Those dang Birthers are at it again
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Pro ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() I find this amusing. Sen. Ted Cruz's birth certificate shows he was born in Canada in 1970 The other part I find amusing is no mention that Obama was technically a triple citizen at birth. Even being born in Hawaii, his father was a Kenyan citizen which was a British Colony at the time. so he was born with both Kenyan, British, and US citizenship on US soil. Then when his mom remarried and moved to Indonesia he technically became an Indonesian citizen as well if he was adopted. So he has at least three, if not four citizenship's and is fully eligible. I doubt the R's will ever let Cruz get a foothold on the nomination so it's likely just a sideshow. |
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Champion ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by tuwood I find this amusing. Sen. Ted Cruz's birth certificate shows he was born in Canada in 1970 The other part I find amusing is no mention that Obama was technically a triple citizen at birth. Even being born in Hawaii, his father was a Kenyan citizen which was a British Colony at the time. so he was born with both Kenyan, British, and US citizenship on US soil. Then when his mom remarried and moved to Indonesia he technically became an Indonesian citizen as well if he was adopted. So he has at least three, if not four citizenship's and is fully eligible. I doubt the R's will ever let Cruz get a foothold on the nomination so it's likely just a sideshow. Mind: Blown. |
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Pro ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by tuwood I find this amusing. Sen. Ted Cruz's birth certificate shows he was born in Canada in 1970 The other part I find amusing is no mention that Obama was technically a triple citizen at birth. Even being born in Hawaii, his father was a Kenyan citizen which was a British Colony at the time. so he was born with both Kenyan, British, and US citizenship on US soil. Then when his mom remarried and moved to Indonesia he technically became an Indonesian citizen as well if he was adopted. So he has at least three, if not four citizenship's and is fully eligible. I doubt the R's will ever let Cruz get a foothold on the nomination so it's likely just a sideshow. Isn't one Kenyan President enough? Edited by BrianRunsPhilly 2013-08-20 8:58 AM |
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Expert ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() I'm withholding any judgements until I hear from MR Trump. |
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Champion ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by jeffnboise I'm withholding any judgements until I hear from MR Trump. I am waiting to hear from him for sure. |
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Pro ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by chirunner134 Originally posted by jeffnboise I'm withholding any judgements until I hear from MR Trump. I am waiting to hear from him for sure. I saw a quote a month or two back where Trump said he wasn't eligible. I followed the whole Birther thing with Obama quite a bit because I thought it brought up a legitimate legal question about what constitutes a natural born citizen and who had standing to challenge it. I never got into the whole "he was born in Kenya" crap because honestly it was irrelevant even if he was born there. I thought the interesting legal question was more in the context of the dual citizen side and who had standing to challenge it. I know there are a lot of establishment Republicans who very much dislike Cruz, so I find it interesting to watch them pull out the Birther card on him already. I have seen a little bit of it from the Dems, but not much. |
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Champion ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Tuwood I agree with you on who checks it and decides. Some Board of elections? I think the whole birther movement was just apart of dirty politics. It can be effective I just do not like it. |
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Pro ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by chirunner134 Tuwood I agree with you on who checks it and decides. Some Board of elections? I think the whole birther movement was just apart of dirty politics. It can be effective I just do not like it. I agree, it was dirty politics. There was a legitimate legal question in there, but it was drowned out by all the garbage. |
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Champion ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by tuwood Originally posted by chirunner134 Tuwood I agree with you on who checks it and decides. Some Board of elections? I think the whole birther movement was just apart of dirty politics. It can be effective I just do not like it. I agree, it was dirty politics. There was a legitimate legal question in there, but it was drowned out by all the garbage. I would agree. |
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Champion ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by tuwood Originally posted by chirunner134 Tuwood I agree with you on who checks it and decides. Some Board of elections? I think the whole birther movement was just apart of dirty politics. It can be effective I just do not like it. I agree, it was dirty politics. There was a legitimate legal question in there, but it was drowned out by all the garbage. What's the legitimate question? |
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Pro ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by mr2tony Originally posted by tuwood What's the legitimate question? Originally posted by chirunner134 Tuwood I agree with you on who checks it and decides. Some Board of elections? I think the whole birther movement was just apart of dirty politics. It can be effective I just do not like it. I agree, it was dirty politics. There was a legitimate legal question in there, but it was drowned out by all the garbage. What legally constitutes/defines a "natural born citizen" per the constitutional requirements to be President? The constitution doesn't define it and there hasn't really been a court case, that I'm aware of, that has either. The court cases that have set precedent are mostly related to citizenship as a whole, such as Lynch v. Clark where the plaintiff was born on US soil to two British parents. She was deemed a US citizen because she was born on US soil, but the word "natural born" wasn't mentioned. Same with most of the other cases. The CRS did put out an opinion on it in 2011, which I agree with. It's not binding law or anything, but just an interpretation. So based on their interpretation as long as you are a US Citizen at birth (no matter where you're born) you are a natural born citizen. It's only the naturalized citizens that aren't eligible. I think it's a reasonable definition. |
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Champion ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by tuwood Originally posted by mr2tony Originally posted by tuwood What's the legitimate question? Originally posted by chirunner134 Tuwood I agree with you on who checks it and decides. Some Board of elections? I think the whole birther movement was just apart of dirty politics. It can be effective I just do not like it. I agree, it was dirty politics. There was a legitimate legal question in there, but it was drowned out by all the garbage. What legally constitutes/defines a "natural born citizen" per the constitutional requirements to be President? The constitution doesn't define it and there hasn't really been a court case, that I'm aware of, that has either. The court cases that have set precedent are mostly related to citizenship as a whole, such as Lynch v. Clark where the plaintiff was born on US soil to two British parents. She was deemed a US citizen because she was born on US soil, but the word "natural born" wasn't mentioned. Same with most of the other cases. The CRS did put out an opinion on it in 2011, which I agree with. It's not binding law or anything, but just an interpretation. So based on their interpretation as long as you are a US Citizen at birth (no matter where you're born) you are a natural born citizen. It's only the naturalized citizens that aren't eligible. I think it's a reasonable definition. OK. How does that pertain to President Obama? Where is the `legitimate legal question' you say is in there? |
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Pro ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by mr2tony Originally posted by tuwood OK. How does that pertain to President Obama? Where is the `legitimate legal question' you say is in there? Originally posted by mr2tony Originally posted by tuwood What's the legitimate question? Originally posted by chirunner134 Tuwood I agree with you on who checks it and decides. Some Board of elections? I think the whole birther movement was just apart of dirty politics. It can be effective I just do not like it. I agree, it was dirty politics. There was a legitimate legal question in there, but it was drowned out by all the garbage. What legally constitutes/defines a "natural born citizen" per the constitutional requirements to be President? The constitution doesn't define it and there hasn't really been a court case, that I'm aware of, that has either. The court cases that have set precedent are mostly related to citizenship as a whole, such as Lynch v. Clark where the plaintiff was born on US soil to two British parents. She was deemed a US citizen because she was born on US soil, but the word "natural born" wasn't mentioned. Same with most of the other cases. The CRS did put out an opinion on it in 2011, which I agree with. It's not binding law or anything, but just an interpretation. So based on their interpretation as long as you are a US Citizen at birth (no matter where you're born) you are a natural born citizen. It's only the naturalized citizens that aren't eligible. I think it's a reasonable definition. Obama was born under a tin foil tent.....TuWood knows this, he was there. |
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Champion ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by Left Brain Originally posted by mr2tony Originally posted by tuwood OK. How does that pertain to President Obama? Where is the `legitimate legal question' you say is in there? Originally posted by mr2tony Originally posted by tuwood What's the legitimate question? Originally posted by chirunner134 Tuwood I agree with you on who checks it and decides. Some Board of elections? I think the whole birther movement was just apart of dirty politics. It can be effective I just do not like it. I agree, it was dirty politics. There was a legitimate legal question in there, but it was drowned out by all the garbage. What legally constitutes/defines a "natural born citizen" per the constitutional requirements to be President? The constitution doesn't define it and there hasn't really been a court case, that I'm aware of, that has either. The court cases that have set precedent are mostly related to citizenship as a whole, such as Lynch v. Clark where the plaintiff was born on US soil to two British parents. She was deemed a US citizen because she was born on US soil, but the word "natural born" wasn't mentioned. Same with most of the other cases. The CRS did put out an opinion on it in 2011, which I agree with. It's not binding law or anything, but just an interpretation. So based on their interpretation as long as you are a US Citizen at birth (no matter where you're born) you are a natural born citizen. It's only the naturalized citizens that aren't eligible. I think it's a reasonable definition. Obama was born under a tin foil tent.....TuWood knows this, he was there. Hmm ... I didn't have Tony pegged as being that old. Something in the Omaha water that makes us look young, I guess. |
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Pro ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by mr2tony Originally posted by Left Brain Hmm ... I didn't have Tony pegged as being that old. Something in the Omaha water that makes us look young, I guess. Originally posted by mr2tony Originally posted by tuwood OK. How does that pertain to President Obama? Where is the `legitimate legal question' you say is in there? Originally posted by mr2tony Originally posted by tuwood What's the legitimate question? Originally posted by chirunner134 Tuwood I agree with you on who checks it and decides. Some Board of elections? I think the whole birther movement was just apart of dirty politics. It can be effective I just do not like it. I agree, it was dirty politics. There was a legitimate legal question in there, but it was drowned out by all the garbage. What legally constitutes/defines a "natural born citizen" per the constitutional requirements to be President? The constitution doesn't define it and there hasn't really been a court case, that I'm aware of, that has either. The court cases that have set precedent are mostly related to citizenship as a whole, such as Lynch v. Clark where the plaintiff was born on US soil to two British parents. She was deemed a US citizen because she was born on US soil, but the word "natural born" wasn't mentioned. Same with most of the other cases. The CRS did put out an opinion on it in 2011, which I agree with. It's not binding law or anything, but just an interpretation. So based on their interpretation as long as you are a US Citizen at birth (no matter where you're born) you are a natural born citizen. It's only the naturalized citizens that aren't eligible. I think it's a reasonable definition. Obama was born under a tin foil tent.....TuWood knows this, he was there. I'm his real father actually |
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Champion ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by tuwood Originally posted by mr2tony Originally posted by Left Brain Hmm ... I didn't have Tony pegged as being that old. Something in the Omaha water that makes us look young, I guess. Originally posted by mr2tony Originally posted by tuwood OK. How does that pertain to President Obama? Where is the `legitimate legal question' you say is in there? Originally posted by mr2tony Originally posted by tuwood What's the legitimate question? Originally posted by chirunner134 Tuwood I agree with you on who checks it and decides. Some Board of elections? I think the whole birther movement was just apart of dirty politics. It can be effective I just do not like it. I agree, it was dirty politics. There was a legitimate legal question in there, but it was drowned out by all the garbage. What legally constitutes/defines a "natural born citizen" per the constitutional requirements to be President? The constitution doesn't define it and there hasn't really been a court case, that I'm aware of, that has either. The court cases that have set precedent are mostly related to citizenship as a whole, such as Lynch v. Clark where the plaintiff was born on US soil to two British parents. She was deemed a US citizen because she was born on US soil, but the word "natural born" wasn't mentioned. Same with most of the other cases. The CRS did put out an opinion on it in 2011, which I agree with. It's not binding law or anything, but just an interpretation. So based on their interpretation as long as you are a US Citizen at birth (no matter where you're born) you are a natural born citizen. It's only the naturalized citizens that aren't eligible. I think it's a reasonable definition. Obama was born under a tin foil tent.....TuWood knows this, he was there. I'm his real father actually And look at you now, one step from being the leader of the dark side. |
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Pro ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by mr2tony Originally posted by tuwood OK. How does that pertain to President Obama? Where is the `legitimate legal question' you say is in there? Originally posted by mr2tony Originally posted by tuwood What's the legitimate question? Originally posted by chirunner134 Tuwood I agree with you on who checks it and decides. Some Board of elections? I think the whole birther movement was just apart of dirty politics. It can be effective I just do not like it. I agree, it was dirty politics. There was a legitimate legal question in there, but it was drowned out by all the garbage. What legally constitutes/defines a "natural born citizen" per the constitutional requirements to be President? The constitution doesn't define it and there hasn't really been a court case, that I'm aware of, that has either. The court cases that have set precedent are mostly related to citizenship as a whole, such as Lynch v. Clark where the plaintiff was born on US soil to two British parents. She was deemed a US citizen because she was born on US soil, but the word "natural born" wasn't mentioned. Same with most of the other cases. The CRS did put out an opinion on it in 2011, which I agree with. It's not binding law or anything, but just an interpretation. So based on their interpretation as long as you are a US Citizen at birth (no matter where you're born) you are a natural born citizen. It's only the naturalized citizens that aren't eligible. I think it's a reasonable definition. Obama was born in Hawaii to a US citizen mother and a dual citizen father (Kenyan/British). There's no question that he is an American citizen because of both his birth place and his mother being a US citizen. The US Constitution says in order to be President you have to be a "natural born citizen" but it doesn't define the term. Various people, typically with a political axe to grind, have attempted to define it to mean various things such as; born on US soil with both US citizen parents, born on US soil with at least one US parent, born anywhere in the world with two US parents, born anywhere in the world with at least one US parent, etc... So, if it's a legal requirement to be eligible I'm simply stating there is a legitimate legal interest in clarifying the definition of what constitutes a "natural born citizen". Obviously there were a lot of whack job lawsuits claiming Obama was born in Kenya and that his birth certificate was forged, so I'm not talking about those. I'm referring to someone challenging Obama as being qualified based on the "natural born" clause. There were several cases making that exact claim, but they were all thrown out for lack of standing because they weren't "close enough" to be able to file. I suspect that the interpretation I quoted above from the CRS would be very similar to what's ultimately adopted by the Supreme Court, but to this point they've never addressed the issue. Hence, there's a legitimate legal question in there. In addition to Obama and Cruz being "challenged" on their eligibility there have been eight other Presidential candidates where the question was raised. Most recently with Romney (born in Mexico) and McCain (born in Panama). |
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Elite ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by tuwood Originally posted by mr2tony Originally posted by tuwood OK. How does that pertain to President Obama? Where is the `legitimate legal question' you say is in there? Originally posted by mr2tony Originally posted by tuwood What's the legitimate question? Originally posted by chirunner134 Tuwood I agree with you on who checks it and decides. Some Board of elections? I think the whole birther movement was just apart of dirty politics. It can be effective I just do not like it. I agree, it was dirty politics. There was a legitimate legal question in there, but it was drowned out by all the garbage. What legally constitutes/defines a "natural born citizen" per the constitutional requirements to be President? The constitution doesn't define it and there hasn't really been a court case, that I'm aware of, that has either. The court cases that have set precedent are mostly related to citizenship as a whole, such as Lynch v. Clark where the plaintiff was born on US soil to two British parents. She was deemed a US citizen because she was born on US soil, but the word "natural born" wasn't mentioned. Same with most of the other cases. The CRS did put out an opinion on it in 2011, which I agree with. It's not binding law or anything, but just an interpretation. So based on their interpretation as long as you are a US Citizen at birth (no matter where you're born) you are a natural born citizen. It's only the naturalized citizens that aren't eligible. I think it's a reasonable definition. Obama was born in Hawaii to a US citizen mother and a dual citizen father (Kenyan/British). There's no question that he is an American citizen because of both his birth place and his mother being a US citizen. The US Constitution says in order to be President you have to be a "natural born citizen" but it doesn't define the term. Various people, typically with a political axe to grind, have attempted to define it to mean various things such as; born on US soil with both US citizen parents, born on US soil with at least one US parent, born anywhere in the world with two US parents, born anywhere in the world with at least one US parent, etc... So, if it's a legal requirement to be eligible I'm simply stating there is a legitimate legal interest in clarifying the definition of what constitutes a "natural born citizen". Obviously there were a lot of whack job lawsuits claiming Obama was born in Kenya and that his birth certificate was forged, so I'm not talking about those. I'm referring to someone challenging Obama as being qualified based on the "natural born" clause. There were several cases making that exact claim, but they were all thrown out for lack of standing because they weren't "close enough" to be able to file. I suspect that the interpretation I quoted above from the CRS would be very similar to what's ultimately adopted by the Supreme Court, but to this point they've never addressed the issue. Hence, there's a legitimate legal question in there. In addition to Obama and Cruz being "challenged" on their eligibility there have been eight other Presidential candidates where the question was raised. Most recently with Romney (born in Mexico) and McCain (born in Panama). I'm no Birther, just interested in the topic. But there were indeed legitimate questions raised about Obama's citizenship at the time of his campaign. He is a natural born citizen, but I have no problem with verification. And I do not think the requirement in the Constitution is outdated. You should be a natural born citizen to run the country. Sorry, Arnold. Can there be some wired thing... well like Arnold for instance, where he lives here and can't be POTUS... sure. But I don't really care. Out of 350 million people, we can't find a natural born citizen qualified to run the country? |
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Veteran ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by powerman Originally posted by tuwood Originally posted by mr2tony Originally posted by tuwood OK. How does that pertain to President Obama? Where is the `legitimate legal question' you say is in there? Originally posted by mr2tony Originally posted by tuwood What's the legitimate question? Originally posted by chirunner134 Tuwood I agree with you on who checks it and decides. Some Board of elections? I think the whole birther movement was just apart of dirty politics. It can be effective I just do not like it. I agree, it was dirty politics. There was a legitimate legal question in there, but it was drowned out by all the garbage. What legally constitutes/defines a "natural born citizen" per the constitutional requirements to be President? The constitution doesn't define it and there hasn't really been a court case, that I'm aware of, that has either. The court cases that have set precedent are mostly related to citizenship as a whole, such as Lynch v. Clark where the plaintiff was born on US soil to two British parents. She was deemed a US citizen because she was born on US soil, but the word "natural born" wasn't mentioned. Same with most of the other cases. The CRS did put out an opinion on it in 2011, which I agree with. It's not binding law or anything, but just an interpretation. So based on their interpretation as long as you are a US Citizen at birth (no matter where you're born) you are a natural born citizen. It's only the naturalized citizens that aren't eligible. I think it's a reasonable definition. Obama was born in Hawaii to a US citizen mother and a dual citizen father (Kenyan/British). There's no question that he is an American citizen because of both his birth place and his mother being a US citizen. The US Constitution says in order to be President you have to be a "natural born citizen" but it doesn't define the term. Various people, typically with a political axe to grind, have attempted to define it to mean various things such as; born on US soil with both US citizen parents, born on US soil with at least one US parent, born anywhere in the world with two US parents, born anywhere in the world with at least one US parent, etc... So, if it's a legal requirement to be eligible I'm simply stating there is a legitimate legal interest in clarifying the definition of what constitutes a "natural born citizen". Obviously there were a lot of whack job lawsuits claiming Obama was born in Kenya and that his birth certificate was forged, so I'm not talking about those. I'm referring to someone challenging Obama as being qualified based on the "natural born" clause. There were several cases making that exact claim, but they were all thrown out for lack of standing because they weren't "close enough" to be able to file. I suspect that the interpretation I quoted above from the CRS would be very similar to what's ultimately adopted by the Supreme Court, but to this point they've never addressed the issue. Hence, there's a legitimate legal question in there. In addition to Obama and Cruz being "challenged" on their eligibility there have been eight other Presidential candidates where the question was raised. Most recently with Romney (born in Mexico) and McCain (born in Panama). I'm no Birther, just interested in the topic. But there were indeed legitimate questions raised about Obama's citizenship at the time of his campaign. He is a natural born citizen, but I have no problem with verification. And I do not think the requirement in the Constitution is outdated. You should be a natural born citizen to run the country. Sorry, Arnold. Can there be some wired thing... well like Arnold for instance, where he lives here and can't be POTUS... sure. But I don't really care. Out of 350 million people, we can't find a natural born citizen qualified to run the country? Judging from the last four presidential elections and the entire 2012 GOP primary field (excluding Dr. Paul who never actually had a chance), I'm starting to think the answer to this is no. |
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Champion ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by kevin_trapp Judging from the last four presidential elections and the entire 2012 GOP primary field (excluding Dr. Paul who never actually had a chance), I'm starting to think the answer to this is no. I agree with the GOP primary field No Sarah Palin? what is up with that. I am glad we still have the natural born citizen clause. Its too important of a position and I would worry about country like China take over the white house if its not. They can already pour as much money as they want into our elections. If they could have there own puppet candidate too? I know they could have that now. Its just not as easy as it would be. |
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Pro ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by chirunner134 Originally posted by kevin_trapp Judging from the last four presidential elections and the entire 2012 GOP primary field (excluding Dr. Paul who never actually had a chance), I'm starting to think the answer to this is no. I agree with the GOP primary field No Sarah Palin? what is up with that. I am glad we still have the natural born citizen clause. Its too important of a position and I would worry about country like China take over the white house if its not. They can already pour as much money as they want into our elections. If they could have there own puppet candidate too? I know they could have that now. Its just not as easy as it would be. Why worry only about China? Foreign and domestic special interests have bought and sold many a politician. Corporations are people too, you know. |
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Pro ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() | ![]() Originally posted by chirunner134 Originally posted by kevin_trapp Judging from the last four presidential elections and the entire 2012 GOP primary field (excluding Dr. Paul who never actually had a chance), I'm starting to think the answer to this is no. I agree with the GOP primary field No Sarah Palin? what is up with that. I am glad we still have the natural born citizen clause. Its too important of a position and I would worry about country like China take over the white house if its not. They can already pour as much money as they want into our elections. If they could have there own puppet candidate too? I know they could have that now. Its just not as easy as it would be. I'm curious to see who the Dem's parade out this time around. I could be wrong, but I think either Hillary or Joe would be a disaster in the general election. Obviously it depends a lot on who they go up against. There's only a few other names mentioned that I've even heard of; Cuomo, Napolitano, and Deval Patrick. |
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