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The level of discussion on the web
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 2014-06-02 10:55 AM |
Elite  6387    |  Subject: The level of discussion on the webSooo... I work for a municipal utility. My plant is a coal fired plant in the middle of town that has come under a lot of scrutiny to be shut down. Except it is very cheap and reliable. So that has been going on for over a year now. Lot's of political mud slinging over the topic. All of which is over making money, not over what is right. Then my plant burned down. Well, we had a very bad fire, and the whole place will be down at least over summer. We had to adjust rates for added purchase power. That made some folks mad, but we are working around the clock to restore the plant. So, my point.... through all of this, I have been involved in the news and City council, and Utility Boards meetings. Lots of news stories, and lots of comments from the peanut gallery. I am shocked to find... people are are much more stupid than I ever gave them credit for. I mean, I am absolutely shocked. That's fine if you disagree, but the comments by people are just ludicrous. These are people that actually think they are intelligent on political matters. It does not matter how much information is presented... they don't even read it, then come up with some lame reasoning. Not refute what is presented, just willfully live in ignorance. Which then leads me to discussing national politics. I like to, and think I am reasonable... but it calls into question whether I have any clue at all about anything I actually talk about. It has been very interesting being involved in something first hand, and then seeing what the public does. And this is a small local issue... I can't imagine how distorted the national discussions could be.... .... and the press... don't even get me started.... willful misrepresentation of the issue. Blatant conflicts of interest. Obvious slants and endless hit pieces. Absolutely astounding. Edited by powerman 2014-06-02 10:57 AM |
| 2014-06-03 10:49 AM in reply to: powerman |
 Deep in the Heart of Texas | Subject: RE: The level of discussion on the web I agree that you probably do not have a clue about the things you espouse, with the exception of the things we agree upon. |
| 2014-06-03 11:11 AM in reply to: Hook'em |
Elite 6387 | Subject: RE: The level of discussion on the web Well that's true. |
| 2014-06-03 1:29 PM in reply to: powerman |
Champion 6993 Chicago, Illinois | Subject: RE: The level of discussion on the web Trouble is after people made up there minds about something they will reject facts that do not support there claims and embrace those that support them. Its easy to embrace misinformation when it something you want to hear. In the defense of the masses no way we can all be experts on everything. That is why its easy to spread your side because everyone looking for the expert they feel they can trust. |
| 2014-06-03 2:06 PM in reply to: 0 |
Elite 6387 | Subject: RE: The level of discussion on the web I have mentioned it before... but there was a very public case here in my city.... a shootout at a bar. The guy was going to fry for sure... except he didn't do it. The news reported the "facts" that was not even close to what every single eyewitness said happened. I mean all they had to do was just ask them. The guy was acquitted.... only because the DA went for 1st degree only and thought it was open and shut. After that, it was like... what in the world do they get right? Even when they report stuff about my work... you tell them basic facts, and they manage to mangle them most times. I'm not talking about the political stuff I mentioned... just little pieces they do from time to time.
Edited by powerman 2014-06-03 2:07 PM |
| 2014-06-03 2:20 PM in reply to: powerman |
Champion 7821 Brooklyn, NY | Subject: RE: The level of discussion on the web Originally posted by powerman Sooo... I work for a municipal utility. My plant is a coal fired plant in the middle of town that has come under a lot of scrutiny to be shut down. Except it is very cheap and reliable. So that has been going on for over a year now. Lot's of political mud slinging over the topic. All of which is over making money, not over what is right. Then my plant burned down. Well, we had a very bad fire, and the whole place will be down at least over summer. We had to adjust rates for added purchase power. That made some folks mad, but we are working around the clock to restore the plant. So, my point.... through all of this, I have been involved in the news and City council, and Utility Boards meetings. Lots of news stories, and lots of comments from the peanut gallery. I am shocked to find... people are are much more stupid than I ever gave them credit for. I mean, I am absolutely shocked. That's fine if you disagree, but the comments by people are just ludicrous. These are people that actually think they are intelligent on political matters. It does not matter how much information is presented... they don't even read it, then come up with some lame reasoning. Not refute what is presented, just willfully live in ignorance. Which then leads me to discussing national politics. I like to, and think I am reasonable... but it calls into question whether I have any clue at all about anything I actually talk about. It has been very interesting being involved in something first hand, and then seeing what the public does. And this is a small local issue... I can't imagine how distorted the national discussions could be.... .... and the press... don't even get me started.... willful misrepresentation of the issue. Blatant conflicts of interest. Obvious slants and endless hit pieces. Absolutely astounding. The press has always been a for-profit endeavor, but I think that over the last 30 years or so, especially with the advent of cable tv and the internet, where there's so much competition for eyeballs and advertising dollars, there's been a real shift towards sensationalism that didn't always exist. There is a "shoot first, ask questions later" mentality in the media where you publish whatever you want as soon as you can, and, as the facts become clearer, make whatever retractions need to be made later, if at all. Remember Richard Jewell? He was the security guard in Atlanta in 1996 who discovered a suspicious-looking backpack in a plaza. He alerted people, and evacuated the area, before it went off, no doubt saving lives. First hailed as a hero, the press turned on him and began painting him as a suspect with no evidence whatsoever other than circumstance. Even though he was eventually exonerated when the bomber was identified, his reputation was ruined and his privacy destroyed, and no media outlet or individual reporter was ever held accountable. That was sort of the first example I can remember of runaway sensationalist journalism, and at the time, it was pretty appalling, but now I feel like it happens all the time. |
| 2014-06-04 10:23 AM in reply to: 0 |
Champion 15211 Southern Chicago Suburbs, IL | Subject: RE: The level of discussion on the web Originally posted by powerman Sooo... I work for a municipal utility. My plant is a coal fired plant in the middle of town that has come under a lot of scrutiny to be shut down. Except it is very cheap and reliable. So that has been going on for over a year now. Lot's of political mud slinging over the topic. All of which is over making money, not over what is right. Then my plant burned down. Well, we had a very bad fire, and the whole place will be down at least over summer. We had to adjust rates for added purchase power. That made some folks mad, but we are working around the clock to restore the plant. So, my point.... through all of this, I have been involved in the news and City council, and Utility Boards meetings. Lots of news stories, and lots of comments from the peanut gallery. I am shocked to find... people are are much more stupid than I ever gave them credit for. I mean, I am absolutely shocked. That's fine if you disagree, but the comments by people are just ludicrous. These are people that actually think they are intelligent on political matters. It does not matter how much information is presented... they don't even read it, then come up with some lame reasoning. Not refute what is presented, just willfully live in ignorance. Which then leads me to discussing national politics. I like to, and think I am reasonable... but it calls into question whether I have any clue at all about anything I actually talk about. It has been very interesting being involved in something first hand, and then seeing what the public does. And this is a small local issue... I can't imagine how distorted the national discussions could be.... .... and the press... don't even get me started.... willful misrepresentation of the issue. Blatant conflicts of interest. Obvious slants and endless hit pieces. Absolutely astounding. Check out what this interesting article. People believe what they want to believe even when presented with hard evidence to the contrary. ETA: The Backfire Effect (http://youarenotsosmart.com/2011/06/10/the-backfire-effect/)
Edited by crowny2 2014-06-04 10:27 AM |
| 2014-06-04 2:03 PM in reply to: crowny2 |
Elite 6387 | Subject: RE: The level of discussion on the web Originally posted by crowny2 Originally posted by powerman Sooo... I work for a municipal utility. My plant is a coal fired plant in the middle of town that has come under a lot of scrutiny to be shut down. Except it is very cheap and reliable. So that has been going on for over a year now. Lot's of political mud slinging over the topic. All of which is over making money, not over what is right. Then my plant burned down. Well, we had a very bad fire, and the whole place will be down at least over summer. We had to adjust rates for added purchase power. That made some folks mad, but we are working around the clock to restore the plant. So, my point.... through all of this, I have been involved in the news and City council, and Utility Boards meetings. Lots of news stories, and lots of comments from the peanut gallery. I am shocked to find... people are are much more stupid than I ever gave them credit for. I mean, I am absolutely shocked. That's fine if you disagree, but the comments by people are just ludicrous. These are people that actually think they are intelligent on political matters. It does not matter how much information is presented... they don't even read it, then come up with some lame reasoning. Not refute what is presented, just willfully live in ignorance. Which then leads me to discussing national politics. I like to, and think I am reasonable... but it calls into question whether I have any clue at all about anything I actually talk about. It has been very interesting being involved in something first hand, and then seeing what the public does. And this is a small local issue... I can't imagine how distorted the national discussions could be.... .... and the press... don't even get me started.... willful misrepresentation of the issue. Blatant conflicts of interest. Obvious slants and endless hit pieces. Absolutely astounding. Check out what this interesting article. People believe what they want to believe even when presented with hard evidence to the contrary. ETA: The Backfire Effect (http://youarenotsosmart.com/2011/06/10/the-backfire-effect/)
I knew someone had a thesis over it. Fascinating stuff. Thanks for the share.... and basically, yes. exactly what I am talking about. Astounding to see it in action knowing first hand information. |
| 2014-06-04 2:31 PM in reply to: powerman |
Master 4101 Denver | Subject: RE: The level of discussion on the web http://youarenotsosmart.com/2010/06/23/confirmation-bias/ A popular method for teaching confirmation bias, first introduced by P.C. Wason in 1960, is to show the following numbers to a classroom: 2, 4, 6 The teacher then asks the classroom to guess why those numbers are in that particular order and to guess the teacher’s secret rule for selecting them in that way. The students answer by offering up three numbers of their own using the rule they think is in play. The teacher will then say “yes” or “no” if the order matches the rule. When the student thinks they have it figured out, they have to write it down and turn it in. Students typically offer sets like 10, 12, 14 or 22, 24, 26. The teacher says “yes” over and over again, and the majority of people believe that the instructor’s confirmation means they have figured out the rule, but they haven’t. To figure out the rule, students would have to offer sets like 2, 2, 2 or 9, 8, 7 – these, the teacher would say, do not fit the rule. With enough guesses playing against what the students think the rule may be, students finally figure out what the original rule was: any three numbers in ascending order. The exercise is intended to show how you tend to come up with a hypothesis and then work to prove it right instead of working to prove it wrong. Once satisfied, you stop searching. You seek out safe havens for your ideology, friends and coworkers of like mind and attitude, media outlets guaranteed to play nice. Whenever your opinions or beliefs are so intertwined with your self-image you couldn’t pull them away without damaging your core concepts of self, you avoid situations which may cause harm to those beliefs. I think you'd find this book really interesting. http://us.macmillan.com/thinkingfastandslow/DanielKahneman
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| 2014-06-05 8:55 AM in reply to: powerman |
Champion 15211 Southern Chicago Suburbs, IL | Subject: RE: The level of discussion on the web Originally posted by powerman Originally posted by crowny2 Originally posted by powerman Sooo... I work for a municipal utility. My plant is a coal fired plant in the middle of town that has come under a lot of scrutiny to be shut down. Except it is very cheap and reliable. So that has been going on for over a year now. Lot's of political mud slinging over the topic. All of which is over making money, not over what is right. Then my plant burned down. Well, we had a very bad fire, and the whole place will be down at least over summer. We had to adjust rates for added purchase power. That made some folks mad, but we are working around the clock to restore the plant. So, my point.... through all of this, I have been involved in the news and City council, and Utility Boards meetings. Lots of news stories, and lots of comments from the peanut gallery. I am shocked to find... people are are much more stupid than I ever gave them credit for. I mean, I am absolutely shocked. That's fine if you disagree, but the comments by people are just ludicrous. These are people that actually think they are intelligent on political matters. It does not matter how much information is presented... they don't even read it, then come up with some lame reasoning. Not refute what is presented, just willfully live in ignorance. Which then leads me to discussing national politics. I like to, and think I am reasonable... but it calls into question whether I have any clue at all about anything I actually talk about. It has been very interesting being involved in something first hand, and then seeing what the public does. And this is a small local issue... I can't imagine how distorted the national discussions could be.... .... and the press... don't even get me started.... willful misrepresentation of the issue. Blatant conflicts of interest. Obvious slants and endless hit pieces. Absolutely astounding. Check out what this interesting article. People believe what they want to believe even when presented with hard evidence to the contrary. ETA: The Backfire Effect (http://youarenotsosmart.com/2011/06/10/the-backfire-effect/)
I knew someone had a thesis over it. Fascinating stuff. Thanks for the share.... and basically, yes. exactly what I am talking about. Astounding to see it in action knowing first hand information. It is funny because I've been having the same thoughts and remember when both of those came out and thought, Yep I see that all the time. And I see it here in Political Joe too. "Oh you are Republican, that explains your stance" or "Go figure a Democrat would have that stance" and from there that person's views are automatically called into question even if they are right.
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| 2014-06-05 9:10 AM in reply to: crowny2 |
Champion 7821 Brooklyn, NY | Subject: RE: The level of discussion on the web Originally posted by crowny2 Originally posted by powerman Sooo... I work for a municipal utility. My plant is a coal fired plant in the middle of town that has come under a lot of scrutiny to be shut down. Except it is very cheap and reliable. So that has been going on for over a year now. Lot's of political mud slinging over the topic. All of which is over making money, not over what is right. Then my plant burned down. Well, we had a very bad fire, and the whole place will be down at least over summer. We had to adjust rates for added purchase power. That made some folks mad, but we are working around the clock to restore the plant. So, my point.... through all of this, I have been involved in the news and City council, and Utility Boards meetings. Lots of news stories, and lots of comments from the peanut gallery. I am shocked to find... people are are much more stupid than I ever gave them credit for. I mean, I am absolutely shocked. That's fine if you disagree, but the comments by people are just ludicrous. These are people that actually think they are intelligent on political matters. It does not matter how much information is presented... they don't even read it, then come up with some lame reasoning. Not refute what is presented, just willfully live in ignorance. Which then leads me to discussing national politics. I like to, and think I am reasonable... but it calls into question whether I have any clue at all about anything I actually talk about. It has been very interesting being involved in something first hand, and then seeing what the public does. And this is a small local issue... I can't imagine how distorted the national discussions could be.... .... and the press... don't even get me started.... willful misrepresentation of the issue. Blatant conflicts of interest. Obvious slants and endless hit pieces. Absolutely astounding. Check out what this interesting article. People believe what they want to believe even when presented with hard evidence to the contrary. ETA: The Backfire Effect (http://youarenotsosmart.com/2011/06/10/the-backfire-effect/)
I don't buy it. |
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