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Vaccine or not? (Page 3)
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 2021-07-29 12:02 PM in reply to: nickster |
Extreme Veteran  5722   |  Subject: RE: Vaccine or not?Originally posted by nickster I'm asking for the source of your data. Here is where I first read it https://www.texastribune.org/2021/07/21/coronavirus-texas-vaccinated... The data matches multiple other geographies |
| 2021-08-03 5:30 AM in reply to: marcag |
Expert 1183   Fort Wayne, IN | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? Originally posted by marcag Originally posted by nickster I'm asking for the source of your data. Here is where I first read it https://www.texastribune.org/2021/07/21/coronavirus-texas-vaccinated... The data matches multiple other geographies I read the article and have a few comments: 1. The Texas dept of health comment was "Of the 8,787 people who have died in Texas due to COVID-19 since early February, at least 43 were fully vaccinated, the Texas Department of State Health Services said." Note this says "at least" 43 fully vaccinated people. This implies (to me at least) they were evaluating whether breakthrough cases exist and not attempting to quantify the exact number of cases in fully vaccinated people. The article them assumes there were exactly 43 such cases. This is a stretch. 2. The data collection was started in early February when relatively few people were vaccinated. By May 21st, only 34% of Texans were fully vaccinated (https://usafacts.org/visualizations/covid-vaccine-tracker-states/state/texas). There are thus many more people unvaccinated people and one would naturally expect more cases and more deaths. 3. The article states that most fully vaccinated deaths were in those with underlying conditions. I believe this is the case for all covid deaths as well. 4. The article states that DSHS checked to see where covid was listed as the cause of death and then checked against vaccine records. Note that it has been reported in several sources that if a person died WITH covid it was assumed they died OF covid. The vaccines have been shown to be effective and I'm not disputing that. It does appear that now, in general, the increase in the number of covd cases is increasing in the US, but so far there is not a corresponding increase in deaths. |
| 2021-08-03 9:23 AM in reply to: nickster |
Extreme Veteran 5722 | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? Originally posted by nickster Originally posted by marcag Originally posted by nickster I'm asking for the source of your data. Here is where I first read it https://www.texastribune.org/2021/07/21/coronavirus-texas-vaccinated... The data matches multiple other geographies I read the article and have a few comments: 1. The Texas dept of health comment was "Of the 8,787 people who have died in Texas due to COVID-19 since early February, at least 43 were fully vaccinated, the Texas Department of State Health Services said." Note this says "at least" 43 fully vaccinated people. This implies (to me at least) they were evaluating whether breakthrough cases exist and not attempting to quantify the exact number of cases in fully vaccinated people. The article them assumes there were exactly 43 such cases. This is a stretch. 2. The data collection was started in early February when relatively few people were vaccinated. By May 21st, only 34% of Texans were fully vaccinated (https://usafacts.org/visualizations/covid-vaccine-tracker-states/state/texas). There are thus many more people unvaccinated people and one would naturally expect more cases and more deaths. 3. The article states that most fully vaccinated deaths were in those with underlying conditions. I believe this is the case for all covid deaths as well. 4. The article states that DSHS checked to see where covid was listed as the cause of death and then checked against vaccine records. Note that it has been reported in several sources that if a person died WITH covid it was assumed they died OF covid. The vaccines have been shown to be effective and I'm not disputing that. It does appear that now, in general, the increase in the number of covd cases is increasing in the US, but so far there is not a corresponding increase in deaths. Here another from May https://apnews.com/article/coronavirus-pandemic-health-941fcf43d9731... it addresses some of the points you bring up. The numbers of deaths is lower, no doubt about it. But it's also rising. That being said, I think some people are starting to get it. Vaccination seems to want to increase. But like women's soccer, you can't keep up with Canada :-) |
| 2021-08-03 9:44 AM in reply to: marcag |
Pro 15655 | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? What is women's soccer? |
| 2021-08-03 7:16 PM in reply to: Left Brain |
Extreme Veteran 5722 | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? Originally posted by Left Brain What is women's soccer? Men's soccer is that sport that neither Canadian or Americans are good enough to qualify for the Olympics. Women's soccer is the same sport played by people that identify as women and have a T level low enough. From what I understand, if you're a Republican you want the US to lose and Canada to win. Not very patriotic those Republicans :-) |
| 2021-08-03 7:42 PM in reply to: marcag |
Expert 4918 Middle River, Maryland Silver member | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? Originally posted by marcag Originally posted by Left Brain Men's soccer is that sport that neither Canadian or Americans are good enough to qualify for the Olympics. Women's soccer is the same sport played by people that identify as women and have a T level low enough. From what I understand, if you're a Republican you want the US to lose and Canada to win. Not very patriotic those Republicans :-) What is women's soccer? And apparently those Republicans (well, only a certain segment of them), are especially triggered by one in particular. |
| 2021-08-04 6:45 AM in reply to: jmhpsu93 |
Champion 10157 Alabama | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? Originally posted by jmhpsu93 Originally posted by marcag Originally posted by Left Brain Men's soccer is that sport that neither Canadian or Americans are good enough to qualify for the Olympics. Women's soccer is the same sport played by people that identify as women and have a T level low enough. From what I understand, if you're a Republican you want the US to lose and Canada to win. Not very patriotic those Republicans :-) What is women's soccer? And apparently those Republicans (well, only a certain segment of them), are especially triggered by one in particular. Yes, the b’ who took a knee during the National Anthem. Actions have consequences. I for one am glad they lost so they won’t be able to disgrace and disrespect the United States on the podium. Athletes are entertainers and should know their audience. Mr Kappermick (?) last seen working the drive thru window at Wendy’s….. BTW, anyone who dyes their hair purple sends a message but I don’t think it’s the message they think they are sending. To me, the message is, “I feel inferior and need to do something radical so people will notice me.” |
| 2021-08-04 7:10 AM in reply to: Rogillio |
Extreme Veteran 5722 | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? Originally posted by Rogillio Originally posted by jmhpsu93 Originally posted by marcag Originally posted by Left Brain Men's soccer is that sport that neither Canadian or Americans are good enough to qualify for the Olympics. Women's soccer is the same sport played by people that identify as women and have a T level low enough. From what I understand, if you're a Republican you want the US to lose and Canada to win. Not very patriotic those Republicans :-) What is women's soccer? And apparently those Republicans (well, only a certain segment of them), are especially triggered by one in particular. Yes, the b’ who took a knee during the National Anthem. Actions have consequences. I for one am glad they lost so they won’t be able to disgrace and disrespect the United States on the podium. Athletes are entertainers and should know their audience. Mr Kappermick (?) last seen working the drive thru window at Wendy’s….. BTW, anyone who dyes their hair purple sends a message but I don’t think it’s the message they think they are sending. To me, the message is, “I feel inferior and need to do something radical so people will notice me.” Miss B is quite the spokeswoman. In the spirit of Olympic camaraderie : "how embarrassing, we lost to Canada" We know how she feels. We felt it when the US won hockey at Lake Placid ie "Miracle on ice" |
| 2021-08-04 9:11 AM in reply to: marcag |
Expert 4918 Middle River, Maryland Silver member | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? Originally posted by marcag Originally posted by Rogillio Miss B is quite the spokeswoman. In the spirit of Olympic camaraderie : "how embarrassing, we lost to Canada" We know how she feels. We felt it when the US won hockey at Lake Placid ie "Miracle on ice" Originally posted by jmhpsu93 Yes, the b’ who took a knee during the National Anthem. Actions have consequences. I for one am glad they lost so they won’t be able to disgrace and disrespect the United States on the podium. Athletes are entertainers and should know their audience. Mr Kappermick (?) last seen working the drive thru window at Wendy’s….. BTW, anyone who dyes their hair purple sends a message but I don’t think it’s the message they think they are sending. To me, the message is, “I feel inferior and need to do something radical so people will notice me.” Originally posted by marcag Originally posted by Left Brain Men's soccer is that sport that neither Canadian or Americans are good enough to qualify for the Olympics. Women's soccer is the same sport played by people that identify as women and have a T level low enough. From what I understand, if you're a Republican you want the US to lose and Canada to win. Not very patriotic those Republicans :-) What is women's soccer? And apparently those Republicans (well, only a certain segment of them), are especially triggered by one in particular. LOL - hey you had your chance against the Soviets in those Olympics, AND Finland for that matter. Don't worry you got us in 2010. That one hurt. |
| 2021-08-04 9:22 AM in reply to: marcag |
Pro 15655 | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? Originally posted by marcag Originally posted by Left Brain Men's soccer is that sport that neither Canadian or Americans are good enough to qualify for the Olympics. Women's soccer is the same sport played by people that identify as women and have a T level low enough. From what I understand, if you're a Republican you want the US to lose and Canada to win. Not very patriotic those Republicans :-) What is women's soccer? You realize I don't care at all about soccer, right? I couldn't name a single person on a men's or women's team. LMAO Yeah, I know the women like to get all worked up over politics....other then that....what? |
| 2021-08-04 9:23 AM in reply to: Rogillio |
Expert 4918 Middle River, Maryland Silver member | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? Originally posted by Rogillio Originally posted by jmhpsu93 Yes, the b’ who took a knee during the National Anthem. Actions have consequences. I for one am glad they lost so they won’t be able to disgrace and disrespect the United States on the podium. Athletes are entertainers and should know their audience. Mr Kappermick (?) last seen working the drive thru window at Wendy’s….. BTW, anyone who dyes their hair purple sends a message but I don’t think it’s the message they think they are sending. To me, the message is, “I feel inferior and need to do something radical so people will notice me.” Originally posted by marcag Originally posted by Left Brain Men's soccer is that sport that neither Canadian or Americans are good enough to qualify for the Olympics. Women's soccer is the same sport played by people that identify as women and have a T level low enough. From what I understand, if you're a Republican you want the US to lose and Canada to win. Not very patriotic those Republicans :-) What is women's soccer? And apparently those Republicans (well, only a certain segment of them), are especially triggered by one in particular. The U.S. side stopped kneeling during the anthem back in February. Now every player kneels for the same cause before the match starts. The men do it too, and in Euro 2020, the Premier League ,the Champions League, etc. “I think those that were collectively kneeling felt like we were kneeling to bring about attention to police brutality and systemic racism, and I think we decided that moving forward we no longer feel the need to kneel because we are doing the work behind the scenes. We are combatting (sic) systemic racism. And we never felt we were going to kneel forever,” defender Crystal Dunn said.
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| 2021-08-04 10:55 AM in reply to: jmhpsu93 |
Pro 15655 | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? Originally posted by jmhpsu93 Originally posted by Rogillio Originally posted by jmhpsu93 Yes, the b’ who took a knee during the National Anthem. Actions have consequences. I for one am glad they lost so they won’t be able to disgrace and disrespect the United States on the podium. Athletes are entertainers and should know their audience. Mr Kappermick (?) last seen working the drive thru window at Wendy’s….. BTW, anyone who dyes their hair purple sends a message but I don’t think it’s the message they think they are sending. To me, the message is, “I feel inferior and need to do something radical so people will notice me.” Originally posted by marcag Originally posted by Left Brain Men's soccer is that sport that neither Canadian or Americans are good enough to qualify for the Olympics. Women's soccer is the same sport played by people that identify as women and have a T level low enough. From what I understand, if you're a Republican you want the US to lose and Canada to win. Not very patriotic those Republicans :-) What is women's soccer? And apparently those Republicans (well, only a certain segment of them), are especially triggered by one in particular. The U.S. side stopped kneeling during the anthem back in February. Now every player kneels for the same cause before the match starts. The men do it too, and in Euro 2020, the Premier League ,the Champions League, etc. “I think those that were collectively kneeling felt like we were kneeling to bring about attention to police brutality and systemic racism, and I think we decided that moving forward we no longer feel the need to kneel because we are doing the work behind the scenes. We are combatting (sic) systemic racism. And we never felt we were going to kneel forever,” defender Crystal Dunn said.
"Lord, save me from the good people" - Jim White KMOX |
| 2021-08-04 1:22 PM in reply to: jmhpsu93 |
Champion 10157 Alabama | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? Originally posted by jmhpsu93 Originally posted by Rogillio Originally posted by jmhpsu93 Yes, the b’ who took a knee during the National Anthem. Actions have consequences. I for one am glad they lost so they won’t be able to disgrace and disrespect the United States on the podium. Athletes are entertainers and should know their audience. Mr Kappermick (?) last seen working the drive thru window at Wendy’s….. BTW, anyone who dyes their hair purple sends a message but I don’t think it’s the message they think they are sending. To me, the message is, “I feel inferior and need to do something radical so people will notice me.” Originally posted by marcag Originally posted by Left Brain Men's soccer is that sport that neither Canadian or Americans are good enough to qualify for the Olympics. Women's soccer is the same sport played by people that identify as women and have a T level low enough. From what I understand, if you're a Republican you want the US to lose and Canada to win. Not very patriotic those Republicans :-) What is women's soccer? And apparently those Republicans (well, only a certain segment of them), are especially triggered by one in particular. The U.S. side stopped kneeling during the anthem back in February. Now every player kneels for the same cause before the match starts. The men do it too, and in Euro 2020, the Premier League ,the Champions League, etc. “I think those that were collectively kneeling felt like we were kneeling to bring about attention to police brutality and systemic racism, and I think we decided that moving forward we no longer feel the need to kneel because we are doing the work behind the scenes. We are combatting (sic) systemic racism. And we never felt we were going to kneel forever,” defender Crystal Dunn said.
Evidently the country ain’t over it yet! They stopped kneeling when they realized they piszed off their fans. Athletes, just like Hollywood celebrities have inflated egos if they think people look to them for “guidance” on social issues. Activism is ruining sports. Michael Jordan said it best, “Democrats and Republicans buy Nikes.” The Olympics used to be fun to watch. Not so much anymore. Although I did watch most of them swimming and men’s triathlon* this year. My wife was playing a recoding of the men’s triathlon when I came into the LR. Knowing I’d be interested she said, “Hey, triathlon is on! I dunno what distance it is but it’s not a ‘full’ triathlon.” I just shook my head! “It’s an Olympic distance honey!” 15 years I did triathlons and every distance from sprint to Oly to HIM to IM and she STILL doesn’t know the distances and said the Oly was not a “full” triathlon. As we say down south, bless her heart! |
| 2021-08-04 2:36 PM in reply to: Rogillio |
Expert 4918 Middle River, Maryland Silver member | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? Originally posted by Rogillio Although I did watch most of them swimming and men’s triathlon* this year. My wife was playing a recoding of the men’s triathlon when I came into the LR. Knowing I’d be interested she said, “Hey, triathlon is on! I dunno what distance it is but it’s not a ‘full’ triathlon.” I just shook my head! “It’s an Olympic distance honey!” 15 years I did triathlons and every distance from sprint to Oly to HIM to IM and she STILL doesn’t know the distances and said the Oly was not a “full” triathlon. As we say down south, bless her heart! Ask her what she thought of the mixed relay. LOL Andrew Yee was running a 4:30/mile pace for the winning GB team. |
| 2021-08-08 6:34 PM in reply to: jmhpsu93 |
Extreme Veteran 5722 | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? God tweeted this and I couldn't help but thing of Rog "If you think your immune system is keeping you free from COVID, it’s also doing an amazing job keeping you free from reason" https://twitter.com/TheTweetOfGod/status/1424064752456658945 |
| 2021-08-10 6:32 AM in reply to: marcag |
Champion 10157 Alabama | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? Originally posted by marcag God tweeted this and I couldn't help but thing of Rog "If you think your immune system is keeping you free from COVID, it’s also doing an amazing job keeping you free from reason" https://twitter.com/TheTweetOfGod/status/1424064752456658945 Wow, you follow God on Twitter?! One would think He would put more stock in the immune system he designed! Trust the science. After all, it was science that created Covid in the first place so trust science. Biden and the media have a new narrative on vaccinations. They are now calling it the “pandemic of the unvaccinated” in an attempt to shame and dehumanize people who are not vaccinated. They are trying to make an alliteration to the biblical “unclean”. IOW, this is now the “pandemic of the unclean”. unclean: morally impure; evil; vile. Biblical, having a physical or moral blemish so as to make impure according to the laws, especially the dietary or ceremonial laws: an unclean animal; unclean persons. I don’t care if you are vaccinated or not! It’s your body and your decision what you feel comfortable injecting into your body. There are many reasons one might have for not getting the vaccine, some rational and some not so much. Maybe you just don’t trust the government. Maybe you don’t trust the vaccine. Maybe you think the approval process was rushed. Maybe you see the vaccine as the mark of the beast. Maybe you have weighed the risks and the reward and for you, not getting vaccinated is the better option. Maybe you are worried about potential long term effects which, let’s be honest, no one could possibly know yet. Maybe you don’t trust big pharm. Maybe you think you might have had covid and recovered and trust you body’s immune system. Maybe you are retired and have almost zero interaction with other people. Maybe you think covid is nature’s way of thinning the herd through survival of the fittest immune systems. Maybe you hate Trump and won’t take a vaccine developed on his watch. Or maybe it’s a combination of many of these things. Pushing fear and shame has a tendency to backfire. |
| 2021-08-10 2:49 PM in reply to: Rogillio |
Extreme Veteran 5722 | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? Originally posted by Rogillio Wow, you follow God on Twitter?! One would think He would put more stock in the immune system he designed! I don't really follow him, but he does send me notifications. He is pretty clear he isn't too proud of some of his work. We won't get into which segment of the population he disowns :-) It's actually pretty funny account to follow. The parody accounts are the best. |
| 2021-08-10 3:05 PM in reply to: Rogillio |
| , Arizona | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? Originally posted by Rogillio Pushing fear and shame has a tendency to backfire. Dunno Rog, it's been a pretty effective strategy for religion for quite some time. |
| 2021-08-11 8:53 AM in reply to: marcag |
Expert 4918 Middle River, Maryland Silver member | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? Originally posted by marcag Originally posted by Rogillio Wow, you follow God on Twitter?! One would think He would put more stock in the immune system he designed! I don't really follow him, but he does send me notifications. He is pretty clear he isn't too proud of some of his work. We won't get into which segment of the population he disowns :-) It's actually pretty funny account to follow. The parody accounts are the best. Satire and the right wing don't play together well in the US, Marc. |
| 2021-08-11 8:54 AM in reply to: Synon |
Expert 4918 Middle River, Maryland Silver member | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? Originally posted by Synon Originally posted by Rogillio Pushing fear and shame has a tendency to backfire. Dunno Rog, it's been a pretty effective strategy for religion for quite some time. Growing up Catholic...yeah. |
| 2021-08-11 12:08 PM in reply to: Synon |
Champion 10157 Alabama | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? Originally posted by Synon Originally posted by Rogillio Pushing fear and shame has a tendency to backfire. Dunno Rog, it's been a pretty effective strategy for religion for quite some time. Good point! Vaccinated people are like a religious cult….now, c’mon, drink some more koolade. Two glasses might not be enough….you might need a booster glass every so often. On a related note, it has come out now that even if you are vaccinated you can still transmit the virus. Which means you are no safer around vaxed than you are around unvaxed. Go figure. |
| 2021-08-11 1:10 PM in reply to: Rogillio |
Expert 4918 Middle River, Maryland Silver member | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? Originally posted by Rogillio Originally posted by Synon Good point! Vaccinated people are like a religious cult….now, c’mon, drink some more koolade. Two glasses might not be enough….you might need a booster glass every so often. On a related note, it has come out now that even if you are vaccinated you can still transmit the virus. Which means you are no safer around vaxed than you are around unvaxed. Go figure. Originally posted by Rogillio Pushing fear and shame has a tendency to backfire. Dunno Rog, it's been a pretty effective strategy for religion for quite some time. Wrong. Please the explain why 95+% of all hospitalizations and deaths are among the unvaccinated? In Maryland it's closer to 100%. If what you're saying were true, then the percentage would better reflect the vaxed vs. unvaxed population. |
| 2021-08-11 2:44 PM in reply to: jmhpsu93 |
Pro 15655 | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? How many unvaccinated previously infected people are getting sick and hospitalized? Hint: Almost none. |
| 2021-08-11 2:58 PM in reply to: Left Brain |
Expert 4918 Middle River, Maryland Silver member | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? Originally posted by Left Brain How many unvaccinated previously infected people are getting sick and hospitalized? Hint: Almost none. You're arguing a different point.. Unvaxed veterans of COVID infections have some immunity, but not as much as those vaccinated. From the CDC study conducted in KY: "Although laboratory evidence suggests that antibody responses following COVID-19 vaccination provide better neutralization of some circulating variants than does natural infection (1,2), few real-world epidemiologic studies exist to support the benefit of vaccination for previously infected persons. This report details the findings of a case-control evaluation of the association between vaccination and SARS-CoV-2 reinfection in Kentucky during May–June 2021 among persons previously infected with SARS-CoV-2 in 2020. Kentucky residents who were not vaccinated had 2.34 times the odds of reinfection compared with those who were fully vaccinated (odds ratio [OR] = 2.34; 95% confidence interval [CI] = 1.58–3.47). These findings suggest that among persons with previous SARS-CoV-2 infection, full vaccination provides additional protection against reinfection. To reduce their risk of infection, all eligible persons should be offered vaccination, even if they have been previously infected with SARS-CoV-2.*" You're not the low-hanging fruit, LB. There are plenty of unvaxed, previously un-infected people filling up hospitals in the south right now. We'll come after you later. |
| 2021-08-12 1:31 AM in reply to: Rogillio |
| , Arizona | Subject: RE: Vaccine or not? Originally posted by Rogillio Good point! Vaccinated people are like a religious cult….now, c’mon, drink some more koolade. Two glasses might not be enough….you might need a booster glass every so often. On a related note, it has come out now that even if you are vaccinated you can still transmit the virus. Which means you are no safer around vaxed than you are around unvaxed. Go figure. So you don't believe the science is solid? It's nothing more than "koolaid" to you? Your personal objections aside, you can't deny that the vaccine is saving large amounts of lives and keeping people out of the hospital. In Arizona, 99.5% of people in the hospital for covid are unvaccinated. As for vaccinated people transmitting the virus, maybe go back to page 1 when marcag taught you about viral loads before you make claims about it being "no safer", that's just flat out false. If you are going to argue against the vaccine, stay away from facts around whether or not it has a massively overwhelming net benefit to society, or you will lose every time. Should have just stuck with your "Because f**k you" rationale, data is clearly not on your side here. |
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