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2011-11-23 10:29 PM
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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012

Question:

I am very interested in doing this plan starting in December, but one of my goals for the year is a Century every month in '12.   Can I work that in without screwing up the schedule too bad?



2011-11-24 6:38 AM
in reply to: #3913821

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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012
furiousferret - 2011-11-23 11:29 PM

Question:

I am very interested in doing this plan starting in December, but one of my goals for the year is a Century every month in '12.   Can I work that in without screwing up the schedule too bad?

 

Why not?  There is a long ride each week, why not once a month you go long, take an extra day to recover from your Century.    Besides, I am officially starting in December and need some to commiserate with while everyone else is deep in the program.

2011-11-24 9:26 AM
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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012

Does anyone know how/if it is possible to disable a Garmin HR alarm? My cardiac drift carries me outside the HR zone as I work at maintaining the speed (which I equate to maintaining the power). Short of turning the radio up, any guidance?

 

Week 8 day 2 in the bag - I started early.

2011-11-24 10:28 AM
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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012
What's the best way to incorporate extra trainer rides using your program? Normally, I would do some easy runs on off days with the program but I have a running injury so I can't.  I would like to add 2 extra trainer rides per week.  Should I just do 75-80% on these days? Thanks!
2011-11-24 10:51 AM
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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012
For some reason I think my critical power calculation came out too low. I plugged in the number for both the 5 min and 20 min effort on the BT calc and Golden Cheetah. The CP number is identical. The problem is that it feels too easy for me. Based on how everyone else is saying how hard the workouts are I feel like I am doing something wrong. For example when it says go 80% I need to go 95 - 100% to feel like it is an adequate challenge. When I first tested I did an FTP test outside at the beginning of the month. My CP result is 40 watts lower than my outdoor FTP result. I did my CP test indoors on the trainer so I can understand that my hard effort outdoors may be much different then indoors. When I based my workouts during the first two weeks on FTP it felt hard now with my CP it feels too easy. Should I just keep going based on my lower CP number or should I plug my FTP result back into my Edge 500. Maybe I am making a big deal out of nothing but I just want to do the workouts correctly. Right now it feels like I am doing something wrong. 
2011-11-24 11:45 AM
in reply to: #3914067

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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012

MRDAVIDALEXANDER - 2011-11-24 10:28 AM What's the best way to incorporate extra trainer rides using your program? Normally, I would do some easy runs on off days with the program but I have a running injury so I can't.  I would like to add 2 extra trainer rides per week.  Should I just do 75-80% on these days? Thanks!

I would start with 1 extra ride @ 70-75% (~60 min) and see how it goes. If you can do all workouts, you recover between workouts and feel good, then add another one similar intensity. If all is doable, you recover, etc. then you can consider adding duration and/or a bit of intensity.

Remember; training load = duration + intensity. when one goes up, usually the other one goes down. This program has a focus on intensity, hence to add more, perhaps duration at easier intensity will work best.



2011-11-24 11:46 AM
in reply to: #3913821

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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012
furiousferret - 2011-11-23 10:29 PM

Question:

I am very interested in doing this plan starting in December, but one of my goals for the year is a Century every month in '12.   Can I work that in without screwing up the schedule too bad?

sure. do some of your long rides, longer/easier to be in shape to tackle the century and when you schedule it 1x month, make other bike workouts that week easier.

See how your body adapts and adjust from there

2011-11-24 11:49 AM
in reply to: #3914090

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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012

TimX3 - 2011-11-24 10:51 AM For some reason I think my critical power calculation came out too low. I plugged in the number for both the 5 min and 20 min effort on the BT calc and Golden Cheetah. The CP number is identical. The problem is that it feels too easy for me. Based on how everyone else is saying how hard the workouts are I feel like I am doing something wrong. For example when it says go 80% I need to go 95 - 100% to feel like it is an adequate challenge. When I first tested I did an FTP test outside at the beginning of the month. My CP result is 40 watts lower than my outdoor FTP result. I did my CP test indoors on the trainer so I can understand that my hard effort outdoors may be much different then indoors. When I based my workouts during the first two weeks on FTP it felt hard now with my CP it feels too easy. Should I just keep going based on my lower CP number or should I plug my FTP result back into my Edge 500. Maybe I am making a big deal out of nothing but I just want to do the workouts correctly. Right now it feels like I am doing something wrong. 

while CP tends to come up lower when testing indoors than outdoors, 40w difference is high. perhaps when you tested indoors the results are not representative to your true fitness level; maybe you didn't paced well, maybe it was too hot, maybe you were tired, etc.

In my experience my CP outdoors vs indoors is no more than 10-15w difference. start with something like that and see how it feels; based on that adjust and when you test again, make sure to be rested, have a good cooling system, hydrated, pace well, etc.

2011-11-26 8:56 AM
in reply to: #3744433

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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012

I am experiencing some pain in my arch (plantar...maybe?) since starting the program.  I have used the v3 program last year but I was using my tri bike.  I am using my road bike right now.  Any sugguestions to fix this?

2011-11-27 9:02 AM
in reply to: #3744433

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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012

Question for you... I just did my 5 min test... completed 20 min earlier this week.. when I update the info on the Power and HR Calculator spreadsheet (using power) my "CP in Watts"on line 17 goes down with a higher 5 min test number... confused...

20 min test= 211

5 min test=225

CP in watts= 206

Updated numbers... 

20 min test= 211 (G10)

5 min test= 276 (G9)

CP in watts= 189 (B17)

Embarassed



Edited by Oriondriver02 2011-11-27 9:20 AM
2011-11-27 11:40 AM
in reply to: #3916109

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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012
Oriondriver02 - 2011-11-27 10:02 AM

Question for you... I just did my 5 min test... completed 20 min earlier this week.. when I update the info on the Power and HR Calculator spreadsheet (using power) my "CP in Watts"on line 17 goes down with a higher 5 min test number... confused...

20 min test= 211

5 min test=225

CP in watts= 206

Updated numbers... 

20 min test= 211 (G10)

5 min test= 276 (G9)

CP in watts= 189 (B17)

Embarassed

That's because of the steepness of the slope between the two, your very strong for the short duration and it's projecting that you cannot hold the wattage over time.

Looking back at the Version 2 program that I did twice that year (with the 5' short test), my "typical" spread between the two tests were in the low to high 30's.



2011-11-27 1:40 PM
in reply to: #3916222

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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012
Donto - 2011-11-27 11:40 AM
Oriondriver02 - 2011-11-27 10:02 AM

Question for you... I just did my 5 min test... completed 20 min earlier this week.. when I update the info on the Power and HR Calculator spreadsheet (using power) my "CP in Watts"on line 17 goes down with a higher 5 min test number... confused...

20 min test= 211

5 min test=225

CP in watts= 206

Updated numbers... 

20 min test= 211 (G10)

5 min test= 276 (G9)

CP in watts= 189 (B17)

Embarassed

That's because of the steepness of the slope between the two, your very strong for the short duration and it's projecting that you cannot hold the wattage over time.

Looking back at the Version 2 program that I did twice that year (with the 5' short test), my "typical" spread between the two tests were in the low to high 30's.

Thanks for the reply... now this has me scratching my head... so how do I use this info to my advantage...  for the past 3 weeks I have completed each of the first 3 weekly rides always riding at the top of the spread on each interval... but now that I have done the tests it has lowered my CP significantly... was using CP of 206 and now it says to use 189...  so I am trying to figure out how I improve my riding by riding at lower wattages... I will add that I was able to complete each ride with relative ease save the two FT's... just trying to figure it all out as I want to improve my biking... thanks in advance!

Cool

2011-11-27 3:48 PM
in reply to: #3916298

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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012
Oriondriver02 - 2011-11-27 2:40 PM
Donto - 2011-11-27 11:40 AM
Oriondriver02 - 2011-11-27 10:02 AM

Question for you... I just did my 5 min test... completed 20 min earlier this week.. when I update the info on the Power and HR Calculator spreadsheet (using power) my "CP in Watts"on line 17 goes down with a higher 5 min test number... confused...

20 min test= 211

5 min test=225

CP in watts= 206

Updated numbers... 

20 min test= 211 (G10)

5 min test= 276 (G9)

CP in watts= 189 (B17)

Embarassed

That's because of the steepness of the slope between the two, your very strong for the short duration and it's projecting that you cannot hold the wattage over time.

Looking back at the Version 2 program that I did twice that year (with the 5' short test), my "typical" spread between the two tests were in the low to high 30's.

Thanks for the reply... now this has me scratching my head... so how do I use this info to my advantage...  for the past 3 weeks I have completed each of the first 3 weekly rides always riding at the top of the spread on each interval... but now that I have done the tests it has lowered my CP significantly... was using CP of 206 and now it says to use 189...  so I am trying to figure out how I improve my riding by riding at lower wattages... I will add that I was able to complete each ride with relative ease save the two FT's... just trying to figure it all out as I want to improve my biking... thanks in advance!

Cool

How did you feel during the 20 min test...do you feel like you gave it all you had?   Maybe it wasn't your day when you did the test...you do have a big gap between the two.

2011-11-27 4:23 PM
in reply to: #3744433

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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012
20 min test was not my day... think I will keep with my current CP and wait to retake the 20 min test again....
2011-11-28 1:46 PM
in reply to: #3744433

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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012

Question for the Brain Trust:

 

I was out of town last week for Turkey Day, so I only did days 1 and 3 of week 4. 

 

Should I continue on to week 5 or repeat week 4?

2011-11-28 3:08 PM
in reply to: #3915395

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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012
MRDAVIDALEXANDER - 2011-11-26 8:56 AM

I am experiencing some pain in my arch (plantar...maybe?) since starting the program.  I have used the v3 program last year but I was using my tri bike.  I am using my road bike right now.  Any sugguestions to fix this?

This is a new one. Perhaps on the road bike you foot tends to 'collapse' more? This is something desirable for running, but not so much for cycling. perhaps consider some of Specialized BG inserts, I hope that helps!


2011-11-28 3:14 PM
in reply to: #3916109

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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012
Oriondriver02 - 2011-11-27 9:02 AM

Question for you... I just did my 5 min test... completed 20 min earlier this week.. when I update the info on the Power and HR Calculator spreadsheet (using power) my "CP in Watts"on line 17 goes down with a higher 5 min test number... confused...

20 min test= 211

5 min test=225

CP in watts= 206

Updated numbers... 

20 min test= 211 (G10)

5 min test= 276 (G9)

CP in watts= 189 (B17)

Embarassed

This is because the model works on the assumption as to how the maximal efforts relate to your fintness and your ability to sustain power overtime

Your 5min power is closely related to your VO2 max; the reason why if your 5 min power increases but your 20min power remains the same it means your ability to sustain power over time is not as string as your ability to sustain a higher power in shorter duration where the anaerobic system contributes more for energy demands. Basically it means you have to focus much more on increasing your ability to produce and SUSTAIN more power between 20 and 60 min. For you, the best time to invest is by doing sets at your 20min power and Critical power

2011-11-28 3:18 PM
in reply to: #3916298

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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012
Oriondriver02 - 2011-11-27 1:40 PM
Donto - 2011-11-27 11:40 AM
Oriondriver02 - 2011-11-27 10:02 AM

Question for you... I just did my 5 min test... completed 20 min earlier this week.. when I update the info on the Power and HR Calculator spreadsheet (using power) my "CP in Watts"on line 17 goes down with a higher 5 min test number... confused...

20 min test= 211

5 min test=225

CP in watts= 206

Updated numbers... 

20 min test= 211 (G10)

5 min test= 276 (G9)

CP in watts= 189 (B17)

Embarassed

That's because of the steepness of the slope between the two, your very strong for the short duration and it's projecting that you cannot hold the wattage over time.

Looking back at the Version 2 program that I did twice that year (with the 5' short test), my "typical" spread between the two tests were in the low to high 30's.

Thanks for the reply... now this has me scratching my head... so how do I use this info to my advantage...  for the past 3 weeks I have completed each of the first 3 weekly rides always riding at the top of the spread on each interval... but now that I have done the tests it has lowered my CP significantly... was using CP of 206 and now it says to use 189...  so I am trying to figure out how I improve my riding by riding at lower wattages... I will add that I was able to complete each ride with relative ease save the two FT's... just trying to figure it all out as I want to improve my biking... thanks in advance!

Cool

BTW, unless you know for sure you did the 20min test at your best of your abilities (i.e. you were rested, you paced well, you were fueled, you had good cooling system, etc. ) then I would use 190w for CP, otherwise if you 'failed' the test then use something between 195 and 200 watts as your CP for now.

The next weeks will focused around the 20min power so by the end of the cycle it should be higher than 211!

2011-11-28 3:19 PM
in reply to: #3917479

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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012
windandsurf - 2011-11-28 1:46 PM

Question for the Brain Trust:

 

I was out of town last week for Turkey Day, so I only did days 1 and 3 of week 4. 

 

Should I continue on to week 5 or repeat week 4?

you should be good to continue on week 5. If you feel you would rather re-do week 4 you can also do that!
2011-11-28 4:06 PM
in reply to: #3917721

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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012
JorgeM - 2011-11-28 3:18 PM
Oriondriver02 - 2011-11-27 1:40 PM
Donto - 2011-11-27 11:40 AM
Oriondriver02 - 2011-11-27 10:02 AM

Question for you... I just did my 5 min test... completed 20 min earlier this week.. when I update the info on the Power and HR Calculator spreadsheet (using power) my "CP in Watts"on line 17 goes down with a higher 5 min test number... confused...

20 min test= 211

5 min test=225

CP in watts= 206

Updated numbers... 

20 min test= 211 (G10)

5 min test= 276 (G9)

CP in watts= 189 (B17)

Embarassed

That's because of the steepness of the slope between the two, your very strong for the short duration and it's projecting that you cannot hold the wattage over time.

Looking back at the Version 2 program that I did twice that year (with the 5' short test), my "typical" spread between the two tests were in the low to high 30's.

Thanks for the reply... now this has me scratching my head... so how do I use this info to my advantage...  for the past 3 weeks I have completed each of the first 3 weekly rides always riding at the top of the spread on each interval... but now that I have done the tests it has lowered my CP significantly... was using CP of 206 and now it says to use 189...  so I am trying to figure out how I improve my riding by riding at lower wattages... I will add that I was able to complete each ride with relative ease save the two FT's... just trying to figure it all out as I want to improve my biking... thanks in advance!

Cool

BTW, unless you know for sure you did the 20min test at your best of your abilities (i.e. you were rested, you paced well, you were fueled, you had good cooling system, etc. ) then I would use 190w for CP, otherwise if you 'failed' the test then use something between 195 and 200 watts as your CP for now.

The next weeks will focused around the 20min power so by the end of the cycle it should be higher than 211!

Thanks Jorge... I completed Week 4 Day 1 this morning... used 206 CP to calculate zones... no issues.... I think I "failed" the 20 min test when I look at it... and killed myself on the 5 min test... first time doing them and I think I worried too much about failing the 20 min test that I failed it... I had a nice bathtub graph... higher for the first 3-5 mins... then a dip down... plateau... then ramp back up for last 3-5 mins... not my best effort and excellent learning curve for me... I think I will stick with what I have now and try to do a better job next testing cycle... thanks again for the response!

2011-11-29 6:15 PM
in reply to: #3744433

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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012

How quickly things changed.  last week I was loving the Day1 intervals.  Last night I suffered through the set ready to puke.  Power was there when I wanted it, but riding on a quessy stomach is no fun.  I suspect I need to watch what I eat late in the day.

I simply cannot eat a race day breakfast 2x a day 4x a week. 

So I ask the forum,

What are you doing nutritionally to prepare for an over the top cycling workouts, like cpv4?



2011-11-29 6:34 PM
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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012

Very annoying.  I did the HR test tonight and at 25 min my HR monitor started acting up.  That is my first time doing the test (ever).  I have been using an estimated threshold up to this point (158). 

For the majority of the test my HR was between 148-162 and then at min 25 it dropped to 88.  Then it hovered around 80 -90 for about 3 minutes with occasional spikes up to 140.  I was pushing as hard as I could and I am sure my heart rate was not in the 80's.

When I checked my avg at the end it said 143.  Do I use 143 or do I bump it up some?  Any suggestions?

2011-11-29 7:49 PM
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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012
gabrelsj - 2011-11-29 7:34 PM

Very annoying.  I did the HR test tonight and at 25 min my HR monitor started acting up.  That is my first time doing the test (ever).  I have been using an estimated threshold up to this point (158). 

For the majority of the test my HR was between 148-162 and then at min 25 it dropped to 88.  Then it hovered around 80 -90 for about 3 minutes with occasional spikes up to 140.  I was pushing as hard as I could and I am sure my heart rate was not in the 80's.

When I checked my avg at the end it said 143.  Do I use 143 or do I bump it up some?  Any suggestions?

What I would do may not be right, but I would take the avg of what you have (155) and use that until it is time to retest.  That is the avg between 148-162.  

2011-11-29 7:58 PM
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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012

Last two weeks have been hit and miss- started today with Wk1 day 1

Min HR: 62
Avg HR: 158
Max HR: 171
Avg Pwr: 202 Max Pwr: 259 yPower: 202 Score: 21 Factor: 0.8 Cad: 0
2:06 PM   [Lap data] HR data]

Power Numbers are for 20min test

 We'll see what the 5 min test will bring Thursday.

Thomas

2011-11-29 7:59 PM
in reply to: #3919693

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Subject: RE: Cycling program v4.0 2011-2012
rsmoylan - 2011-11-29 7:49 PM
gabrelsj - 2011-11-29 7:34 PM

Very annoying.  I did the HR test tonight and at 25 min my HR monitor started acting up.  That is my first time doing the test (ever).  I have been using an estimated threshold up to this point (158). 

For the majority of the test my HR was between 148-162 and then at min 25 it dropped to 88.  Then it hovered around 80 -90 for about 3 minutes with occasional spikes up to 140.  I was pushing as hard as I could and I am sure my heart rate was not in the 80's.

When I checked my avg at the end it said 143.  Do I use 143 or do I bump it up some?  Any suggestions?

What I would do may not be right, but I would take the avg of what you have (155) and use that until it is time to retest.  That is the avg between 148-162.  

Thank you.  That is what I was thinking.

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