Gray Guys/Girls Masters Focus Triathlete Forum--OPEN! (Page 16)

Hey Kim,

Good start!  You are right to be cognizant of injury prevention as you start a training program and yes, it is helpful to have a training plan, although, just starting out, there really aren't any plans that will be truly helpful (there are a number of "beginner" plans here on BT however they assume a basic level of fitness and they are not really written for the true beginner/newbie that is coming off of the couch).  I would suggest a Couch-to-5K app for your smartphone.  That will give you a good start on the running.  You can just search C25K or Couch to 5K on either your Android or Apple and find any number of apps.  The apps are all similar in that they have you walking and running.  Each workout you run a bit longer and walk a bit less.  Over the course of 12 weeks or so the app will guide you to running a 5K (3.1 miles).  Really good way to get started and avoid injury.  Most of the C25K apps have you working out 3 times a week. The temptation after a good workout is to try and speed things up and workout every day or double up on workouts.  Word of caution, don't try to shortcut the system.  One of the first thing "newbies" need to learn is that the recovery time (rest) is as important as the actual workout time.

The same concept applies to your bike riding.  You are not as likely to develop an overuse injury on the bike as running because you don't have the impact on the bike.  Just enjoy getting out and riding and maybe add a couple minutes or a bit of distance each time you ride.  There are a couple of free apps available for your smartphone that can help you track progress.  One in particular that I like is called MapMyFitness.  They have several variations - MayMyRun, MapMyRide, as well as the MapMyFitness app.  All of them do the same thing.  They use the GPS in your phone to record speed/pace, mileage, workout time, etc.  An alternative to the MapMyFitness apps is an app called Endomondo.  It does the same thing using a bit different format.  The nice thing about Endomondo is you can export a TCX file and upload that to your training log here on Beginner Triathlete.  Not that big a deal as it is easy to enter the information manually.  Both the MayMyFitness  and Endomondo apps have a paid version which you really don't need if you are using the BT training logs.

Speaking of training logs, it is a very good idea to start keeping a log.  You are a member of BT so you have access to "Your" training log.  It is helpful to be able to go back and see what you have done.  You can also plan workouts which will be handy as you become more experienced.  If you are really into tracking things there is also a nutrition log available so you can have more numbers to look at then you will know what to do with!

Finally, on swimming.  You mentioned "I know I need to work up my cardio capacity to do this."  That is true, however the bigger limiting factor at this point is probably your stroke technique.  It is wonderful that you have someone that can help you.  Eyes on deck are always the best way to make rapid progress in the pool.  I have written a couple articles about swimming and various aspects of the freestyle stroke, if you are interested you can find them at http://goscottgo.info/index.php/swimming-technique.  Also you can visit http://swimsmooth.com where you can find some good animations as well as a number of informative articles.

Good luck and welcome to this crazy world of triathlon!

I rest my case.  There is a reason they have two sections that train at different pools!  You will be better served by joining the triathlon team.  If at some point in the future you get bitten by the swimming bug, you can always change which pool you train at.  It will probably be helpful to train with the swim team during the triathlon off-season.  That will keep you in shape over the winter, not to mention make you a faster swimmer.

Good luck!

Originally posted by lutzman

Originally posted by k9car363

Steve,

Now that we know you are well on the road to recovery.  I am wondering how your bike made out?  Is it repairable or are you in the market for a new bike?

Hey Scott: The answer on the condition of my bike is I really don't know yet as I haven't seen it. When I crashed one of the guys on the scene told me it looked OK but who knows? Pretty funny story: When it came time to pack up and go home I was still drugged up and in the hospital. But my bike needed to be taken apart and packed into my bike box. Enter my wife, a cousin who lives in Boise and her husband, all of whom really know nothing about bikes. To me, it's a pretty simple project. Our strategy was they would get the bike and bike box at the hotel, call me in my hospital room and I would walk them through the steps via cell phone. Sure. Step one--start with the easy stuff to build confidence--remove pedals. Seems simple enough. 20 minutes later they are still at it, just taking off the pedals. They finally say they got the first pedal off but it also caused the chain to come off, too? What? Exasperated, I tell them to send me a cell phone pic of what their doing. Turns out, they removed the big chain ring and crank arm. I in turn found a picture on the internet of what pedals are and sent it back. And so it went. Meanwhile, I'm drugged up, hooked to an oxygen monitor which would set off an alarm claxon if my blood oxygen levels dropped to some pre-set warning level. So they keep asking question after question, I'm answering, the alarms are going off continuously. My wife can't hear me on the phone over the alarms so I'm shouting, the nurses are running in and out of the room to respond to the oxygen alert. Meanwhile, the nurses are all trying to figure out what I' yelling about causing the alarms. And this went on for about an hour. They finally got it boxed up. At least that's their story. My cousin and her hubby are visiting us in two weeks and "say" they will bring the bike box with them then. Until that time I have no idea about the condition of my bike, whether I'll ever see it again, or if it actually survived the crash but later lost its life during the bike box recovery effort. Stay tuned. Steve

That's pretty funny ....as an old ICU nurse we used to get people who would thump their fingers on their chest to send the monitors into what looked like bad rhythms so we'd go running in expecting they were in arrest to find them watching TV and playing with the leads.

Worrying about the condition of your bike seems kind of a secondary thing while you are recovering--but I know I would be a mess about my ride too if I crashed as badly as that.

Deb – I know I really should get a proper bike fit. My doctor has suggested it might be the cause of my hip problems. I just haven’t been able to bring myself to spend the money for it. I think I’m a little afraid they’ll tell me I have the wrong size bike and they can’t correctly fit me to it – and a new bike is just not a possibility right now. I did do some of those exercises and stretches last night after my walk and things feel a little better today. I know it’ll take time, but at least it’s a start.

Scott – so I’ve been back in the pool twice now and after reading your website I think my biggest problem is my body roll, or maybe I should say lack thereofJ, to one side at least. I can breathe bi-laterally but prefer the left and have noticed that I tend to face that way instead of flattening out between breaths. So then when I do breathe to the right, I feel like I have farther to go – hope that makes sense to you, not quite sure how else to put it.

I have a question for you on pool “toys”. I know you’re not a fan of fins and kickboards (I don’t usually use either one), but what about a pull buoy? I don’t use it often - only occasionally when I want to concentrate on my stroke and not worry about my legs sinking. I know if I’m swimming correctly, my legs shouldn’t sink, but they do. Am I doing more harm than good by using a pull buoy every once in a while?

Janet

Steve:  I love the bike story and hope it all turns out well.  Hopefully they did not use a pipe wrench during the disassembly.

Scott I:  Great times on that first tri!!  Congrats!

I got out for a 3.5 hour bike ride this morning and found a new route that I know I will be spending a lot of time on - not much traffic, no signals, very good road condition, a good long section of flat and then a long slow hill climb.  If my legs are feeling okay tomorrow, I will be heading out for another ride.   Have a great weekend everyone!!

Hi Janet,

This is probably going to surprise a couple people!  I don't have a problem at all with paddles, ankle bands and/or pull buoys - with a brief explanation.

I will start with paddles.  They are a wonderful tool if used properly.  The problem is that most coaches and swimmers use them improperly.  Just a few minutes ago I read a post by a coach in response to a question about setting up a workout that said - "Have 1 swim workout as strength (use paddles, bands, pull buoy, etc.)."  That is NOT what paddles are for!  The swim paddle as we know it today was designed and patented by a gentleman named Jim Montrella.  I know this because Jim was my swimming coach back in the day.  We were the first team to use paddles in our training.  Paddles are to reinforce stroke technique.  We would use them during our swim technique trainings at the beginning of the season and during our recovery weeks during stroke technique sets.  Using paddles magnifies and highlights technique flaws.  For example, if your hand is somewhat sideways when it enters the water, the paddles will magnify the fact and cause your hand to rapidly slide off to the side.  If you hand is in the wrong position during the pull, the paddles will make it very difficult to keep your hand in the proper position.  If you are paying attention to what the paddles are telling you, in VERY short order, along the lines of just a couple hundred yards, you will be able to identify and correct any flaws in your technique.  Once you have identified the flaws and corrected them, you can then do a couple intervals at threshold pace and be able to identify any technique breakdown when you speed up.  I will say again, paddles are NOT for strength work.  If you want to strengthen your arms, shoulders, back, chest, and core muscles - go to the gym.  It is faster, more precise, and has less risk of injury (yes, using paddles puts increased pressure on the shoulders).

I would not use ankle bands and/or pull buoys unless I was using paddles.  To my way of thinking, paddles are for pulling and when you are pulling you want to immobilize the feet.  Ideally, you are only using an ankle band (we used old truck tire inner tubes cut into approximately 2" pieces - basically a big rubber band).  I do acknowledge that some people have a problem with their legs sinking so they use a buoy.  I encourage you to try it with an ankle band.  You can still "kick," and while you won't have the propulsion of the foot movement, you will have the benefit of kicking which will assist with your rotation and keep your legs from sinking.  What I mean is, with the band on, obviously you aren't able to actually kick.  However, your body doesn't necessarily know your feet aren't moving.  Remember that thing back in school about for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction?  Well, when you kick, even though the band stopped it, your body responds as if you DID kick.  I hope that makes sense, I rewrote it a couple times and I am still not sure what I mean is coming through.

Bottom line is this - I encourage the use of paddles and bands during your recovery week.  If you are not doing periodized training, then I would limit the use of paddles and pull sets to no more than once every 2-3 of weeks.  I would start east, something like 8 x 50 with 1:00 rest.  Follow that with 2 x 50 at threshold pace and 0:30 rest.  Pay particular attention to what the paddles are telling you about your stroke technique.

One final thought - if you use paddles you will feel like your stroke is doing NOTHING the first few laps after you take them off.  For those laps, it will seem as though you have absolutely no feel for the water.  During that time, focus on the technique flaws you identified and make sure your technique is correct.  After a couple laps you will be "back to normal" and your feel for the water will return.

Hope that answers the question.

Janet,

I figured this is important enough that it deserves it's own response.  From what you said and obviously without having seen you swim, I agree, it sounds like you have a bit of a problem with your body rotation.

I don't think you are "facing to you left" as you said.  I suspect it feels that way because the rotation is so unequal.  So, stating the obvious, you need to rotate equally to both sides.  To start with, let's recall a couple points about body rotation:

1. Body rotation should be symmetrical around the long axis of the body.  That means it should be equal to the left and right.
2. The head should remain stationary and not roll with the body unless you are breathing.
3. Single sided breathing tends to magnify body rotation problems (roll will be good to breathing side, bad to non-breathing side).
4. High turnover rate can negatively impact body rotation.

A couple things that help facilitate body rotation (these are direct copies from my website):

1. Reach for the wall – After your hand enters the water, reach for the far wall, stretching your hand as far forward as you can. This will promote rolling into the stroke, thereby enhancing your body roll.  Use caution not to over-reach.
2. Brush Your Hip with Your Thumb – As you begin your recovery, brush your hip with your thumb. Visualize your thumb helping to rotate your hip up, or stated another way, your thumb brushes your hip out of the way. The effect of this is twofold. First, in order for your thumb to brush your hip, you must have full extension in your stroke. Second, it will facilitate proper body roll at release and the recovery end of your stroke.

To correct this I would start with a dry land drill.  Assume the "swimmer's position," bend at the waist, torso parallel to the floor.  One arm above your head, the other behind you.  Go through the entire freestyle stroke, including body rotation (from the waist up) and breathing.  I would not worry so much about "proper" stroke technique, however I would focus on your shoulders.  If you can do this in front of a mirror, so much the better.  You want to work on getting your rotation equal to both sides.  Get to know what that feels like.

Once you have a sense of what equal rotation feels like, transfer it to the water.  When you get in the pool, I would breathe bi-laterally one lap, then breathe only to your right one lap, then repeat.  Use that breathing pattern for the next couple workouts, then go back to bi-lateral breathing.  The idea is to break the habit of favoring the left side.

As you go through all of this, remember to "reach for the wall," and "brush your hip with your thumb," to facilitate proper body rotation.

Hopefully that helps.  If you have any questions please ask.

Let me know how it is going.