my huge honkin' TROPHY!! wooo HOOOO!



You'd still have bragging rights! Not to mention...so many sponsors knocking down your door that you'd be able to turn pro and blow them all out of the water with your outstanding time differential in your next IM!
2007-10-15 7:47 AM
in reply to: #1007889

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Subject: RE: Why do the Pros get to go earlier??
BbMoozer - 2007-10-14 9:29 PM
JeepFleeb - 2007-10-14 1:34 PM

It wouldn't matter if an AGer crossed the line first; the money and the title go to the first pro.  Part of the rules for elites is that they're the only ones eligible for prize money and therefore they get credited as the winner.

A friend (arch-rival) of mine had this happen a few weeks ago.  He raced in the elite wave, came in first, but an age grouper was a few seconds faster than him on the results.  He still got the first place trophy.

Well, as my 4 year old says, "THAT'S NOT FAIR!" Sure doesn't ring of true sportsmanship. Man, if I had trained my butt off and ran head to head with pro's and won --- I'd not care about the money but would sure want to be acknowledged as NUMERO UNO and get my huge honkin' TROPHY!! wooo HOOOO!

yes it is... if you race as an elite and as an AGer you would know both are two different races 99% of the time. If you are fast enought to stay with the elites, suck it up and either get an elite card or at small races request to start in the elite wave... 
2007-10-15 1:05 PM
in reply to: #1007889

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Subject: RE: Why do the Pros get to go earlier??
BbMoozer - 2007-10-14 8:29 PM

Well, as my 4 year old says, "THAT'S NOT FAIR!"

You can always use Standard Parental ResponseTM #4: "LIFE's not fair!"

2007-10-15 4:51 PM
in reply to: #1006177

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Subject: RE: Why do the Pros get to go earlier??

yeah, scottnm, life ain't fair and I tell my son that lots

Amiine - well, I guess I'm looking at it as a fluke. Certainly if I were that fast --as the elites, I'd know it, they'd know it and I'd up the ante and compete as such.

I'm just saying if I were having an incredibly great day and the Speed Gods decided to bless me for the day, then it would be a shame not to 'win' if I really did come in first.



Edited by BbMoozer 2007-10-15 4:51 PM
2007-10-15 5:05 PM
in reply to: #1006177

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Subject: RE: Why do the Pros get to go earlier??
I cna understand in a Wave start since you can slow down and walk in and go yeah I one only to have someone else trailing behind you and beat you because he never slowed down. If you saw him coming chances are you would sped back up and win.

In a mass start that just seems silly that first guy to cross the line does not win.

2007-10-17 8:58 AM
in reply to: #1007279

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Subject: RE: Why do the Pros get to go earlier??
tjfry - 2007-10-14 10:38 AM

kproudfoot - 2007-10-13 8:18 PM

chirunner134 - 2007-10-13 7:46 PM
JeepFleeb - 2007-10-13 10:51 AM

And most off all it's to seperate the top amateur men from the pro women.

I think its also to make sure no a/g wins it all also and if you do you have to win by over 15 minutes.
I think AG can still win it all but it would be pretty hard.  Isn't the race chip timed?  Watch the results and some AG will place pretty high.


That would be quite a feat. I remember 1986 an age grouper finished 4th, but I think that may have been the last time and age grouper (at least male) cracked the top 10 in Hawaii. I am thinking that if you are training that much to be that good, you might as well make a little money at it and turn pro.


At IMLP in 2005 It was a women's PRO race and an AG male finished first before the first woman pro. Sponsors/RD were not happy. A woman was supposed to cross the line first. Tony DeLong (sp?) is the guy. It was his first IM. At IMLP since its a 2 lap swim course, the pros get a 1 lap head start. I dont remember if they changed that to 15 minutes this past year, since I was racing I wasn't paying attention. at IMAZ they got 15 minutes, but its a 1 loop swim course.
2007-10-17 1:11 PM
in reply to: #1011644

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Subject: RE: Why do the Pros get to go earlier??
jeanneroth - 2007-10-17 8:58 AM
tjfry - 2007-10-14 10:38 AM
kproudfoot - 2007-10-13 8:18 PM
chirunner134 - 2007-10-13 7:46 PM
JeepFleeb - 2007-10-13 10:51 AM

And most off all it's to seperate the top amateur men from the pro women.

I think its also to make sure no a/g wins it all also and if you do you have to win by over 15 minutes.
I think AG can still win it all but it would be pretty hard.  Isn't the race chip timed?  Watch the results and some AG will place pretty high.
That would be quite a feat. I remember 1986 an age grouper finished 4th, but I think that may have been the last time and age grouper (at least male) cracked the top 10 in Hawaii. I am thinking that if you are training that much to be that good, you might as well make a little money at it and turn pro.
At IMLP in 2005 It was a women's PRO race and an AG male finished first before the first woman pro. Sponsors/RD were not happy. A woman was supposed to cross the line first. Tony DeLong (sp?) is the guy. It was his first IM. At IMLP since its a 2 lap swim course, the pros get a 1 lap head start. I dont remember if they changed that to 15 minutes this past year, since I was racing I wasn't paying attention. at IMAZ they got 15 minutes, but its a 1 loop swim course.
Hey you have to tell team timex to update their site with the news about team member Alex Mroszczyk-McDonald OA amateur win at Kona! (of course, we are very proud because he is an athlete coach by PBM coaching )
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