Tookie Williams (Page 3)

Here are the death penalty countries:

AFGHANISTAN, ANTIGUA AND BARBUDA, BAHAMAS, BANGLADESH, BARBADOS, BELARUS, BELIZE, BOTSWANA, BURUNDI, CAMEROON, CHAD, CHINA, COMOROS, CONGO (Democratic Republic), CUBA, DOMINICA, EGYPT, EQUATORIAL GUINEA, ERITREA, ETHIOPIA, GABON, GHANA, GUATEMALA, GUINEA, GUYANA, INDIA, INDONESIA, IRAN, IRAQ, JAMAICA, JAPAN, JORDAN, KAZAKSTAN, KOREA (North), KOREA (South), KUWAIT, KYRGYZSTAN, LAOS, LEBANON, LESOTHO, LIBYA, MALAWI, MALAYSIA, MONGOLIA, NIGERIA, OMAN, PAKISTAN, PALESTINIAN AUTHORITY, PHILIPPINES, QATAR, RWANDA, SAINT CHRISTOPHER & NEVIS, SAINT LUCIA, SAINT VINCENT & GRENADINES, SAUDI ARABIA, SIERRA LEONE, SINGAPORE, SOMALIA, SUDAN, SWAZILAND, SYRIA, TAIWAN, TAJIKISTAN, TANZANIA, THAILAND, TRINIDAD AND TOBAGO, UGANDA, UNITED ARAB EMIRATES, UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, UZBEKISTAN, VIET NAM, YEMEN, ZAMBIA, ZIMBABWE

One thing that has been discussed in this thread is the efficacy of the trial process. Lately, many death penalty convicitions have been overturned based on new (often DNA) evidence being examined. There are also cases of people being executed who are later found not to have committed the crime for which they were convicted.

So that being said, how do you death penalty advocates feel about people being wrongly executed?

I don't think anyone was talking about letting Tookie go free. Rehab is a problem. If we say one of the goals of the penal system is to rehabilitate, then we should do it. But by and large, we don't. That's a social problem that probably needs to be solved. BUt the fact of the matter is, resources don't exist to incarcerate every criminal for as long as they should be. Parole is a problem, but if we don't parole people, we don't have room for more bodies.

So what's the answer? Maybe it lies in societal changes that would prevent the crimes from happening in the first place. Take Tookie's example. Why do you think he was so successful in setting up and flourishing the Crips? Was it because kids were just aching to comit crimes? Or is it because they didn't see a viable opportunity to make something of their lives?

In a capitalist society, there will always be disenfranchised people. By and lagre, the poor aren't criminals, but when you don't see a way out, some of us would choose any possible road available. So kids turn to drugs and gangs, because they don't have the opportunity of education and a straight future they way the middle and upper class does.

To rebutt the "cost of execution" argument here is an easy solution:

Winchester 270 30-06-$500.00

Box of Ammo-$35.00

Grand Total-$535.00

This is probably less than it costs to feed one of these scumbags for a week.....

As for Tookie, I hope he is rotting in Hell!

Not only do I think capital punishment is right and moral, I think the families of the victims should be able to be the executioner if they so choose. And I agree with Courtney, get rid of this lethal injection stuff, bring back the chair!

The cost of execution isn't in the potassium chloride used to stop the heart. It's the due process.

Or are you advocating against the criminal justice system as a whole? 

This may be a simple thought, but isn't one innocent person wrongly executed reason enough to reconsider the death penalty. (Per my avatar, I belong to a no-death-penalty country, and hope it stays that way).

Other issues aside, that's kinda how I feel. 

No physical evidence linked Burrows to the murder of William Dulin.The prosecution's two chief witnesses recanted their testimony againstMr. Burrows, and one of them confessed to the murder for which Burrowshad been sent to death row. One of the witnesses said he had been coercedby prosecutors and police. Burrows was released in September, 1994, andthe Illinois appellate courts have upheld the overturning of his conviction.

Cruz was sentenced to death for the murder of 10-year-old Jeanine Nicarico.Another man, Brian Dugan, who had already pled guilty to two rapes andmurders, including that of an 8-year-old girl, authorized his lawyer totell the prosecutors that he killed Nicarico. Cruz was convicted at a secondtrial in 1990, at which Dugan did not testify. In July, 1994, the stateSupreme Court overturned Cruz's second conviction. An assistant state attorneygeneral resigned because she thought the evidence showed Cruz was innocentand thought it wrong to pursue the prosecution. Other law enforcement officialsalso protested the continued efforts to prosecute Cruz. Cruz was finallyacquitted at his retrial in November, 1995. The judge did not even waitfor the defense to put on its case before entering a directed verdict ofnot guilty. Three prosecutors and four law enforcement officers involvedwith the prosecution of Cruz and his co-defendant (see below) have beenindicted for obstruction of justice in this case.

Hernandez was sentenced to death along with Rolando Cruz for the murderof Jeanine Nicarico in 1983. Hernandez was re-tried in 1990, but the trialended in a hung jury. A third trial in 1991 resulted in a conviction andan 80 year prison sentence. The conviction was overturned by the IllinoisSupreme Court in January, 1995. Only his own indirect statements, not anydirect physical evidence, linked Hernandez, who is borderline retarded,to the killing. He was released on bond, and charges were subsequentlydropped on Dec. 8, 1995. The man who has confessed to the murder of JeanineNicarico, and whose DNA has been linked to the crime, has not been chargedin the case. The U.S. Dept. of Justice is considering an investigationinto civil rights violations in this case.

Butler was sentenced to death for the murder of her nine-month-old child.When she found her baby not breathing, she performed CPR and took him tothe hospital. She was interrogated by the police and then prosecuted. Herconviction was overturned by the Mississippi Supreme Court in 1992. Uponre-trial, she was acquitted on Dec. 17, 1995 after a very brief jury deliberation.It is now believed that the baby may have died either of cystic kidneydisease or from sudden infant death syndrome (SIDS).

Verneal Jimerson Illinois Conviction 1985 Released 1996

Jimerson was sentenced to death in 1985 for a murder which occurredin 1978. The chief witness against him was Paula Gray, who has an IQ of57. In her original story to the police, she did not mention Jimerson.Then she added his name to her account, along with three other names, includingDennis Williams (see #64). She later recanted her entire testimony, sayingthe police had forced her to lie. The original charges against Jimersonwere dismissed, but they were resurrected seven years later when the policeoffered to drop some charges against Gray if she would implicate Jimerson.Gray's 50 year sentence was converted to 2 years probation. In 1995, theIllinois Supreme Court unanimously reversed Jimerson's conviction, becauseGray had been allowed to testify falsely about her bargain. Jimerson wasreleased on bond in early 1996, and charges against him were subsequentlydropped.

Dennis Williams Illinois Conviction 1979 Released 1996

Williams was convicted, along with three others (including Verneal Jimerson), for the murder of a young couple in 1978. After spending 18 yearsin prison, Williams was released on June 14, 1996 because new evidencepointed to the fact that all four men were wrongly convicted. Much of theinvestigative work which led to the defendants' release was done by threejournalism students. Recent DNA tests indicate that none of the four menwere involved in the crime, and another man has confessed to the murder.Charges against Williams, and two others who received lesser sentencesin the same case, were dropped on July 2, 1996. Cook County State's AttorneyJack O'Malley apologized to the four wrongly convicted defendants, includingVerneal Jimerson, who had also been on death row.

Why? What is it about revenge?

This seems to be shared by many people.

When you experience revenge, what is it that you are feeling?