First race of the season and my run was slow
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2010-06-02 10:27 AM |
Member 39 | Subject: First race of the season and my run was slow Just completed a sprint tri last weekend and although I was happy with my swim and bike I lost alot of positions on my miserable run. typically I am running 2 to 3 times a week one day is a long distance run of around 6 or 7 miles one day will be a short 3 mile run and one day a 2 mile sprint. I have ran just over 7 minute miles on my sprint day it varies to 8 minutes. for this sprint i ran 9 minute miles. I admit i need to brick more often as i only had one brick before this race. any advise? I would like to shave off a minute off my run time per mile hopefully soon. distance of this last race was 1/4 mile ocean swim in very rough water, 10 mile bike, 5k run. my time was 1:07:10 i was about 20th place overall coming out of the water, then 35th off the bike and 69th after the run. so you can see why i need some help running. i averaged 21 mph on the bike swim was 8:25 but it was a very rough swim and i came out good there |
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2010-06-02 10:36 AM in reply to: #2896452 |
Runner | Subject: RE: First race of the season and my run was slow Run more. A lot more. |
2010-06-02 10:47 AM in reply to: #2896452 |
Extreme Veteran 590 Sioux Falls, SD | Subject: RE: First race of the season and my run was slow In my admittedly amateur opinion: I think you need to run more often. Three times a week is a bare minimum and twice a week is simply not enough. I'd shoot for at least four run sessions. Myself, running was my weak discipline so I decided to do something about it this spring. I created a training plan that had me running six days a week. Two medium length runs, one long and three short runs. The long run is about 33% longer than the medium runs, and the short runs are about 33% less. Each week I increase volume by no more than 10%, and step back my volume every 4th week as a recovery week. Right now I'm just running easy, not worrying about speed. Currently I'm closing in on 30 miles per week, with my volume target being around 40 miles per week (training for a half-mary in Sept.) Once I hit my volume target, I'll back off a bit and start incorporating some speed work. I tried doing speed work a while back when I was logging < 15 miles per week, but discovered that all I accomplished was injuring myself. So I decided I needed to build a better base first. I had my first sprint tri of the year this last saturday. While running still isn't my strong point, I PR'd the 5k portion of the race by over two minutes from my previous best. Again, this was simply by building weekly volume. I can only imagine once I start including speedwork I'll turn into a complete wild man on the run. So that's my two cents. Take it for what it's worth. |
2010-06-02 10:57 AM in reply to: #2896452 |
Member 39 | Subject: RE: First race of the season and my run was slow I am definitely going to step up my running even if i need to cut back somewhere or add more time somewhere. 9 minutes isn't cutting it. |
2010-06-02 10:57 AM in reply to: #2896452 |
Expert 1310 Alabama | Subject: RE: First race of the season and my run was slow I'm in the same boat, only worse. My run is abysmally slow. In my sprint tri a couple of weeks, i spotted everyone in my age group 6 minutes based on my run time. Thank goodness I had a decent bike, swim and transitions. I'm trying to ramp up my mileage and keep up the rest of my training. I'm finding it difficult to balance all the tri training for each sport, and concentrate on building more than one area. Only advice I have, is what everyone else has said, run more and try to do it more often. |
2010-06-02 10:57 AM in reply to: #2896506 |
Champion 10018 , Minnesota | Subject: RE: First race of the season and my run was slow I also wonder if you are accustomed to sprint a bike effort that fast with enough gas left for the run. Were you conserving anything for the run? Are you trained for that hard of an effort? You don't necessarily need to do bricks, but perhaps the brick will help you to see how hard you can go on the bike and still execute a good run. In addition to running lots, I would suggesting biking lots Good luck! It will come with time. |
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2010-06-02 10:59 AM in reply to: #2896452 |
Expert 2852 Pfafftown, NC | Subject: RE: First race of the season and my run was slow Begs the questions, from me.........(just out of curiosity and NOT a critique).... How fast do you normally swim? Did you go pretty much "all-out" on the swim leg? Same questions with the bike. |
2010-06-02 11:03 AM in reply to: #2896452 |
Pro 6582 Melbourne FL | Subject: RE: First race of the season and my run was slow Scout said it (as always), RUN MORE. At the end of 08 I decided to become a "runner" and started to train to run long races (15k & 13.1). First long run race was to be a HM in Feb 09 but got sick and didn't run it, then did a 15k was in July, 2nd 15k in Nov and the HM in Feb of this year. I had a Sprint race in Oct of last year, didn't really train for it other than some swimming and riding ~8wks beforehand. Had my fast Sprint run ever with a 7:12 pace that included an over and back bridge climb (1/4 mile up 4% grade) in the FL Sun and heat. |
2010-06-02 11:14 AM in reply to: #2896546 |
Champion 10471 Dallas, TX | Subject: RE: First race of the season and my run was slow This was going to be mt feedback/questions as well. I can train for half marathons on 3 days a week. So I tend to question you bike fitness. 21 mph is pretty fast and if you do not do that in training You may have blown your run on the bike. BikerGrrrl - 2010-06-02 10:57 AM I also wonder if you are accustomed to sprint a bike effort that fast with enough gas left for the run. Were you conserving anything for the run? Are you trained for that hard of an effort? You don't necessarily need to do bricks, but perhaps the brick will help you to see how hard you can go on the bike and still execute a good run. In addition to running lots, I would suggesting biking lots Good luck! It will come with time. |
2010-06-02 12:10 PM in reply to: #2896553 |
Member 39 | Subject: RE: First race of the season and my run was slow i have been swimming masters for about 15 months and my 200 time is at 2:35 as far as the bike i sometimes will do a 14 mile loop and is it pretty common for me to average 19.6 on my computer. this particular race the ocean was borderline canceling it due to rough seas. i swam it pretty hard but i didnt run out in the water so as to have an elevated heart rate. i went quick but not in a panic like most do. I felt decent coming off the bike but after about a 1/2 mile I could tell i wasnt going to be running fast. |
2010-06-02 12:22 PM in reply to: #2896452 |
Champion 10471 Dallas, TX | Subject: RE: First race of the season and my run was slow How accurate are your logs? I thought I saw around 25 miles of running for the month of May? |
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2010-06-02 12:22 PM in reply to: #2896452 |
Not a Coach 11473 Media, PA | Subject: RE: First race of the season and my run was slow Scout only hit 1/3 of the issue this time (silly runners ). You need better swim & bike fitness to run to whatever your "potential" happens to be. And pacing to get you T2 with enough energy to do so. Running well in a tri often as as much (or more) to do with swimming and biking as it does running. |
2010-06-02 12:44 PM in reply to: #2896806 |
Runner | Subject: RE: First race of the season and my run was slow JohnnyKay - 2010-06-02 1:22 PM Scout only hit 1/3 of the issue this time (silly runners ). You need better swim & bike fitness to run to whatever your "potential" happens to be. And pacing to get you T2 with enough energy to do so. Running well in a tri often as as much (or more) to do with swimming and biking as it does running. Well, I see a person only running 2x a week, I think "low hanging fruit". |
2010-06-02 1:01 PM in reply to: #2896870 |
Not a Coach 11473 Media, PA | Subject: RE: First race of the season and my run was slow Scout7 - 2010-06-02 1:44 PM JohnnyKay - 2010-06-02 1:22 PM Scout only hit 1/3 of the issue this time (silly runners ). You need better swim & bike fitness to run to whatever your "potential" happens to be. And pacing to get you T2 with enough energy to do so. Running well in a tri often as as much (or more) to do with swimming and biking as it does running. Well, I see a person only running 2x a week, I think "low hanging fruit".Like I said, 1/3 of the fruit. I see someone who likely swam & biked too hard for their respective swim & bike fitness levels. But I don't disagree that running more will help eventually too. |
2010-06-02 1:20 PM in reply to: #2896452 |
Extreme Veteran 607 Rochester, MN | Subject: RE: First race of the season and my run was slow As others have said s/b/r more. If you want to nail the run next race, tank the bike and you'll have lots left for the run. Seriously, learning to pace each leg properly based on your fitness level takes some race experience. Keep training smart, get more race experience and your pacing will improve. You should be able to get within 15-20 seconds per mile pace of your open 5k pace with proper training and pacing. ?????? |
2010-06-02 3:18 PM in reply to: #2896452 |
Expert 2555 Colorado Springs, Colorado | Subject: RE: First race of the season and my run was slow If your logs are accurate, the obvious answer is you don't train enough to be able to carry speed through an entire race. Your bike and run training is woefully insufficient. At a bare minimum you should be doing the amount of bike and run volume that your logs show for the entire month of May - every week. Currently you are only averaging ~25 miles/week on the bike and ~5 miles/week running. Speed and endurance come from consistently training at higher volumes over a long period of time, coupled with some speedwork after a decent base has been built. These things do not come from training at minimum levels and only ramping up for a week before a race - unless a person is very genetically gifted. |
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2010-06-02 3:21 PM in reply to: #2896802 |
Member 39 | Subject: RE: First race of the season and my run was slow I never fill that out usually. I only discovered it the other day. I write everything down on a calendar |
2010-06-02 3:30 PM in reply to: #2897267 |
Expert 2555 Colorado Springs, Colorado | Subject: RE: First race of the season and my run was slow OK, even going by what you wrote in the OP, your running is only ~12 miles/week and there is no indication of how much you bike. The running volume alone needs to be doubled. Most likely your biking needs to be increased as well. Since you fell off the pace so quickly that would indicate you're biking at your maximum fitness level and have nothing left for the run. Stronger bike legs will allow you to have something left and more running will increase your endurance. |
2010-06-02 3:38 PM in reply to: #2896452 |
Member 39 | Subject: RE: First race of the season and my run was slow basically the breakdown of my schedule is this and does not vary a whole lot. monday wednesday and friday I swim masters, 1:15 minutes 3000 to 3500 yds tuesday evenings 1 hour hard spin with 15 minute warm up, thursdays I either do spin or ill bring my bike to work and do a 12 mile out and back which takes me 36 minutes. saturdays I do a group ride at 20 mph pace with sprint sections up to 25 mph that ride is 30 miles, occasionally i will run a couple miles after the ride but not so far ths year. sunday i try to reserve for my 6 to 7 mile run the only thing i do on top of this is add my running after i get home from work which is usually my short run days and sometimes i am slacking and only run on a swim day twice a week. I am training about 1 plus hour per day somewhere i have to commit to an additional run day. |