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Death of an American City
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 2005-12-12 11:49 AM |
Resident Curmudgeon  25290    The Road Back Gold member |  Subject: Death of an American CityThe following is an editorial from the NY Times, forwarded to me by a friend of mine. She is asking people to send it to friends and relatives who live out of Louisiana...asking them to contact their senators and congressman, telling them it is time to pay attention to New Orleans. Hope this will help light a fire under the federal government. Thanks for your help. Death of an American CityPublished: December 11, 2005 We are about to lose New Orleans. Whether it is a conscious plan to let the city rot until no one is willing to move back or honest paralysis over difficult questions, the moment is upon us when a major American city will die, leaving nothing but a few shells for tourists to visit like a museum.
We said this wouldn't happen. President Bush said it wouldn't happen. He stood in Jackson Square and said, "There is no way to imagine America without New Orleans." But it has been over three months since Hurricane Katrina struck and the city is in complete shambles.
There are many unanswered questions that will take years to work out, but one is make-or-break and needs to be dealt with immediately. It all boils down to the levee system. People will clear garbage, live in tents, work their fingers to the bone to reclaim homes and lives, but not if they don't believe they will be protected by more than patches to the same old system that failed during the deadly storm. Homeowners, businesses and insurance companies all need a commitment before they will stake their futures on the city.
At this moment the reconstruction is a rudderless ship. There is no effective leadership that we can identify. How many people could even name the president's liaison for the reconstruction effort, Donald Powell? Lawmakers need to understand that for New Orleans the words "pending in Congress" are a death warrant requiring no signature. The rumbling from Washington that the proposed cost of better levees is too much has grown louder. Pretending we are going to do the necessary work eventually, while stalling until the next hurricane season is upon us, is dishonest and cowardly. Unless some clear, quick commitments are made, the displaced will have no choice but to sink roots in the alien communities where they landed.
The price tag for protection against a Category 5 hurricane, which would involve not just stronger and higher levees but also new drainage canals and environmental restoration, would very likely run to well over $32 billion. That is a lot of money. But that starting point represents just 1.2 percent of this year's estimated $2.6 trillion in federal spending, which actually overstates the case, since the cost would be spread over many years. And it is barely one-third the cost of the $95 billion in tax cuts passed just last week by the House of Representatives. Total allocations for the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and the war on terror have topped $300 billion. All that money has been appropriated as the cost of protecting the nation from terrorist attacks. But what was the worst possible case we fought to prevent?
Losing a major American city.
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| 2005-12-12 11:51 AM in reply to: #303761 |
Queen BTich 12411 , | Subject: RE: Death of an American City |
| 2005-12-12 12:04 PM in reply to: #303761 |
Master 1845  Athens, Ga. | Subject: RE: Death of an American City I heard from a friend whose brother lives in New Orleans (their house was okay) that the leadership there doesn't want to rebuild the town like it was before Katrina. Something about trying to deter people from returning. Hmmm... Something to think about. |
| 2005-12-12 1:57 PM in reply to: #303780 |
Resident Curmudgeon 25290 The Road Back Gold member | Subject: RE: Death of an American City watergirl - 2005-12-12 12:04 PM I heard from a friend whose brother lives in New Orleans (their house was okay) that the leadership there doesn't want to rebuild the town like it was before Katrina. Something about trying to deter people from returning. Hmmm... Something to think about. Sounds like one of those purposely vague conspiracy theories, heard from a friend of a friend, that "they" are trying to do something. Exactly who is trying to deter whom from returning, and how are they attempting to accomplish this? And what exactly should we "think about"? These are the kinds of rumors and innuendo that keep the simple-minded folk from taking a stand. What I've seen lately, and plenty of it, is Ray Nagim visiting cities where the evacuees landed and beating the bushes trying to get them to return. I don't think anyone wants "to rebuild the town like it was before Katrina." Stronger and safer, maybe. |
| 2005-12-12 2:58 PM in reply to: #303761 |
Master 1462 Michigan | Subject: RE: Death of an American City Death of an American City, we have that here in Michigan, Detroit. |
| 2005-12-12 3:03 PM in reply to: #303961 |
Resident Curmudgeon 25290 The Road Back Gold member | Subject: RE: Death of an American City smokeater1833 - 2005-12-12 2:58 PM Death of an American City, we have that here in Michigan, Detroit. Yes, but that's a mercy killing. just kidding of course. |
| 2005-12-12 3:59 PM in reply to: #303761 |
Champion 5183 Wisconsin | Subject: RE: Death of an American City The American Library Association has deicded to go ahead and hold our annual meeting(convention) there this summer. (It has been planned for there for like 10 yrs...) It is the nation's largest meeting after the dem/rep national committee. Press release is here: http://www.ala.org/ala/pressreleases2005/october2005/2006neworleans... as a profession, we are doing a LOT, (being the socialists we all secretly are, we know we can't rely on that guy in Washington who doesn't work or act on behalf of anyone but himself) http://www.ala.org/ala/cro/katrina/katrina.htm Edited by possum 2005-12-12 3:59 PM |
| 2005-12-12 4:02 PM in reply to: #303761 |
Master 1845 Athens, Ga. | Subject: RE: Death of an American City the bear - 2005-12-12 2:57 PM I don't think anyone wants "to rebuild the town like it was before Katrina." Stronger and safer, maybe. I forgot I was talking to "the bear" |
 2005-12-12 4:04 PM in reply to: #304040 |
| Subject: ... This user's post has been ignored. |
| 2005-12-12 4:13 PM in reply to: #304045 |
| Resident Curmudgeon 25290 The Road Back Gold member | Subject: RE: Death of an American City watergirl - 2005-12-12 4:02 PM the bear - 2005-12-12 2:57 PM I don't think anyone wants "to rebuild the town like it was before Katrina." Stronger and safer, maybe. I forgot I was talking to "the bear" That's all well and good and understood, but without the money to provide hurricane protection, not many people are going to want to "give of themselves," only to have it destroyed with the next Cat 3 storm. possum, that's a step. Supposedly the city is open for business, just need tourists, and workers, and companies and, well, people. I have yet to visit, post-Katrina, but we are planning a trip next week. |
| 2005-12-12 6:57 PM in reply to: #304059 |
| Elite 2458 Livingston, MT | Subject: RE: Death of an American City the bear - 2005-12-12 1:13 PM That's all well and good and understood, but without the money to provide hurricane protection, not many people are going to want to "give of themselves," only to have it destroyed with the next Cat 3 storm. possum, that's a step. Supposedly the city is open for business, just need tourists, and workers, and companies and, well, people. I have yet to visit, post-Katrina, but we are planning a trip next week. I thought it was a Cat 5 storm before it hit land and was a Cat 4 storm when it came ashore. It was my understanding that the Army Corps of Engineers certified the levee system for Cat 3 storms. No matter I guess  |
| 2005-12-12 7:02 PM in reply to: #304140 |
| Resident Curmudgeon 25290 The Road Back Gold member | Subject: RE: Death of an American City ChuckyFinster - 2005-12-12 6:57 PM the bear - 2005-12-12 1:13 PM That's all well and good and understood, but without the money to provide hurricane protection, not many people are going to want to "give of themselves," only to have it destroyed with the next Cat 3 storm. I thought it was a Cat 5 storm before it hit land and was a Cat 4 storm when it came ashore. It was my understanding that the Army Corps of Engineers certified the levee system for Cat 3 storms. No matter I guess
possum, that's a step. Supposedly the city is open for business, just need tourists, and workers, and companies and, well, people. I have yet to visit, post-Katrina, but we are planning a trip next week. So did I say anything about what size storm Katrina was, or the "certification" of the previous levee system? |
| 2005-12-12 9:23 PM in reply to: #304142 |
| Elite 3650 Laurium, MI | Subject: RE: Death of an American City I'm not trying to sound mean here, but before we start pointing our fingers at washington, maybe we should start looking at the local government. The weakness of the flood protection system was a known issue. Has been for years. I believe there was money set aside to begin improvment, but it was "side tracked" by the mayor for other "projects." From what I've heard the whole local government of that city isn't the most scrupulous. |
| 2005-12-12 9:44 PM in reply to: #304219 |
| Champion 8936 | Subject: RE: Death of an American City vortmax - 2005-12-12 9:23 PM I'm not trying to sound mean here, but before we start pointing our fingers at washington, maybe we should start looking at the local government. The weakness of the flood protection system was a known issue. Has been for years. I believe there was money set aside to begin improvment, but it was "side tracked" by the mayor for other "projects." From what I've heard the whole local government of that city isn't the most scrupulous. The weakness of the levee system was NOT known before the storm. What has been discovered since the storm is that the system was inadequate for a Category 3 because it was improperly built in the first place. And I'll remind you that the Army Corps of Engineers is who's resposible for the building and continued upkeep and inspection of the levee system. Also, money for upgrading the levee system has been denied on a federal level for years and years. The money was never here to begin with, so the claim that it was squandered isn't a valid one. Now, the local government has been crooked as hell, but Nagin is a big improvement over what we've had in the past, believe it or not. He's just been put in a situation nobody could have ever imagined or anticipated. |
| 2005-12-12 9:57 PM in reply to: #304219 |
| Resident Curmudgeon 25290 The Road Back Gold member | Subject: RE: Death of an American City vortmax - 2005-12-12 9:23 PM I'm not trying to sound mean here, but before we start pointing our fingers at washington, maybe we should start looking at the local government. The weakness of the flood protection system was a known issue. Has been for years. I believe there was money set aside to begin improvment, but it was "side tracked" by the mayor for other "projects." From what I've heard the whole local government of that city isn't the most scrupulous. More rumor, innuendo, misinformation. Please check your information before doing something even as innocuous as posting on a tri board. "From what I heard"? What kind of source is that? |
| 2005-12-12 10:48 PM in reply to: #304241 |
| Extreme Veteran 584 coastal NC | Subject: RE: Death of an American City There is a thread on this board that lists citations about the 10-15-year history of the levee systems' neglect by both flavors of presidents and administrations. Army Corps takes years to build things and years to screw them up. They need help and political will to drive the rebuilding of the levee system to protect its people. New Orleans is a special place. One with major problems, but hellfire, what city isn't? I've been there nine times, four for Jazzfest, five because I was feeling hedonistic or looking to woo someone. I love that city. Could not live there without becoming a 400-lb. alchoholic chef music aficionado, but still... Bear, I'll write and if you have a susceptible reporter in DC to reach out to, I'll do so after the holidays. I've got a sick kid now, but later. Just say. |
| 2005-12-13 3:04 AM in reply to: #304241 |
| Elite 3650 Laurium, MI | Subject: RE: Death of an American City first off, there were complaints about the levee system. It was designed for cat 3, but there were known issues with them dating back for years. Reports that were never filed with the Army Corp of engineers. But I guess the USA today is nothing but propaganda and innuendo http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2005-11-19-levee-warnings_x.htm The levee's may have been built and maintained by the army corp of engineers, but they were not managed by them. Managment was performed by local government. I'm not implying the feds had nothing to do with it. I'm implying that the local govt was a hapless victim in the mess |
| 2005-12-13 4:59 AM in reply to: #304273 |
| Resident Curmudgeon 25290 The Road Back Gold member | Subject: RE: Death of an American City vortmax - 2005-12-13 3:04 AM first off, there were complaints about the levee system. It was designed for cat 3, but there were known issues with them dating back for years. Reports that were never filed with the Army Corp of engineers. But I guess the USA today is nothing but propaganda and innuendo http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2005-11-19-levee-warnings_x.htmThe levee's may have been built and maintained by the army corp of engineers, but they were not managed by them. Managment was performed by local government. I'm not implying the feds had nothing to do with it. I'm implying that the local govt was a hapless victim in the mess There is nothing in your article that suggests that "there was money set aside to begin improvment, but it was "side tracked" by the mayor for other "projects." That is the rumor, innuendo, misinformation with which I have contention . The money needed to bring the levee system up to necessary standard was never approved by the feds. Of course the local government was aware of the levee system's shortcomings. Being able to fund the improvement is a whole 'nother proposition.
Edited by the bear 2005-12-13 5:02 AM |
| 2005-12-13 5:24 AM in reply to: #303761 |
| Resident Curmudgeon 25290 The Road Back Gold member | Subject: RE: Death of an American City As a side note, my planned visit to the city for next week will have to be a day trip few hotel rooms are available. City and state officials have been extolling the fact that "the city is open for business," but in truth you have to wonder if they presently have the capacity for tourists. |
| 2005-12-13 6:54 AM in reply to: #304273 |
| Champion 8936 | Subject: RE: Death of an American City vortmax - 2005-12-13 3:04 AM first off, there were complaints about the levee system. It was designed for cat 3, but there were known issues with them dating back for years. Reports that were never filed with the Army Corp of engineers. But I guess the USA today is nothing but propaganda and innuendo http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2005-11-19-levee-warnings_x.htmThe levee's may have been built and maintained by the army corp of engineers, but they were not managed by them. Managment was performed by local government. I'm not implying the feds had nothing to do with it. I'm implying that the local govt was a hapless victim in the mess Hi, I live here. I'm well aware of the situation and don't need to get my info from USA Today. Unlike others, I was aware of the levee system before the hurricane as well and have followed this for years. You're not going to tell me something I don't know, and more than likely you'll tell me something that's not true because you're quoting a secondhand news source. I've already told you that our local government has been bad for years and is in the process of getting better. Sure they're partly to blame, but how exactly do you fix a levee system that wasn't built to specifications without being given the money to do it? |
| 2005-12-13 7:51 AM in reply to: #303761 |
| Subject: RE: Death of an American City A few questions: Since New Orleans is an essential port and will continue to be a hub of oil and other big industry, how can the city "die"? Won't there always be a need for blue collar workers, skilled workers, and white collar business? Isn't this just the kind of deeper infastructure that keeps a city alive? What is so wrong about not re-developing the most vuenrable areas? Why would poor people want to move back to an area where they'd be set up again for disastar? Isn't it possible to bring these locals home, without putting them back in an area that will always be in danger? |
| 2005-12-13 8:06 AM in reply to: #304344 |
| Giver 18427 | Subject: RE: Death of an American City When people talk abou the city dying, it seems to me that they're talking more about the soul than the body. NOLA is an essential port city, and I can't see that ever going away. But the soul of the city, its culture and its people are in grave danger. I heard an NPR story yesterday about New Orleanians protesting the mayor's decision to have Mardi Gras this year, saying it's not a time to celibrate. That's one way the city is dying.
newbiedoo - 2005-12-13 8:51 AM A few questions: Since New Orleans is an essential port and will continue to be a hub of oil and other big industry, how can the city "die"? Won't there always be a need for blue collar workers, skilled workers, and white collar business? Isn't this just the kind of deeper infastructure that keeps a city alive? What is so wrong about not re-developing the most vuenrable areas? Why would poor people want to move back to an area where they'd be set up again for disastar? Isn't it possible to bring these locals home, without putting them back in an area that will always be in danger?
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| 2005-12-13 8:10 AM in reply to: #303961 |
| The Original 7834 Raleigh/Durham | Subject: RE: Death of an American City smokeater1833 - 2005-12-12 3:58 PM Death of an American City, we have that here in Michigan, Detroit. Agree- Detroit is awful. Is it getting any better? Before I moved from MI they were trying to reviatalize parts of it, and really focusing on the are near Comerica park. Although with something like that it takes lot of time. |
| 2005-12-13 8:16 AM in reply to: #304350 |
| Queen BTich 12411 , | Subject: RE: Death of an American City Yes, the soul, the heartbeat dying, not the port. New Orleans is so much more than a port. As for those protesting, they are the transplants in Atlanta that are protesting. I don't understand that mentality, if they want the city to come back, Mardi Gras is perfect. Get tourists back, get money back, get people back! run4yrlif - 2005-12-13 9:06 AM I heard an NPR story yesterday about New Orleanians protesting the mayor's decision to have Mardi Gras this year, saying it's not a time to celibrate. That's one way the city is dying. |
| 2005-12-13 8:18 AM in reply to: #304353 |
| Giver 18427 | Subject: RE: Death of an American City Go watch ""Roger & Me", Michael Moore's film on the Big Three and what they've done in Michigan.
runnergirl29 - 2005-12-13 9:10 AM smokeater1833 - 2005-12-12 3:58 PM Death of an American City, we have that here in Michigan, Detroit. Agree- Detroit is awful. Is it getting any better? Before I moved from MI they were trying to reviatalize parts of it, and really focusing on the are near Comerica park. Although with something like that it takes lot of time. |
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